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July 10, 2009

Awaye Realty Caught Lifting Listing from Owner

What started as an all-too-common slimy maneuver on the part of a brokerage firm is morphing into a PR nightmare that will haunt its Google search results for years to come: Yesterday, after finding a listing for a house at 180 Adelphi Street on the website of Awaye Realty, we wrote it up as a house of the day. Certainly a factor in what was a far-from-glowing analysis on our part was the poor presentation on the part of the broker, including low-res interior shots and the omission of any exterior photos. Things didn't get interesting, though, until later in the day when the owner of the house chimed in saying he was surprised to learn that a broker was marketing his FSBO listing without his permission.

I own this house, and I have never heard of Awaye Realty. Awaye Realty is fraudulently holding itself out as representing us without any authorization whatsoever. I have no idea why my house is listed on its website. It appears that this realtor copied information and photos from an (admittedly amateurish) website that I made--www.180Adelphi.com--in order to create the listing.

Less than an hour later, the owner posted another comment:

An update concerning Awaye Realty: I just called Awaye Realty's main number, and asked to speak to the realtor listed on the website as the broker for 180 Adelphi. The agent answering the phone said that she was out of the office. I explained the situation and asked that the brokerage de-list my property. The agent said that nobody who could help me was in the office. I asked the agent's name, and she literally said, "I don't have a name," and then hung up.

First of all, we'd encourage everyone to check out the FSBO site at 180adelphi.com, which certainly puts a better foot forward than the Awaye rip-off listing; secondly, we're curious to know how common this practice is (quite common, is our impression); third, we'd like to know if this practice is illegal in addition to being unethical.

Update 7/16/09: Here's the response we received from Arlene Waye earlier this week:

Regarding the situation with 180 Adelphi Street, it is very disappointing that a public venue like this can act to defame a company for no good reason. Our Sales Manager solicited a FSBO listing, exchanged several emails with the seller (regarding things like commission and access to show the property) and put the listing into inventory. Unfortunately, an error was made in-house, and the listing was advertised well enough to get listed as “Home of the Day” on Brownstoner.com. Once we received the owner’s phone call, the listing was pulled from ALL advertising venues within 5 minutes. It does not serve our company to spend time and money to advertise a listing without the owner’s permission. Perhaps if the home was listed with Awaye Realty, the owner would have reaped the benefit of added exposure via Brownstoner, rather than frittering the opportunity away in smearing a firm that intended no harm or deception.

House of the Day: 180 Adelphi Street [Brownstoner]

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Comments

I'm dying to know what the ramifications are for Awaye regarding this debacle. Cue the jokes to stay 'Awaye' from this realtor.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:07 AM

Aw, aye, aye, aye!

Posted by: Arkady at July 10, 2009 10:09 AM

The same thing happened to me 5 yrs ago when we put our property on the market FSBO.

This Russian chick at a hole in the wall broker stole our craigslist text and NYT photo's, added 15% to the price and listed it.

I thought it was kinda comical. It was my daily routine. Wake up, look for her posting on cl and flag for removal.

I couldn't do anything about her website but didn't really care.

Posted by: jasetheace at July 10, 2009 10:10 AM

P.S...to the owner of the subject property...I'd consider calling in the tv media to further put this realtor on blast so more people than Brownstoner readers will know about their practices. Shame them in public and watch them fall.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:10 AM

Snappy, as I (quite cynically) stated in the OT, Awaye will likely be the unanimous winner of the Real Estate Brokers of New York's Most Innovative Broker Award for 2009.

Mr. B, you should be commended for posting this thread and calling out Awaye like this. Great job.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 10:11 AM

Snappy, doesn't one of the networks do a "Shame, shame, shame" segment???

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 10:12 AM

Great idea, Snappy.

Posted by: Arkady at July 10, 2009 10:12 AM

brokers are dickbags. sellers and renter brokers. one dickbag broker waltzed into our apartment when we had an open house (NO BROKERS ALLOWED was the rule according the owner) told me to "get that f'ing dog out of here while im showing this place." i was like who the hell are you? get out. then i got nasty call from his agency saying "why are you haranguing my employees." i was like whaaaaa?

that sucks for the owner in this case, i hope someone gets in trouble for this.

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at July 10, 2009 10:13 AM

I've sold two places FSBO and never had this problem, but both time the listing was clearly marked NO BROKERS on my site and all other materials. I know friends who have chosen to write BROKERS WELCOME on their listings and found their listings all over NY Times and other internet listing sites. I wonder if it's illegal if you don't specify no brokers...

Posted by: Ringo at July 10, 2009 10:14 AM

Mr. B, perhaps, if you haven't done so already, you should call Awaye and ask if they would like to comment on this. I know someone tried last night. Maybe trying today would produce a more substantive response.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 10:14 AM

I am Mr Awaye. I have never heard of awayerealty.com, it has nothing to do with me, or the awayerealty.com that I will be starting next week.

Posted by: dittoburg at July 10, 2009 10:14 AM

I'm gonna have to speak to some of my real estate lawyer friends and see what they say about any possible illegality wrt this. I know I shouldn't be shocked that a realtor would stoop so low, but my jaw is on the floor.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:14 AM

Maybe tip off the N Y Times guy who writes the Ft. Greene blog.

Posted by: Arkady at July 10, 2009 10:16 AM

Ringo, I was under the impression that stating "BROKERS WELCOME" was simply a consent to have them contact the seller on behalf of a potential buyer, NOT a consent for them to cut and paste one's FSBO on the broker's own website.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 10:17 AM

Mr. B,

We come up with a lot of legal questions during the course of blogging.

Anyone out there or anyone know a real estate attorney that would like to contribute some knowledge of the law to these situations?

Remember the whole landlord rights vs. potential tenants right with regard to producing paperwork?

Would be nice to know the actual laws.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at July 10, 2009 10:17 AM

I've seen the scam jase talks about. They find potential buyers who want to look at the property, then call the owner and say they can get them asking price if not more and they don't have to pay anything for the broker out of pocket since the price is jacked up. As long as they sign the 6% commission, they'll bring the buyers and they have like 5 already lined up. Really big scammers!

Posted by: Kensingtonian at July 10, 2009 10:18 AM

Another reason why NYC should have MLS listings.

Posted by: diego at July 10, 2009 10:18 AM

Even if Awaye's actions are not breaking the law, this would appear to me as clearly being an ethical violation. Maybe we should submit this to The Ethicist in the New York Times Magazine. :-)

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 10:20 AM

The listing is still up on Awayne's website: http://www.awayerealty.com/detail_buy.asp?webid=770

Posted by: diego at July 10, 2009 10:21 AM

Biff, I have no idea what's legal and what isn't. Everyone I know who has had this happen to them is annoyed by it. Especially since they often add 3% to the price (assuming, I guess, this is their commission). On the other hand, maybe realtors could argue, "this is how I get buyers". I think it's lame, but I'm not sure it's illegal.

Posted by: Ringo at July 10, 2009 10:23 AM

There is no such thing as bad publicity. The seller should benefit nicely from this, especially if there is further, broader publicity.

Glad for him if it turns out well.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 10:23 AM

Does anyone want to call and say they want to see the house and get the broker on the phone? :o).

I would like to be in on that conference call.

Posted by: Kensingtonian at July 10, 2009 10:23 AM

Wow - one way or another, somebody over at Awaye is screwed.

Posted by: dirty_hipster at July 10, 2009 10:23 AM

I just spoke to an attorney I know about this. He's not a full-on expert in this field, but I think he made some good points. He said there is clearly ethical violations that can and should be reported to their governing body, but likely no legal ramifications as there is no real damage. His other point, the most interesting I thought, was that the seller should use this situtation to his advantage. He said that contacting other forms of media (newspapers and tv) is a great idea because while you bring attention to the shady dealings of this real estate house, you also widen your audience of folks looking at your house and possibly increase your chances for a sale or even a quick sale.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:27 AM

The listing on the website gives the name "Arlene Waye" as the listing agent. Clearly this is the owner of the eponymous Awaye Realty.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 10:28 AM

What do you want to bet Arlene Waye and/or one of her employees skipped out on the ethics portion of broker school!

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:30 AM

The seller should file a formal complaint with the Department of State......DOS controls RE licenses

Posted by: PHfamily at July 10, 2009 10:31 AM

Snappy, that was my point at 10:23.....the seller will benefit if there's more coverage on this; and he should given the circumstances.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 10:31 AM

Awaye's office is on Court Street, fairly far south. I have walked past it a few times. Think they have been around for a while as I have seen the name before.

Posted by: etson at July 10, 2009 10:32 AM

Are they being contacted for comment? Perhaps they should be sent a link to this and the original HOTD thread. I'd pay good money to see the looks on their faces and be a fly on the wall in that office when they take a gander at all this.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:35 AM

Awaye are a bunch of nut cases. I called there to inquire about an apartment that they never really had. As this is common practice here in NYC (the old bait and switch), she started to offer me other places. I asked her why she still had the apartment listed (rental) and she totally freaked out and hung up on me. I'm not surprised at all by their behavior.

Posted by: ekename at July 10, 2009 10:35 AM

And, is there really any type of mistake that can be claimed on this one? 'Ooops! I lifted your ad thinking it was another one we were going to contract with!' I doubt it.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:36 AM

This is a disgrace. And unfortunately only solidifies the believe that all brokers are "dickbags". But some of us do try to do the right thing. And also live up to the ethical codes that Rebny and in some instances, our firms, expect from us.
My believe is that it is better to expose these unethical practices and put a good light on it. Hopefully it will prevent these types of unlawful listings to ever see daylight in the future.
Some additional reading material about what the current economy has done to SOME in the brokerage community.
http://therealdeal.com/newyork/articles/agents-ethical-code-starts-to-erode

Posted by: happyhome at July 10, 2009 10:37 AM

I guess it's just a bait and switch, but it doesn't make sense. The house IS up for sale. All they had to do is make 1 phone call to the seller to see if it's ok to bring potential buyers in. Now, they've really screwed themselves.

Posted by: rh at July 10, 2009 10:38 AM

Don't you sign a contract when you have a RE Agency represent you as the seller and your property?

So why would it be o.k. for them to act without a contract?

Seems highly fraudulent. Can't wait to see what the laws are with regard to this. I would absolutely as the owner file a complaint with the DOS.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at July 10, 2009 10:38 AM

Ekename, forgive the water behind my ears, but is this really a common broker practice? Yikes! Someone suggested that this is a good reason for the use of an MLS here....I know what an MLS is, but can someone explain to me (in laymen's terms please!) how that will help prevent this type of thing from happening?

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:39 AM

Doesn't this scam work only if the FSBO price is already below market? I mean, who's going to pay 6-15% MORE these days?

Posted by: NorthHeights at July 10, 2009 10:39 AM

Legal or ethical or not, how would the broker make any money off of this in the first place.
The seller never signed anything. And if I'm a buyer, knowing how buying/selling works in New York, I wouldn't pay the broker. And the broker wouldn't have any recourse if, now that I know about the property, I just find a way to contact the owner myself and do the deal without her.
So not only is she a sleaze-bag, in a way, she's a sleaze-bag giving this guy free advertising.

Posted by: RaginCajun at July 10, 2009 10:40 AM

Guys lets remember that Brownstoner did not call the Broker FIRST when he post this crap. Why should Jon get a pass for not being diligent! This goes to show how much effort Brownstoner puts into finding out the truth...

Plus how do we know what really happen??? You take the world of this "Seller"?? What if the Broker and the Seller had some sort of agreement before. Come people don't be ignorant!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 10:41 AM

It's illegal for retail stores such as electronics stores to put items in their sales ads that they don't have in stock to bait people into coming to the store.

So why shouldn't the same apply here.

It's classic bait and switch.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at July 10, 2009 10:41 AM

im not sure if the seller will benefit with the publicity if their house is still being sold for twice what it's worth. they might get a few more laughs tho.

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at July 10, 2009 10:43 AM

Good point about the false advertising re stores, THL.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:43 AM

Plus how do we know what really happen??? You take the world of this "Seller"?? What if the Broker and the Seller had some sort of agreement before. Come people don't be ignorant!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 10:41 AM

READ THE ORIGINAL POST BEFORE YOU START BLAMING. ALL OF US SEEM TO KNOW WHAT REALLY HAPPENED BECAUSE WE READ THE POST. JACKASS

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 10:45 AM

"Come people don't be ignorant!

The What"

Oh the hypocrisy.

Posted by: dittoburg at July 10, 2009 10:45 AM

The MLS (Multiple Listing Service) would show you what company indeed has the listing, and who to contact (as a buyer or a broker) to look at the property. It confirms the listing to everyone.

Also, it reduces the need to go to 10 different agents to see a house. You can go to one and they will have a source for every house for sale in the whole city.

Posted by: diego at July 10, 2009 10:46 AM

Diego, can FSBO put their home in an MLS?

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 10:49 AM

The seller put his phone number in his initial post, the same one as on the FSBO website. Doesn't completely rule out The What's hypothesis, but I think it is very likely that the seller is legit, especially given other people's comments about Awaye in other situations.

Posted by: etson at July 10, 2009 10:53 AM

No. However, there are brokers and many online services which offer FSBO sellers the option of listing their property in their local MLS database by paying a flat fee or another non-traditional compensation method.

Posted by: diego at July 10, 2009 10:55 AM

Hey guys, let's try not to fight here and make this a tit for tat shouting match. If the owners do try to take action this very post may possibly be used and you'd hate for it to be littered with the 'usual'.

I think you catch my drift.

Take that to the OT.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at July 10, 2009 10:55 AM

LOL
The What is telling people not to jump the gun and start flaming/blaming.

The hilarity of it.

Posted by: crimsonson at July 10, 2009 10:56 AM

You just have to marvel at the short-sightedness. Did Awaye think it could get somewhere if it brought someone to the fsbo seller? ("I posted a listing of your property without your permission and now have someone who wants to see the house. Can I have the key?") Or was this just window dressing for bait and switch to make the realtor look more credible?

What, I highly doubt there is another side to the story, based on the owner's posting on the HOTD thread yesterday. But if you have doubts, why don't you call Awaye and ask to see the house and report back what happens? We'd all be curious.

Mr. B is a blogger and has never held himself out as a journalist. I am sure if Awaye has any response, Mr. B will post that, too, whether credible or not, and I would be surprised if they are not aware of the thread at this point.

Posted by: slopefarm at July 10, 2009 10:57 AM

Excellent point, ThL - although it'd be hilarious to see a transcript in the Sunday Times R.E. section...

Posted by: Arkady at July 10, 2009 10:57 AM

So we shouldn't make any comments about the blonde person in the American Apparel ad either?

Posted by: dittoburg at July 10, 2009 11:01 AM

READ THE ORIGINAL POST BEFORE YOU START BLAMING. ALL OF US SEEM TO KNOW WHAT REALLY HAPPENED BECAUSE WE READ THE POST. JACKASS

All Brownstoner had to do is pick up the phone and call the listing. End of story!

This proves that Jon pulls stories out of his ass! You lap it up like a Porn Shot!

"No. However, there are brokers and many online services which offer FSBO sellers the option of listing their property in their local MLS database by paying a flat fee or another non-traditional compensation method."

100% WRONG!! I'm a former MLS member and you have to be part of the MLS and NAR's to start showing those listings and sometimes the Brokers don't want to share their listings on the MLS.

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:02 AM

I know several RE brokers (for small local companies) and they are not at all like Awaye. They are hardworking and honest. It's a shame brokers like Awaye get all the attention, and these guys get a bad rep because of guilt by association.

I'm really curious how Awaye expected this to work? Did they really think they could bring buyers to the house and the owner would just let them sell the house in front of them? especially if buyers are turned off by the added commission?

Posted by: bxgrl at July 10, 2009 11:06 AM

"Mr. B is a blogger and has never held himself out as a journalist."

So that's Brownstoner's pass?? So that means anyone can spew lies and half truths about anyone Slopefarm? I love the way everyone Circle Jerks one another!

*** Pressing the mute button***

The What

Someday this war is gonna end..

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:06 AM

At a minimum, the owner can bring a claim of copyright infringement against Awaye Realty for use of the photos and any copied text, though it's hard to assess what the damages would be. Other potential causes of action might be certain common law deceptive trading practice claims etc... . A written threat to bring any such claim would, I would assume, be enough to get Awaye to take the ad down if it bothered the owner enough.

Posted by: 1842 at July 10, 2009 11:06 AM

Guys you can have a Verbal Open Listing agreement with a seller! Awaye can claim that the seller gave permission to sell the property end of story!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:10 AM

What is really showing himself as the fool that he is and the half-baked poseur of all things righteous.

It's clear he never read the original thread from yesterday. He never lets the facts get in the way of his drivel & vitriol.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:13 AM

What,

You haven't demonstrated that there was a lie. Prove there was a lie and then call Mr. B on it. Right now we have a set of facts on one side and pure conjecture from you on the other.

I am curious why you are so ready to paint all hedge fund managers as ponzi-scheming fraudsters while cutting a dishonest broker an awful lot of slack. You seem to think everyone is lying about everything, then you rush to the defense of someone who seems to be a bald-faced liar without any facts to support your side.

If you have some real info on all this, we would all like to see it.

Posted by: slopefarm at July 10, 2009 11:14 AM

I sold my Manhattan apartment FSBO and had the same problem. One realtor posted the listing with pictures from the way it looked with the previous owner. Another one of the trouble makers was from Domain properties, and I harassed him until he took the listing down.

Posted by: Stopthemadness at July 10, 2009 11:16 AM

When I've posted my commercial space on Craig's list, whether I've stated "no brokers" or not, within a day or two several miscellaneous brokers are posting my ad without asking me. Once they have rounded up "clients" they start calling me. I don't really mind it too much as I seem to get more exposure, but it is weird. The mainstream brokers always get involved,too, but they call me before they start advestising.

Posted by: bessie2 at July 10, 2009 11:16 AM

Posted by: Stopthemadness at July 10, 2009 11:16 AM

Guys you can have a Verbal Open Listing agreement with a seller! Awaye can claim that the seller gave permission to sell the property end of story!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:10 AM

Numbnuts, the seller has posted that no such agreement was ever in force. How dense can you actually be?????

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:16 AM

slopefarm- I really like you but if you think What is going to answer perfectly logical and intelligent questions I'm afraid you've had too much Kool-aid. :-)

Posted by: bxgrl at July 10, 2009 11:18 AM

DIBS, its WhatWorld

Posted by: dittoburg at July 10, 2009 11:21 AM

Once again he's managed to make the comments about him rather than the initial post.

You can laugh at him all you want but he sure knows how to make it happen doesn't he?

Posted by: TownhouseLady at July 10, 2009 11:25 AM

ditto, it al reminds me of the song "White Rabbit," but I don't want to get called racist because of it.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:26 AM

Whether or not he considers himself a blogger, a journalist or a combination of the two, I think it would behoove Mr. B to try to contact Awaye and ask if they would like to comment, as I suggested at 10:14 am.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 11:26 AM

"You haven't demonstrated that there was a lie. Prove there was a lie and then call Mr. B on it. Right now we have a set of facts on one side and pure conjecture from you on the other."

I never said it was a lie! This is what I said " Guys lets remember that Brownstoner did not call the Broker FIRST when he post this crap. Why should Jon get a pass for not being diligent! This goes to show how much effort Brownstoner puts into finding out the truth..."

If you can find out the part where I called Brownstoner a liar, I will buy you a steak dinner!

"I am curious why you are so ready to paint all hedge fund managers as ponzi-scheming fraudsters while cutting a dishonest broker an awful lot of slack."

Before I go full tilt on the Broker (BTW they're Scumballs) I need to see some more information!

People change their minds every second but if Brownstoner would do a little investigating then this problem would've never happen.

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:29 AM

I hope with all the publicity the owner is able to sell this. A couple of factual errors on his site, though: PS 20 is no longer the site of a citywide gifted and talented school. Brooklyn School of Inquiry, which is located in Bay Ridge, will be the only citywide G&T in Brooklyn starting this fall.

Posted by: since 2000 at July 10, 2009 11:30 AM

bx,

I don't really think so at this point, but I am testing the hypothesis. I really should let it go. I've done absoltuely no name calling and have been trying to engage on the merits, expressing agerement where I can and arguing on merits only. I like cobble and Biff a lot and they see something of merit in what's posts and his role on this site. But I am starting to think he just wants to pick fights with the posters he hates, no matter what teh topic or whether there is any basis for argument, and either can't or won't make subtle distinctions or wrestle with facts when they are not on his side. It is beginning to seem pointless.

Posted by: slopefarm at July 10, 2009 11:30 AM

Biff, I think they just did comment. The original listing on their website has been deleted....

http://www.awayerealty.com/detail_buy.asp?webid=770

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:31 AM

"Whether or not he considers himself a blogger, a journalist or a combination of the two, I think it would behoove Mr. B to try to contact Awaye and ask if they would like to comment, as I suggested at 10:14 am."

What??!! A voice of reason???!! You mean there is intelligent life on Planet Earth???

I made a point about contacting the Broker and 3 Jackasses made it about The What, thanks guys for proving my point!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:32 AM

Yes, I think it would be interesting to hear Awaye's side of the story. Not holding my breath, though.

Posted by: etson at July 10, 2009 11:32 AM

"But I am starting to think he just wants to pick fights with the posters he hates, no matter what teh topic or whether there is any basis for argument, and either can't or won't make subtle distinctions or wrestle with facts when they are not on his side. It is beginning to seem pointless."

When did try to pick a fight here Slopefarm?? When??!! I made a point about being diligent and everyone attacks me!

That's it Mute for everyone..

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:35 AM

Mr. B, I implore you to put a stop to this bickering nonsense and just let us know if you tried (wether it was sucessful or not) to contact Awaye and get a statement.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 11:36 AM

Yep THL, as Benson (RIP) once said, he's an "arsonist"

Posted by: dittoburg at July 10, 2009 11:37 AM

What, in my first post I disagreed with you. I did not make it about you. (10:57) You chose to call me a circle jerk participant and press the "mute" button. This is my main issue with you -- you take all disagreement as an attack and you attack back disproportionately. As a major poster on this blog, you could just as easily have called Awaye yourself, as I suggested, and posted the results, if you thought there was more to the story. You have chosen to make this a fight, not me. But if you can't engage proportionately over disagreement, I may need to get a mute button of my own.

Posted by: slopefarm at July 10, 2009 11:40 AM

That's it Mute for everyone..

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 11:35 AM

HURRAH!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5iseJJ5ogA

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:41 AM

What a shocker - an interesting thread gets "The Whatjacked"

Posted by: dirty_hipster at July 10, 2009 11:42 AM

I REPEAT....

The original listing on their website has been deleted....

http://www.awayerealty.com/detail_buy.asp?webid=770

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:42 AM

Agreed, slopefarm. I've gone through the same process and came to the same conclusions.

Posted by: bxgrl at July 10, 2009 11:43 AM

What, I wrote:

"You haven't demonstrated that there was a lie. Prove there was a lie and then call Mr. B on it. Right now we have a set of facts on one side and pure conjecture from you on the other."

You wrote:

"I never said it was a lie!"

But you earlier wrote:

"So that's Brownstoner's pass?? So that means anyone can spew lies and half truths about anyone Slopefarm? I love the way everyone Circle Jerks one another!"

So which is it? Were there lies and half truths in the Awaye story or not?

Posted by: slopefarm at July 10, 2009 11:48 AM

I'm going outside now. I'll probably run into the lunatic with the tight pants, no butt and the cane who rants and raves on the corner.

I will most likely be able to have a more intelligent converstion with him than with the What.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 11:56 AM

Awaye has a standing offer from us to run a comment from them regarding their side of the story...

Posted by: brownstoner at July 10, 2009 12:02 PM

Thank you Mr. B. for responding.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 10, 2009 12:10 PM

DIBS - I work on 46th & Lex. By any chance, are you referring to the guy who wears purple wool leggings almost every day, year round (thus, my office calls him "Purple Leggings Guy")?

Posted by: CarrollGardened at July 10, 2009 12:14 PM

Thanks Mr B
(just to clarify, in my earlier comment I meant I wasn't holding my breath for a response from Awaye, not that I was waiting for you to ask).

Posted by: etson at July 10, 2009 12:16 PM

I hired Awaye Realty earlier this year. I had to endure many unscrupulous practices until my contract with them expired. Dreadful people.

Posted by: Topham Beauclerk at July 10, 2009 12:17 PM

No fire escape?! Is there some reason this would be legal on a 2-family?

Posted by: dbrown at July 10, 2009 1:05 PM

"Cue the jokes to stay 'Awaye' from this realtor."

I won't take that bait, but can I at least state that it would be cute if Awaye made Jamie Farr a partner in the Company and gave him top billing.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 1:10 PM

if the broker from awaye actually could get a buyer willing to pay enough to cover the owner's asking price and the broker's fee, how is this bad? maybe the folks at awaye are having a hard time in this economy (like the rest of us) and just trying to make some money.

obviously, if awaye is using this listing to get people to call and then show other properties, it's pretty unethical. but "ethics" doesn't seem to be a requirement for brokers, especially not in a down market. why is everyone so surprised?

Posted by: funkymonkey at July 10, 2009 1:40 PM

I don't understand what the broker could possibly get out of lifting a FSBO listing like this. Could someone explain?

And, Rob, your description of the broker showing up at your open house gave me a good giggle. Thanks!

Mr. B, could you get someone from Awaye on the phone to get their side of the story?

Posted by: BrooklynButler at July 10, 2009 1:45 PM

In any case...

Just wanted to mention that one of the recourses the owner of the FSBO has is to contact the licensing agency for brokers/agents, which I believe is the NYS Department of State, and file a complaint. I would think that they (everyone involved) should lose their license(s).

What Awaye did wrong was to misrepresent that they do indeed represent the seller, which intereferes with how the owner goes about selling their property. This is the difference between Awaye and Mr. B, who merely directed everyone's attention to the Awaye listing.

Posted by: tower at July 10, 2009 2:22 PM

CarrollGardened....he's usually on the SE corner of 43rd street.

I work in the 466 lexington building...aka 237 Park Ave. Where r u???

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 2:26 PM

i know this seller personally and he is absolutely legitimate, and obviously quite distressed about the situation.

setting my personal knowledge aside, with respect to the legal questions, surely new york state might have a cause of action. the new york state consumer protection anti-deceptive practices law is pretty broad and also appears to provide a private right of action to the seller. See NY General Business law section 349. (you can find it here, http://law.justia.com/newyork/codes/general-business/gbs0349_349.html, or at the official NYS website under Laws of New York/General Business/Article 22-A): http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/frmload.cgi?MENU-56609890) the remedy isn't huge, either for the state or the individual, but the publicity surrounding it could be very uncomfortable.

more aggressively, you could call this a bunch of different types of fraud. even if you ultimately can't prove damages, or any other element, a government investigation alone - well prior to any actual charges - could cause this shop at least a little (and in my opinion, well-deserved) pain.

Posted by: i disagree at July 10, 2009 3:14 PM

"i know this seller personally and he is absolutely legitimate, and obviously quite distressed about the situation."

I also know President Obama and he's going to me let run a Strip Club from Camp David...

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at July 10, 2009 3:19 PM

I hope you're not part of the act.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at July 10, 2009 3:31 PM

As someone who regularly pisses on Corcoran and other big brokers for what I view as unrealistic pricing, I would like to comment that regardless of my views on their pricing practices they are highly professional and can be trusted not to engage in questionable business practices. I have a high comfort level dealing with Corcoran and their peers. Whether their services are worth 6%, and whether their asking prices are unrealistic, is a different point. They are professionals and they act accordingly. Clearly this Awaye place is a bucket shop in comparison.

Posted by: lechacal at July 10, 2009 3:31 PM

Lechecal, I wouldn't be surprised if they have in their offices a big chalkboard with the words:

Always
Be
Closing

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 4:00 PM

Biff - assume you mean Awaye, not Corcoran.

"First prize: a Cadillac. Second prize: a set of steak knives. Third prize: you're fired."

Posted by: lechacal at July 10, 2009 4:07 PM

Lechacal, yes, I meant Awaye. God, what an amazing scene with Alec Baldwin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TROhlThs9qY

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 4:28 PM

Coffee is for closers.

Posted by: Biff Champion at July 10, 2009 4:29 PM

There are numerous possible causes of action. First, there are the misrepresentation and consumer protection laws for the false posting of information. Second, there are copyright issues for the lifting of the pictures and text. The damages for the first type are difficult to prove - the seller isnt hurt financially as the only benefit to this guy that his portfolio of properties he represents will seem larger, which makes him look like a bigger player. so no money damages there. But on the Copyright cause of action, there are statutory damages (as well as attorneys fees and costs) - you dont need to show actual loss or damage, all you need to do is prove infringement.

Posted by: saminthehood at July 10, 2009 5:01 PM

I once had access to MLS. I was a broker. I worked for Awaye. That is how I made a living. I was a fraud. I am a fraud. But don't call me a fraud or I will call you a liar.

I created the housing bubble! I was unprofessional and unethical.

I am going to put you all on mute and then respond to all of you all day long.

I am crazy.

Posted by: ghettoazzpnkbtch at July 10, 2009 5:43 PM

This is very common. It is against the code of conduct for licensed brokers, so you can complain to the licensing agency. It is also illegal to use photos and text that do not belong to you without permission, so the seller can sue the agency. In general, it's a good idea for FSBO to always say "no brokers, please" in their listings to discourage the kind of thing.

Posted by: mopar at July 10, 2009 5:51 PM

To file a complaint with a real estate broker's licensing agency,
the NYS Department of State, go here:
http://www.dos.state.ny.us/cnsl/repops.html

Click on the,
"Licensing Complaint Resolution Process - LI02" hyperlink,
then
"through this website" hyperlink.

Or you can go directly there here:
http://www.dos.state.ny.us/lcns/lcnscf.html

I didn't want to put this first because it looks so basic, someone might think it's a fake page. lol.

Posted by: tower at July 10, 2009 6:27 PM

I really think you hurt them pretty good if they get their license taken away. They then have to explain the revocation on every other license application. If this happens a few times, brokers will get the message.

Posted by: tower at July 10, 2009 6:31 PM

The naughtiness is already indexed 6th from the top of Googling Awaye Realty. This newbie won't get within 100 yards of Awaye as I'm looking. Won't some of you join me - google them and hit the link. Indexing the naughtiness a little higher up each time - surely we can jack that puppy to the #1 with only a few refreshes.

Posted by: brooklyndoug at July 10, 2009 7:50 PM

Unfortunately this is all too common. This happened to me about 5 years ago when I was selling my apartment on the Upper East Side. Bellmarc Realty lifted my listing that I put on the NY Times web site. I immediately called Bellmarc and sent them a cease and desist email. I was furious. When you do a FSBO you have to be very careful. A lot of real estate companies will approach you and say you can list on their site or they ask to come by and just take some pictures that they list on their site. If a customer comes through their site then they claim that they represented you. It is an ugly business.

Posted by: drbrooklyn at July 10, 2009 10:15 PM

This kind of thing might be common practice with the "bucket shops" but not with the larger brokers like BHS and Corcoran, as Lechecal pointed out.

Someone above said their attorney friend said this:
"He said there is clearly ethical violations that can and should be reported to their governing body, but likely no legal ramifications as there is no real damage."

I think there IS a way to show there was real damage. Awaye put up bad photos and a bad listing for the property which turned away potential buyers for this owner. That's the damage. It's to the reputation or perception of the property by the current pool of potential buyers. The owner can pull comments from Brownstoner as proof people were insulting the property based on the bad photos.

Posted by: traditionalmod at July 11, 2009 9:13 AM

I'm sure there was some kind of an agreement between the owner and the broker. The damage was done by the owner, the second he started this blog, maybe this was his intention all along to try to get his house some publicity. I'm a bank appraiser and what the asking price and the real estimate value are totally two different animals. The owner should realize that this house will not appraise to the price that he's asking. The house is worth $850,000
Obviously the owner is still in denial, it's not a seller's market anymore. It's a buyers market and what buyer is going to want to buy this house even at $1 million when its worth $850,000??
Looks like the seller is desperate to try to get some activity on his home and causing a commotion. If I were a buyer, I wouldn't want to deal with an owner like this. If you gave him an offer that wasn't to his approval, he would probably blog about your whole business to the whole internet. Also, my brother is a lawyer. There's no real threat to the owner, this listing was not put into the MLS, just on their website. Certainly there's no criminal intent. Some brokers take OPEN LISTINGS more or less from FSBO's because a FSBO thinks all of the sudden, he's become a profestional realtor, appraiser, closer, mortgage broker, attorney etc

The owner doesn't sound like a nice fellow. I wouldn't want to deal with him not personally or professionally.

Posted by: jwlprincess1 at July 11, 2009 5:03 PM

Awaye Realty is the WORST!

Posted by: hawthorne3 at July 11, 2009 9:07 PM

JWLPRINCESS you obviously work for Awaye Realty. You are speculating that the owner somehow is in cahoots with Mr. B. and other posters to have them make negative comments about your website's poor grammar, low-rez photos downgraded from photos on the owner's website, and your history of mistreating your clients? All so that the owner could complain about Awaye Realty and get publicity?!

You guys are truly unethical, underhanded and pathetic.

Posted by: EdNorton at July 11, 2009 10:27 PM

EDNORTON, No I don't work with Awaye Realty. I work with Chase as a bank appraiser. Most of the realtors who I work with are RE/MAX, Coldwell Banker, Fillmore, Century 21 and Corcoran. I've never even heard of this firm but I do know a lot of agents who will take an open listing from a FSBO which means For Sale By Owner.
Sometimes they get lucky and they get an offer which is accepted, goes into contract, I come along to appraise the property, The property doesn't appraise even though the buyer has 20% down, house appraises below market value. You ask the agent, how is it you came to this price? Agent replies, have it as open listing, the owner is a for sale by owner. Guess what? buyer doesn't want to buy because the appraisal came in low, the buyer doesnt want to come with their down payment, seller doesnt want to budge with their price. Who loses at this point as time goes by? the seller, property devaluates more. As interest rates go up- property value goes down. No matter which way you look at it.
Maybe the real estate was wrong to put it up on their website, thinking it was okay from the owner, there's only one side of this story. what about the company itself. Have they even been contacted in reference to this blog?

Also,one more thing sweety, you should always make sure you have all your facts straight before you falsely accuse and point your finger at someone which is not the person who you thought it was.

PS If you should ever need a loan check out our website: www.chase.com

Posted by: jwlprincess1 at July 12, 2009 12:42 AM

let's see, which of the following is most likely:

1. a chase bank appraiser became so agitated by this story that she registered for a brownstoner account just to post twice about how awful the property owner must be.

2. ms. awaye finally decided to try some damage control, creating a new login as an alter-ego "appraiser" to post a fantasy version of the story and make wild, desperate accusations about the property owner in an effort to distract from her own misconduct.

pretty pathetic, ms. awaye.

Posted by: z at July 12, 2009 12:56 AM

jwlprincess, you really are Awaye Realty!! From the post that you made on ripoffreport about how even after taking Roberta Asher’s real estate course, you still were a crappy broker, we know that you are a broker, not a bank appraiser as you claim in your post. Check it out:

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/329/RipOff0329204.htm

It often takes one 5 second search to unmask frauds like you, Ms. Awaye.

I think that it is funny that in responding to your ridiculous post on ripoffreports, someone said that she was "therefore quite comfortable in labeling the originator, Jwlprincess1, of this ludicrous complaint a moron." Evidently that same moron got a job at Awaye Realty and now cruises websites pretending to be a an objective "bank appraiser," and defending the unethical practices of Awaye Realty.

Awaye Realty is a joke. If you want a real broker, try Brooklyn Properties or Corcoran.

Posted by: EdNorton at July 12, 2009 8:47 AM

Z is right. It makes no sense that a Chase broker would become so upset about the theoretical possibility that Awaye Realty actually had the owner's permission to sell his property that he would create an ID on brownstoner to argue the point. Jwlprincess obviously is someone at Awaye Realty.

jwlprincess arguing that she is not Awaye Realty is just further proof that she is. Why does she care who we think she is? She clearly takes this personally, which shows that she works at Awaye Realty.

... As does the ripoffreport post. LOL. You're busted jwlprincess. Give it up and quit creating more evidence of your underhandedness.

Posted by: Jumbo at July 12, 2009 9:08 AM

EdNorton, great detective work!
SOMEONE GET THIS MAN A TROPHY! ASAP!
When I read your post and the link you provided I howled. So, JWlprincess1, are you still going to claim to be a bank appraiser and not a broker? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 12, 2009 7:42 PM

Oh, and by the way, it makes zero sense that the owner of the subject property and Awaye would have cooked up this scheme together. What would Awaye get out of it? Having their firm trounced and called the worst in the business for the world to see in perpetuity on the internet? There may be some dumb brokers out there, but even I'm willing to give folks the benefit of the doubt that they aren't *that* stupid. Also, it makes no sense that the owner would cook up this idea on his own. Why? So he can be sued for libel by Awaye? Again, you can trip over the numerous dumb folks in this world, but I'm doubting that the owner is *that* dumb. I think it speaks volumes that the listing disappeared from Awaye's site. C'mon JWlprincess1...it disappeared for a reason. But I guess you already knew that :)

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at July 12, 2009 7:47 PM

Among other things, jwlPrincess1 (can there possibly be a jwlP...2?!?), there were several attempts to get Awaye to respond to the threads to no avail.
Unfortunately, a broker friend of mine (w/ a big firm) says there's nothing legally wrong so far as Awaye didn't say it was an exclusive listing.

Posted by: Arkady at July 13, 2009 9:32 AM

To the 180-Adelphi St owner,

In case you did not know:

This company is so great,they have a track record of advertising properties that aren't theirs.
The Standish or 169 Columbia Hgts
8-10 Clark St. and a majority of the listings on the site are either other broker's listings or listings simply stolen off Craigs List. The absolute highlight of it all is that 'Associate Broker'AnnMarie Barker isnt even licensed! Check it out at the DOS website.
Arlene Waye,the broker is notorious for presenting false offers,frauding sellers names on MLS forms and automatically extending listing agreements. That office is a real piece of work! The 'vice president' of the company who is Arlenes husband was newly licensed in Dec.08 although has been selling & renting at Clark St.& Columbia Hgts wayyyy long before he held his license. They charge RE Fees to building they manage...they will do ANYTHING for that extra buck! B E W A R E

Posted by: MoneyMarkets300 at July 15, 2009 2:24 PM

The realtor's explanation does not make sense. In order to list the property, Awaye had to copy the photos from the FSBO Webpage. I did not compare the property description to see if that was copied as well. Seems to be evidence of an intention to list it, not just "put the listing into inventory", whatever that means...

In any event, at least they took it down relatively promptly.

Posted by: 1842 at July 16, 2009 3:55 PM

@saminthehood: You also need to register the copyright before you can sue for damages, which takes about a year to do.

Interestingly, Awaye never actually claims that they were contracted to sell the house, so how it got into "inventory" is a bit fishy. My guess is that they're trying to get a buyer's broker commission out of the bogus listing.

And here's my favorite part of the response: "it is very disappointing that a public venue like this can act to defame a company for no good reason ...."

A venue can no more defame a company than a medium can paint a picture.

Posted by: kimcheater at July 16, 2009 3:57 PM

I still like them better than Rapid Reality.

Posted by: mrkknox at July 16, 2009 4:02 PM

Awaye's update makes no sense.

Posted by: mopar at July 16, 2009 4:25 PM

"A venue can no more defame a company than a medium can paint a picture."

Oh, I dunno, I have a very nice landscape that was done by a storefront psychic on 37th street.

Posted by: bfarwell at July 16, 2009 11:36 PM

Seriously, though, I think Awaye was handling the giant loft building on Court/9th in when I lived there, and they were absolutely horrible to deal with.

Posted by: bfarwell at July 16, 2009 11:42 PM

4 years ago I went to an open house held by Awaye. I arrived right as it was starting on a Sunday morning (no small feat for me).

The agent's assistant opened the door and was noticeably uncomfortable... kept glancing at the bathroom.
Moments later the Awaye agent came bursting out of the bathroom rubbing her nose and acting WAAAYYYY too excited for the time of day... if you know what I mean.
She then strangely made a proclamation/affirmation right into my face; "I'm going to sell this house today!!!", began to talk my head off, finally becoming aggressive and dejected when I told her it wasn't the house for me.

I remember thinking to myself "I should start an online list of Real Estate Agents who are freaks, this lady is first"

-R

Posted by: WTBrooklyn at July 18, 2009 3:39 AM

Awaye Realty has built a house with a deck of cards that will slowly be knocked down.

Posted by: MoneyMarkets300 at July 23, 2009 7:59 PM