« The Edge Tests the Price-Cutting Waters House of the Day: 52 Strong Place »

March 18, 2009

Co-op of the Day: 692 President Street

This top-floor duplex at 692 President Street has a couple of things going for it: It's cute and it has exclusive roof rights. (The listing describes a slick new kitchen ~~but fails to include a photo~~.) On the flip side, at 650 square feet, this one-bedroom is on the small side. Luckily, the monthly maintenance is only $536. The asking price, however, is $499,000, which is high on a per-square-foot basis, unless you place a lot of value on the undeveloped roof.
692 President Street [Corcoran] GMAP P*Shark

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want.

it.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 12:46 PM

where to start?... bathroom up a spiral staircase, off the bedroom. "exclusive roof rights" looks like it's just a bare roof. that pic with the lounge chairs is laughable.

Posted by: bowl of dicks at March 18, 2009 12:46 PM

Too small for my needs. Killer location tho.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at March 18, 2009 12:51 PM

Super cute, and really 500 square feet at most. It's a very adorable garret, I think $1,000/square foot is aspirational.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 12:52 PM

I'd love to live there... for half the asking price.

Posted by: alsawo at March 18, 2009 12:53 PM

When we were searching for our first home in 1994 we looked at a 4 story, 4 family brownstone in this block (or maybe it was the next one over). At $248k we couldn't afford. We ended up with a frame on 15th St for under $200k but I'll always regret not robbing a bank to get that house on President.

Posted by: rh at March 18, 2009 12:56 PM

"Super cute, and really 500 square feet at most"

Sorry I have to disagree. Just by adding the dimensions on the floorplan of the Living, Bedroom and kitchen, it's 530 sf.

And that's not including closets, bathroom, etc, which they ALWAYS consider in square footage calculations.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 12:57 PM

"The listing describes a slick new kitchen but fails to include a photo."

There are two photos of the kitchen, and it does in fact look slick to me.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 12:59 PM

(The listing describes a slick new kitchen but fails to include a photo.)

Um..Mr B the 4th photo in the listing is of the kitchen. Nice pad but definitely on the small side. Price per square foot is high but still not too many cheaper and nicer apts available in that part of town.

Posted by: wasder at March 18, 2009 1:00 PM

Once you factor in the usual Corcoran inflation of the square footage, the psf is quit ridiculous. And the spiral staircase kills it for me.

Offer $300k.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at March 18, 2009 1:00 PM

I do like that kitchen though.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at March 18, 2009 1:01 PM

11217, you are right, I forgot to add the kitchen dimensions, so it's probably accurate enough. Still though, it is very very small. I think it would be a fantastic starter apartment for someone, if it were priced around $350,000. At this price, someone needs a sugar daddy to afford it.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 1:03 PM

monthlies (mortgage + maintenance) would be around 2700/month. would 2700 yield a much better unit in the area?

that said, very cute place. would be better if it was NOT a duplex w/ spiral stair case

Posted by: more4less at March 18, 2009 1:05 PM

monthlies (mortgage + maintenance) would be around 2700/month. would 2700 yield a much better unit (rental-wise) in the area?

that said, very cute place. would be better if it was NOT a duplex w/ spiral stair case

Posted by: more4less at March 18, 2009 1:06 PM

I agree...500K is steep, but it looks pristine and some people care about that.

Some were saying that 530K was starting to look attractive for the Edge i bedrooms (although it turns out they are not price chopped, but still 695K or whatever for a 1 bedroom) so to me, this is a MUCH more attractive option.

It'll sell somewhere in the 400's.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:07 PM

I feel like the duplex aspect of it would make it nice for a couple without kids. Wouldn't it provide a bit more privacy? I love the idea of retiring upstairs for the night, while the other person stays downstairs to read/watch tv, whatever...

Obviously ideal for 1 person, but I think a couple could make this work really easily too.

More4less, does your $2700 factor in the mortgage interest deduction? With that, I don't think it's all THAT far off from a rental. You aren't going to find a rental done to this level, I don't think either. With the roof, washer and dryer in the basement etc, I'd say this would rent for 2400 maybe....

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:10 PM

Yeah, roof value should not be overlooked. It wouldn't be that hard to put a deck up there and I think a lot of people in NYC would pay a premium to have an exclusive deck on a nice block like this...

Posted by: wasder at March 18, 2009 1:13 PM

Honestly, if I were looking to buy right now, I'd bid on this place. I love it that much. I'd try for 400K.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:15 PM

The Corcoran site says roof rights to HALF the roof.

That kitchen is at best a one cook kitchen. The sink looks like a bar sink. Dishwasher? Great place for a single young person who wouldn't mind climbing down the spiral staircase at 3am to snack on leftover take-out.

Posted by: IMBY at March 18, 2009 1:15 PM

However, the roofdeck has shared access, and this is a coop. There might be a reason the roof is bare. I would have loved to have an apartment like this as a student. Maybe someone will figure it's cheaper to buy this than pay housing fees for their proud NYU 2013 graduate?

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 1:17 PM

Pretty sure that kitchen photo wasn't up yet when we wrote this yesterday...

Posted by: brownstoner at March 18, 2009 1:21 PM

I hate when the put the stove-top against a wall. Makes it difficult to use the right burners, and possible damage to the wall.

Cute place though. Will sell for 450k and the new owner should spend 20k to build out the roof deck

Posted by: Adam Dahill at March 18, 2009 1:22 PM

11217, AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!

Every time a Park Slope apartment is posted you are gushing over it. And in almost every case where an apartment is listed in any other prime area you find fault with it and/or dig up a listing of a comp in Park Slope that you say you would prefer. The second I saw the address of this place on the main page I knew you would be in here singing it's praises.

Posted by: Biff Champion at March 18, 2009 1:27 PM

Spiral staircases were cool until I was about 12. Now they look like head trauma. It's cute, but half a million dollars?

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 1:29 PM

Total coincidence, Biff. If I saw this listed in Ft. Greene, Brooklyn Heights, Carroll Gardens, Cobble Hill, Prospect Heights, I'd be gushing all the same...

I'm not gunna lie though. Park Slope is my favorite 'hood. Makes sense since I choose to live here, no...?

It's interesting, because I find people who are enthusiastic about their neighborhood a GOOD thing. I'm trying to sway anyone...I'm just giving my perception and opinions. You all could hate Park Slope (and it seems some do) and it has no bearing whatsoever on my love for it.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:33 PM

"I hate when the put the stove-top against a wall. Makes it difficult to use the right burners, and possible damage to the wall."

Yes, noticed that. The kitchen might be "slick" (or was it sleek?), but it has the design and size problems that you put up with in a rental, not that you'd pay this kind of money for.

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 1:34 PM

Ha. Of course I'd make that typo...I'm NOT trying to sway anyone.

But yeah..when I see a 1 bedroom in BH for 700K and an equally nice looking one for 400K in PS, I'll post a link...sure...

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:36 PM

quote:

I would have loved to have an apartment like this as a student. Maybe someone will figure it's cheaper to buy this than pay housing fees for their proud NYU 2013 graduate?

grrrrrrrrrrr

*rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at March 18, 2009 1:46 PM

Heya Rob,

I didn't much care for that quote either, since I'd personally love to have this place and I'm certainly not a student anymore. I think many non-students would love an apartment like this. Some people aren't really based in reality all that much.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:49 PM

Nice location. Apt. is uninspiring, Bland to say the least....ho hum.
A very expensive 2-story small white box.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at March 18, 2009 1:52 PM

Yes Biff, and yesterday's COTD was 599K with a $1200 maintenance for a 1 bedroom apartment. So effectively $1500 more per month than this place.

So had I known, I'd probably have linked this one. A much better deal no matter what neighborhood it's in. And this one is high, even.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 1:54 PM

I used to live right across the street. That block is nice enough, but I'm at a loss why anyone would describe it as a 'killer location.'

Posted by: Sparafucile at March 18, 2009 1:55 PM

I looked at an identical unit in the building next door, circa 2002 - believe they were asking $250K-or-so. Needed kitchen & bath renno and was lacking a 'real' roofdeck too.
The only major downside, then as now, is that roof access is via a hatch & ladder - not ideal for cocktail parties...
Otherwise, this is a great space for a young couple - the duplex does increase the sense of privacy despite the low square footage. And the main floor has very high ceilings. That, plus the southern exposure make this a very cheery place.
And yes, President is one of the best blocks in PS.
As usual, the broker should have been more explicit about all this!
$500K may be too much to swallow in the current climate - but there's not much else on the market in the totally prime PS core right now. Personally, I can't stand the 4th Ave/South Slope new condos & think they'll be a wretched investment for years to-come. So I'd definitely sacrifice the space/mod cons of a new condo for a reliable Center Slope co-op like this.

Posted by: parkedslope at March 18, 2009 1:56 PM

I like Park Slope...if only the people that live there didn't live there.
Nothing is perfect in this world.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at March 18, 2009 1:57 PM

No point in resenting mama's boys and daddy's girls when you prop this place as a "deal" for 400K. Who else has a $100,000 to put down and can pay $2,800 a month under the age of 23?

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 1:59 PM

I like the apartment. I think it being a walk up and having a spiral would be OK for a year and then completely drive me insane. Think about all the running around to do your laundry.

Posted by: LincolnSlope at March 18, 2009 2:00 PM

brg, you took the words right out of my mouth.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 2:01 PM

Sparafucile - I think 'killer location,' in this case, means: halfway between 5th & 7th Ave restaurants, stores, etc.; 5-7 mins walk to B,Q,R [one stop from D,N] & 10 mins to F; PS321 school district [tho not relevant to this place, most likely]; and <10 minute walk to Prospect Park; clean, quiet, safe street with no noisy/smelly/dirty commercial businesses sharing the backyard core between Carrol & President...
'nuff said?

Posted by: parkedslope at March 18, 2009 2:02 PM

Two 16' squares stacked atop one another for 499K? A walk-up?
Sounds like quite a deal.

Posted by: buttermilk channel at March 18, 2009 2:05 PM

Sorry to quibble on the numbers Maly, but at 400K, that's 80K down, 320K mortgage is $2350 a month with maintenance costs.

When you factor in the interest deduction, we're talking less than 2K a month.

Maybe not for a 23 year old, but certainly a young professional.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 2:05 PM

Yes Maly, I've been an almost life long resident of Brooklyn and have been regularly visiting Park Slope for the better of 25 years, I've seen it change from a bad neighborhood to what it is today, unfortunately the people that have moved in are........and I say no more!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at March 18, 2009 2:08 PM

This is pretty nice 1BR. Like nearly every property we see on here, its about 10% overpriced. Either a single person or couple with no kids will surely cough up 450k to live here for its great location.

Posted by: bktycoon at March 18, 2009 2:09 PM

This is a pretty nice 1BR. Like nearly every property we see on here, its about 10% overpriced. Either a single person or couple with no kids will surely cough up 450k to live here for its great location.

Posted by: bktycoon at March 18, 2009 2:09 PM

"BRG, you and I think alike. Scary!"

Great minds think alike?

Okay, I'm done with this apartment...it's a very boring little place. Take out the cutish Ikea-ish furniture and it's white walls with a wood floor.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at March 18, 2009 2:13 PM

This place is for sale for 499K, that's what the numbers say. I suggested 350K as a somewhat reasonable price for such an apartment (spiral staircase and roof trapdoor.)
400K would be selling to a young professional who already make 100K or so and has 90K in savings. How many of those want a rad pad? I would suggest that my tongue-in-cheek remark about NYU freshmen still applies.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 2:14 PM

Great location for sure. But the living space is diminshed because of the spiral staircase, and the staircase itself will start to drive you insane (having lived with one). If there was a half bath on the main level that would do wonders. The bedroom looks great though.

Lousy closet space, and cramped first floor makes this less of a great choice for a couple. The roof is nice, but the steep ladder climb to get up there forecloses any real roof entertaining/hanging potential (tried that one too...). Some single will pick this up - but not at ask (at least I hope not).

Posted by: saminthehood at March 18, 2009 2:21 PM

well, I guess that settles it nicely. Park Slopers are douchebags.
Can I get QOTD now?

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 2:23 PM

ParkedSlope did a fine job of explaining why I used the term "killer" in my assessment of the location. It's got tons of transportation, shopping, dining, bars, the park, etc within a very short walk, but the street itself is quiet and pretty. Unsure what would be much more killer than that.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at March 18, 2009 2:33 PM

If some people feel the need to carry on like this, please do so in the Open Thread. Believe it or not, there are some readers who like to follow the discussion about the co-op without having to wade through all this crap. We're going to purge this thread.
Thanks

Posted by: brownstoner at March 18, 2009 2:42 PM

And now I'll make an on topic comment...I know nothing of prices, but I'm not a fan of President Street and the spiral staircase is silly - as is the cook top abutting the wall.

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at March 18, 2009 2:42 PM

I lived in a duplex apt. in Chelsea. A spiral staircase in a detahtrap. I can't recall how many times wither I or one of my guests slid and ended up with one leg on each side of an iron rail (uh, ow!).

Besides the staircase, if you're going to have a two room apt. it's not such a bad thing to have them on separate floors. It is kinda nice to have two levels.

Also, since when do we complain about roof access? Fix it up the way you'd like it.

I've seen worse.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at March 18, 2009 2:49 PM

Please note that the thread was a great one (I thought) and 100% on topic, until Biff's comment at 1:27 derailed the whole darn thing.

I should not have taken the bait.

I apologize.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 2:49 PM

Please leave my comment about the spiral staircase as head trauma. I'm proud of that.

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 2:49 PM

That was a great comment, Nomi! I liked it :)

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at March 18, 2009 2:51 PM

who is 11217?
The mayor of Park Slope?

Posted by: Mrs de Dough at March 18, 2009 2:57 PM

mortgage interest deduction is over-hyped. Given the high prices currently, many people who can afford these prices are making over 100k/yr. I suspect many of them is or will soon be subjected to AMT limitations on their tax returns - rendering little to no deduction allowed on the mortgage interest. As NYC income and property taxes rocket up to close budget gaps, many more people will be slammed with AMT caps. So I view the whole mortgage payment (vs. netting it against mortgage interest deduction) as an outflow.

Park slope is a very nice neighborhood - particularly for families. If no kids yets, not the optimal hood. So this small bachelor pad type aptmt is not where park slope would be most attractive / competitive vs. other prime hoods. Not saying it's bad but would suspect most singles or young couples with no kids plans soon would prefer other hoods (ie less judgemental / disapproving stares from the stroller crowd)

Posted by: more4less at March 18, 2009 3:00 PM

more4less...you don't lose the mortgage deduction at $100k...it fades quite slowly actually.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at March 18, 2009 3:09 PM

I see the hand of a stager here: the wooden bowl with the oranges, the colorful canvases, the carpet on the roof (??), which just goes to show far some cute furniture and a little taste along with decent photos can go to generate interest.

Posted by: lucybb at March 18, 2009 3:11 PM

I think more4less was talking about the AMT limiting your deductions, especially as we go to the next fiscal year.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 3:12 PM

This place was on the market a few months ago. The asking price then was $500k when I went to the open house. It is small!! I laughed at the price then and still can't see it going for anything in the 400k range. The spiral stair case is narrow and opens right into the bedroom. Access to the roof is from the bedroom, which isn't ideal.

Posted by: TJPD at March 18, 2009 3:12 PM

"That was a great comment, Nomi! I liked it :)"

Hey thanks, ISNH.

And, lucybb, yes, even if some of the staging is a little corny, it plus decent photos make a huge difference for the *average* buyer. I know there are some visionaries on here who can see past just about anything, but most of us schlubs are somewhat limited as far as that. I am, anyway.

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 3:22 PM

DIBS, my point was for someone who can afford comfortably 500k for this small pad, that person probably making big coin (ie hence has enough savings to commit the $100k down) and likely close or in AMT cap. the 4% NYC income tax (for the big earners) almost guarantees these people will be in AMT. So for them, mortgage interest deduction is small to none on tax return.

For someone who is safely below the AMT levels & bank claim the interest deduction, 500k is not an easy or comfortable purchase price for this small pad.

if I had $100k+ savings, I rather rent right now and felt safe knowing I have the $100k safety net for in case econ gets worst or stays this bad for long time, or lose job. Now if one is loaded, then yeah why not

Posted by: more4less at March 18, 2009 3:26 PM

or you could buy this apartment, also a coop in Park Slope, but right by the park, with 2 bedrooms and a perfectly accessible and furnished roofdeck.
http://www.citi-habitats.com/viewsales.php?adID=145622

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 3:28 PM

I don't know who these people in their mid-20s are that have $100k saved up. That's a huge amount to save by that age. Even if you were putting away a grand a month, which is well above what most people in entry-level jobs are able to bank, you're looking at 8+ years (so at least 29-30 years old post-college) before you've got $100k in the bank.

I guess maybe a finance hotshot or a lawyer or something? But wouldn't they likely be paying off student loans and/or spending fairly extravagantly to live the lifestyle that's expected of them?

Dunno. I've never come close to having that much in savings, and I'm financially more solid than almost anyone I know in my age range (31).

Posted by: cwbuecheler at March 18, 2009 3:46 PM

A friend of mine is selling her place FSBO, also a one bedroom for around 500k, which is more like 800 sq feet and an even better location in Park Slope. check it out. it shows really beautifully and feels quite spacious. plus it's in great condition. doesn't need a thing.

http://916unionstreet4d.com/

Posted by: lucybb at March 18, 2009 3:49 PM

Glad to see some reasonable people here... Yeah, if you can afford this place, you shouldn't live in a place like this. This is a starter apartment at best. It's a little 2-room, 1-bedroom apartment spread into two floors.... basically a $1400 rental (because of the roof)

Why would someone want to buy this for more than $275k? (And in my mind, that's still pushing it HARD)

Posted by: tybur6 at March 18, 2009 3:54 PM

cw, they are mythical creatures, that's what I was snarking about. 500k is not reasonable for an apartment that's the adult version of a treehouse, because there are almost no 20-something with 100K in the bank and a 6-figure income. I would think that if they do, they either have a hedge-fund daddy in Greenwich CT, or are superstars. Either way, they are unlikely to aspire to this cute little place in Park Slope.

Posted by: Maly at March 18, 2009 3:59 PM

What did I miss? Did it get heated in here?

BRG, Park Slope wasn't "bad" 25 years ago. That's about the time it was the coolest neighborhood in Brooklyn (ok, not saying much since BK was so uncool back then). I loved PS once. But that's all a distant memory now. :(

Posted by: rh at March 18, 2009 4:01 PM

Lucybb:

Very interesting as I just saw today (in Streeteasy) that apartment 6C in that same building went to contract on March 10th for 518K.

Your friends place looks even better, so he/she shouldn't have too hard of a time selling that place for 500K.

Posted by: 11217 at March 18, 2009 4:16 PM

The person who buys this place should seek help... because this probably isn't the only poor choice they made.

Posted by: tybur6 at March 18, 2009 4:40 PM

Seems pricey, it's a fourth floor walkup with squat ceilings. 14 * 16 isn't much of a living/dining area. The roof is a crapshoot in a coop, quite possibly the reason the roof is undeveloped is becasue coop doesn't want anything up there for various reasons. Roof rites can mean you can stand and gaze, not entertain or grill. If you have to pop your head thru like a ground hog it's not worth a penny.

Posted by: DeLepp at March 18, 2009 4:46 PM

I agree that this is a weird little Bohemian apartment with a Burgeoise price tag. I can't imagine it will go for anywhere near this price for a couple of years. It's a ridiculous layout.

Posted by: Mrs de Dough at March 18, 2009 4:59 PM

Nice apartment for a college student. $130,000 would be a good price. But the maintenance is way too high.

Posted by: mopar at March 18, 2009 5:13 PM

Mopar - I'd go as high as $150k

Posted by: tybur6 at March 18, 2009 5:32 PM

looks like a bidding war. I'll offer $155k no contingencies, can close anytime.

Posted by: more4less at March 18, 2009 5:58 PM

tybur6 -- "basically a $1400 rental (because of the roof)"

That's pushing it, don't you think? It's at least an $1800 rental.

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 6:09 PM

I saw this pace at an open house last summer.

It is super tiny. Teeny weeny. It feels much smaller than 530 square feet because of the awkward layout. It's basically two small studio apartments stacked one on top of the other (there's a door to the hallway on both floors).

Worst of all, the access to the roof is via a very narrow and steep ladder.

The decor is cute, but this place is SERIOUSLY overpriced. I remember the lady of the house telling me how expensive the soapstone countertops were....

Posted by: Kris at March 18, 2009 6:34 PM

Soapstone countertops? Hm. I would not have thought they were soapstone from the photo.

Describing it as two small stacked studio apartments gives it a whole different and much less pleasant feel. Sounds like if the lower level were a good 50% larger, the stairs were normal, and the kitchen slightly larger, it'd be a lot more appealing and more in line with the asking price.

Posted by: Nomi at March 18, 2009 6:49 PM

I am the owner of this apartment, thanks for the comments. Some factual corrections from posts above. The square footage is 650 sq feet, the kitchen countertops are Caesarstone, the sink is Blanco and deep instead of wide to increase available work surface. The roof can be developed and has DOB approved plans to build a small penthouse w/ garden, viewable in sketch at this website: http://www.mabbottstudio.com/studio/0601/0601-07.html Views include Manhattan, Statue of Liberty and the Church on 6th Avenue. The entrance is one flight up in the building. I've raised a child here, am pregnant with a second and have no accident reports or issues with the spiral stair, we quite like it actually. The master bedroom is large enough to include a nursery and add closets should you desire. This apartment is a sunny, peaceful, loved, well maintained, highly functional home with great finishings and roof garden potential. It is also in PS321 and near great facilities for raising a young child. Hope to see you at the open house on Sunday.

Posted by: hnn at March 18, 2009 10:53 PM

Lucybb/11217

There are several units on the market at 916 Union....why so many on the market at once, Im wondering aloud.....I went to look at the one that went into contract; liked the view and the elevator, but couldnt get past the settled sloping floors...i imagine every unit in the building is tilted this way, toward the center of the building. dealbreaker for me...

Posted by: sloper77 at March 18, 2009 11:56 PM

I want to love this apt for sure, but I find myself looking for a way to stick in a conventional stair somehow (and at what price)...so assume 50K off for stair replacement, and maybe this baby goes for 400k. this means all in = 450K = 700/sf.....maybe?

Posted by: sloper77 at March 19, 2009 12:01 AM

« The Edge Tests the Price-Cutting Waters House of the Day: 52 Strong Place »

March 18, 2009

Co-op of the Day: 692 President Street

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