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February 3, 2010

Co-op of the Day: 47 Plaza Street West, #11C

47-Plaza-Street-West-0210.jpg
How sweet it is! This four-bedroom apartment at 47 Plaza Street West in Park Slope has to be one of the finer pads within walking distance of the Park Slope Co-op. After spending the summer on the market, the 11th floor co-op sat out the fall selling season before getting back in the game again this week with a price tag of $1,995,000. In addition to the size (2,270 square feet) and all the prewar detail, we are mighty impressed with all the windows and views this place brings to the table. Maintenance is a tough-to-swallow $3,008 per month though.
47 Plaza Street West, #11C [Corcoran] GMAP P*Shark





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Comments

Stunning. Love this place. I'd scarp the wall to wall but the views and all the windows are amazing.

Posted by: Adam Dahill at February 3, 2010 12:53 PM

Obviously the proximity to the Food Coop is not a selling point that has people scrambling to snap this up. Do people who pay these amounts of money really want to work at the Food Coop to save a couple of bucks?

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at February 3, 2010 12:54 PM

Apt. 13B which was a 1300 sf 2 bedroom/2 bath sold in December for $912,000.

This apartment is 1000 sf larger and is 4 bedrooms and 3 baths. Just to compare...

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 12:56 PM

Dibs: That's HILARIOUS! - what a poor marketing selling point!

The pics of the rooms they chose look very pretty and the space one would have is amazing. But yet again I have issue with no pics of kitchen and bath, so we are to assume those need work and that $3K mainteance a month is ridiculous

Posted by: gemini10 at February 3, 2010 12:57 PM

Food Coop! LOL

Posted by: Boerumresident at February 3, 2010 12:57 PM

If I were in the market for a 4 bedroom co-op in Park Slope, I'd choose this one, though:

http://www.bhsbrooklyn.com/detail.asp?id=910767

Too bad it's almost 4 mil.

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 12:58 PM

Dave,

This apartment overlooks the wonderful Greenmarket at Grand Army Plaza, and is surely where anyone looking at this apartment will want to purchase their fruits, vegetables and fish. :)

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:00 PM

Regardless of working at the Co-op, this is a lovely apartment in plan and in the rooms shown, but the lack of photos is suspicious.

I assume this is full-service, so $3K for that size is not all that ridiculous.

Posted by: Boerumresident at February 3, 2010 1:01 PM

"Maintenance is a tough-to-swallow $3,008 per month though."

Tough to swallow, its like an additional $600K mortgage!

That means you are paying the equivalent of a 2.6 mil.

Id rather buy a really nice town house.

Posted by: newsouthsloper at February 3, 2010 1:01 PM

i could see the type of family who buys this place working at the food co-op actually, being all salt of the earth, pretending to be middle class, pretending they dont think their children are precious little snowflakes but just like every other kid in nyc, just all around being general phonies.

so yeah, it could very well be a selling point.

*rob*

Posted by: Butterfly at February 3, 2010 1:01 PM

P.S. The maintenance on the 1300 sf 2 bedroom which sold in December was $1800.

So clearly *SOME* people do pay these maintenance fees.

Given that this is almost twice as large, $3000 doesn't seem totally out of line for this apartment.

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:02 PM

How can an apt be "elusive"? Does it run away when you try to go inside?

Posted by: DeadCatBounce at February 3, 2010 1:02 PM

11217, that PS coop made me drool on my keyboard. it was so nice that even the 4k maintenance didn't even bother me. if the cashflow was comparable, I prefer living in a huge aptmt than in a house

Posted by: more4less at February 3, 2010 1:06 PM

More4less,

I think that might be one of the nicest apartments I've ever seen. Seriously crazypants beautiful.

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:07 PM

"Obviously the proximity to the Food Coop is not a selling point that has people scrambling to snap this up."

ummm... you're right, it's NOT a selling point. Nowhere in the Corcoran ad is the Food Coop mentioned. brownstoner is not the real estate agent for this apartment, and I'm pretty sure the "within walking distance of the Park Slope Co-op" line was sarcasm.

Posted by: TD at February 3, 2010 1:08 PM

*Rob*, all parents think their children are 'precious little snowflakes'. Every. Single. One. Of. Us.

And they are precious! To us. ;)

Also, why would working at the food coop necessitate 'pretending' to be middle class? Or mean only wholesale phoniness?

You have a chip on your shoulder in need of ATTENTION! Go on and get some caulking immediately.

Now go about your business.

Posted by: Nokilissa at February 3, 2010 1:08 PM

When I'm rich in my dottage years this is exactly the type of space I need. A bldg with an elevator and space for the nurse and bartender. The ceiling light in bedroom looks so builder square.

Posted by: DeLepp at February 3, 2010 1:12 PM

It's also about the best subway accessible location in all of Park Slope.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at February 3, 2010 1:12 PM

Umm... OK, I said I would calm down... so this question is in that calmer spirit.

Is $3,000 a month really that "hard to swallow" when you are already buying a TWO MILLION DOLLAR apartment? I mean, really. Newsouthsloper said it's basically like taking on a $2.6 million purchase.... and?

See... this is why I said i would calm down. NONE of this smacks of reality to me.

It does include one of those undoubtedly nifty tip-of-the-triangle rooms, so that's somethin'

Posted by: tybur6 at February 3, 2010 1:12 PM

Triangular room in 47 Plaza Street West: Heaven
Triangular room in Forte: Epic Fail

Yes, Dave...I think the Park Slope co-op reference was merely intended to point out that this apartment is in the North Slope, which is desirable first and foremost because of the transportation issue (Q at 7th AND 2/3 at Grand Army Plaza) and because you are within shouting distance of the Greenmarket, Bk Museum and the Botanical Gardens, etc.

Location is terrific.

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:17 PM

Ty, I only said it does make sense because for 2.6 Mil I would buy a brownstone that has more square footage and had a yard, etc. What amenities does this place offer for your 3K a month? A doorman and a newspaper delivered to your door, plus the priviledge of servicing the massive mortgage that must be on this building.

Posted by: newsouthsloper at February 3, 2010 1:19 PM

Ty, I only said it does make sense because for 2.6 Mil I would buy a brownstone that has more square footage and had a yard, etc. What amenities does this place offer for your 3K a month? A doorman and a newspaper delivered to your door, plus the priviledge of servicing the massive mortgage that must be on this building.

Posted by: newsouthsloper at February 3, 2010 1:20 PM

Why are more than half the pics of the outside and surrounding area than of the apartment! I'd rather see more pics of the apt and can go to streetview to look at surrounding area.

That's a huge apartment.......
but that kitchen is teeny tiny and oddly configured. The laundry room is bigger than the kitchen. New owners should eat out a lot and have lots of dirty clothes.

Posted by: Expert Textpert at February 3, 2010 1:21 PM

11217, if that PS listing has an open house, I'm SO THERE and I'll be lingering around too.

this pad is super nice too. now that eastern parkway one last week (1.1M, 2200 sq ft) is creeping into my head for comparison sake. this definitely better than the all-you-can-see glass condos opposite it

Posted by: more4less at February 3, 2010 1:23 PM

BTW, this is the famous Rosario Candela designed "Flatiron" building for those who don't know it.

Candela's buildings are some of the most beautiful and coveted in the city. I think that's what the "elusive" was referring to, which is a silly term to use. Especially in a recession.

But taking that aside, some of the most famous buildings in Manhattan (Park Avenue, West End Ave, Sutton Place, etc) are Candela buildings, and they do carry a lot of prestige with them.

I believe (and maybe Montrose can correct me if I'm wrong) that this and 39 Plaza Street West (Berkeley Plaza) may be the only Rosario Candela buildings in Brooklyn...

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:25 PM

Absolutely, Newsouthsloper, for $2.6 million you can get something much better. My point is that at a certain point the $$ doesn't seem to matter anymore. In this case, I don't really see a difference between a monthly maintenance of $1500 or one of $4500....

Posted by: tybur6 at February 3, 2010 1:26 PM

I always loved that building... but the kitchen is tiny, and probably needs help. Someone like 11217 or rob who eats a lot of takeout (?)

:-)

Posted by: denton at February 3, 2010 1:27 PM

"I don't really see a difference between a monthly maintenance of $1500 or one of $4500...."


You don't?? Most single people who own 1 bedrooms in Manhattan pay more than $750 in maintenance a month. You get married, double it, and there you go...$1500 a month. No biggie.

4500 on the other hand is in a whole other league...

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:29 PM

I almost never do take out, Denton. Maybe 10 times a year, if that.

I eat out often and cook a ton.

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:30 PM

A few years back we looked at this same line of apartments on a different floor. It's a great building, self managed and in immaculate condition. The only nitpick is the shape of the master BR. Great to have all those windows, but the odd shape makes it a challenge to fit a queen-sized bed (I remember this from my visit to the other apartment too). There is very little closet space in the MBR, though you could use one of the other three bedrooms for clothes storage.

Posted by: zeebee_in_bklyn at February 3, 2010 1:31 PM

My old building, 135 East 54th Street, is a Candela building as well, built in 1948. I'd have to say, though it was an incredibly well managed condo, the building itself was rather blah.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at February 3, 2010 1:32 PM

From a design standpoint, all of the interior walls are masonry. In the hallway, outside my unit, I could hear the guy at the end of the hall playing his piano but once inside my apartment, I never heard a sound froma ny other aprtment, including above.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at February 3, 2010 1:33 PM

When I was 10, one of my best friends lived in this apartment (lower floor, I think, but same layout). I remember that I felt so sorry for him that he had to live in such a small apartment in an icky building in a noisy location.

Posted by: shillstoner at February 3, 2010 1:34 PM

This one was built in 1928, Dave.

I looked at an apartment for sale in a Candela building on West End Avenue when I was looking...also very well managed and the price was right, but the maintenance put it above my budget.

It had a gorgeous lobby though...

Posted by: 11217 at February 3, 2010 1:35 PM

11217 -- I'm talking when you are already plopping down Two Million for an apartment. Like I said, these numbers don't even register in my head. $1500 to $4000.... or anything in between. It's all more than I even pay for rent.

But to be fair, I would really like to have one of those little tip-o-the-triangle rooms. Maybe that's worth the equivalent of $2.6 million!

Posted by: tybur6 at February 3, 2010 1:36 PM

Tybur6 no offense but are wealthy people such a mystery to you (and others, just picking on you bc of your post) that it is inconceivable to understand that somone who can afford a 2m apartment may not be able to afford one that is effectively 2.6m? Yet every single time an 1m+ listing. Occurs that requires very high carry (either maintennce or taxes or school) and the carry costs are mentioned, someone has to reflexivly post something to the effect....does these expenses matter for someone who can afford this place....let me answer this one last time because apparently some people are so naive about people who earn more than 350k that they can't even utilize reasonable judgement....

YES EXPENSES MATTER....people buying a home generally have some budget, people don't cross shop 2m altar with 20m altar for a reason....there money is limited to some extent (granted higher then yours) but still limited and so if a unit (in virtually any priced range) has unusually high expenses then IT MATTERS, so please stop asking.

Posted by: fsrg at February 3, 2010 1:49 PM

So... $3000 per month is a lot? :-)

(just teasing. but yes, wealthy people are a bit of a mystery to me. it's like a vegan wanting to know what a hot dog tastes like.)

Posted by: tybur6 at February 3, 2010 2:00 PM

(to be clear, I'm the vegan and wealthy people are the hot dog eaters in this metaphor.)

Posted by: tybur6 at February 3, 2010 2:03 PM

11217, I confess I'm not that up on Brooklyn Candela buildings. This is certainly a great one, however. I need to do some research, and when I do, will do a Candela piece on Walkabout.

Posted by: Montrose Morris at February 3, 2010 2:06 PM

Sadly, this building is not on the Columbia collection of original offering documents that NOP linked to last week.

Posted by: Boerumresident at February 3, 2010 2:10 PM

$3000 is not a lot for an apartment of this size in a full service coop building. In Manhattan $3500 for this large an apartment would be on the low side. In a lot of these smaller prewar coops, the maintenance is not what it is because there is a huge underlying mortgage, but rather because of the salaries -- chances are this building employs several doormen, a live-in super, and a porter or two. I understand that not everyone thinks it would be worthwhile to have a building staff -- but if you work long hours, or if you're looking for a place you can keep well into retirement, doormen and such can be invaluable.

Posted by: ilovebrooklyn at February 3, 2010 2:13 PM

hey 1121, suck on this!

Goldman May Lose Record Profit to Bid-Ask Spread: Chart of Day

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=a4iH4BSl.4xQ&pos=15

Posted by: stevieb at February 3, 2010 2:15 PM

If I am not mistaken, this building still has an elevator operator. How very quaint. Annoying, mind you, but quaint.

Posted by: DitmasSnark at February 3, 2010 2:26 PM

I think One Plaza also has an elevator operator, or at least it did a few years ago.

Posted by: Boerumresident at February 3, 2010 2:44 PM

All snarking aside, that pad looks totally bitchin'.

The only thing it seems to lack is outdoor space. With that view, I want a terrace upon which to lounge and survey my domain.

Posted by: DitmasSnark at February 3, 2010 3:31 PM

Brownstoner:

This is a fine building by Rosario Candela, for those of us who are fans of pre-War New York apartments, also known as the architect for 740 Park Avenue, recently dubbed "the most expensive apartment house in the world." There prices can go over 30-million. For this top-of-the line Park Slope number, the price is a "mere" two-million. Seven-forty and other Candela buildings on the East Side also often require all-cash; here it's only 25-percent down. For Brooklynites with a passion for Candela and can afford it, this apartment is a no-brainer.

What I love about this building is that you can see the architect struggle with the odd geometry of the site -- and win! Sure there are odd nooks and crannies, but Candela's mastery of the apartment "problem" allows him to provide the formality and hierarchy among rooms expected of upper-class apartments of the time within the building site's complex intersection of triangle and circle.

Before the Depression, there were two great rivals in New York apartment-house design. Candela, who built the most expensive apartments in the city, and Emery Roth, who also built on Park and Fifth Avenues but was best known for upper-middle-class buildings like the Majestic and El Dorado along Central Park West. The contrasts between the two men's differences are telling.

Candela's work was more formal, the rooms bigger, the spaces more rigorously defined. Roth's was slightly freer and spatially more economical and open. In hindsight, Roth was the more "advanced" architect, as was appropriate to his market of rising merchants and businessmen who reflected the emergence in New York of a robust Jewish middle- and upper-middle class. These were people who wanted to be "modern" as they moved from old-fashioned tenement neighborhoods. Candela, on the other hand, catered to a more established clientele of old-line, often Anglo-Saxon New Yorkers who grudgingly gave up their private houses to live in apartments and who found he could give them "houses in the air."

As they did in Manhattan, Candela and Roth faced off in Park Slope, where their buildings share Grand Army Plaza and Prospect Park West addresses. Interestingly, both men were from immigrant families and sometimes built for developers who'd restrict people like them from living in the apartments they designed. (Roth wasn't even allowed to join the American Institute of Architects, which at the time was run like a private club.) Nevertheless, they'd help define the skyline of New York -- and a little bit of Brooklyn's.

My own co-op is by Roth. Yes, it's old and sags and squeaks in parts, but there's nothing quite like stepping into the lobby with its five different marbles, bronze torcheres, trompe l'oeil ceiling and star-patterned terrazzo floor to make me feel I'm in New York. For a pre-War apartment aficianado, as great a high a brownstoner must feel arriving at his stoop.

Come to think of it, Mr. B., maybe I should start writing an occasional column about Brooklyn's pre-War apartment houses. There are lots of great of examples by prominent architects like Candela and Roth and many others who are less known but whose work enriches the borough, including the brownstone belt.

Nostalgic on Park Avenue

Posted by: NOP at February 3, 2010 4:14 PM

An elevator operator? Really? You'd have ti pay me to live there , that is beyond annoying.

Posted by: fsrg at February 3, 2010 4:19 PM

"if you're looking for a place you can keep well into retirement, doormen and such can be invaluable.

Posted by: ilovebrooklyn at February 3, 2010 2:13 PM"


With that maintenance, you might never be able to afford to retire!

Posted by: the chicken at February 3, 2010 4:22 PM

NOP, that would be great, I loved the information you just posted, of which I knew nothing beyond what the AIA guide has told me. I would be the first to tell anyone that apartment buildings, especially upscale 20th century ones, are not my area of expertise. I'd love to know more.

Posted by: Montrose Morris at February 3, 2010 5:24 PM

People who didn't grow up in NYC may not understand but co-ops like these are the best addresses in the city. Co-op boards keep out people who just have money and the owners don't want terraces or backyards because they have country homes for these. There are many wealthy and prominent people who live in these buildings and the doormen etc. provide privacy, security and services. In a way no private house (like mine) is comparable unless you have your own staff.

Posted by: mimi at February 3, 2010 6:28 PM

I would not say that this building, or this odd floorplan, was Rosario Candela's finest hour.

Posted by: Minard Lafever at February 3, 2010 7:58 PM

If you think buying a townhouse means you don't have to pay maintenance, forget it.

We own a townhouse a few blocks from this listing, and believe me, we're paying maintenance. Heat, hot water, taxes, new mechanicals, upgrades, facade, sidewalk repair, backyard, general upkeep. These things require ongoing maintenance. Maybe not $3000 month, but it adds up quick.

Posted by: likes2lurk at February 3, 2010 10:06 PM

MASTERPIECE! Damn, if I had the dough, I'd snap this baby up fast, if the coop would have me, that is!

Posted by: RinTinTin at February 3, 2010 10:43 PM

I'd love to have somebody hold the elevator door for me as I'm struggling in with the stroller and my bags from shopping at the farmers market across the way. And the porter picks up our garbage FIVE DAYS a week from our back service entrance door? I'm sold. The kind of people who are approved by the coop board to buy here won't have a mortgage or much of it, and they won't mind at all paying $3k for those services. Not everyone wants to clean up a basement flood in a brownstone at 2am on a rainy night. The buyers to compare to here aren't those who buy a Park Slope brownstone with a tenant to help pay the mortgage. Something like this sells to somebody who sees it as a bargain compared to Park Ave in Manhattan, something that allows them buy a summer place too.

Posted by: traditionalmod at February 4, 2010 9:36 AM

I live on this Street and I agree that the location is fantastic, particularly if you are an ex-Manhattanite and have grown accustomed to easy subway access. I think rich folks take the subway, but perhaps not.
As you might expect, the building is very picky about who they let in. I had a wealthy friend who was rejected. Still a mystery as to why.
Strangely no one coming in or out of the building looks the least bit affluent or glamorous.

Posted by: PlazaMan at February 4, 2010 1:25 PM

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