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August 31, 2005
Wood vs Vinyl Windows
Seeking advice about WINDOWS for a center slope 3-story brick renovation in non-landmarked street, where most neighbors have replaced wood windows with something artificial. After getting bids from contractors, we're looking to save money. Our architect specified Bonneville wood windows throughout. But wood, we said, needs maintenance and is pricier than vinyl. But vinyl, we're told, is cheap and falls apart after a few years. Do the words "good quality" and "vinyl" never belong in the same sentence? Do wood windows require maintenance every 3-5 years? (Aluminum is out of our budget). What have you done? What companies besides Bonneville are worth considering? Thanks in advance.
Comments
We would have loved to buy Marvin windows (wood) for our place, but was not in the budget. We installed aluminum windows made by Crystal (I believe it's an Asian-owned company). We got 14 windows for around $2,000, maybe less. They are a brownish color, so they don't look too bad. They have argon gas and some ultra-violet protection. The guys installed them in half a day. The windows aren't too bad. I would not recomment vinyl.
Posted by: Anonymous at August 31, 2005 12:01 PM
Please don't put those vinyl windows in. They are painfully ugly, even if you are non-landmarked (lucky you, btw!). We are landmarked so we went with the full-on fancy Marvins, but they really hurt the wallet. I've noticed Home Depot and Lowes have some good lines in the wood, double insulated family (Pella, Anderson), that are energy efficient and also nice to look at.
It's worth spending a couple of extra bucks for the double insulation. You can REALLY tell the difference in the dead of winter.
Posted by: renogirl at August 31, 2005 12:58 PM
That $2000 for 14 windows is unbelievably cheap. What gives?
I have some vinyl replacements from LWP (Lucky Window Products, in Brooklyn, in the phone book) and some rehabed original wood windows (parlor floor windows are mad expensive to replace, and why do it when you can get the old ones fixed?!) Talk to local lumber yards for original wood rehab carpenter suggestions. Wood does not need much maintenance -- just a good paint job or seal lasts a long time.
LWP did fine with my back of the house vinyls. It's been 9 years or so, and so far so good. The white ones look like shit when people put them in the front of the house on a brownstone, but the dark ("bronze") look as good as aluminum. BTW I don't think aluminum is any great deal.
Posted by: LG at August 31, 2005 1:18 PM
If maintenace is a problem get wood windows with exterior clading.
Posted by: Anonymous at August 31, 2005 1:19 PM
I also purchased my aluminum windows from Crystal. Coincidentally I also needed 14 windows but my price was not $2000. Perhaps my windows are a lot larger. Crystal Windows has won quite a few awards. They do not install. They can recommend someone or you can have your own person buy from them. I am quite pleased with mine.
Posted by: Susan at August 31, 2005 1:37 PM
GOOD aluminum windows are far better (and less expensive) than wood. Get a price from the store at 39th Street and 10th Avenue in Brooklyn (it's under the el) If you can't find the name, etc., I'll look it up for you. They only manufacture, but they might be able to recommend someone.
Posted by: Ken at August 31, 2005 6:47 PM
Maybe my 14 aluminum windows for $2,000 were more, I don't remember offhand. We had Brooklyn Team Windows (718) 871-6826 do the job and they were good. We also paid in cash and did them at the same time as our neighbor, so maybe we got a small discount.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 2, 2005 9:16 AM
Hi Everyone...
This is my first posting on the site. I am the Pella Windows and Doors Replacement Window Specialist for Brooklyn and Queens. Don't worry I don't plan on making a sales pitch. I just want to help maintain the architecture of our city.
Their are major difference in not only wood and vinyl but also aluminum to vinyl. Window salespeople like to talk about R and U factors in discussing window insulation. Industry standard is approx .35, thats for wood, vinyl and aluminum. Here's the catch...that rating is at the center of the glass and DOES NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE MATERIAL OF THE FRAME. Wood is a natural insulator, its an organic material...but also comes with the highest price point. Aluminum, obviously is metal so ambient temps which can reach below zero in our winters gives very little insulation from the frame. Vinyl has its problems in the opposite end of the spectrum, summer. Vinyl is PLASTIC, frame surface temps can reach 140 degrees...plastic begins to breakdown at those temps which is why vinyl is none for SEAL FAILURE. Seal failure=merky looking windows, white cascades on the glass...insulation is nil when this occurs. The cascades of white is actually moss build up from condensation.
Being in the field, I can tell you that wood holds up the best over the long haul. The price is damaging to the wallet and ego. Beware of insulation factors with aluminum but they are durable and have a niche with the cost concious. If you feel like saving money up front but have the means to replace windows every 6-8 years buy vinyl.
Another hint for you home owners- the reputable window makers have higher prices but also accomadate with the easiest payment programs. Don't let "cash on hand" be the deciding factor here...payment programs are the way to go and salespeople will actually give you a better prices if you use the payment programs.
Posted by: Jay at September 17, 2005 2:14 AM
I replaced 55+ double-hung, wooden sash windows with white vinyl windows and had not a single seal failure in over 8 years. I discovered a tiny crack in one pane, which was barely visible. No sash lock failure, either. The quality in the construction of these windows varies greatly, however.
Having said that, you can always tell it is a vinyl window and not wood, just like vinyl vs. clapboard siding on a colonial or Victorian. If I owned a $2 million brownstone, I might spend the money and go for the aesthetic appeal and insulating qualities of wood.
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