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October 8, 2009

Collision at Grand Army

crash_081009.jpg
There were at least half a dozen emergency vehicles filling the road near Grand Army Plaza last night around midnight, blocking traffic between the arch and the park. At the center, there were two cars in terrible condition from what looked like a head-on or perhaps side-impact collision. Despite some improvements to bicycle and pedestrian paths around Grand Army Plaza, the roads there are still some of the busiest and most dangerous in Brooklyn. When passing this particularly nasty accident scene, we didn't have the time to stop and talk to the police, but we hope that everyone involved survived unscathed.




Posted by jscheff at 9:01 AM | Comments (20)
Categories: Park Slope, Prospect Heights, Streets

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Comments

what is it about car crashes that everyone needs to look?

Posted by: Petebklyn at October 8, 2009 9:30 AM

Shocker - GAP is a death trap for drivers and peds.

Posted by: dirty_hipster at October 8, 2009 9:45 AM

I wonder if GAP will ever become what it is- a plaza. It's a shame that peds, bikers, etc are all but cut off from the gorgeous fountain area.

Posted by: Fjorder at October 8, 2009 10:03 AM


I dunno... yeah, for pedestrians (and, less so, bikes) the Grand Army Plaza is dangerous, awkward, impossible... but for cars? It's not the smoothest of traffic situations. It doesn't work. It's unnecessarily complicated. But I don't think it's actually that dangerous.

Sure, you can't be texting. Sure, you have to pay attention. Sure, there are some aggressive drivers -- and you have a be aggressive yourself (if, say, you want to go from north on Flatbush to a right on Union)... but it's not that "dangerous."

The picture above -- I also hope everyone is AOK -- I'm sure this was something fairly extraordinary. Running a red light, driving way to fast, etc. (I know, neither of those things are atypical for Brooklyn... but the complexity of the GAP actually mitigate the "danger")

What about the 70 mph drivers weaving in and out of lanes on any of the boulevard-sized roads? That's far more dangerous than almost anything in GAP. That's more common and far more pervasive in our fine city.

Just because the "intersection" is totally dysfunctional traffic-wise, it doesn't make it "dangerous." (Oh, and yes I discount fender benders and little rear enders from the definition of "danger.")

Posted by: tybur6 at October 8, 2009 10:04 AM

what if drivers actually drove in the lanes that are painted on the street instead of cutting across and making a bee line across a traffic circle? oy! dont get me started! It doesnt seem like the circle is badly designed its because some drivers are stupid, selfish and uneducated. The only solution is to put in massive concrete barriers and slow every thing way down, Even then we will see crashes but a least they will be going slower so maybe there will be less harm.
other solution? education, huge visible traffic enforcement to ticket drivers and deter future bad driving , cameras to document and ticket reckless drivers.
I know this all sounds so heavy handed but I have accepted that fact that you cannot underestimate the stupidity of many of these drivers.

Posted by: tsarina at October 8, 2009 10:36 AM

tsarina, one has to cut across lanes to get from the entry lane to certain exit lanes in many examples. I have to do it myself at when coming from Eastern Parkway to get to Prospect Park West, and theres only a short stretch to do it in. If one doesn't cut across it'll be Chevy Chase on his London roundabout a la National Lampoon's European Vacation.

Posted by: dittoburg at October 8, 2009 10:54 AM

Supposedly after 10 o'clock at night a third of drivers are alcohol-impaired.

Posted by: infinitejester at October 8, 2009 11:16 AM

"I have to do it myself at when coming from Eastern Parkway to get to Prospect Park West, and theres only a short stretch to do it in. If one doesn't cut across it'll be Chevy Chase on his London roundabout a la National Lampoon's European Vacation."

Posted by: dittoburg at October 8, 2009 10:54 AM


I chuckled at this one, but dittoburg you're so right, coming from Eastern Pkway and trying to get to PPW can
be daunting!

Posted by: bren at October 8, 2009 11:30 AM

Tsarina -- Can't agree with you more! This is why the NYPD has to start ENFORCING TRAFFIC LAWS.

It's a huge revenue stream that could be tapped and it could actually make traffic function properly.

I have only been living in the city for a few years, but I'm thinking traffic enforcement MUST have happened at some point. For example, everyone seems very well trained (even the complete assholes that drive at 70 mph on a side street) to not turn right on red. Why is that? There must have been a flurry of tickets at some point to get them to maintain this behavior.... no?

They are rebuilding the traffic circle at Prospect Parkway and Coney Island Avenue at the bottom of the park... but the BIGGEST problem with that circle is that there are 4 lanes -- which is appropriate -- BUT folks turn right from the CENTER. That's so effing illegal and dangerous. Two right lanes may turn onto the two lanes of Coney Is Avenue... not all four! But there's no on ticketing... so why shouldn't they drive wherever they want? Why don't folks just drive right through the island in the center?!

Posted by: tybur6 at October 8, 2009 11:32 AM

" For example, everyone seems very well trained (even the complete assholes that drive at 70 mph on a side street) to not turn right on red. Why is that? There must have been a flurry of tickets at some point to get them to maintain this behavior.... no?"

Umm, no T6. It was never legal to make a right on red in NYC, (except SI) so why would people do it thinking it was legal

Posted by: denton at October 8, 2009 12:32 PM

Sing it, Tyburg. And WHY is NYC leaving this tasty traffic enforcement income on the table?

Posted by: Brooklyn Chicken at October 8, 2009 12:55 PM

I hope all involved in this crash above is ok!!!

I don't think GAP is dangerous at all, it's poorly planned,but dangerous - not really? people need to start focusing on DRIVING when DRIVING! - I don't text,eat,or drink my coffee or put on mascara or read the Effin NYtimes - all things I have witnessed Brooklyn drivers to do.
and what is this talk about thr NYPD enforcing driving behavior?
Really? Come on! - oh so, if I am behind some idiot who is showing his mother how beauiful the PPW brownstones are and they are driving 15 mph veering left and right with no blinker and I start to road rage a bit, honk my horn and creep up reaaaaal close behind him- who gets the ticket?

Posted by: gemini10 at October 8, 2009 1:07 PM

It takes slightly longer but is a lot less hair-raising to go off Eastern Pkwy onto the service road opposite the museum & then turn onto Plaza St. at the Meier Bldg. to get to Lincoln Pl., Union St. or PPW.

Posted by: Arkady at October 8, 2009 1:15 PM

Driving the sling shot from Eastern Parkway to Prospect Park West around GAP is white knuckled driving not for the faint of heart. I figured out a long time ago, that the best way to go from Eastern Parkway to Prospect Park West is to use Plaza Street.

Posted by: BrooklynIsHome at October 8, 2009 1:54 PM

I guess it depends on the type of driver you are.
I do that run from Eastern Parkway to PPW all the time and have never had trouble getting over. you have to be aggressive and you have to know when to break and let others in that need to then go across the opposite way(Flatbush to Eastern Parkway)

Posted by: gemini10 at October 8, 2009 2:04 PM

I've lived on flatbush in PLG and now live in Crown Heights and I've done the traffic circle ALOT. It all works well if people follow the lanes and realize that that it is a circle and turns are made from the outside right. Oh it also works if drivers realize that they are not the only one on the road. But to add to the list of things drivers have done...
going south on Flatbush cut across all lanes when entering the circle to get into the left (center) of the traffic circle and thus impede drivers trying to merge from the left to the right. I have witnessed these same drivers in the left lane then cut back across lanes of traffic to go down Flatbush. I guess they feel that a straight line drive thru a traffic circle is the way to go. they must die.

then there are the drivers at the west side of the circle that stop and block traffic so that they can cross the line of traffic at a 90 degree angle. The correct way, of course is to keep driving, follow the lines to merge with traffic, and cross the lanes while moving. It is easier and faster to cross the lanes individually moving with traffic than waiting for all of Brooklyn to stop moving so you can cross perpendicularly all at once. jesus!!! its a traffic circle.!!!!

Posted by: tsarina at October 8, 2009 2:47 PM

tsarina, there is one exception to the "turns are made from the outside right;" and that is you can legally (there's a sign) make a left onto Plaza St. E as you head East onto Eastern Parkway (near the site of last nights accident). Therefore, if you are heading South on Flatbush, you will want to get all the way to the left lane in order to make that left onto Plaza Street East. I agree that the ideal way is to merge from one lane to the next, but unfortunately the way that traffic patterns and red lights are timed, you can't always do that and one ends up having to cut across the lanes at some point thereby holding up traffic. WRT GAP in general, I have seen some crazy things: 1. Drivers making a left from the service road on Eastern Parkway to get on Flatbush Avenue going North. 2. Drivers making a LEFT from Eastern Parkway to go SOUTH (i.e. the WRONG WAY) on Flatbush. 3. People going straight off the Eastern Parkway service road, over the sidewalk, onto Flatbush Avenue going North. 4. Drivers cutting through the Plaza (between the arch and the fountain).

I am curious about the suggestion that has been proposed to make PPW a two way street, and have the East and West sides of GAP also be two-way. It would mean more lights, and probably more congestion, but slower and safer.

In any event, something needs to be done. Either some better timed lights and better signs, better traffic enforcement,or a redesign of the Plaza.

Posted by: neone at October 8, 2009 3:19 PM

What I hate is what happens when eastbound drivers leave GAP: they accelerate like crazy on Eastern Parkway to release all of the frustrations accumulated while getting through the plaza. I pity the poor folks trying to cross the EPW in front of the Museum and Botanic Garden. And then there are all of the pedestrians and cyclists squeezed onto the 10 foot wide sidewalk on the south side of the Parkway, half of which is blocked with multiple tree pits. How do you spell planning disaster?

Posted by: thisnthat at October 8, 2009 3:43 PM


Denton... It has never been legal to drive at 60 mph down Eastern Parkway either, but plenty of people do that! So why don't they turn on read? I think "disobeying a traffic signal" is far less of an infraction than "driving to endanger" -- but the latter happens, and the former does not.

(Of course just running red lights straight through happens fairly commonly, but I VERY seldom see rights on red. Actually, it's really curious!)

Posted by: tybur6 at October 8, 2009 4:17 PM

neone, you are right about the left turn unto plaza st., i just didnt include that exception because my comment was already too busy.

Posted by: tsarina at October 8, 2009 7:19 PM

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