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August 14, 2009
DIBS Refinishes His Facade
Reader, commenter and frequenter of Brownstoner after-work gatherings, daveinbedstuy today shares with us the tale of his recent facade renovation...
I recently had the facade on my brownstone refinished. It had been covered with 2-3 layers of paint and was crumbling badly on the garden level, primarily the stoop area. I got a number of estimates and the price range was wide. After a recommendation from a neighbor who owns a number of properties and has had work done by a local guy, I went with Millad from CTG Construction. He literally lives around the corner.
We had an extensive discussion about the work needed and both he and I came to the same conclusion independently that we'd try to save as much of the original flat stone as possible from the parlour level and the top floor. (For before, during and after photos, click here.) This would be in the best interest long term instead of chiselling ALL of it off. The lintels & sills for those levels howvere, needed to be completely rebuilt.
The first step was...
...to apply two coats of paint stripper on the parlour level and top floor facade where we intended to save the stone. This stood for about a week and a half and was then powerwashed leaving a paint-free surface. It was nice to see.
All of the original brownstone was chipped away from the garden level and stoop area and rebuilt with a layer of masonry and two layers of brownstone "slurry." Since this was going on for the past 3 months, you can imagine the difficulty working around the rainy weather; which is why it took almost 3 months! Millad was adamant that each layer needed adequate drying time before an additional layer is added; something I have not witnessed when watching other jobs around the neighborhood.
As you can see from the accompanying flikr photos, it was a major job at the garden level. The parlour and top floor sills & lintels were rebuilt. Millad's mason is excellent. He formed crisp detailed lines in each rosette and the work on each side of the stoop.
With the flat brownstone surface on the parlour & top floor level about 90% in nice shape, there was some patching necessary. This has resulted in an imperfect match in some areas but I knew that was the case going into the process. Some of you may want a perfect match throughout but that will cost you a lot more money as well and I believe that the integrity of the existing stone is more important. You can see this in the last few pictures of the finished product.
My original tall double door entryway had been closed in to make a transom and a single 36" door sometime in the 40s or 50s when the building became a two family, as was required by the fire department back then. The casings were very detailed fluted pilasters and looked nice so I decided against returning the entryway to the original style (plus it would be an additional $12-14,000) and I went on a search for an appropriate door to replace the fugly one that was there. I found a beautiful double tombstone window door at www.archantiquities.com in maine...about $1,600 including shipping. I replaced the door myself and added the hardware from www.houseofantiquehardware.com.
I also believe that a black entry, window casings % cornice is the most appealing color scheme.
Millad drew up a contract and everything went as contracted. The only addition was that we determined that the space underneath the stoop should get a new skim coat of cement because it was just exposed brick and needed to be repointed.
$20,000 + $1,500 for the additional masonry work under the stoop. This was at the low end of most of the quotes. Millad was very easy to work with and his men are very conscientious.
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Comments
i kinda sorta pictured you living in something a little more regal.
*Bfly*
Posted by: PitbullNYC at August 14, 2009 11:03 AM
Hey What, come share a drink on the stoop with me.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:05 AM
Congrats dibs it looks lovely. The door and iron work is quite special as well, ties it all together beautifully.
Posted by: DeLepp at August 14, 2009 11:07 AM
Dave, they did a great job. I had forgotten what your fugly door looked like, this one works really well, and looks great. My fugly door has yours beat, and they reduced my double doors to a single, too, but my new frame is nothing worth keeping. Inspiring to see someone get some quality work done. Hopefully, I'll be able to do that too, someday.
Posted by: Montrose Morris at August 14, 2009 11:09 AM
Very nice! Was the iron work redone as part of the job?
Posted by: Arkady at August 14, 2009 11:09 AM
It looks great, Dave! I'll be by tonight with my 40 ounce to enjoy the loveliness of your stoop :)
Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at August 14, 2009 11:10 AM
Hey, Dave, looks great! And I love your choice of a new door. Seeing the end result makes me want to own a house again.
Posted by: CarrollGardened at August 14, 2009 11:10 AM
I also had the small curved section of the ironwork and the right gatepost replaced when I first moved in. Vinnie's Italian Ironworks did that and matched the other post with an original and reproduced the fence details exactly.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:10 AM
Dave, thanks for sharing the "before" and "after" pics...
just so aesthetically pleasing to the eye! Enjoy!
Posted by: bren at August 14, 2009 11:11 AM
Very nice!
Posted by: dirty_hipster at August 14, 2009 11:11 AM
okay seriously there's a dildo on the bottome step :-/
*butterfly*
Posted by: PitbullNYC at August 14, 2009 11:12 AM
OH, and if anyone can use the old door (sorry I called it fugly) you can have it...it's 36" X 84"...let me know.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:13 AM
Nice. That's a smart-looking stoop. I like the detail on the side. A bonus that you come through to the end still happy with the contractor. Must have helped that he was a local guy.
Looking forward to news reports of your beer summit with what.
Posted by: slopefarm at August 14, 2009 11:14 AM
Whoa--looks very different than last time I saw the outside of your house. Nice job. Gets me thinking. I just repointed my bricks but I need to repair the cornice.
Posted by: wasder at August 14, 2009 11:17 AM
Nice work great color choice.
Olive branch extended.
Posted by: jack slade at August 14, 2009 11:18 AM
excellent headline. Like the very clean glass in the front door, makes all the difference. And you have the thick balustrade too, none of that skinny modern railings crap. nice job.
Posted by: dittoburg at August 14, 2009 11:18 AM
wasder, my guys just started the cornice work for that architect who was featured in the NY Times about a year or so when he bought that place and rehabbed it over on malcolm X.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:19 AM
I think they did a really good job... I am loving the stoop... great job
Posted by: Amzi Hill at August 14, 2009 11:20 AM
Thanks jack. Same here. I can't remember what we disagreed on anyway.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:21 AM
Very interesting and informative. I particularly liked the part about the history of your front entryway and door. Thanks for sharing!
Posted by: brownlime at August 14, 2009 11:26 AM
Beautiful job. Facade looks like it's still curing in some of the photos. Love the preservation of the details in the lintels, and also that you replaced the fugly motion detector lights with a fixture more in keeping with the age of the building. Really great that you found and worked with a local contractor.
Posted by: vinca at August 14, 2009 11:26 AM
Those photos show how much effort you've put into your home. It looks great.
Posted by: infinitejester at August 14, 2009 11:29 AM
I LOVE the door and the color you chose. I think you did a great job!
Posted by: gemini10 at August 14, 2009 11:30 AM
vinca, that's the difference in color between the "repaired" portions of the stone and the rest that we left intact instead of destroying for no good reason except to match the color. I knew there'd be "blotches" because of it but was prepared to live with it. I see blotches on buildings that have been completely resurfaced but not this dramatic.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:32 AM
Dave, if you don't mind me asking, in which part of BedStuy do you live?
Posted by: lostintranslation at August 14, 2009 11:40 AM
Dave, it looks beautiful.
Posted by: Nomi at August 14, 2009 11:42 AM
DIBS, we had same color-match problem when we rebuilt our stoop but left the elevated brownstone stringers, which did not need repair. Even after preparing and drying a mortar sample the color's off by a degree or so (soon to be modified by the broad brush of mother nature). The craftsmanship looks great and I'm sure very satisfying to come home to.
Posted by: vinca at August 14, 2009 11:44 AM
Dave--I suppose they would have to completely rebuild the cornice on my house because its pretty rotted out in places. Do you think they could recreate the look of the old one?
Posted by: wasder at August 14, 2009 11:45 AM
looks great. But do address Rob's question...what is that on the lower stair?
Posted by: Petebklyn at August 14, 2009 11:45 AM
wasder....I will check in with the architect owner I spoke about and see how extensively they are rebuilding his cornice and get back to you. I can't attest to their woodworking skills as mine didn't require any restoration, only painting.
Pete, that is actually a piece of Sycamore bark. The tree sheds a lot of bark this time of year and they wind up looking almost like rolled up cigars. As you know, cigars can be used for many different purposes as Pres. Clinton will attest to.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 11:49 AM
DIBS and wasder: We'll be needing a cornice repair to our building sometime down the road. Just FYI, there's a pretty good older Brownstoner link on cornices: http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2005/06/close_up_on_cor.php
Posted by: vinca at August 14, 2009 11:57 AM
Looks great, Dave.
Nothing 'creepy' about it.
Is anyone else thinking of naughty apropos re-writes for 'DIBS refinishes his facade' besides me ;-)
Posted by: Expert Textpert at August 14, 2009 12:00 PM
Great job Dave. I already saw the front of the house when it was almost done so I didn't realize of the amount of work that was actually done. Looks great.
Posted by: Kensingtonian at August 14, 2009 12:01 PM
Beautiful! I like that you decided to leave the repaired area side by side with the original, without attempting to disguise as if brand new. Love the railings too.
Posted by: Maly at August 14, 2009 12:04 PM
To paraphrase freud, sometimes sycamore bark is just sycamore bark.
Posted by: slopefarm at August 14, 2009 12:08 PM
now that the front is recognizable, i give 2 days before The What becomes your new midnight peeping-tom.
Posted by: goldie at August 14, 2009 12:09 PM
Nice job Dibs... Love the color of your door.. Mind sharing....
Posted by: HOBOKENROCKS at August 14, 2009 12:11 PM
The door is just a satin black. It's California Paints Wear-All Multi purpose Acylic Latec Enamel in Black.
"This durable, easily applied acrylic enamel is fortified with emulsified epoxy to provide maximum performance in a low gloss, water-based floor and trim finish."
I think California Paints is owned by benjamin Moore. i got it at Weinstein's on Throop.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:17 PM
House is in Stuy Heights but not the landmarked section.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:18 PM
Nice, DIBS. Maybe you didn't overpay afterall (yeah, rrrighht).
***Bid half off peak comps***
Posted by: Brownstones Half Off at August 14, 2009 12:19 PM
Thanks, BHO. We all know with 20/20 hindsight that I did overpay. That said, all I did was trade a manhattan condo and some more money for this. If I were still in the condo, I'd probably be down more AND, I would never have moved to brooklyn and met all you lovely people, yourself included.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:24 PM
are you sure a sycamore? very similar to London Plane tree which is common on NYC streets. Difference is seed ball. Does it have 1 or 2 balls hanging. Thats how you easily tell difference.
Posted by: Petebklyn at August 14, 2009 12:27 PM
Dave--would love to know about the wordworking capability of your contractor for sure. Thanks. And thanks Vinca for the link.
Posted by: wasder at August 14, 2009 12:31 PM
I've always heard them referred to as Sycamores, Pete. I'll have to count the balls next week. But yes, this is the same tree that you see all over NYC, large with peeling bark and I've NEVER heard anyone call them London Plane.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:35 PM
The American sycamore (Platanus occidentalis) — also called American plane, Occidental plane and Buttonwood — is a common and familiar species native to North America. It is usually called a sycamore where it is endemic, a name that refers to other, unrelated trees in other parts of the world.
An American sycamore tree is easily recognized by its mottled exfoliating bark. The bark of all trees has to yield to a growing trunk; in the case of trees such as the Silver Maple and the Shagbark Hickory the process is not hidden, but the Sycamore shows the process of exfoliation more openly than any other tree. The bark of the trunk and larger limbs flakes off in great irregular masses, leaving the surface mottled, and greenish-white, gray and brown. Sometimes the smaller limbs look as if whitewashed. The explanation is found in the rigid texture of the bark tissue, which lacks the elasticity common to the bark of other trees, so it is incapable of stretching to accommodate the growth of the wood underneath and the tree sloughs it off.[1]
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:38 PM
looks fantastic! thanks for posting all the info. if I ever have 2 nickels to rub together again I'll know who to call to do my steps.
Posted by: herkimermaid at August 14, 2009 12:39 PM
Not to nitpick, but Weinstein's Paint, which is a great local resource, is on the corner of Halsey and Thompkins St. Their prices are good, and they have Benjamin Moore paint, as well as other brands, tile, and general hardware. I believe they still close at noon on Saturday's though.
Posted by: Montrose Morris at August 14, 2009 12:47 PM
They are on Tomkins, MM, you are right. I think they may be closed all day on Saturday though, not sure. They have another Bklyn location as well. They are great for anything paint related.
I've always been a huge proponent of buying the most expensive paints for durability. I'll always prime in oil but 100% Acrylic paints are now the best for exterior. I did use the Fine Paints of Europe once on a door in PA, for the super high gloss look which looks fantastic but it has to be a perfectly smooth surface.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 12:57 PM
dibs, I am no longer posting on brownstoner but i do occassionally look at the site and I just wanted to write that your restoration turned out beautifully. congrats.
Posted by: sam at August 14, 2009 1:01 PM
Beautiful job.
Posted by: sebb at August 14, 2009 1:02 PM
sam, we miss you, vehemently. :)
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 1:04 PM
I doubt that it matters to most, but London Planes are a hybrid, now common in NYC. We definitely called these trees Sycamores when I was growing up (even as
a child gardener at the BBG), and had many fights throwing their fruitballs, which we called "itchy balls." http://bit.ly/7zqBh
Posted by: vinca at August 14, 2009 1:13 PM
Dave that looks fantastic. I particularly like the single door treatment. I've mentioned that my double doors had been removed and replaced by a fugly single door before. This makes the case for revamping it with a better single and not going whole hog and having the doubles rebuilt (at a ridiculous cost).
Great job!
Posted by: TownhouseLady at August 14, 2009 1:35 PM
What a very nicely done facade restoration! Love the door as well. This is the kind of exterior work that goes beyond being a personal benefit to the homeowner. It's a benefit to the community in general as it becomes support (or encouragement) for your immediate neighbors as well as top notch brownstone eye candy for all passersby. Congratulations (and thanks)!
Posted by: Brooklynista at August 14, 2009 1:48 PM
DIBS, nice! Great for you, great for your block. You're definitely the right kind of owner.
Congratulations.
Posted by: JKB at August 14, 2009 2:30 PM
Dibs, Having only spent $20K on your facade 'refinish', i guess you can't be too picky. I can't see how the two tone acid wash jeans looks doesn't bother you. You can convince yourself that "integrity of the existing stone is more important". But the two tone look is an example of getting what you pay for. How much extra would it have cost you to chisel and reface whole thing?
Posted by: Colonel Steve Austin at August 14, 2009 2:38 PM
"Does it have 1 or 2 balls hanging."
DIBS sees enuf so he might have lost track by now.
I always thought they were London Planes also. Then again I am horticulturally challenged.
Congrats on a nice job. Always fulfilling when the job is done within budget and the results are as desired.
Posted by: denton at August 14, 2009 2:56 PM
Yo DAve
I bet youre rims cost more then youre car :)
Posted by: brickoven at August 14, 2009 2:57 PM
great job DIBS! looks beautiful.
Posted by: bkny at August 14, 2009 3:01 PM
brickoven, believe it or not I drive a "ghetto" Dodge Magnum. I never put the 22"ers on it though.
Colonel Angus...as much as Team Bull is trying to convince me, it'll never be a $3MM+ brownstone, the same reason I didn't bother to spend the $12,000 for the double doors.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 3:04 PM
Thw door I would love to take a look at it if its still avail. Let me know
Posted by: flawlessphoto06 at August 14, 2009 4:14 PM
Hey DIBS congratulations and thanks for sharing. This turned out really nicely and the door is a beautiful compromise.
BTW we've always trusted you had great taste but a Dodge Magnum ? :) That is not you bro!
Posted by: pierre de taille at August 14, 2009 4:32 PM
DIBS,
Very nice work. congratulations.
Regarding the ironwork, I have a property with pretty much the identical style. I have always had trouble deciding on which type of black to use. Gloss or Matte. Gloss always seems a bit showy but neater, while Matte seems more elegant and original.
Which way did you go. It looks like Gloss.
Posted by: Legion at August 14, 2009 4:34 PM
flawless...yes it is. You can see it in pic #12 where it says "click here" above. email me at DJL135e54@yahoo.com
Legion, thanks...it's gloss on the fence/gate/stoop rail...satin on the doorway & cornice.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 14, 2009 4:43 PM
Looks fantastic. Thanks so much for posting this.
Posted by: mopar at August 14, 2009 6:00 PM
Great job DIBS! Love the detail work. Nice lamp on the lower entrance, too! : )
Posted by: cobblehiller at August 14, 2009 6:59 PM
sycamores are awful trees, they give off gallons of super-sticky car paint-destroying sap in the summer. London planes trees are much nicer to have around.
Posted by: dittoburg at August 14, 2009 7:59 PM
good for you. i am impressed with your financial take on things in general, and sounds like you did your research.
Posted by: wine lover at August 14, 2009 7:59 PM
I'm thinking of the european sycamore which has twirly-bird tyep seeds which helicopter down.
Posted by: dittoburg at August 14, 2009 8:00 PM
At home, I just had time to read this whole post thoroughly. This really is an amazing transformation. Dave, it must be very satisfying.
Posted by: mopar at August 14, 2009 9:33 PM
Yup, looks good to me too. I remember feeling sick to my stomach after having "brownstone" redone because I thought it came out too dark, but it faded over the years and looks perfectly natural now. I agree that your coloration differences will definitely fade over time, and with the way the market's heading, you made the right choice not spending the extra 10k plus to do the entire facade over.
Posted by: IronBalls at August 14, 2009 10:10 PM
Hey Dibs...I recognize this home...OK I am not stalking you but I was walking through Bed Stuy and I remember two men working on a brownstone facade similar to this and I was so impressed okay so now the question is can you finally pass me the contractor who did your refacing.
Beautiful JOB!!
Thanks!!
Posted by: mysideofstuy at August 14, 2009 11:05 PM
I just want to say that I knew that was bark from a Sycamore from the first time I zoomed in on that picture on your flickr page. I almost almost said it before you did but then I chickened out cause I was going to say something about it being an awfully crumbly dildo and that is beneath me, so.
Beneath me. Ha.
Posted by: Nomi at August 15, 2009 3:06 AM
People seem to think that DIBS saved as much of the original brownstone out of cheapness. While he certainly saved money, preserving as much of the buildings fabric as possible is a worthy preservation goal and is to be applauded.
Besides, I know Dave and, unlike me, he's NOT a cheapskate.
Posted by: Bob Marvin at August 15, 2009 8:45 AM
No- that's the last thing dibs is. But he did feel he wanted to preserve as much of the original out of respect for the building. (you aren't cheap, bob!)
Posted by: bxgrl at August 15, 2009 11:42 AM
But bxgrl, I PRIDE myself on being cheap, or, at least, frugal. That's one reason I bought one of those silly old brownstones that no one else wanted instead of a BEAUTIFUL suburban tract house :-)
Posted by: Bob Marvin at August 15, 2009 4:07 PM
Also, there WERE comments like "Having only spent $20K on your facade 'refinish', i guess you can't be too picky.... You can convince yourself that 'integrity of the existing stone is more important'. But the two tone look is an example of getting what you pay for"
Such comments assume that spending $$ is somehow better than preserving original building fabric which, IMHO, is nonsense. I don't think a 130 year old house like DIBS' SHOULD look new. I also think that future preservationists will curse those who replace what doesn't NEED replacement because they're foolish enough to buy the idiocy that you get what you pay for. "less is more" doesn't just apply to modernist architecture.
Posted by: Bob Marvin at August 15, 2009 5:46 PM
Sorry everyone, the original email I sent in had the contractor's name and number...I just realized it wasn't printed
Millad
CTG Construction
718-669-8305
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at August 16, 2009 4:49 PM
Love your take on things, Bob Marvin.
Posted by: mopar at August 16, 2009 9:53 PM
Dave, this is cool !
Posted by: BklynSoFar at August 16, 2009 11:55 PM
DIBS - I'm a latecomer to the posting, but I wanted to say that the work looks great. And hey, if you and The What get arrested for drinking on your stoop, I'll represent you (yes, I remember those stories someone posted last year). Seriously, congrats.
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