« Inside Third & Bond: Week 98 House of the Day: 86 Douglass Street »

August 27, 2009

Co-op of the Day: 269 Clinton Avenue, #D2

This two-bedroom co-op at 269 Clinton Avenue in Clinton Hill just hit the market with an asking price of $485,000. The buiding itself is a gem and the apartment is nicely done (though we don't think the exposed brick was the best call). In addition to the historic vibe, there's also a common backyard that this apartment has access two. The monthly maintenance of $629 is reasonable given the unit's size of 825 square feet. Think it'll sell for close to the asking price?
269 Clinton Avenue, #D2 [Douglas Elliman] GMAP P*Shark

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I kinda like the exposed brick. It's that kitchen that's hurting my feelings.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at August 27, 2009 12:47 PM

There's a two bedroom at 315 Clinton going for $699 with the same maintenance fees. This one seems to have better light. 315 was a duplex in a gorgeous mansion.

Posted by: DeLepp at August 27, 2009 12:53 PM

It is always a little sad to see a magnificent house like this cut up into tight little apartments but that's so often the case here in the Big Boro. I guess it is the legacy of the boarding house days and middle class flight.
The apartment is alright. The front windows are very attractive.
I am always warry of small co-ops.
All you need is one overextended financial wizard and the finances are down the toilet. It takes at least a year to evict someone for non-payment of their maintenance and even longer to foreclose especially now that the courts are very hesitant to foreclose on even the biggest deadbeats.

Posted by: Minard Lafever at August 27, 2009 12:54 PM

The kitchen definitely needs to be de-fuglyfied, but it's a sweet pad overall.

Posted by: DitmasSnark at August 27, 2009 12:58 PM

minard, not so hard to get maintenance from deadbeats, a little work with the bank who holds the mtg and they're sending you monthly checks.

Posted by: DeLepp at August 27, 2009 12:58 PM

It's cute and the listing is good (photos, floor plan). And the price sounds low on the face of it. But I calculate the square footage at about 650, not 825, which makes the price really abut $750 per square foot. Kinda high. But it'll probably sell in a hot minute above ask with three bids, groan.

Posted by: mopar at August 27, 2009 12:59 PM

so this will run about $3k/mo with 20% down. What would a comparable apt rent for on this block?

Posted by: Frederick Law Homestead at August 27, 2009 12:59 PM

Isn't it funny how housing gets chopped up into little tiny units both when a neighborhood becomes impoverished and also when it becomes extremely expensive?

Posted by: mopar at August 27, 2009 1:02 PM

"so this will run about $3k/mo with 20% down. What would a comparable apt rent for on this block?"

It's actually more like $2810 a month with mortgage and maintenance without factoring in the interest deduction. I know people who pay 2400 for a 2 bedroom very close to here, so the rental and ownership costs seem about equal to me in this particular instance.

And I think quite a few people would be willing to pay a little more to own over a comparable rental to have the ability to do what you want with your home.

If you rented this place, you'd have to keep that kitchen as is. Some people really value being able to redecorate, remodel, etc and are willing to pay a small premium over renting to do so.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:06 PM

This building has been a co-op for at least 20 years, if not longer. So I'm not sure how mopar's comment applies.

Posted by: Stonergut at August 27, 2009 1:06 PM

agree with mopar - can't see how this is much more than 650-700 sqft. that said, the building is quite beautiful, it's a nice block, and the common garden actually looks pleasant and usable (in my experience this latter fact is rare). i bet it goes fairly close to ask.

Posted by: perhaps at August 27, 2009 1:10 PM

DeLepp, how can you even compare a 2-bed at this price and one for $699k? You are not talking about the same buyers, not by a long shot.

I was at this open house last weekend. This is really a 1-bed that was converted. The second bedroom has no closet and was actually the kitchen. The kitchen was moved forward into the LR. You can still see the wall where the former kitchen should have ended. The real 2-beds in this building are enormous!!

Posted by: mksk at August 27, 2009 1:15 PM

think the rent for something comparable is around 2200-2300. would be 2400 or a little more if not for some really nice (& much much bigger) units comng to the mkt recently at 2600-2700.

Posted by: more4less at August 27, 2009 1:15 PM

if One Hanson is going for 500 PSF now this should be worth around 400 PSF

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:16 PM

Stonergut, it's a general statement about the relationship of price and size. Think about Cobble Hill, Park Slope, Manhattan, or San Francisco. Clinton Hill is nowhere near "extremely expensive" yet.

Posted by: mopar at August 27, 2009 1:16 PM

Oh boy, what a pretty one bedroom this would be. Course, you need the second bedroom.

Posted by: mopar at August 27, 2009 1:18 PM

mksk, the bedrooms at 315 Clinton weren't all that large(2nd bedroom just had a crib and it was cramped). I wasn't comparing as much as saying look at the different price points on two apts about 50 steps from each other. Granted 315 is in a gorgeous mansion, I haven't been in 269. Even if just a 1 bedroom, does a small crib size bedroom cost $200K these days?

Posted by: DeLepp at August 27, 2009 1:20 PM

I pay 2300 for 850 sft in BH> I find it hard to believe that Clinton Hill is more then 1800 for a place like this.

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:21 PM

"if One Hanson is going for 500 PSF now this should be worth around 400 PSF"

Here are the most recent sales for One Hanson. $909 psf

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/212164-condo-1-hanson-place-fort-greene-brooklyn

and $815 psf.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/428407-condo-1-hanson-place-fort-greene-brooklyn

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:25 PM

one hanson

ask 588 psf
http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/380599-condo-1-hanson-place-fort-greene-brooklyn

and ask 623

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/264170-condo-1-hanson-place-fort-greene-brooklyn

roh ruh 11217

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:30 PM

one hanson is definitely not at 500psf yet. i assume, BO, you're referring to yesterdays price cuts - which were, admittedly, pretty big - and bring some units into the 580-615psf range. of course, that's been accompanied by a big uptick in maintenance at the building as well.

Posted by: perhaps at August 27, 2009 1:30 PM

> Here are the most recent sales for One Hanson. $909 psf... and $815 psf.

Yep, BO doth exaggerate. Though this is an interesting tidbit: "26 active sales listings: $750 per ft² (avg)" so it looks like prices are indeed dropping a bit.

Posted by: DitmasSnark at August 27, 2009 1:31 PM

588 nor 623 is 500.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:31 PM

ask 588 is 500 in this market. Eyes wide shut?

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:33 PM

"access two". I am now writing copy for Brownstoner.

Posted by: ghettoazzpnkbtch at August 27, 2009 1:34 PM

And here is (what looks to me) to be a small 2 bedroom rental in Clinton Hill listed at $2400 per month.

http://www.idealpropertiesgroup.com/property/details/13063#img_preview

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:35 PM

BO, like I told you before, think you got a pretty good deal for your pad. BTW, clinton ave is probably the most expensive st in clinton hill and this location is prime so yeah, around 2200. if you want cheaper, the clinton hill coop are 1500 for 750 sq ft 1-bdrm, 2000 for 875 sq ft 2-bdrm

Posted by: more4less at August 27, 2009 1:36 PM

One listing at 588 psf does not mean "One Hanson is going for 500 psf now" BO.

Try to get your head out of your ass for a second and realize that two other people besides me just said your information is not entirely accurate also.

I'm not getting into it with you again today. You exaggerate to make your "point" and here is a perfect example of that yet again.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:37 PM

anybody who would pay 2400 for a small 2 bed in clinton hill does not have the capacity to sign a legal contract. :) you guys like that one?

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:39 PM

11217 i bet you could get out of youre mortgage based on capacity

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:42 PM

BO--

Do you actually spend much time in Clinton Hill, or do you just make pronouncements/guesstimates from the comfort of BH?

Posted by: tinarina at August 27, 2009 1:42 PM

tinarina I am in the comfort of my summer retreat right now actually. I have been to Clinton Hill and parties on Clinton street towards the end by Fulton i think. Some parts are nice some parts are not. NOTHING is worth more then 2000 in rent for a small 2 bed. NOTHING

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:48 PM

"I have been to Clinton Hill and parties on Clinton street"

There is no Clinton Street in Clinton Hill. It's Clinton Avenue.

And p.s. it's "I bet you could get out of YOUR mortgage."

If you are going to insult my "capacity" you might want to learn the basics of English grammar. At least for that one sentence. Do you have the capability of being proven wrong without then following it up with some sort of personal attack which usually makes no sense?

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2009 1:53 PM

so nice. so out of my price range. so sad.

Posted by: NeilskiH at August 27, 2009 1:57 PM

11217 I dunno howta spill jus leeb me along

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:57 PM

Price chops at One Hanson are significant. Not just in $$$ but in impact to competition.

Posted by: LilBitOfLuck at August 27, 2009 1:57 PM

We pay 2400, lol. That space looks comparable to what we have, without the elevator and in a pretty mansion. I was just comparing it to the places at 80 Metropolitan in my head and laughing at how much they're going for vs. this. This looks like a pretty fair deal in this market -- that's zoned for PS 20?

Posted by: Heather at August 27, 2009 1:58 PM

anyway this place is a 1 bed and its not even a large 1 bed 350 tops

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 1:59 PM

Heather, yeah, think its zoned for ps20. recall some of the house listings on that block and they were all zoned for ps20.

Posted by: more4less at August 27, 2009 2:13 PM

"so this will run about $3k/mo with 20% down. What would a comparable apt rent for on this block?"

...plus 243k (depreciation) divided by 60 mos (avg time before resale) plus net maint after tax (say 300) equals 4,350/mo. A comparable rental would be much cheaper.

It's really a 1.5 BR too. 8 x 10 is a brownstone "alcove". In a normal market you don't have to pay this much for historical charm.

But Minsky's got it! He can sell salt to slugs.

***Bid half off peak comps***

Posted by: Brownstones Half Off at August 27, 2009 2:25 PM

I am going to bid $350K for this place. If I don't get it, I will call the buyer stupid and not apologize to anyone on Brownstoner for beinig an ass.

If I am unemployed and hanging out in the park, does that mean I am "in the comfort of my summer retreat?"

Posted by: ghettoazzpnkbtch at August 27, 2009 2:29 PM

it will cost $10,000 / month to own this place!

I add in a non-cash item like depreciation but I don't factor in the cash on the resale to determine the cash out-of-pocket costs to live here. My rent is not an out-of-pocket cost. I am a wizzard!

If I wait for CS index to return to 0 YOY, does that mean I am waiting for house prices to increase 20% in NYC before I would even think of buying?

Yes, I am a wizzard.

Posted by: ghettoazzpnkbtch at August 27, 2009 2:34 PM

11217 did you see the studio in One Hanson asking 262,000? dont you have a studio in that area? How is the big investment coming along? Yeah rich yet?

Posted by: brickoven at August 27, 2009 2:46 PM

Looking at this layout, it has potential to be an awesome apartment but I would want to change it somewhat. I think that master bedroom is unnecessarily big, and can be split in two (it has THREE windows!). Then I would take the smaller bedroom completely "out" -- remove all the walls, including the one that separates it from the kitchen -- that way you have a big open space with a kitchen in the middle, no hallways. Huge dining table where the small bedroom used to be, lots of light flowing through the house and skylights etc. .. And two small bedrooms approx (120 sq feet each) in the back with big windows. That's a space i'd LOVE.

Posted by: iz at August 27, 2009 2:51 PM

"Try to get your head out of your ass for a second"

He likes the view from up there.

Posted by: East New York at August 27, 2009 2:53 PM

Another comparable is a fairly recent apartment of the day at 328 Clinton Avenue #3 - which was listed as a 3 bedroom duplex at 860k; also a (much bigger) one bedroom apartment where additional bedrooms had been shoe-horned in. That apartment had been bought at one-tenth that price in 97 and sold for 330k in 2001.

Posted by: Putnamdenizen at August 27, 2009 3:11 PM

This is a very good price for a great place in an excellent area. It will sale very close to asking. Trust me. I sold my 900sqf in the area in a less desireble area for $580k. This will sale.

Posted by: Crooklyn at August 27, 2009 3:19 PM

Back on the Jerry Minsky tip, eh Brownstoner?

Posted by: IronBalls at August 27, 2009 3:36 PM

nice place, exposed brick is a nice touch and pl...ease drop the "we", unless you're a siamise twin it really does make you sound like a total retard.

Posted by: bobbyj at August 27, 2009 3:43 PM

nice place, exposed brick is a nice touch and pl...ease drop the "we", unless you're a siamise twin it really does make you sound like a total retard.

Posted by: bobbyj at August 27, 2009 3:45 PM

I personally love it.

Posted by: Kensingtonian at August 27, 2009 4:25 PM

I looked at the place. I love the building, but the apartment does need work. The kitchen is awkward and the fridge is basically in the living area. Also, the second bedroom could be an office, but not a bedroom. The bathroom could definitely use a renovation.

Posted by: daleed77 at August 27, 2009 4:29 PM

Gotta say this looks like a pretty fair deal all around. Nice, modest pad at reasonably modest price in a sweet location. Hard to argue with much in this listing.

Posted by: wasder at August 27, 2009 5:40 PM

Is Clinton Hill considered a safe neighborhood now?
Geez, you used to hear stories....

Posted by: Minard Lafever at August 27, 2009 9:51 PM

iz -- I was thinking too about how I might rearrange this place. But splitting the master like you're talking about, that would make for two very skinny rooms. Remember, that 17 feet is including the alcove. Plus you'd have to walk thru one to get to the other. Tho, since my current bedroom is the size of a bed plus a foot in each direction, it's not unimaginable. If I had kids, that'd be awfully close, however.

But, for me, anytime I can see that a place has a stuck in bedroom, it makes me want to rip it out. This apt. should really be a grand one-bedroom. Yes, I know -- others would say this mansion is meant to be a MANSION. But short of that -- if it's going to be cut up, I'd like to see more of the grandness maintained.

Still a very appealing apt. that I think will not go for too much under ask.

Posted by: Nomi at August 28, 2009 12:20 AM

« Inside Third & Bond: Week 98 House of the Day: 86 Douglass Street »

August 27, 2009

Co-op of the Day: 269 Clinton Avenue, #D2

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