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January 3, 2008
Brownstone renovation costs - why $100k per floor?
I have seen quotes on here several times that as a ballpark figure, you can budget for $100k per floor (not including kitchens and baths).
Can anyone break that down for me? I'm having trouble figuring out how it comes to $100k per floor MINUS the kitchens and baths.
Based on rough quotes I've been given from contractors, it seems that these are the main components:
-$15-20k electric + plumbing
-$15k new floors (if we go with pre-fab floors on a roughly 900sq ft place)
-$15-20k new interior walls and doors
Even being generous, that doesn't come close to $100k. Where am I off in my estimates, or what else am I missing?
Thank you!
Comments
I think it depends on how extensive a renovation you are talking about. $100K a floor simply to redo the floors, walls and electric is high. But when you add in the costs of demo, bathrooms/kitchens, windows, roof, hvac, moldings, painting, hardware, plaster work, replacement of beams etc.. it can easily exceed $100K. Also factoring in any small exterior work and all new mechanicals that count toward the "per floor" costs.
Also, don't underestimate those "little" things that add up like doorknobs, faucets, lighting fixtures, switches, etc.. They are small costs individually but really add up over time.
I do think you can do a reno for less than $100K per floor including kitchens and bathrooms but so much depends on finishes. Much like you can redo a kitchen for $5 or $500K, its impossible to give a range without knowing current state and what you want the end state to look like.
Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at January 3, 2008 8:39 AM
I think it's about 100K per floor INCLUDING bathrooms and kitchen. Otherwise, I can't imagine how it could be that expensive.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 8:43 AM
Having just done a gut reno in excess of 100k/floor - here are things that could drive up the #:
1) Electric & plumbing - are you combining apartments, changing location of plumbing stack (gas, water), adding central heating or A/C, upgrading electrical service, new boiler
2) Structural issues that require replacement of joists/floor boards
3) How much demo, and how much in the way of new walls, skim coating, installation of light fixtures in ceiling (recessed lighting for instance) - how much is your floorplan changing
4) New doors, closets
5) Venting for washing machine dryer
6) New windows
7) Stripping and repair of woodwork
8) Staircase repair
9) Facade work
10) Repair/replacement of roof
11) Waterproofing basement
12) Landscaping
It all adds up - that's not even including what you spend on kitchen fixtures, appliances, bathroom fixtures, tiles,
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 8:58 AM
Wow, that's really low. Let me know how you pull that off.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 9:34 AM
depends on whom you hire. i did 3 floors a year back. thats six units total gut with new everything. cost me only about 100k per floor. but thats double the work. so about 50k per unit.
right now i'm doing 3 units about 180k for almost all. but this guy is slightly more expensive than my last guy. my last guy already taken up too many projects.
Posted by: armchairwarrior at January 3, 2008 9:54 AM
Thank you very much all!!! I realize how naive my question was- I was just trying to get a sense of where that quote came from. Your info has been VERY helpful!
To be specific, we are hoping to just do cosmetic work fo 2 units (2 floors), incl. new kitchens and baths (but lower end stuff). I anticipate new floors, new kitchen, new bath, likely some new electrical b/c of adding some track lighting in, and other cosmetic stuff (new paint, maybe some wall sanding, etc.). I was hoping to get all that done for below $100k per floor. Sounds like its doable.
The owners duplex sounds like it's highly likely to exceed $100k per floor, which is understandable.
Thanks again!
Posted by: U510545 at January 3, 2008 10:32 AM
Cosmetic work should not cost you anywhere near $100K a floor. When people on this site quote those numbers, they are speaking of gut or near gut renovations.
Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at January 3, 2008 10:48 AM
If you are renovating an old brownstone, you may find your cosmetic work leads to much more intensive work than you initially expect. I refer to these as the "hey lady, look at this" moments.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 11:02 AM
I just received 2 estimates for a complete gut renovation for 4 floors with 1400 sqf each. I was given a low estimates of $500-$700k, and a high estimate of 1.5 mill. What gives? This seems so expensive to what others are saying on this thread.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 11:29 AM
We spent $250,000 on 2 floor semi-gut reno without kitchens or bathrooms. Reno was mid-range.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 11:32 AM
some additional perspective from a contractor..
100k per floor to me means, 20-30k for overhead/profit right off the top (standard rate/fee). The remaining 70-80k will demo/cart away throughout, buy material, frame, insulate, rock, tape, prime/paint, mechanical, woodwork (window/door surround, baseboard, etc), and ultimately finish the project. Hi-end anything will add to the cost.
Is 100k low/fair/high..all depends on the project and schedule.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 1:26 PM
I think you should get quotes from diffrent companies and get a company that deals with Con-Ed and the building depatment to make sure everything is up to code. When i did my renevation I called Christopher John Electrical and the deal with both these companies and they get the job done
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 3:57 PM
We spent $140K to gut renovate a duplex ($120 to contractor (which included kitchen cabinets), $20 for all new appliances, tiles, fixtures, bathtub, etc.). It was a mid-range reno - high end Home Depot fixtures but not fancy designer fixtures. It was a complete redo of 2 bedrooms, 2.5 baths, moved walls, plumbing, electric, new floors, etc. One thing that might have made a difference was that the building was post-war, not old brownstone. However, nothing had been touched in over 25 years.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 4:03 PM
"When i did my renevation I called Christopher John Electrical and the deal with both these companies and they get the job done "
ok. you posted this same thing in another thread.
but it doesn't really make sense in this thread.
you are obviously affiliated with this company.
Posted by: guest at January 3, 2008 4:04 PM
Many brownstones are 700 square feet per floor (20x35) so 11:29's 1400 is twice size of common brownstone.
Posted by: Putnamdenizen at January 3, 2008 5:19 PM
Depends on the quality of work you want remember the old saying you get what you pay for? Maybe that is why you see alot of people on this site whining about how some contractor screwed them. What do you expect when you take the low bid from unlicensed uninsured newbie contractors, beat the guy up on the price, expect him to include for free additional work that you find needs to be done? You get a guy who figures if im not making any money why should I stay?
Posted by: guest at January 4, 2008 2:15 AM
To- 2:15am
When a contractor accepts the job for a specific price.
He should stick to it.
In my experience, contractors are inefficient and rotten business people.
They overload the client with useless supplies, etc.
They make mistakes in math all the time (miscalculating measurements, quantity, etc.) and are wasteful on top of everything else.
The biggie is they don't know how to manage their money which is why their subcontractor don't get paid sometimes.
Learn math or get a calculator and learn how to shop!
The client is paying for all the inefficienies in the construction.
The worst part is they get free leftover material from the client to start this nightmare all over with somebody else.
It is called tap dancing through your wallet.
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 5, 2008 10:50 AM
in addition to the contractor's fees (mentioned above), which should run around 15-20%, don't forget you're also going to need an architect's services and an expediter to file with the DOB. it adds up.
Posted by: guest at January 8, 2008 1:22 PM
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