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April 22, 2009

The Sex Offenders Amongst Us

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Last week's Daily News article about the convicted sex offender found naked and self-mutilated in Fort Greene made us realize that we didn't have a clue about how many registered sex offenders were living in our midst, so we headed over to the State Division of Criminal Justice Services website that makes such information public. We learned that our home zip code of 11238, which includes Fort Greene, Clinton Hill and parts of Prospect Heights and Crown Heights had 18 registered sex offenders—and that one of them, a child molester, lives just a block away from us. That's nothing compared to the 90-odd men registered in Bed Stuy's zip code of 11216 though. By comparison, Brooklyn Heights and Dumbo appear to be sex offender-free. Not surprisingly, many of the offenders are required to attend drug treatment as one of the terms of their parole. Luckily for them, Clinton Hill, Bed Stuy and Crown Heights also have more than their fair share of those too—unless a new clinic has popped up on Remsen or Pierrepont recently and we didn't get the memo.




Posted by Brownstoner at 10:00 AM | Comments (33)
Categories: Clinton Hill, Crown Heights, Fort Greene, Quality of Life

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I have mixed feelings about these types of things. I think there is nothing more devastating than hurting a child because in many ways you are destroying a part of them for the rest of their lives. On the other, the stench of witch huntery and grossness of being able to map people based on something they did grosses me out. Imagine if you could map out people who stole, or prostituted themselves, or once killed someone in a DUI. Creeps me out.

Posted by: LincolnSlope at April 22, 2009 10:14 AM

i vote for tracking those who stole and those who killed someone while dui.

i have a hard time imagining that you are hurting society by knowing where the thieves and drunks with cars live.

now, as for those who prostitute themselves out....

that seems to be a slippery slope definitionally.

Posted by: bkn4life at April 22, 2009 10:26 AM

I have to admit that I torture myself by going to that website at least twice yearly to check who is lurking around my house. On the one hand, it's good to have the information, but then again I walk around for a few weeks looking over my shoulder and trying to recognize the faces I saw. For folks with children, it's a very valuable tool though. You can never be too careful with your kids.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at April 22, 2009 10:31 AM

It's true. If I heard a neighbor touched a kid I would want to string him by the b___s. So yeah, map it.

Posted by: LincolnSlope at April 22, 2009 10:39 AM

Since I know where this one may go, during the course of the day, I took the opportunity to check out some of the names in my zipcode, the Bed Stuy 11216, now before the name calling starts.

While the list is long, it's obvious some of the names are aliases, or variations on the same name, which the website states as a certainty. So that cuts the list by a third. Clicking on some names at random brought out more clever aliases, so we're down further. A lot of these guys are still in jail, too. We're down to half.

So 45 sex offenders in an area the size of Hoboken is, unfortunately, about par for the course. Our guys are mostly rapists, not child molesters. Not cool by any standard, and some of them were downright terrifying, some just pitiful. Fortunately, I recognized none of them, and most of the addresses were in parts of the area I have no cause to visit.

What does this really mean? It means that we have to keep our heads, not go running around like panicked reactionaries, and be careful. The same things we did half an hour ago before we looked at this list. In a way it's like seeing a slide of the bacteria and viruses that are on the elevator button to your office. It was there before you saw the slide, and you didn't drop dead of Ebola, and you probably won't now, but you're going to avoid touching it.

Sex crimes are often about rage, social impotence, drug addiction, opportunity, and the abuse of the perpetrators themselves. I am not downplaying their horror, brutality, or seriousness. I am not advocating that we understand the reasons and pat the perps on the wrist. These guys are scary, and what they do is unacceptable in a civilized society. What I am saying is that this underscores the need for us to educate ourselves in preventative behavior, support lobbying for better social and preventative services for kids, more cops, better funded courts and better ways of rehabilitation, when possible.

I'm not going to say Brownstoner is unfairly picking on my community, these things exist. We need to deal with them, work to eliminate them, yet realize that they are not the defining face of our communities, and those communities are still fine places to live.

Posted by: Montrose Morris at April 22, 2009 10:43 AM

We tried not to include the duplicates in our counting...total numbers on the lists were higher than we cited in our post.

Posted by: brownstoner at April 22, 2009 10:47 AM

I would like to find out among the new transplants into the
area who are on the sex offender's list. Any idea how to map that information?

Posted by: The Who at April 22, 2009 10:50 AM

although I imagine I'll be the minority, while I understand the knee-jerk reaction to the horrendous nature of sex-offender's crimes, any potential benefit by this is outweighed by the invasion of privacy, "witch-hunting", and other violations of the rights of accused. the list conjures up images of each of these individuals violating a small child against their will, and waiting to do it to yours, which is in no way productive. I would hope in the end that parents will still be thoughtful and aware parents, and won't rely on a system that further shames criminals and ostrasizes them from society. It also is at odds with the intent of our legal/incarceration system as a means for rehabilitation.

Posted by: amt230 at April 22, 2009 11:01 AM

I just saw on this site that there was a sex offender living across the street from a friend. I sent her the link and it turns out he'd been following her. So, basically, that's all I need to know about whether there should be a sex offender registry.

Posted by: feral at April 22, 2009 11:01 AM

Also, there are totally sex offenders in Brooklyn Heights. Just put in 11201!

Posted by: feral at April 22, 2009 11:04 AM

I did this about three months ago and compared Jackson Heights, Bushwick, and the part of Bed Stuy that is 11233. Bed Stuy had the largest list by far.

I don't know what to make of it. Maybe that rents are cheaper in Bed Stuy?

Posted by: mopar at April 22, 2009 11:11 AM

amt230, apparently feral's post of 11:01 would negate your argument.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 22, 2009 11:19 AM

There are a number of substance abuse treatment programs on Remsen and there's even a rapid drug testing facility on Pierrepont. This isn't all that surprising given that Criminal and Supreme Court, the Department of Probation and a number of re-entry programs are also all housed in the area.

Posted by: greatergowanus at April 22, 2009 11:23 AM

Re: 11201, none of those people actually live in Heights proper or Dumbo...as for the clinics there, thanks for pointing that out. We had no idea. Are they high-volume? How are relations with the rest of community?

Posted by: brownstoner at April 22, 2009 11:30 AM

dibs - actually, I'd argue it would reinforce it. without invalidating this friend's experience (and I'm sure I'll get a rampant response to this one), I'd be interested to hear what actually formed the basis of her positive conclusion that he'd been following her. short of an admission on his part, i think that his presence on the list contributed at least partially to the conclusion. it resolves any ambiguities in the favor of fear-mongering, which is the unproductive form of awareness.

i am very happy that your friend is safe, but she should be wary of anyone following her, regardless of this list.

Posted by: amt230 at April 22, 2009 11:30 AM

I totally agree that you can have too much information for your own good. If you were visiting BH would you first check out the map? I have a child, and I say no, you CAN 'be too careful' with your children; certainly I was over-protected as one, and I would not want to visit that on my son. That way lies vigilantism.

Posted by: cmu at April 22, 2009 11:39 AM

Based on Census data-- there are 50,000 people in the 11238. If we have 18 sex offenders that probably makes us one of the safest sex-offender-free neighborhoods in the country.

Just a thought.

Posted by: havelc at April 22, 2009 11:42 AM

"I just saw on this site that there was a sex offender living across the street from a friend. I sent her the link and it turns out he'd been following her. So, basically, that's all I need to know about whether there should be a sex offender registry."

o_o <--?????

"I'm not going to say Brownstoner is unfairly picking on my community, these things exist."

I will...

Someday this war's gonna end. That'd be just fine with the boys on the boat. They weren't looking for anything more than a way home. Trouble is, I'd been back there, and I knew that it just didn't exist anymore.

Captain Benjamin L. Willard - Apocalypse Now

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at April 22, 2009 11:58 AM

The thing is, being a sex offender is different than other offenders due to the nature of the compulsion and the demonstrable recidivism rate. It's not an issue of "shaming" perpetrators, it's one of actually protecting the community. By the way, those on the list are not "accused," they've been convicted.

That said, I completely recognize the "witch-hunt" potential here. It's a very gray area.

Posted by: feral at April 22, 2009 12:00 PM

well, we can absolutely agree it's a very gray.

Posted by: amt230 at April 22, 2009 12:09 PM

I think it bears noting that the registered sex offender who mutilated himself in Clinton Hill did not live here. Whatever you might think about the register and the map, don't forget you live in a city with hundreds of miles of subways. A registered sex offender can live in Woodside and be up to no good in Parkchester.

Posted by: altervoce at April 22, 2009 12:10 PM

...wait for it... "area."

didn't finish that sentence apparently.

Posted by: amt230 at April 22, 2009 12:13 PM

Pretty sure he did live here...he was listed with a Classon address.

Posted by: brownstoner at April 22, 2009 12:25 PM

I'll leave this subject alone after this only because as a resident of Fort Greene for over 20 yrs, Bed-Stuy 15 yrs I've never been victimized or paranoid about sex offenders nor has anyone that I know. My girls walked to and from school - Queen of All Sts and Bishop Loughlin - back there, before anybody was remotely interested in Ft. Greene and the sex offender population.

I'm more worried, now, about whats hidden behind the squeaky clean facade of the new arrivals. The craig's list killer types - its worrisome because they're non-suspect and they consider this creep to be "all american"

I don't support sex offenders at all, but what exactly is the purpose of this article? Because some areas don't have sex offenders doesn't mean that none exist.
The average Jewish male sexual offenders aren't even listed with NY state violators- most don't even go to jail. You figure that out.

This means that, somewhere along the line, it was decided that sexual offender information won't be reported in certain diverse populations.
You figure that out too!

Posted by: The Who at April 22, 2009 1:46 PM

doesn't matter where they live. It is where they pray - I mean prey.
I have some strong reservations about this registry and mapping thing - because of many cases I've read where people who have done minor things get labeled and grouped with people that could be trouble. (say someone at 18 had fling very consensual with very experienced 15 year old).

Posted by: Petebklyn at April 22, 2009 2:02 PM

havelc is 100% correct. The rape stats for NYC fall far below the national average. Much lower than cities like Portland and Atlanta. NYC is generally a very safe city making the top 20 safest this calendar year. Looking at crime witihin a particular precinct which may cross several zip codes has been an effective crime management tool. However, where people reside and where they commit crimes are not always one and the same particularly in NYC. Rapists have metrocards too.

Posted by: Chosen at April 22, 2009 2:02 PM

Jonathan, Capt. Kight stated at last night's precinct council meeting that he did not live here or have any relationship to the archdiocese.

Posted by: altervoce at April 22, 2009 3:24 PM

"The average Jewish male sexual offenders aren't even listed with NY state violators- most don't even go to jail."

What on earth is that supposed to mean, who?

Posted by: sixyearsandcounting at April 22, 2009 4:01 PM

Guess that's possible, altervoce, but the guy on this link has the same first name (These offenders often show up under multiple last names) and is guilty of the same crime (13 y.o. girl): http://tinyurl.com/c55cgh . Seems highly coincidental.

Posted by: brownstoner at April 22, 2009 5:10 PM

I hear you; I was quoting what was announced in public by a city official. She could be wrong, or have additional information. My real point--not unlike comments made back when about the federal probation office downtown--is that people move around.

Posted by: altervoce at April 22, 2009 6:25 PM

Actually, Brownstoner, 175 Remsen Street has a bunch of substance-abuse treatment programs: Bridge Back to Life, Realization Center, Brooklyn TASC, etc. Many of these serve a criminal justice population mandated by parole and probation to get treatment. That area has a high concentration of therapists, some of whom treat sex offenders.

Posted by: Big Jugs at April 22, 2009 6:48 PM

sixyearsandcounting:
It means exactly what it states: that sex crimes commited by jewish males are for the most part ommitted from NY state public sex offender stats and reports..almost all of them serve no time for sexual violations upon another person.....Go to the brooklyn D.A.'s website for more info on sex crimes for this population.

Sexual predators was not - has not and is not a dominating issue for us long time residents of Fort Green; but for some reason the paranoia seems to be catching "afire" I believe the paranoia is totally related to something else.
Btw,
Does anyone know the outcome of the report of a woman who was raped near Brooklyn Hospital behind garbage cans?

Posted by: The Who at April 22, 2009 7:11 PM

The Who: the average Jewish mail is barely observant, let alone Hasidic. The scandals in the Hasidic and Lubovich communities are a whole can of worms but they don't say a thing about "most Jewish males"

I know two people on that registry, one was 18 when he had sex with a 14 year old and plead guilty to statutory rape. Threat to society? I'm not convinced.

The other is a more complex story, and I haven't made it my business to assess guilt or innocence but he took a plea bargain because he didn't have a good lawyer. Despite what makes news, most child molesters are related to their victims. Wealthy offenders get a good lawyer and enough expert witnesses to inspire doubt. Offenders who can't afford a lawyer take a plea bargain that includes the registry.

So the registry says more about who can afford slick lawyers than anything else.

Posted by: serpentor at April 24, 2009 1:53 PM

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