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March 14, 2007
Illegal apartment
So how much risk is there in renting an apartment illegaly? By illegal I mean, renting out 3 apartments in a legal 2-family. All the apartments are separate and have kitchen and bath. Utilities for two of the units would have to be shared. What's the worst that could happen? Thanks!
Comments
You should probably try to rent to family, friends or friends of friends. I think it also makes a difference what neighborhood you're in. Old school Bklyn doesn't give a sh*t what their neighbors are up to. They just want to live their own lives. The newcomers may report you. Example..Bed Stuy=safe, Park Slope=watch your back.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 14, 2007 9:54 AM
the worst? A fire starts in the kitchen of the illegal apt, burns down the entire house and then your insurance company won't pay out because the apt is illegal. Then you get sued by the other tenant because everything they have is lost (hopefully not life) and they say you were negligent because you rented an illegal apt that caused the fire.
You file for bankruptcy and spend the next 10 yrs trying to dig yourself out of the hole.
The not so bad? You get caught by DOB, they issue fines of up to $3025/day (yes, per day) plus you have to pay an architect and licensed contractor to rip out the apt and restore it to its previous use.
I believe there are also issues if you have a deadbeat tenant as the regular landlord tenant court will not hear cases for illegal apts.
Other than these minor risks you should be all set. Go for it.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 14, 2007 9:54 AM
http://home2.nyc.gov/html/dob/downloads/pdf/dob_Illegal.pdf
Posted by: Girgis at March 14, 2007 9:54 AM
I bought a house where the prior owner had done what you are proposing.(it was delivered vacant) They turned a 2 family into a 3. What ended up happening is the person in the illegal unit (it was a basement) called up the buildings department and reported it. The owner got multiple violations on the house. The violations were not that expensive to clear up but the big problem was that her tenant started withholding rent and legally there was nothing she could do. You can't legally collect rent on an illegal apartment. That really is your biggest risk. You can end up with a tenant paying no rent and you have to go to court to evict somehow. This individual who had done this ended up moving out of the apartment and renting another illegal unit from one of my neighbors and did the exact same thing again. There are some shady people out there and I don't know how you would screen for something like that. Personally i don't think its worth risk, though apparently MANY people in brooklyn seem to do it so *shrug*.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 14, 2007 10:03 AM
article from last year about this:
http://www.villagevoice.com/nyclife/0629,tucker,73881,15.html
Posted by: Girgis at March 14, 2007 10:07 AM
Hello New Yorkers,
If you have anything to say about the apartment rentals or living in NYC, please post it here.
http://www.empire-apartments.us/community
Posted by: Alexander Mirvis at March 14, 2007 11:00 AM
what if you have a roommate on a floor and are charging them, but it's not an apartment?
Posted by: pietro at March 14, 2007 11:36 AM
anon 10:13--the end of your post was quite humorous. warning someone who knows they'd be renting an illegal apartment that their tenants might be "shady." good one!
Posted by: Anonymous at March 14, 2007 3:57 PM
yeah. who exactly is the shady one? the tenant or the landlord? duh.
Posted by: sf at March 14, 2007 11:09 PM
I know someone who rents a 2-bed apt, the 2 beds and a bath of which have been illegally constructed belwo ground (albeit with intersting use of window wells so it's not dark.) His landlord told him that there'd be an inspection, and he (landlord) called in workmen to seal up parts of the bottom floor and move furniture so it wouldn't look like anyone lives there whil being inspected (and I suspect he's also being paid off). I told my friend he's got a good case to stop paying his high rent it he wants to!
Posted by: anon at March 15, 2007 8:33 AM
If you read the article it is easier to get away with in Manhattan as there are situations in Brooklyn where a landlord can take an illegal tenant to housing court.
Posted by: Girgis at March 15, 2007 10:00 AM
I'd only rent it to a student or a friend -- somebody very unlikely to make problems.
Middle aged women (actually women in general) are the worst tenants and tend (though not always) to complain the most.
Look for a hipster looking for a deal who's too busy to even contemplate making problems for you and clearly won't stay forever.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 15, 2007 12:50 PM
Anon 12:50: "women in general make the worst tenants?" Uhhhh...that's half the population, moron. Are you advising OP to rent only to men? That would 1) be illegal and 2) cut down on 1/2 of the geographic that wants to rent.
Posted by: North Sleeper at March 15, 2007 1:12 PM
Anon 12:50 here --- I didn't say not to rent to a woman. I've had lots of building management experience and I'm just sharing it. Laid back males with good jobs are usually the easiest tenants.
What's wrong with sharing lessons learned through personal experience? Isn't that what this blog is all about? If I were a female landlord, I'd have the same advice.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 15, 2007 2:15 PM
I agree, women are the worst tenants. Most of my tenants are women, they complain constantly. Males only complain if the electricity goes out and they can't warm up their pizza. Women complain if the hinge on a kitchen cabinet door squeeks. If you think this is sexist, then so be it. I'm sure there are lots of exceptions to this, but largely true in my experience.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 15, 2007 6:45 PM
female poster here. it is true that male tenants are much easier to deal with in general.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 16, 2007 4:30 PM
sorry, female poster here, I'm on my second female tenant and absolutely no problems and no complaints, and got to say, I made every apartment I ever lived in nicer than it was when I moved in. In fact when I rent what I have found is just the opposite, most men don't come back when I mention a credit check and I asked a broker about this and he said men were more risk-taking and worse tenants. I have always been told that men under 40 were the worst renters. So, I care not about the sex of the person. I do care about their credit, I call their previous landlords as well as their employers and of course my gut feeling when I meet them.
Posted by: anon at March 17, 2007 12:47 AM
I agree that women complain about things a little more than men but they also take a lot more care of the place. They seem to be much more concerned about their environment which means they clean the mildew off the shower, vaccuum, etc which helps maintain the property, so I think even if they are a bit more trouble, women are worth it.
Posted by: Anonymous at March 17, 2007 9:13 AM
Why can't you people post your comments on my site? I wanna hear all about this stuff and share with the rest of New Yorkers.
Please post here:
http://www.empire-apartments.us/community
Posted by: Alex at April 20, 2007 12:46 PM
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