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November 17, 2009

Footage from 357 4th Street Condo Lawsuit

Holy crap! We were just sent the link to a video the plaintiffs in the Corcoran lawsuit made a couple of years ago to document the flooding problems in their newly purchased condo at 357 4th Street.
Corcoran Found Negligent in Park Slope Condo Sale [Brownstoner]
State Supreme Court Rules Corcoran "Negligent" [TRD]
E-mail Shows Couple's Suit vs. Corcoran Group Holds Water [NYDN]

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Comments

HOLY SHIT! Now that's a lotta water. The developer should definitely be on the hook for that one. I still say however that the jury is out wrt Corco's liability here (you can read my post in the other thread).

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 11:58 AM

HOLY SHIT is right.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 17, 2009 12:02 PM

OMG!!! That's unacceptable. Shame on the developer. That shouldn't happen in a recently renovated house.

If there is a lawsuit going on can/should this evidence be made public?

Posted by: Expert Textpert at November 17, 2009 12:02 PM

Expert, unless the judge issues a gag order, it's all fair game to put out in public.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:04 PM

Thanks Snapesquire,

Is Gag Order a legalese term? It's sure to get Dave all wound up.

Posted by: Expert Textpert at November 17, 2009 12:08 PM

When a conversion like this takes place, is there or is there not a final inspection by the city that would look at the grading of the land surrounding the building (seems like it was not properly sloped for runoff away from the building) and proper drainage mechanisms (or could it be that the drainage was fine and later became severely backed up thus allowing the water to run into what appears to be the lower level of this duplex)? It would seem as though some sloppy shit went down work here work-wise and perhaps city inspectors were snoozing on the job as well.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:08 PM

LOL Expert! A judge doesn't issue a gag order in the way Dave thinks of it :)

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:09 PM

Too bad the brokers weren't the Clinton Hill poets (Abdul Muid and I blank.)
A River Runs Through It
Beautiful contemporary home, thoughtfully blending the outside/inside. Let nature come in!
Top notch development provides a flexible, flowing layout that will let you enjoy the outdoor year round. Lovely Park Slope location, the Very Best for the Discerning buyer. Don't walk, swim to this one! Will not last!!

Posted by: Maly at November 17, 2009 12:12 PM

That's not a "flooding problem" - it's an indoor waterway! Jeez.

Posted by: East New York at November 17, 2009 12:17 PM

Perhaps they should have thrown in an ark with the price of this unit. This is a shame. A damn shame.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:17 PM

OH MY GOD. Those poor people. I would lose my mind. I also would not stand there in the water if it is over a foot. Could get electrocuted, no?

Posted by: mopar at November 17, 2009 12:21 PM

I will keep this in mind next time we have a little plumbing leak (we seem to have a new one every day.) It's not so bad!

Posted by: mopar at November 17, 2009 12:23 PM

Wow! That is totally f*cked up!! I do have a tough time believing- considering the sheer volume of water pouring in, that Corcoran did not know about this. The one email about canceling because of a heavy thunderstorm looks to be really suspicious now. And no way the developer could have possibly not known. (All the animals two by two outside the door is a dead giveaway).

Posted by: bxgrl at November 17, 2009 12:23 PM

My mouth is agape. I can not even imagine the horror.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 17, 2009 12:23 PM

silly buyers, that's just the salt water pool amenity!

ugh, seriously tho, that suuuuucks, good they got it all on video. but why was someone literally frolicking barefoot in the water at one point in the video?

*rob*

Posted by: Butterfly at November 17, 2009 12:24 PM

I can't imagine any scenario in which Corcoran didn't know. Even a day or two after the rain has stopped you'd have to imagine that there would be water residue still remaining on the tile floor right? All of that can't dissipate overnight.

Insanity.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 17, 2009 12:30 PM

How long does it take for mold to set up shop? How long does it take to properly and fully abate the mold? I ask because I am now really wondering about the qualifications of the inspector they used (if any was used at all). If showings were delayed due to this water park appearing in the rec room, and said showings were repeatedly delayed due to the same, why did the inspector (again, assuming there was one) not see/report water damage? Surely soaked drywall is discoverable. Which leads to my above questions about the timetable for the appearance of mold and its subsequent remediation.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:32 PM

"Walks like a duck, talks like a duck . . . so on.

Posted by: foulplay at November 17, 2009 12:32 PM

And in this apartment, it apparently can float like a duck too.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:35 PM

Snappy...with any water like that, the drywall and the insulation are already toast. Mold will start soon but can be stopped.

This is NOT an $800,000 job to remebdy as was alluded to in the other thread.

I suspect the drain outside the door goes nowhere...it needs a sump system installed. That said, something's definitely wrong at the top of the stairs to allow all that water to flow down. The drain will never handle all of it.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 17, 2009 12:35 PM

Dave, how can the mold be efficiently stopped if the source (ie the water slide that is the stairs, poor drain and clearly not sealed door) is not fixed? Obviously the source wasn't fixed as evidenced by the video.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 12:38 PM

It can be stopped only after the water problem is fixed. But mold remediation of this sort is not a big deal.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 17, 2009 12:52 PM

snappy- mold can start within a day. Once the source is stopped- but also, all the mold has to be gotten out. That can be more extensive than anticipated.

Posted by: bxgrl at November 17, 2009 12:57 PM

Guy looks at phone and reads "It's December 21st, 2012 and as you can see, we got a lot of water pouring in here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Posted by: IMBY at November 17, 2009 12:58 PM

THL, is right. Water of this magnitude would yield lingering mildew smells long after they pump the water out and scrub the tile. Smells eminating from nooks like behind that louver panel...A-m-a-z-i-n-g that an inspector missed this. That's who I'd be suing.

Posted by: bowl of dicks at November 17, 2009 1:04 PM

So if the mold can only be fixed after the water problem is remedied, shouldn't there have been some evidence of mold or at the very least water damage for the inspector to see and report? I suppose it's also possible that the buyers knew of some water problem (possibly downplayed) and were assured that it was fixed. But that still leaves the inspector looking like an incompetent dumbass.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 1:04 PM

"an incompetent dumbass"

Is that the technical legal term?

Can you say that in Latin for me...slowly, while you're peeling a grape and feeding it to me in your toga???

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 17, 2009 1:13 PM

Note: this is not defending Corcoran or the builder.

But, there was a massive amount of flooding on that day. I remember all of the drains backing up in PS and PH, my house included:

Here's a link
http://bk.ly/0t

Posted by: quig at November 17, 2009 1:19 PM

Heartbreaking for the owners. Extremely sobering for any potential buyers of anything in Brooklyn. What a nightmare.

For those of you who missed it on the previous thread, the Corcoran posting, proudly bragging the condo's sold status!

http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=877070

For those of you in the know, how could this happen? It looks like there is no drainage whatsoever -- except what drains into the house.

Posted by: Brooklyn Chicken at November 17, 2009 1:21 PM

Wow, that's pretty awful. Seems like there would have been a waterline mark on the walls, or mold. Good luck to the owners.

Posted by: Montrose Morris at November 17, 2009 1:25 PM

snappy- cosmetic fix ups can be done very fast. Problem is they don't fix the issue, nor last. It would have been relatively easy to hide this problem just for apartment showings.

Posted by: bxgrl at November 17, 2009 1:29 PM

Mold will develop if the area is wet for three days. It will be all over the surface of the drywall. You won't have to guess if it's there -- you will see it. It costs thousands to remove it and replace it with new drywall. This is after you pay to stop the flood problem, of course. Another reason not to live in a basement.

Posted by: mopar at November 17, 2009 1:44 PM

So the judge awarded them $35,000 to cover the legal fees they were charged to get Corcoran to finally turn over Emails that may or may not prove there was some broker conspiracy. True? And the case is still in the discovery phase, no?

I know of a few condo buildings in the SSlope with water problems, some as bad as the ones in this video. Any good lawyer is going to find a way to recover damages for their client including looking to see if the seller/broker knew about these floods before.

With all this new construction the city's infrastructure is certainly being taxed. You can't add 40-80 new units to a street and not expect backups like the one you see in the video.
In the web site photos the garden duplex has a backyard that is completely cemented over with nowhere for the water to go but that 4" drain.

Posted by: IMBY at November 17, 2009 1:53 PM

Yes, IMBY, there is one clear WINNER here...the lawyer.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 17, 2009 1:57 PM

Re the mold, there won't be much if any. Reason is, the developer already knew the place flooded. Why? He didn't use standard wallboard, according to the story, he used wonderboard. And there's a reason he put that ceramic tile down. If he thought that space was nice and dry and tight, he would have put down a nice wood floor.

Moral: Never buy a below-grade living space with tile. The person put it there for a reason, which is that when it floods you can just mop it up. And it will flood, that's why it's there in the first place!

Posted by: denton at November 17, 2009 2:22 PM

I guess I missed it, but did the owners get out of the condo and get their money back?

(And speaking of crimes, dude, those socks with those shoes...)

Posted by: Ringo at November 17, 2009 2:23 PM

If they could prove it's a company-wide practice there might be a class-action lawsuit in this. The Corcoran broker (not this one) who sold our house to us also canceled open houses on rainy days and once we moved in we learned the basement would flood through the back door just like this video. In our case it wasn't difficult to fix. Still, it all begs the question did both brokers separately decide to do that or was it the company's instruction to brokers?

Posted by: traditionalmod at November 17, 2009 2:24 PM

It looks like most of the water is coming up from an under stoop drain (if you pause when he opens the door you can see the water ‘mound’ over the drain hole).

This happens VERY often in Park Slope when it rains heavily. The combined storm-sewer system is overloaded and you get a “backflow” condition where sewer water runs INTO your drain pipes instead of out.

Most of this can be prevented with a plumbing item called a “check valve.” Any good plumber will be able to install one on your main drain line. One drawback: Until the flow resumes it’s normal course (out, not in) you can’t use your plumbing fixtures. That said, it normally subsides after an hour or two.

There also looks to be water coming in from the HVAC PVC lines from foundation hydrostatic pressure (a bigger deal and not as easily corrected).

Posted by: Mr Joist at November 17, 2009 3:49 PM

So why didn't a building inspector find this?

Posted by: NYGuy7 at November 17, 2009 4:00 PM

I would say that less than 10% of homes in Park Slope have check valves. Probably more than 50% still have lead water mains.

Check Valves are not a construction quality or code item so an inspector would have no reason to “flag” it. There definitely seem to be other foundation leakage problems with the house but (from the short video) it looks like most is coming in from the cellar front door.

Posted by: Mr Joist at November 17, 2009 4:10 PM

The owner's last name is Einstein, but he's not that smart. Open the door to let more water in?

Posted by: Breukleen at November 17, 2009 5:36 PM

LATENT DEFECT Anyone? HAHA, All that nonsense about Corcoran being a "reputable" firm. They are like any other company - as honest as their (individual) agents

Posted by: Crownlfc at November 17, 2009 11:54 PM

Corcoran is simply over rated..dumb ass agents not to be trusted.
Bunch of crooks and liars.
I will never work with them again after an awful exerience with them last year. UGH!

Posted by: tjj at November 20, 2009 7:14 PM