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January 2, 2009
buidling an outhouse thing?
We have a rowhouse with a fairly large backyard and a few neighbors have built little barns or even offices in the backs of their yards. We are considering an artist space with lots of windows but we want plumbing and electricity and insulation. How hard will this be (to basically build a little room, not connected to the house - about 20x18). Has anyone done something like this? What kind of price range are we looking at?
Comments
A prefab shed might be an outbuilding, but definitely would not be an outhouse
(in the age-old sense). There's a whole new market and several sources for these, including buildings with creature comforts. Two articles/sources are:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/06/realestate/keymagazine/406hssheds-t.html
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/06/ecospace_prefab.php
Regardless what your neighbors have built, be aware that there are zoning regulations in NYC that might render many of these sheds illegal. Double-check before undertaking construction.
Posted by: vinca at January 2, 2009 2:06 PM
I agree with vinca; you don't want to put up one of those sheds/artist spaces, and I've seen some gorgeous prefab sheds in Dwell...and then have to remove it. Though if a garage is allowed, why not a shed? On a related note, there are a number of composting toilets for people who want to live off the grid. This might be your best bet for the space. It would probably be reasonably easy to run a water line, less easy to run a sewer line. I've heard that they work pretty well, but I imagine that they might be steamy on a hot steamy day...
Posted by: Minmin at January 2, 2009 2:19 PM
Thanks Vinca - great links! Exactly what i had in mind (you're right, not an "outhouse, per se). Curious - how do I check zoning? We are in Windsor Terrace, all residential, single family rowhouses. Any tips to figure out what can be done?
Posted by: WTbound at January 2, 2009 2:22 PM
Zoning text is here: http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/zone/zonetext.shtml
It's not a straightforward topic, and I recommend speaking to someone knowledgeable like an architect. Pay close attention to lot coverage (your building, your building location, size of your yard, etc.)
Posted by: vinca at January 2, 2009 3:02 PM
I second Vinca's advice. I have an existing 10x14 shed that is falling apart and needs to be rebuilt. Current code allows for a 120 sq. foot shed only, and there are definite limitations about height. It cannot be permanently afixed to the ground (no foundation) and I strongly suspect a toilet and kitchen plumbing would also be verboten.
I contacted the Brooklyn DOB and asked if I could just tear down and rebuild the current shed in its current footprint.
They said no.
I asked if I could tear it down and rebuild to code without filing.
They said no.
They said I would have to file with drawings done by a licensed architect and work to be done by licensed GC.
They will be all over anything that looks like it could be used for habitation. From their perspective, it comes down to public safety. How do the fire dept. and police quickly get to a "shed" in the backyard of a townhouse? What if everybody built a little house in their back yard? Just take a look at the restrictions on building decks and porches. If you think that is tough....
I may take my chances and rebuild my shed to old dimensions and even run electricity and cold water out there for the planned adjacent vegetable garden, and take my chances on a violation and risk having to rip it all down when I sell, but the sauna, sink, bunkbed, etc. will have to wait for when I get rich and buy the weekend house in the Catskills.
Good luck.
Posted by: renomandru at January 2, 2009 3:25 PM
Lot coverage and setback requirements usually kill these things in any zoning district. Floor area also an issue. Sometimes ONE CAR GARAGES are excluded from the calculations based on zoning district. Also dont forget fire ratings.
Posted by: jp2 at January 2, 2009 3:26 PM
you really have to hire an architect and do the whole thing legally...otherwise, if you ever sell, you will be sued for endless amounts..you will be an idiot to try to get over the dob in this day and age
Posted by: eman1234 at January 2, 2009 8:38 PM
Can I meet with an architect to find out if it is even possible? Do architects know the ins and outs of the code? I'm fine with doing something legally, even if it turns out to be more of a gazebo than a shed, but I don't even know how to figure out what! Every time we've had contractors over for different things we always get told different stories about what is legal and not. Are architects more reliable?
Posted by: WTbound at January 3, 2009 9:04 AM
You simply need a code and zoning analysis, an expediter, architect and maybe the right engineer could do it for you. The governing issues are NYC Building Code and the Zoning Resolution. It may cost you some money to get a complete and comprehensive review. There is also an open house at the DOB tuesday nights once a month or something you could go and try and get answers from the horses mouth that way.
Posted by: jp2 at January 3, 2009 10:08 AM
JP2's suggestion of the DOB open house would be a great way to start.
Both architect and expediter will know code. (Most contractors will know code, too, but not necessarily want to adhere to it.) You should be able to get more information by attending this show in March, co-sponsored by the NY Times and Architectural Digest: http://www.archdigesthomeshow.com/
Posted by: vinca at January 3, 2009 12:46 PM
Scott Schnall on Atlantic Ave is the best source for zoning law and filing (expediting). He is not cheap, but he knows what get approved. He will not design or do construction drawings, but he will give parameters.
Posted by: eFortGreene at January 3, 2009 8:54 PM
You can pretty much assume these things are illegal...maybe your neighbors don't care, or they were built a long time ago.
Posted by: oe at January 3, 2009 10:35 PM
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