Forum
« Moisture Under Window storm glass on screen door? »
December 16, 2007
How much do I tip people working on my house?
I recently purchased a new home in Cobble Hill and have a few folks working on the house. Is there a general rule of thumb on how much one is supposed to tip (if at all) for any of the following:
- Contractor
- Painter
- Plumber
- Electrician
- Cleaning Service
Please forgive my ignorance - any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Clueless in Crooklyn
Comments
Contractor, painter, plumber and the like, would probably be offended if you tipped them. They're professional skilled laborers, they're not waiting on you.
I have done skilled labor for people in the past, and found that the *very few* tips I was offered (and declined) were from those people who always seemed to be looking for another way to create/reinforce a Me Master-You Servant dynamic.
Cleaning lady? To me a different story. Tipping unskilled labor is completely appropriate.
Posted by: vanburenproud at December 16, 2007 8:11 PM
Interesting... I never would have guessed that. The last thing I want to do is offend. I simply didn't want to short-change any of these folks that are working very hard right now. I'm assuming it's inappropriate to tip the folks on their teams too then.
Posted by: nohazmats at December 16, 2007 8:18 PM
Tipping unskilled labor is appropriate. I always tip the garbage hauler's assistant. I tipped my demo crew. I wouldn't tip a painter's or plumber's assistant. These people are learning professional trades.
A tip is an acknowledgment of a service relationship. The person who hauls your trash or cleans your house is performing a service with their body for you that you are unwilling/unable to do, but do technically have the *skills* to do. If you had less money or more muscles or whatever, you'd be doing that work. This makes the person you employ merely a stand-in for your body. A tip acknowledges that relationship.
A plumber, on the other hand, is a professional who has a world of specialized information under his belt that you don't have. You are paying him a *premium* day rate to get access to it. The power relationship is totally different.
Think of it this way: how would your doctor look at you if you slipped him a twenty?
Posted by: vanburenproud at December 16, 2007 8:32 PM
OK, but what about the Property Manager of a Co-op building? Professional yes, but they also attend frequent board meetings that are held in the evening.
Posted by: guest at December 16, 2007 8:46 PM
Me Master-You Servant dynamic for tipping someone? Vanburenproud who thinks like this? When someone has done an really good job I think it's nice to give a tip. Delivering the papers to my stoop is "unskilled" but I send the guy $20 at Christmas because it's nice to be generous. Who would be offended or insulted? Many times professional like painters work for a large company and make very little $ compared to what the GC or company charges you. Always give the money directly to the intended person as most contractors (from my experience )pocket the $ and don't give it to their workers.
Posted by: guest at December 16, 2007 9:06 PM
I own my business so I would not accept a tip while charging for a service.
The people I employ, however, get tips often and are greatly appreciative.
I have no idea who shares vanburenproud's point of view but he/she is certainly entitled to an opinion, especially in light of the fact that tipping tradespeople is very optional.
A standard gratuity seems to be $10-$20 for a two-man crew to be divided as they see fit.
The record? A gentleman in the West Village paid his $2,200 invoice with a check and then handed over $300 in cash to our plumber and his helper.
My guys can't do enough for him now when he calls but he never did anything like that again.
Interesting.
Posted by: Master Plvmber at December 16, 2007 9:38 PM
Recently I have tipped: the movers, the cleaning lady, demo guys and my hair dresser :) I will/would not tip the plumber, electrician, handyman, carpenter or architect. Though, when it comes to my carpenter, whom I adore, I will often round up when paying him because he does such a fantastic job and is, himself, a generous person. So, use your judgment too, about how to handle payment. I would definitely not tip anyone associated with a co-op board. I believe that may be seen (at the risk of sounding snobbish) as poor form...
Posted by: guest at December 16, 2007 11:11 PM
If possible, tips should always be sexual in nature. Who doesn't love a blowjob?
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 12:13 AM
To answer guest 9:06's question, I have waited a lot of tables and worked in a couple of galleries and done quite a bit of custom metalwork in people's houses. And I have to say that sometimes rich people are amazingly rude.
Not all rich people, but some are. And when they are rude, they are often rude along this Insecure-About-Their-Power axis.
Again, tipping any nonskilled labor is completely appropriate. Tipping someone who is already charging me for their skills (unless they are cutting my hair) feels rude to me. Manipulative. See MP's $300 tip story. It makes sense, but IMHO, it's crass to pull this kind of shit with skilled grownups. At that level, it's buying people.
About the nicest thing a client ever did for me was bake me a pie. It conveyed exactly what he wanted it to convey: that he understood that I took time to make something right for him, and that he appreciated that time and humanity with some of his own.
What's wrong with a small gift? It seems like a less loaded, more genuine way to appreciate someone who has already given you a price.
Posted by: vanburenproud at December 17, 2007 8:07 AM
Or a blowjob. Everyone loves a blowjob.
Posted by: vanburenproud at December 17, 2007 8:08 AM
I don't see what skilled vs. unskilled has to do with the tipping situation. A hairdresser is a skill and I tip her. A massage therapist is also a skilled job and I tip her as well.
Generally, I think a tip is an appropriate thank you to any one performing a service for you. Owners and highly paid specials can sometimes be excluded (but not always). Most people appreciate the gesture and take it for its meant to be.
Ive worked at jobs where tips were common and I can tell you that Ive never felt belittled when someone was gracious enough to hand me their hard earned money. Few people are.
Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at December 17, 2007 8:31 AM
A curious thread. What is un-skilled labor - where is that line drawn?
A guy cutting my lawn has skills appropriate to the job at hand. I am accessing his knowledge base.
Some so-called professionals in the construction business (or any other) have one primary skill - the ability to con you out of your money, so I guess a tip would be unjustified.
Most practitioners of trade-work, excepting some unions do not apprentice to trades anymore in any formal sense, technology and lax standards have eliminated the need for much of it to the detriment of consumers.
It is unlikely the person that tiled your bathroom wall spent 4 years acquiring that trade (tiling is a trade) as was done in the old days. A waitress in a restaurant might well have spent much longer acquiring her set of skills and when her shift ends might go home and tile her bathroom wall.
Not to mention, it smacks of elitism to suggest that Joe over there digging that trench could be tipped but "Please do not insult me, I am a professional I just changed your light fixture"
When it comes to a tipee a little humility goes a long way.
As for the tipper the only important thing to remember is that size matters.
'Tip o the mornin to ya'
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 9:03 AM
Next thing I'll have to start tipping my attorney and my dentist
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 9:04 AM
I think I am being misunderstood.
I am speaking from the position of someone who has taken a lot of tips--I worked as a waiter and bartender for twelve years.
For that matter, I give a lot of tips. I think they are an important gesture. What I am saying is that I think it's important to understand what exactly the gesture is when you give a tip, because they can become rude.
Perhaps I should put this another way. When I tip a waiter or a demo guy, I am saying, "thank you for being humble enough to put yourself in this position for me. Thanks for extending your body and your time to serve my needs in this direct, potentially self-reducing way. Thanks for taking my direct orders. Thanks for allowing me to tell you what to do." As a waiter, I totally appreciated tips, because knowledgable subservience is what waiting tables is about. There's nothing wrong with that. I could go back to waiting tables tomorrow, and would be happy to accept a tip, because that's the deal.
As a skilled tradesperson, I have much more control over how much I charge and what I do for you. If you want me to take out your kitchen garbage because you are wearing something nice, or clean up some other subcontractor's mess (both examples taken from real life experiences I have had in other people's houses), I can, tactfully, say no.
To tip a skilled tradesperson who has already set their price is to assert a power relationship that is not there, and that I have, in my professional experience, found it best to avoid. I decline tips because I have, out of a misplaced sense of humility, received a tip from a client, only to find myself in the weird position of being asked by the (otherwise nice and respectful) client to take her dog out for a walk while I was in the middle of installing her cabinets, because she was "busy doing other things," and not quite being able to say no because, after all, I did take a twenty from her a month ago.
That's because a tip communicates that you have been bought, and sometimes this is respectful and appropriate and sometimes it is not. It's all about context. I am all about humility--it's a very useful business tool. But there is no good reason for an independent contractor who is in your house on specific business to have the *type* of humility that accepting a tip communicates.
FWIW, I am not the only one who thinks this way. Waiters talk about tips in this level of detail all the time, and I have never been at a party with woodworkers or metalworkers without hearing outrageous tip stories, generally followed by loud, clinky-glassed avowals not to ever accept a tip again.
Posted by: vanburenproud at December 17, 2007 9:56 AM
Vanburenproud, nobody has misunderstood you. We all understand that you have a serious chip on your shoulder. Get over yourself and your skills. Your assumption that someone offers you a tip so they have power over you belies your own insecurity. If it makes you feel better, go to work in a tie. Your clients are just trying to be respectful. They don't know what's customary or expected.
If some woman once asked you to walk her dog, it had nothing to do with the fact that she tipped you. It was because you had been in and out of her house for over a month which is a strange invasion of privacy that in fact puts you in a position of power over her. You had established a friendly interaction and she asked you for a favor. She didn't offer you $50 to do it, did she? She asked you to help her out of bind in that moment.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 1:07 PM
So, if my painted is charging me $3k to paint my house, it's rude to offer a tip to him or his team of guys?
Posted by: nohazmats at December 17, 2007 2:38 PM
I'm a professional woodworker. I submit a price to my clients, and that's all that I expect in compensation. The best tip that my clients can give me is their trust, and kindness. I love it when a client says that there are cold drinks in the fridge, and I can help myself. Some even ask what kind of beer I like.
On the other hand, I have an assistant, to whom I pay a decent wage. He has skills, but not top notch. I appreciate it when he gets a tip from my clients...and he does.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 4:28 PM
I forgot to mention (guest @ 4:28)...when I have a good client, I always make them something out of wood...so I do the tipping, as a way of thanking them for picking me, and being nice.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 4:32 PM
I've been hanging out (often in pubs) with independent contractors and tradesmen un-skilled and skilled all my life.
I have never heard such unadulterated shite.
I have never once heard anyone speak of refusing a tip
- except for Mary the waitress at the diner but that guy eats for two, tries to chat her up and always leaves a quaeter -
rather of the client's largesse or more often great lack thereof.
Get a grip of yourself Vanburen et al. I hope you and your party of woodworkers tipped the barmaid - if for no other reason than to establish your notion of power over her.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 4:48 PM
So I guess this means I should tip the guys on my general contractor's crew? They have been working on my gut renovation for 6 months now. How much would be appropriate? I imagine $20 a person (they are three in the crew) is way too small.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 5:40 PM
Vanburenproud is telling you people something you don't want to hear, and he's right.
I work on a cabinetmaker's crew (and work on my house...), and I don't appreciate tips.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 5:49 PM
5:49, then you, like vanburenproud, are the one who is rude. Being unappreciative of someone who is trying to express their gratitude and respect for your work shows you to be the ungracious asshole. Get over yourself. If you don't think you should be tipped, why not simply say so when you submit your estimate or contract. Just say it's come up in the pas and you want the homeowner to know what is and isn't expected. Nobody is insulting you. They are simply trying to do the right thing.
Posted by: guest at December 17, 2007 7:04 PM
I don't tip people working on my house. I am respectful, appreciative of good work, pay as agreed promptly and recommend the tradesman if he/she does a good job. It is not appropriate to tip tradespeople; they can price the job for what they think it is worth. I tip wait staff, food delivery guys like take out, Fresh Direct etc. and a few people at the holidays. There has to be a line otherwise we will all go crazy. Or we could be like Japan where people think that good service is simply part of any job and tips are always inappropriate. I like tipping people in hotels and restaurants where tipping is considered part of the wages and where personal service and attention is much better when you tip well.
Posted by: donatella at December 17, 2007 10:03 PM
We are currently doing a major renovation and instead of giving our workers a tip, I've provided lunch or drinks.. hot chocolate is great while it is cold. I think that it is a great way for them to feel appreciated.
Posted by: guest at December 18, 2007 9:25 AM
I actually have a friend who says he doesn't like blow jobs. Can we please stick to the really interesting stuff here?
Posted by: guest at December 18, 2007 10:44 AM
It's obviously an unclear situation. You can offer a tip, or a gift. Ask the GC/foreman, explain that it's a sign of appreciation. You can even find out what the crew might like and buy them a gift. Providing lunch and drinks is another way to go. The best "tip" you can give them is to refer them to friends or the brownstoner crowd -- another nice paying job goes much further than a tip of $50 or $100 (remember,they've been busting their butts for you for over 6 months, so $20???)
Posted by: guest at December 18, 2007 11:11 AM
vanburenproud is correct in his assessment of the use of tips, at least in doling out cash for services. In the professional relationship you give a thoughtfull gift.
I would give the guys delivering my furniture some money; I would send my lawyer who helped close my housing deal a bottle of wine.
Posted by: guest at December 18, 2007 12:53 PM
I forgot to say I gave my contractor and his guys food/alcohol gifts. I never gave my garbage men money and regretted it during my renovation. When I finally realized they were dropping heavy hints, I thought 'damn, I pay taxes' and lived to regret it. That is one 'tip' you definately want to give. Once you pay them, they stop counting the bags.
Posted by: donatella at December 18, 2007 3:52 PM
we tip the mailcarrier, the ups/fedex guys, the water delivery people, the cleaning person, the garage attendants, the supers, the office staff, the groomers, etc.
have even tipped a medical doctor
Posted by: guest at December 21, 2007 12:33 PM
Post a comment
Please be patient while your comment is published. It may take a moment.