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September 8, 2009

Last Week's Biggest Sales

lwbs%2009-08-2009.jpg

1. BROOKLYN HEIGHTS $3,050,000
45 State Street GMAP (left)
This house was purchased by a developer a few years ago and then marketed for $4,250,000 in '08; by the time it was an Open House Pick this May, it was listed for $3,900,000. Entered into contract on 6/25/09; closed on 8/20/09; deed recorded on 9/1/09.

2. PROSPECT HEIGHTS $2,300,000
On Prospect Park, Unit 10E GMAP (right)
This is an 1,825-sf, 3-bedroom unit in the Meier-designed condo, according to StreetEasy. Entered into contract on 12/17/07; closed on 8/27/09; deed recorded on 9/4/09.

3. BOERUM HILL $1,800,000
291 State Street GMAP
This four-story brownstone was a House of the Day twice: First in November '08, when it was listed for $2,250,000, and then in January '09, when the price had come down a touch, to $2,100,000. Entered into contract on 6/11/09; closed on 8/27/09; deed recorded on 9/2/09.

4. CARROLL GARDENS $1,690,000
6 3rd Street GMAP
The last ask on this 4-story townhouse was $1,895,000 late last year, according to StreetEasy. Entered into contract on 5/8/09; closed on 7/24/09; deed recorded on 9/4/09.

5. GOWANUS $1,650,500
162 Douglass Street GMAP
This renovated townhouse was listed for $1,825,000 in April, according to StreetEasy. Entered into contract on 6/22/09; closed on 8/20/09; deed recorded on 9/2/09.

State Street pic from StateandHicks.




Posted by Gabby at 11:30 AM | Comments (36)
Categories: Sales

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Lots of familiar addresses today!

Posted by: brownstoner at September 8, 2009 11:33 AM

shall I say to all the 'eew, that is so close to the projects it can't sell for more than $1m people that Douglass St sale for $1.65m directly faces 'the projects'...not nearby or down the street.

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 8, 2009 11:38 AM

I dont know Pete. 390 Per sft in Gowanus might not be a very good indicator.

Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at September 8, 2009 11:55 AM

bbb-
you're joking right? that is a healthy price for that house in that location. sq ft is vastly overstated via inclusion of the cellar.

rest-
i guess the collapse of the "upper end" is still just in the gestation stage of the collapse. 5 sales over 1.6 and all look like strong prices even if ask was inflated in 1 or 2 cases.

also another sale for the widget underpricer.
743 Eastern Parkway listed for 650K sold for 6% less at 612.5 or 12% more than Le Widget predicted (548.5). HOTD 4/20/09.

Dommage. There's always next week.

Posted by: antidope at September 8, 2009 12:07 PM

I agree with you Antidope about Gowanus, but to be fair on the Richard Meier place...that went to contract in 2007 and just closed in 09.

I'm just happy to see people living there now and the building has really nice curb appeal.

The rest of the sales look healthy.

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 12:10 PM

yeah, how did they get that sq ftage?
bldg is almost 19x50' x 4 = 3800. then they took the cellar..musta dug out deeper in back yard and added space.
But they took off most of the former garden level to have double height from the former cellar.
So really it is 2 double duplexes. Very, very nicely modern done. But the point is people do pay good money and aren't turned off by projects as some folks here seem to indicate.
(and please don't call it gowanus).

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 8, 2009 12:23 PM

$1250/psf for the Meier building? So these are people that were locked in at the height of the bubble and didn't want to lose their deposits? Just seems crazy, when you could get a mint brownstone anywhere in Brooklyn or a comparable apartment in Tribeca or Soho for that kind of price today.

Posted by: Frederick Law Homestead at September 8, 2009 12:27 PM

ok so take the cellar out and its 430 Per sft. Still not good , I wish I had not got in at the top.

Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at September 8, 2009 12:32 PM

they're not locked into buying the apt. they choose to close at the contracted price rather than walk from their 10% downpayment.

you can take one of two viewpoints:

1) they're idiots that don't know what going on, what's gone on and what will go on.

2) they believe that the market value of the building is not severely below their contracted price and/or that prices will rebound. they would be tarred and feathered as bulls around these parts...

Posted by: antidope at September 8, 2009 12:33 PM

"when you could get a mint brownstone anywhere in Brooklyn or a comparable apartment in Tribeca or Soho for that kind of price today."


Agree about the brownstone, but you really can not get a comparable (to On Prospect Park) in Tribeca or Soho for less than $2000 psf. The name of the architect does indeed matter in this instance, even if you don't personally like the building.

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 12:36 PM


Carroll Gardens + Gowanus on fire....gotta be COUGAR related

Posted by: bklyn14 at September 8, 2009 12:39 PM

Regarding the Douglass Street home... I don't understand.
Why would anyone pay that much to live across the street from PJs (projects)? Could someone explain?

Posted by: brownlime at September 8, 2009 12:43 PM

Bklyn14 wrote: "Carroll Gardens + Gowanus on fire....gotta be COUGAR related"

What is "COUGAR"?

Posted by: brownlime at September 8, 2009 12:48 PM

"Could someone explain?"


Some of us have chosen to live in NYC precisely because it is one of the most diverse cities on the planet, where rich live side by side with poor, white with black, etc etc.

And then I guess there are those who don't like the diversity, but live here anyway and wish they could erect a wall around their disneyfied bubble they choose to live in.

You are aware that there are projects all over Manhattan...Chelsea, Lower East Side, Upper West Side, Hell's Kitchen....all within spitting distance of multi-million dollar apartments, correct...?

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 12:49 PM

11217, it's one thing to live across, next, near,... projects and another to pay 1.7M to do so - think that was brownlime's point.

Posted by: more4less at September 8, 2009 12:52 PM

11217: Great point.

Posted by: sebb at September 8, 2009 12:54 PM

I think that houses that show in excellent condition will exact high prices. Douglass Street was just such a house -- you only need one buyer to meet that price. Those projects aren't really all that bad. Much worse for this house is that it is kind of a haul to the trains (except for the F maybe). I also have heard mixed feelings about PS 32.

In terms of collapse vs. strength of high end market, I think this week's sales are a good mark that we are looking at 2005/2006 prices for the fall season, which is not bad news for sellers (if the house is in good condition and shows ok).

Posted by: Boerumresident at September 8, 2009 12:55 PM

And my point M4L is that people do it all over Manhattan and it's a non issue. Within a couple block radius in Chelsea there are projects and then apartments which cost 5 million dollars right next door.

People in Brooklyn are such pathetic whiners sometimes.

That same Gowanus house would cost a million dollars more to be farther away from the projects. I'm not sure exactly how much more of a discount you want on a 4000 sf nice home like that. This seems about what homes in Gowanus sell for...the last couple on Wyckoff (sandwiched between 2 projects) both sold for more than anyone here predicted.

The brownstoner bunch is a rare one and not necessarily the voice of all of Brooklyn. Thank GOD!

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 12:57 PM

Antidope -

There is a third possibility. By combining the info above (contract date 12/17/07) and the Street Easy info of only one listing price of $2,725,000, it is possible that the building did knock off $425,000 in order to get the deal closed.
Maybe its bullish, maybe its bearish, but if that is what happened, it certainly is different.

Posted by: Ledbury at September 8, 2009 12:57 PM

And I used to walk by those projects in Gowanus nearly every day for 6 months. Gay old me. NEVER did I have a problem. As boreumresident says...they really aren't that bad.

Take a look at the crime statistics....it's a hell of a lot safer to live in the Gowanus area than it is to live in many sections of Bed Stuy and Crown Heights.

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 1:00 PM

11217--totally agree with your perspective here. Thanks.

Posted by: wasder at September 8, 2009 1:03 PM

11217, I grew up next to the projects. I still go to the projects all the time and have no issues whatsoever. That's me. I'm sure some people have issues with the projects. at 1.7M, I can see brownlime's point. you telling me there's no good alternative in that area that can be had at 1.7M? knock a few hundred K off, then I'm in your camp - ie hey, the price already accounts for any project discount, etc

Posted by: more4less at September 8, 2009 1:06 PM

ledbury-
i will not argue that the top has been knocked off the real estate market.

however, 1250/sqft and an ungodly monthly maintenance to live in prospect heights is a solid price. i don't care what the ask was. it doesn't matter. if there were another comp that matches perfectly (ideally the same unit), i would not be surprised if price was 10-15% off peak. it is hardly 50% off.

boerumresident-
agree with point about finished houses selling better.
disagree that we are at 2005/06 prices. what's your data?

Posted by: antidope at September 8, 2009 1:07 PM

for me, it's not so much the safety of the projects as the fact that there is always a ton of car traffic around them and that for whatever reason (don't receive very good services like trash pickups? i dunno) they are often pretty dirty in a way that no amount of good neighborliness will ever improve. not necessarily more so than other parts of brooklyn, but in the case of douglass in particular, gmaps suggests that it looks directly into the trash dump area of the housing complex, which i would not want outside my window. $1.6 is a decent price for that place, and strong for the area. still, i have to think that unless they got a crazy bargain on their initial purchase, the sellers couldn't have made that much on the post-reno sale.

Posted by: i disagree at September 8, 2009 1:22 PM

Antidope,

When do you think the peak was and where do you feel we are relative to it? I am not trying to be a d@ck, just curious.

A non-data driven observation is that it appears to be quite different for new condos versus established co-ops versus Brownstones.

My non-data driven, but based on anecdotes guess:
New Condos - peak Winter 2007 - down more than 30%
Established co-ops - peak Summer 2008 - down 10%
Brownstones - peak summer 2008 - down 20%

If this holds, I think these declines would be a pretty good outcome for NY property owners and would show some solid resilience with some tough regional economic news. Unfortunately, I think we have a bit to go, though.

Posted by: Brokedeveloper at September 8, 2009 1:33 PM

With sale prices like these, it really makes me think about finally putting the house on the market. Phew!

Posted by: BrooklynGreene at September 8, 2009 1:33 PM

Antidope -

I don't really disagree with you, but I think we can also agree that someone who stands to lose 10% of a contract price isn't in the best position to renegotiate. And if that buyer still managed to get a 16% reduction in the price of the contract, then concluding that "they believe that the market value of the building is not severely below their contracted price and/or that prices will rebound" just seems like a leap made for the sake of being bullish.
Anyway, the sale was healthy and I am certainly not sure that what I think happened actually happened so there isn't much to discuss I guess.

Posted by: Ledbury at September 8, 2009 1:49 PM

I asked "Why would anyone pay that much (1.65 M) to live across the street from PJs (projects)?"

The response was, in part, "I guess there are those who don't like the diversity."

That response missed my point.

I like diversity.

My point is:
PJs are high-crime (even if you haven't been mugged there, they are nevertheless high-crime).
Most PJs (including this one) are architecturally very ugly.
PJs are very often poorly maintained.
The services around PJs are often lower than the population density warrants.

In sum, PJs make poor neighbors.


Posted by: brownlime at September 8, 2009 1:57 PM

Brownlime:

And my point was more specific than yours because the projects near the house in question are in fact not high crime anymore, are no less ugly than the Clinton Hill Co-ops or the Co-ops over on Congress Street in Cobble Hill, and in fact the grounds at the complex are nearly immaculate. Green, trees, flowers, the whole bit.

These particular projects are 2 blocks from Park Slope's 5th Avenue and 2 blocks to Smith Street...no lack of services either. They are low-income housing. That's all.

I'm not trying to paint them as the picture of perfection, but all projects can't be lumped together. These used to be bad and are not any longer. They've been cleaned up enormously. For that reason, people pay prices like the one above. If the projects were worse, I doubt they'd get a price like that.

Sometimes I think the Pj's (these in particular) would make better neighbors than some of my entitled, whiny, rich neighbors.

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 2:03 PM

Antidope -- No reliable block-by-block analysis, just my gut feel on where the market is for a seller to find a buyer in a reasonable amount of time (<3 months).

For example, I thought the 291 State Street place would sell for $1.6 to 1.8 M (see the HOTD thread) based on comps of houses across the street that sold in that time frame. It seems like it took a long time for the right buyer to come in with a price in that range and for the seller to take it. Or, the other possibility is that by waiting for so many months the sellers finally found a buyer at the higher end.

Posted by: Boerumresident at September 8, 2009 2:27 PM

11217:

That these PJs are "no less ugly than the Clinton Hill Co-ops or the Co-ops over on Congress Street in Cobble Hill" doesn't mean that these PJs aren't ugly. Simply put, these PJs are ugly!

And I don't think that "2 blocks from Park Slope's 5th Avenue and 2 blocks to Smith Street" qualifies as "no lack of services," but maybe I'm just being lazy, and I should walk more. These PJs are in a very good 'hood, even if the services directly bordering them are sub-par.

I think your point about not lumping all projects together is a very good one. And I'm most convinced by your point that "if the projects were worse, I doubt [the home facing them would] get a price like that."

Posted by: brownlime at September 8, 2009 2:42 PM

WELL... 11217 - you are only thinking your personal safety. have to think schools too when it comes to property values. right or wrong, parents are not going to want to send their kids to a school with low scores, and unfortunately, that tends to go hand in hand with low income kids. upper middle class parents don't want to risk their kids being slowed down by underpreforming kids.

Posted by: wine lover at September 8, 2009 4:51 PM

wine lover -- I don't think that PS 32 has exceptionally low scores. (This link supposedly has the latest report on proficiency reviews of grades 3-5: http://www.greatschools.net/modperl/achievement/ny/2128#nytest) Certainly, it gets realtively high rankings on insideschools.

The biggest problem I have heard about the school are more that its facilities are kind of crappy. I actually hear more complaints about PS 38, which serves more of Boerum Hill.

Admittedly, PS 32 test scores are lower than PS 38, 261 or 58, so there is cause for concern. OTOH, there is the quasi-mainstreaming of ASD kids at the school, and I don't know how the score reports account for children with disabilities.

Posted by: Boerumresident at September 8, 2009 5:47 PM

Invisible:

There have been a lot more than a "few shootings" in neighborhoods like Bed Stuy and Crown Heights in the past year...both neighborhoods that people on this board talk all the time about how it's a great place to call home.

I don't believe there have been any murders in those Gowanus projects this year, which is more than I can say for the 2 neighborhoods I just mentioned.

There are many "yuppies" as you saying living in Boreum Hill near these projects and love it. It's a fantastic URBAN neighborhood. Probably more prototypical urban neighborhood than many of the other neighborhoods we talk about on this board regularly.

I hope you are wrong and I hope these new owners are very happy in their new home for a long time to come.

Posted by: 11217 at September 8, 2009 8:03 PM

The buyers of 6 3rd street in Carroll Gardens are friggin morons. They bought it from a flipper who paid 975K for the house at the height of the housing bubble and a month before the crash of Lehman, in August of 2008. The flipper then put it on the market 4 months later at a listed price of $1.895 mil, an increase of 94%? How much work could have been put into the house in just 4 months? At $1.69mil, I can't fathom how you could pay 715K above the price paid at the top peak point of the real estate bubble, even including the price for renovations put in. The old adage " A fool and his money shall soon part ways" holds true again.

Posted by: dandel at September 8, 2009 9:49 PM

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