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July 31, 2008
Help!!!!!! PLease CODES????
My mother is an owner of a brownstone for 33 years
She is very ill and I am trying to help out
I would rather being helping with her health
Yet building issues keep distracting us
I am finding I am in over my head yet hesitate calling people from the yellow pages
What is the code needed for a multi family brownstone
for purposes of passing inspection
I have heard many things
From fire escapes
Which I would never consider
To sprinklers in the hall ways only
To sprinklers in every apartment
(Any idea of a cost or a good reliable company for Manhattan)
To some kind of a metal wall or separator around the boiler in the basement
I can really use your advice
My mom’s brownstone……
Was a multi- occupied not certified many years ago....but I do not think it ever had sprinklers when purchased
Then brought down to a two family for personal use plus one
And now we are thinking of going back to a four family
As it could be done with minor very minor changes
But if the fire code inspection or the C of O certificate would be very hard or costly to get we may not change
Trying not to undergo major renovation and cost
But would like the additional income
We would like to use the extra income for her in home care over the next two years
She loves her home and it is our wish to stay in her home but home care will be costly and the income would be an answer to all our problems
Well unfortunately not her health problem just her comfort in passing at home
Can’t seem to find the requirements anywhere on line
I want to bring to code even if we do not change the c of o.
Taxes and insurance are paid as a multi but i think the c of o is still two family
I do not think it would be easy to add sprinklers
Maybe in the hallways
But certainly not passed the hallways
Can someone please point me in the right direction?
I am a novice in this arena and trying to advise a relative
If I knew the requirement I can assess
I do not want to ask allot of people and bring them in
I am just trying to get an answer
Hoping it is a minimum situation
Just sprinklers in the hallway and if needed a metal divider around the boiler....I may be able to afford this if I find a reasonable company to do work....
Can someone please just tell me a simple and definite rule or code to meet?
The city code website made my stomach do flip flops
Gratefully yours
Confused novice
Comments
Hi ConfusedNovice
Sorry to hear about your anxiety. It's a bit hard to help answer what you're talking about specifically but if you have questions about the code, requirements, procedure then please post them here and I'll give a shot at answering them. Or send an email directly to me, whatever you prefer.
First of all, is there a reason that you're needing to pass an inspection? are you changing the C of O now?
Broadly speaking sice you're asking about sprinklers if your building is 3 units or more you would need a sprinkler system in the egress route (that usually means stairs, public hall and vestibule). If your building is small enough they could come off the domestic line which means your normal cold water could be used to serve the sprinklers, if your water pressure is sufficient. That's good since it's a lot cheaper that way.
Posted by: Smokychimp at July 31, 2008 11:57 AM
...I see I just read it again and you are trying to convert the C of O to four family. Four family is trickier than 3 since the egress requirements are a little more stringent.
The boiler issue you bring up may or may not be a problem depending on what's the surrounding construction of the room. It needs to be enclosed in what's called a 1 hour rated fire assembly if your building is pre-1963, which means properly sheetrocked with a door that's fire rated and all the pipe penetrations sealed right. This is really a simple task for a contractor, very routine.
By the way I can't blame you the city code still makes my stomache do flip flops too and I've been using it for decades.
Posted by: Smokychimp at July 31, 2008 12:04 PM
If you are unsure as to what the C of O is on your home, you can look it up online at ACRIS or go to NYC.gov Buildings Dept. You can search by both address and block and lot.
However, the building codes are very confusing even for an experienced homeowner which is why I would just call in the professionals. I would seek the help of reputable engineers, contractors and fire specialists. They should all be able to explain the codes and give you a free estimate of what it would cost in your specific case. Hopefully Smokychimp will see your post and offer advice on the subject. I find her (?) to be very knowledgable on subjects like this.
Posted by: Chaka at July 31, 2008 12:09 PM
I have tremendous sympathy for your situation, having experienced something very similar. However, you MUST inform yourself about city rules and regulations, even if it makes your head swim. You MUST make sure your taxes and water bills are paid to date, and that you understand whether there are existing violations. Start by visiting the offices of one of your elected representatives--depending on where you live, both Hakeem Jeffries and Jim Brennan are good choices:
Assemblyman Hakeem Jeffries, 57th District
- 718-596-0100
Assemblyman Jim Brennan, 44th District -
718-788-7221
Also active, helpful and knowledgeable on housing issues is the Fifth Avenue Committee, 621 DeGraw Street, Brooklyn NY 11217. Tel: 718-237-2017
Visit the offices of the DOB and HPD and make clarify your questions about your home's CO and registration. Both are in the same building in downtown Brooklyn, 210 Joralemon Street, at Court Street:
Department of Buildings, Eighth Floor
- 718-802-3675
HPD Neighborhood Preservation Office, 13th Floor
- 718-802-4503
Residential property owners can visit HPD by appointment or as walk-ins to obtain information on HPD's Housing Education Program, low-interest loans, and correcting housing code violations. From personal experience, I will tell you that HPD's classes are excellent and free.
There is a great deal of information available online. Go to nyc.gov and visit the ACRIS (Automated City Register Information System), Dept. of Finance and HPD sites, where you will find a tremendous number of useful links and information. This link might also be useful: http://www.nyc.gov/html/lpc/html/faqs/research_resource.shtml
Posted by: vinca at July 31, 2008 12:45 PM
Oh my God
Answers so quickly...I cannot beleive it!!
I am so Gratful for any and all info
I see that smokeychimp is veiwed to be an expert on this subject by your piers and I can see why
I feel a little better
I am running into the city to do my Mom's banking and go to the store and errands ...so I cannot ask any more now
But I wanted to thank you all caring and sharing
Smokeychimp
Do you know any buzz words so I can talk to my mom's guy or potential guy ... what the enclosed room and standards for bolier enclosure is that may be needed to install
I am not making a room for purposes of room only...it is for code so I want to meet code requirement.. door size and correct material and size etc
Is there a company you trust?
Also on water sprinklers
If you take off your main domestic line
Will the water pressure for the house drop much???
or only drop if fire sprinklers are in use
If you need to get another line from the street is it costly and is it asking for trouble bringing in the city and possible permits
I would like to stay under the radar if possible
Thank you for walking me through this difficult time in my life, I appreciate your time and help very much
Confused Novice
Posted by: confused novice at July 31, 2008 1:54 PM
You have already gotten some excellent advice both from Vinca and Smokeychimp. But, I must tell you, I am really concerned about the level of anxiety and panic that seems to be emanating from your post. If you are trying to move forward with this, on your mom's behalf, but in a "confused novice" state of mind you are surely going to impress as a huge potential target for every tom, dick, and harry rip-off artist contractor, etc. you meet! Believe me, I know this, 'cause I've been there. I'm also currently dealing with codes and construction management issues on my ailing mom's house (in a different state). It's no joke.
Bottom line, though, please try to slow down,take a deep breath and try to unbundle the myriad issues before you one, by one. Asking this forum for help is a start. But there is no way you are going to work through this very complicated and potentially costly process by asking strangers on the internet how to do it. I'm thinking you need to get an architect's consultation. Don't know one? Perhaps that's a better preliminary question to ask this Forum. Here is where you are likely to get some suggestions of whom you should hire to help you work through these kinds of issues.
Alternatively, and in addition to the HPD programs, elected officials' offices, Fifth Avenue Committee and other resources that Vinca has mentioned, I would also suggest you call on Neighborhood Housing Services of New York : http://www.nhsnyc.org/. They are a nonprofit organization that does much work helping out homeowners get mortgages, manage construction projects,etc. I don't know if NHS has anyone on staff who can help you directly with these various issues you are trying to sort out, but they definitely ought to be able to refer you to someone who can. IMHO, they are also trustworthy.
Good luck!
Posted by: Brooklynista at July 31, 2008 3:09 PM
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