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April 21, 2009

Hard Times In Store for Coney Island?

coney-island-boardwalk-0409.jpgAs the future of Coney Island hangs in the balance, they city is talking about taking concrete steps to address one of the pieces it actually controls--the boardwalk. The city is toying around with three options to replace the tropical hard wood that has made up the boardwalk for the last 86years, reports The Post. And while it's considering both plastic and hardwood planks, word is that concrete is the odds-on favorite. "A full concrete boardwalk is the best way to go from a cost-benefit perspective," said Liam Kavanagh, the first deputy commissioner of the city's Parks Department. "It lasts 40 years with little maintenance -- about twice as long as wood." The idea isn't sitting well with some: "Why don't they just call it a sidewalk, if they're going to do it in concrete?" said Dennis Thomas of the Coney Island Polar Bear Club. "There'll be a huge loss of character." Others though buy the practicality argument. "I'd rather see anything than the boardwalk falling apart," said Anthony Berlingieri, who owns Beer Island and Shoot the Freak.
Poured Walk [NY Post]
Photo by ecallender




Posted by Brownstoner at 10:13 AM | Comments (38)
Categories: Coney Island Area, Parks, Streets

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a concrete boardwalk? what? that's lame. :(

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at April 21, 2009 10:19 AM

How about Trex or something similar? Surely pouring the footings and all the required steel structural work that will have to be changed to convert to cement sidewalks is a major cost.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 21, 2009 10:20 AM

I think this has already been discussed - but this is a perfect WPA (or whatever it is called today) project

between repairing the old wood, cutting new wood and the installation we can employ hundreds and teach them new (carpentry) skills as well.

Posted by: fsrg at April 21, 2009 10:24 AM

I didn't know "Shoot the Freak" could be owned. Not much there but a trash strewn alley and a sign.

Posted by: wasder at April 21, 2009 10:24 AM

> "Not much there but a trash strewn alley and a sign."

Sums up all of Coney Island in my mind. Sorry, but I don't get the appeal. It's just a sad, dilapidated dump.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 10:32 AM

Yep -- lame...just as lame as the Parks Department's enlightened treatment of the Red Hook vendors. Trex or a substitute could be promoted as a "green" initiative. All bottom line all the time makes the City a dull boy. *sigh*

Posted by: bibini at April 21, 2009 10:35 AM

Snark, precisely. When I have family and friends visit and they tell me they want to go to Coney Island, I shoot them a look of bewilderment. I guess they have a far different vision of what it is these days based on what they might have heard and seen on TV and in the movies. Sad is an appropriate word for it.

Posted by: Biff Champion at April 21, 2009 10:39 AM

Neither one is maintenance free (no matter what the city says, particular in a salty marine environment). If we're really talking life spans of 40 vs. 20 years, why not stay with wood? There is something to be said for the character of a BOARDwalk that differs from that, say, of a jetty. (OTOH, a concrete boardwalk would make for some excellent skateboarding.)

Posted by: WBer at April 21, 2009 10:39 AM

quote:

It's just a sad, dilapidated dump.


so is brooklyn heights. what's your point?

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at April 21, 2009 10:40 AM

> "what's your point?"

Coming from you, that's comedy gold.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 10:45 AM

Biff - If I had grown up going to Coney Island, I would probably harbor some nostalgic affection for it. But coming to it as an adult, as an outsider, I don't get it.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 10:48 AM

"> "what's your point?"
Coming from you, that's comedy gold."

That is what I call one brilliant Snark attack.

Snark, I can understand the nostalgia, especially having been through the museum there and seen the old pictures of how it used to be. But I would imagine it is even sadder to those who grew up going there. To you and me, it's always been a dump, so it is harder to feel a sense of loss as strong as those who experienced it in its heyday.

Posted by: Biff Champion at April 21, 2009 10:53 AM

Sounds like some of you need to get to Coney Island for the Mermaid parade and a ride on the cyclone.

Posted by: DeLepp at April 21, 2009 10:57 AM

there are wood substitutes that will last as long as concrete but look better...

Posted by: smeyer418 at April 21, 2009 10:57 AM

DeLepp, I've been on the Cyclone (one of the first things I did when I came to New York), but haven't seen the mermaid parade. But the parade can be anywhere; that's not really a part of Coney Island to me any more than one would say the Israeli Day Parade is a part of 5th Avenue.

The only (permanent) thing worth seeing at Coney Island is the Acquarium.

Posted by: Biff Champion at April 21, 2009 11:01 AM

yeah you people are nuts. coconuts! coney island is fun as hell. i was just there this last summer and it was SO much fun. much more fun than stick in the mud boring museums and the opera and generic wine bars.

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at April 21, 2009 11:03 AM

The Coney Island paintings and drawings of Reginald Marsh come to mind:

- http://www.areaofdesign.com/americanicons/marsh/sideshow.jpg
- http://www.areaofdesign.com/americanicons/marsh/fourgirls.jpg
- http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2781645539_81bcba64eb.jpg?v=0
- http://americanart.si.edu/images/1985/1985.30.38V_1a.jpg

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 11:05 AM

Pull up the existing boardwalk and recycle it into furniture, art, or simply pieces of nostalgia.

Use the proceeds to subsidise a new wooden boardwalk. Rinse and repeat after 50 years. Job done.

Rob, what is your opinion of the aquarium then?

Posted by: the chicken at April 21, 2009 11:07 AM

I don't think the mermaid parade would fit in anywhere else than CI. Perfect with the burlesque shows and side show vibe not to mention the acquarium. Though it's too crowded lately with a lot of "walk" rage. And it's too bad it's not so easy to get tickets to see the cyclones, watching baseball there is magical at dusk.

Posted by: DeLepp at April 21, 2009 11:07 AM

Snark and Biff;

I'm glad to hear someone finally speak the truth about CI on this site. The way it is discussed, you'd think that Thorr was wrecking the premier resort area in the country.

It has been this way since the mid 1960's, when the last great amusement park, Steeplechase, closed.

One thing I don't get about CI also is the shortsightedness of the local merchants. You go there on a summer day, and the litter cans are overflowing with garbage. What does it take to organize an extra collection?

As far as I'm concerned, I'd be happy to have Thorr redevelop CI. I don't know why the city and the blogs are fighting him on it.

Posted by: benson at April 21, 2009 11:07 AM

I did go to Coney a bunch as a kid in the 70's and I do love it. I used to wander there in the winter in the early 90's and loved the relics and windblown solitude. But now that Sitt has ruined it it truly is sad. there are very few of the little things I used to love. The amazing Carousel on Surf Ave is gone, the Hell Hole (which I did a water color of once) gone, the log flume, all of the other rides except the Wonder Wheel (which is and always will be truly awesome) and the Cyclone. but yes some of you should go for the Mermaid Parade and ride the Cyclone and WOnder Wheel on a lovely June day and you will get some of the flavor. FOllowed by a trip to Nathans (where you can drink beer--and eat frog's legs!).

Posted by: wasder at April 21, 2009 11:12 AM

Well, Benson, I wouldn't say that I am speaking the truth. *My* truth perhaps, ie, my opinion, that's all. Some people obviously love it the way it is.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 11:13 AM

Snark, thank you for the links. Those pieces are stunning.

DeLepp, I haven't yet made it to a Cyclones game, but am going to try my best this year.

wasder, were you born in New York?

Posted by: Biff Champion at April 21, 2009 11:22 AM


Benson is right, it's been dying a slow death since the 1960s. It's a sad shadow of what it once was, even at that time (nevermind the REAL heyday in the 1910s-1940s). As a native Brooklynite, the name itself evokes great memories. In any event, regardless of the fate of the amusement district, Coney Island is still a community fronted by the ocean. I think the need for an intact boardwalk is clear. If concrete is the most efficient option, that would be OK. But there is a need for a boardwalk, regardless of what happens to the entertainment aspect.

Posted by: East New York at April 21, 2009 11:44 AM

Biff---born and partially raised in Sheepshead Bay. Though we moved away when my dad got an academic job at a big University in the middle Atlantic region, I continued to spend a lot of time in Sheepshead Bay through my childhood and actually lived there with my Grandma when I first moved to NYC as an adult in 92.

Posted by: wasder at April 21, 2009 11:50 AM

Ok sure CI - as in the Boardwalk and amusements is a $hit hole but I think may of you are missing the main attraction - the beach - which is reasonably nice (the sand) and the water (which is great).

Posted by: fsrg at April 21, 2009 11:52 AM

ENY and FSRQ;

Agreed that the Boardwalk should be maintained.

I have to say, though, that for my money I prefer the Rockaways. In fact I took a drive there on Sunday to get some fresh air. The thing I like about the Rockaways is that you feel like you're leaving the city. When you drive down Flatbush Ave south of Ave. U towards the Gil Hodges bridge, you feel like you are in the country - even though only a few miles up the street you are in the heart of the city.

I like the area around Beach 95th Street, where Robert Moses built a beautiful esplanade/boardwalk complex. I recommend that area to all.

By the way, there is also some fantastic development going on in the Rockaways, particularly in the Arverne area. It's great to see the Rockaways being revived. Hopefully, the same will happen one day for CI.

Posted by: benson at April 21, 2009 12:04 PM

isnt the rockaways a really dangerous area tho?

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at April 21, 2009 1:06 PM

I'm sorry but I LOVE Coney Island. The stories passed down to me from my Dad about hanging out there as a kid. Reading Henry Miller and his depictions. Getting my first Seafood Platter of the season from Nathans. The smell of the salt air. Buying Ice Cold "Butt-wiser" and "Pessis" from the vendors on the beach. Taking the cold plunge into the surf. Walking all the way down the boardwalk in either direction. Riding back on the train smelling of dried salt water and suntan lotion.

I feel alive when I go there. I'm filled with the history and enormity of past. It's almost like visiting a graveyard and feeling the presence of the dead. It's magical to me and it literally chokes me up to think of it becoming some privatized behemoth.

Oh yeah, concrete would be a travesty. It needs to remain a BOARDwalk.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at April 21, 2009 1:32 PM

Agree with the whole post, thl.

Not only would concrete suck visually, it's harder on the walkers and joggers who use it in the morning.

Posted by: denton at April 21, 2009 2:42 PM

THL, our first disagreement in 1,000s of posts!!! Can we possibly survive this set back?

I think that you prove the point Snark and I were making; i.e., that it is understandable how folks like you and wasder, who grew up with memories of CI, still have a place in your hearts for it, versus relative newbies like us who have only seen it in it's present state.

Posted by: Biff Champion at April 21, 2009 2:43 PM

There is still no amusement park in the world that has the name recognition of Coney Island. The baseball park is very successful.There's the Cyclone,the aquarium,the boardwalk,and a renovated train station. Tourists from all over the world are discovering Brooklyn. Build a friggin amusement park at Coney already.It would be wildly successful.

Posted by: crafty at April 21, 2009 3:19 PM


100 years ago, coney island was bigger than disney world and miami beach combined. they used to put on operas in a 3000 seat venue. It's one of the most historic areas of this city, where the very concept of entertainment evolved for the whole world. Now it's reduced to shoddy attractions, a potentially lethal roller coaster, and packs of wild dogs.

Its history needs to be respected but it needs to be modernized with attractions for this century. I want to see an indoor ski/water park, not a mall. Think big!

Posted by: slick at April 21, 2009 3:43 PM

A new Coney Island that revived and improved upon the old legend would be great. Even when I was a kid in San Diego in the 80s, I had heard of Coney Island and knew it was the original Disneyland.

Nothing quite like the Cyclone and Nathan's (btw there's a Nathan's in Kuwait) - but they have to be enjoyed in that order. One year my colleagues went down there on the first day of summer vacation, ate at Nathan's, and then rode the Cyclone. Some lawn in Sheepshead Bay got a free infusion of fertilizer soon afterwards (hope it wasn't wasder's grandma!).

Posted by: sixyearsandcounting at April 21, 2009 3:49 PM

They need to implode the housing projects from west 7th to seagate, build luxury hotels and casinos and turn it to las vegas by the sea.

Posted by: Xander Crews at April 21, 2009 3:52 PM

> "turn it to las vegas by the sea."

Then bring on the tsunami.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at April 21, 2009 4:03 PM

Boardwalk should be made of boards, period. The fact that this one is still in place at all after 80+ years speaks very well of wood; 'chicken' had the same brilliant idea I had, to recycle it into cool stuff (unless it's pressure-treated with toxic stuff like today's decking), and use the proceeds to build another.

As for CI itself, despite the passion of its fans (like the late Bob Guskind) for its seedy honkytonk "charm," it is simply not a viable entity unless you make it more family-friendly. Even before the latest round of closings, it was basically a collection of trash-strewn lots with 2 world-class rides (Cyclone and WonderWheel) and a lot of aging stuff no better than any aging midway anywhere...a little depressing, creepy, overpriced, and with inexcusable bathroom facilities. This "vibe" may appeal to moody hipsters, but preserving Coney's emo-album-cover-ready look does it no favor. What's stunning to me is that the obvious--building a world-class amusement park around its historic gems, something like Lake Compounce or Hershey Park (NOT all the way to a homogenized corporate monster like DisneyWorld) hasn't been the simple first order of business. What the hell is the problem with that? Why does everything have to revolve around freakin' CONDOs? The lack of vision and leadership are staggering.

Posted by: Brenda from Flatbush at April 22, 2009 9:09 AM

While it's heartening to find a lively, intelligent discussion about Coney Island, there's quite a bit of misinformation floating around about Coney's recent past.
For those who had negative comments or are immune to Coney's charm, please take a look at CIHP's public flickr group "Coney Island is Alive and Kicking and Welcomes Visitors in 2009!" http://www.flickr.com/groups/coneyislandisaliveandkicking/pool/

Launched on January 30,we now have over 575 wonderful photos by 85+ accomplished photographers. The purpose of the group is to show the world that contrary to news reports, Coney Island Is NOT closed! All of the images showcase attractions or landmarks that are here to welcome visitors in the 2009 season. We also have photos of people enjoying what Coney Island has to offer--the beach, The Boardwalk, the pier, special events like the Mermaid Parade. Info about the attractions shown often appear as “comments” on each photo’s page. To view as a slide show, click on icon at top right corner of group pool page on flickr.

The Coney Island History Project, founded in 2004, is a not-for-profit organization that aims to increase awareness of Coney Island's legendary and colorful past and to encourage appreciation of the Coney Island neighborhood of today. You're invited to visit our free public exhibition center on Surf Ave. under the Cyclone Roller Coaster. We're open on weekends from Memorial Day through Labor Day. Exhibitions feature historic artifacts, documentary material and an interactive video/photo booth. For news and upcoming free events, sign up for our monthly What's New In Coney newsletter @ www.coneyislandhistory.org

Posted by: Coney Island History Project at April 22, 2009 12:52 PM

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