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April 22, 2009

"Life Deserved" Slogan Sets off Gentrification Debate

isabella-0409.jpgA post on Clinton Hill Chill last week (originally posted on blog With a Brooklyn Accent) that started with a deconstruction of the marketing slogan of a condo development in the area erupted into a debate about everything from race and class and to the efficacy of community organizations and the role of churches. The comment thread ultimately turns into a head-to-head between Putnamdenizen and a commenter known as X; their arguments show how easy it is for people to speak past each other and epitomizes why the emotionally-charged issue is so hard to discuss in a constructive manner. Thought-provoking reading, for sure.




Posted by Brownstoner at 10:52 AM | Comments (16)
Categories: Clinton Hill, Gentrification

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Brownstoner, you should have noted that Clinton Hill Chill stole the post from With a Brooklyn Accent:

http://withabrooklynaccent.blogspot.com/2009/04/isabella-life-deserved-advertisement.html

You guys need to be more respectful of each other!

Posted by: shillstoner at April 22, 2009 11:06 AM

right on

Posted by: brownstoner at April 22, 2009 11:09 AM

race bait comment from the What in 5-4-3-2...

Posted by: Prodigal_Son at April 22, 2009 11:19 AM

I participated briefly in this discussion, which putnamdenizen bravely carried on despite arguing with a person (X) completely unwilling or unable to see another perspective. In the end I couldn't put myself the bruising process but I think putnam did yeomans work in tackling very thorny topics with dexterity and grace.

Posted by: wasder at April 22, 2009 11:21 AM

Someday this war's gonna end. That'd be just fine with the boys on the boat. They weren't looking for anything more than a way home. Trouble is, I'd been back there, and I knew that it just didn't exist anymore.

Captain Benjamin L. Willard - Apocalypse Now

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at April 22, 2009 11:32 AM

Well said, Wasder. It really is a socio-economic argument cloaked by race.

Posted by: Schultz at April 22, 2009 11:33 AM

Whenever a blog/message board devolves into a back and forth between primarily two people, I stop reading. There is no such thing as arbitration on the Internet.

Posted by: infinitejester at April 22, 2009 11:51 AM

Interesting tidbit about Mr. Naison - he was on the Chappelle show in a skit called "I know black people".

Posted by: nycdelisauce at April 22, 2009 12:02 PM

You see Brownstoner crap post like this one cannot boost the traffic!

You attempted Covert Race /Class bullshit failed! ROTFLMMFAO!!!

The What (Where is that shark again?)

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at April 22, 2009 12:16 PM

Naison's post is just ridiculous. His main assumption seems to be that black=poor or working class and I find that deeply offensive. If rich blacks moved into those condos would that be ok? Is the problem class or race? If the argument were about class he may have a leg to stand on but it seems clear his issue is race and he's done more harm than good in the way he presented his argument.

Posted by: kimerama at April 22, 2009 12:20 PM

Agreed, wasder- and you know me. I am the sort to jump feet first into a discussion like that but even I found it too exhausting to even think about posting. We've certainly had our fair share of like discussions on brownstoner. We're a long way from resolving these questions but to me the very act of arguing or discussing implies a step in the right direction. There was a time when no one would even acknowledge the problems.

I don't necessarily like where we are at this point in time, but I am more hopeful now than I've been in the past that we can find a better way to deal with change, one that respects longtime residents and their needs too.

Posted by: bxgrl at April 22, 2009 12:25 PM

"Someday this war's gonna end. That'd be just fine with the boys on the boat. They weren't looking for anything more than a way home. Trouble is, I'd been back there, and I knew that it just didn't exist anymore.

Captain Benjamin L. Willard - Apocalypse Now"

Ahhhhhhh yeahhhh!!! 'bout time you brought it back!

***Bid half off peak comps***

Posted by: Brownstones Half Off at April 22, 2009 12:28 PM

"Ahhhhhhh yeahhhh!!! 'bout time you brought it back!"

Oh yeah! Back to the beginning....

The What (I knew that it just didn't exist anymore.)

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: Return of The What at April 22, 2009 12:33 PM

I have lived in Clinton Hill for about 5 years. I'm white, my best friend is black, a lot of my neighbors are black, gay, latino, asian and other more complex mixes. I really enjoy being in a diverse neighbothood. The neighborhood is also very mixed socio-economicly, which is also great. Sorry you guys can't get along and move on.

Posted by: FloatingWorld at April 22, 2009 2:22 PM

Floatingworld- I've always lived in very mixed neighborhoods and love them. I think maybe the probelem is more when change is forced, instead of happening naturally over time. Change comes in any case but recently a report came out questioning the wisdom of forcing changes on neighborhoods instead of letting them evolve as they would. (I could remember if I wasn't having a special dead brain cells moment). But the report was- or seemed to be- in reference to the impact of AY on a neighborhood that was coming back on its own. AY claimed it was blighted and now it most certainly is, thanks to them.

Posted by: bxgrl at April 22, 2009 2:49 PM

I agree with Kimerama, I found the original post condescending as hell. And, let me get this straight, he doesn't even live here? Does he know the brownstones sell for $2MM? Why is he whining about some crappy $500K condos? For that matter (and this point seems obvious) does he realize not all black people are poor?

Posted by: Heather at April 22, 2009 3:30 PM

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