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December 11, 2008
What the Census Says About Us
"Carroll Gardens is getting whiter! Williamsburg is getting smarter! And the Park Slope baby boom is real!" That's the Brooklyn Paper's three exclamation point recap of the census data released yesterday; we're still a very diverse borough, but the make-up has shifted. Richer, whiter folks have displaced minority families since 2000 in neighborhoods west of Prospect Park, from the Slope to Red Hook, which "had the biggest jump in median household income — 23 percent, to $77,784 — partly because nearly a fifth of black and Hispanic families, who earn half as much as their white counterparts, left during the seven-year period." Carroll Gardens, Park Slope and Cobble Hill have indeed had baby booms — "The number of children under-5 shot up 35 percent in the area" — and around 80 percent more college graduates have flocked to Williamsburg than lived there in 2000. Neighborhoods further out in Brooklyn grew more diverse, with white populations shrinking slightly in Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights and Bensonhurst, and the Asian population increasing by 34 percent. The Brooklyn Eagle looked at the number of "now married" and "never married" folks (roughly the same size), and found that two-parent families are most common, followed by female-headed families. "Ninety-one percent of those surveyed lived in the same house or apartment they lived in a year ago," they write, signaling that perhaps folks are moving less, or the influx of folks from other boroughs and states is slowing. And the highest concentration of rents fall between $750 and $1,500; must still be plenty of rent stabilized pads out there.
Census ‘Community Survey’ Reveals Facts About Brooklyn [Brooklyn Eagle]
Making Census of Brooklyn [Brooklyn Paper]
Photo by heimdalsgata.
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Comments
I can see 200+ posts here
Posted by: wasder at December 11, 2008 9:28 AM
"I can see 200+ posts here"
Yes, and at least 100 posts will be from DIBS, 11217, Rob et.al. commenting about how hot the DILF in the red hoody is.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 9:32 AM
I was just about to type the same thing wasder...this one pushes every button....white/black, rich/poor, strollers, kids, cell phones, hipsters, asians, rent stabilization, bitter renters, blah, blah, blah
Merry Christmas.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:32 AM
Not my type Biff but I bet you're drooling over that MILF to the left with the big stoop and the double stroller.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:40 AM
Why is it "pushing every button" to examine census data, which asks folks their races and ages and incomes, etc? This doesn't seem inflammatory to me. It seems informative. Can there be a discussion of the data itself, or do we have to talk about how to talk about it?
Posted by: longtimelistener at December 11, 2008 9:44 AM
Nothing like hijacking a thread on the 2nd post though is there?
"Ninety-one percent of those surveyed lived in the same house or apartment they lived in a year ago," I wouldn't have thought the number would be much different anytime, anywhere!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:45 AM
new here longtimelistener???
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:46 AM
pretty soon everyone is going to be asian
Posted by: Santa at December 11, 2008 9:46 AM
Race Bait Clap Trap! Yep! I knew Brownstoner would go this route!!!
And the Asshats say that I'm a Racist????!!!!!! How in the hell is this promoting any kind of harmony??
2009 Please get here!!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Do anyone see how low Brownstoner has become?
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 9:49 AM
"Do anyone see how low Brownstoner has become?" I'd like to see the census data for Lodi, NJ and how it describes the fall in the education level since you moved there.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:54 AM
"Nothing like hijacking a thread on the 2nd post though is there?"
Come on, DIBS, it was lovable wasder in the FIRST thread who made me do it.
Ok, sorry everyone, back to the topic. longtimelistener, I believe DIBS was merely pointing out that discussions here around race, income, stroller moms, etc. almost always at some point turn to less than constructive insult-hurling matches for singles vs. parents, renters vs. owners, rich vs. poor, my neighborhood vs. your neighborhood, etc. However, the data can and should be used for more constructive dialogue, which would have been nice during the gentrification discussion the other day. Unfortunately, headlines from the media like the Brooklyn Paper's ("Carroll Gardens is getting whiter! Williamsburg is getting smarter! And the Park Slope baby boom is real!") don't help encourage intelligent and courteous exchanges.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 9:55 AM
once again i ask, why is it race baiting to report census data? the what is no more comfortable talking about race than anyone else. too bad. we're missing an opportunity to talk about how the borough can grow and shift without displacing people, to improve without necessarily gentrifying, to become "family-friendly" without reserving all the pre-school space for procreating corporate lawyers. census data is a tool for figuring out what the problems are, what the changes are, and how to address them.
Posted by: longtimelistener at December 11, 2008 9:56 AM
Well said Biff. Certainly in the running for QOTD. That is until Montrose Morris gets here!!!
Sorry BRG, you're 15 minutes of QOTD fame are history.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 9:57 AM
get your point, biff.
Posted by: longtimelistener at December 11, 2008 9:57 AM
"Can there be a discussion of the data itself, or do we have to talk about how to talk about it?"
We do have to talk about how to talk about it. I have to ask that everyone recognize that the word "data" is plural. So, it should be "data themselves" not "itself".
Sorry to nitpick, but I could see this little annoyance coming a mile away. People never seem to get it right with that word. It's particularly irksome because people tend to use it to make themselves seem educated.
Posted by: ownhs at December 11, 2008 9:58 AM
does anyone know where one can view the actual report?
Posted by: lincolnlimestone at December 11, 2008 10:00 AM
You're anthropomorhisizing the data ownhs.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:00 AM
do we have to talk about how to talk about them? thanks for the correction.
Posted by: longtimelistener at December 11, 2008 10:00 AM
So far. I am the only post (at 9:45) that has actually asked a critical question of the data.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:03 AM
Checking in, Dave. Gotta run, and will come back later, but gotta say, regarding Brooklyn Paper's article, what do you expect from a writer calling himself "Zeke Faux"? Ironic much?
Posted by: Montrose Morris at December 11, 2008 10:08 AM
Just think of how much bigger of a baby boom there'd be if all those Hispanics didn't get displaced.
Comments?
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:13 AM
"Richer, whiter folks have displaced minority families..."
um, or, minorities have greatly benefited by taking advantage of the market and selling their houses at huge profits, and those that stayed saw an imporovement in neighborhood safety and amenities.
(my comment might be good for a few more reactions to get to that 200 posts)
Posted by: goldie at December 11, 2008 10:13 AM
Montrose Morris make sure you use a stapler gun to smash your weave in!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 10:14 AM
Why is it that when it comes to income Hispanics and Blacks almost ALWAYS positioned as a homogeneous group made up of primarily lower income people while Whites are a "high" income? Come on, it's 2008!!!
The Census article from which the information was extrapolated ALSO stated that the average HH income level in Bed-Stuy increased. Well, the assumption would be that the White hipsters who are MOSTLY RENTING in Bed-Stuy are driving the increase. However, most of that increase is being driven by Black professionals who are moving back to the neighborhood and renovating the beautiful brownstones. The White hipsters in Bed-Stuy are broke!! If they had money the'd chose to live elsewhere.
Posted by: cthecat at December 11, 2008 10:14 AM
I'm always amused when someone uses the adjective "whiter" If one assumes that the contrast is black, does that include Asians and brown or olive skinned latinos who essentially are "whiter" than black folk?
And not all "whier" folk are richer, white trash being a case in point.
14 shopping days until Christmas!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:18 AM
DIBS! What on earth...
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 10:18 AM
Concerning Williamsburg's 80% increase in college grads...
Would like to see the break down of what their actual degrees are in. MFA's or MBA's?
Posted by: IMBY at December 11, 2008 10:19 AM
Funny, I expected a lot of whining about the rent-stabilized "parasites."
Posted by: Heather at December 11, 2008 10:20 AM
Nobody understands that cthecat unless you live there. I love this line...."The White hipsters in Bed-Stuy are broke!! If they had money the'd chose to live elsewhere."
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:20 AM
The 'influx' was never from other boroughs or states. It was from other countries. The Eurotrash colonizing Williamsburg are the most visible to the typical Brownstoner, but the real numbers are in southern and eastern Brooklyn: Russians, Chinese, various Caribbean nationalities, Mexicans, etc.
Posted by: Sparafucile at December 11, 2008 10:23 AM
Very true,cthecat, very true.
What, you made me laugh. You sound like a junior high school girl.
Montrose Morris, PBA
Posted by: Montrose Morris at December 11, 2008 10:23 AM
Just trying to jump start the thread cobblehiller. I thought the posts had slowed down for a few seconds. In fact my Mexican boyfriend's wife just had a baby on Thanksgiving. William, 9 lbs, 4 ozs!!!!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:24 AM
What...do you get eyebrow weaves???
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:26 AM
Good on ya, incite away!
Me, I'm tracking which hot-button issue gets the most hits - that is IF this thread stays on topic...
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 10:26 AM
I've lived in Brooklyn all my life, and this census update is just one data point in a continuing saga. Brooklyn is a big place, capable of handling alot of changes in population, demographics and economics. The Brooklyn of the 19th and early 20th century - a maunfacturing powerhouse - bears almost no resemblance to the Brooklyn of today. More recently, I can draw on my own family's history. My folks grew up in Red Hook and Carroll Gardens, and I spent the early part of my childhood there too (in the Red Hook projects). I recall the exodus of folks from this area in the 60's and 70's. My father's friend owned a group of buildings at the corner of Smith St. and 3rd St. When he decided to flee NY for Florida, he practically had to give these homes away, as nobody wanted them. Seems hard to believe today, but I remember it like it was yesterday.
After many years of decline, Brooklyn is on the rise again. I welcome the folks who are moving to our Borough. They are injecting new life and prosperity to the place.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 10:28 AM
"my Mexican boyfriend's wife"??????????
Dave please die...
The What
Someday this war is gonna end..
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 10:31 AM
Well, this thread was train wrecked fast...
What this data says to me is that my wife and I were not the only people who got priced out of Manhattan and decided to move to Park Slope, Prospect Heights, Brooklyn Heights, Cobble Hill, or Carroll Gardens. But I already knew that.
FWIW, I know the previous tenants of our apartment were a white couple with a kid, so we just maintained status quo. Actually, since we didn't have the kid til after we'd been living there 7 months, maybe we brought the kid ratio down for a while?
The 91% people in same place number is meaningless without some historical data to compare it to.
Posted by: northsloperenter at December 11, 2008 10:34 AM
Regarding my 10.28 post..
Make that "manufacturing powerhouse". I think I'mbecoming dyslexic.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 10:34 AM
"When he decided to flee NY for Florida, he practically had to give these homes away, as nobody wanted them. "
Oh no Dumbass! That was "white flight" and it brought on urban decay in New york during the 70's and 80's. No one made the White people to flee the city, racism was the main culprit behind that. Don't sit up and slide that piece of crap here! And guess what??!! The same thing will happen when the Great Depression 2 sets in! The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"! This is my main problem with Gentrification! When things don't "work out" and the Asshats leave everything get worse!!!!!!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 10:38 AM
Not too much controversial info in that article. In fact, it is about as bland and expected a description of new census info as one could expect. Maybe there won't be 200 posts afterall.
Posted by: wasder at December 11, 2008 10:38 AM
"The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"! "
What please die.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:40 AM
"Yes, and at least 100 posts will be from DIBS, 11217, Rob et.al. commenting about how hot the DILF in the red hoody is."
Include me in the et.al.
There is definitely something hot about a guy pushing a baby carriage, or zipping up a child's coat, or wiping their mouth with a napkin, etc.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 10:42 AM
Oh no! Don't die DIBS! At least not until you explain the Mexican boyfriend :-)
Let us know when you get the money to move out of Bed-Stuy too- we'll follow you anywhere.(I heard the What had a nose hair weave)
Montrose- they have nifty metallic colored staples now. You can color coordinate your outfits, arrange them in a pattern, like hair jewelry.
Posted by: bxgrl at December 11, 2008 10:43 AM
"The same thing will happen when the Great Depression 2 sets in! The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"! This is my main problem with Gentrification! When things don't "work out" and the Asshats leave everything get worse!!!!!!"
Wow- we white asshats are damned if we do, damned if we don't. So, What, looks like gentrification is not all bad in your book? Yes folks- the What said it here.
Posted by: bxgrl at December 11, 2008 10:46 AM
No Dave! If stay around Beford Stuyvesant long enough you will see this first hand! Plenty of Asshats RENT Dave not own. When they lose their Jobs or get robbed the will move back to Ohio!!!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 10:46 AM
Yes What...if the Asshats leave "everything get worse." You got that right.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:47 AM
goldie - word. i "displaced" a minority family in much the same way that the minority family "displaced" a million dollars from me! maybe we were "richer" at some point, but we sure ain't now.
Posted by: i disagree at December 11, 2008 10:47 AM
I heard that The What wears a (synthetic) Merkin.
Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 11, 2008 10:47 AM
I'd like to go back to the DILF in the red hoodie.
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 10:48 AM
bxgrl! Where have you been?
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 10:49 AM
"The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave!...When things don't "work out" and the Asshats leave everything get worse!!!!!!"
What, I look forward to your future comments with your phony indignation when you're once again called out as the racist (and homophobe and misogynist) you are.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 10:50 AM
Bxgrl;
Where have you been? Nice to see you back.
What;
Regarding your statement:
The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"!
Do you realize that you are stating that a primarily African America neighborhood is not worthwhile unless the rich white folks take over? Do you suffer from self-hate?
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 10:50 AM
I hope your husband isn't lurking Nokilissa.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 10:50 AM
I didn't say I'd like to DO the DILF in the red hoodie Dave!
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 10:51 AM
So much for DIBS being the one excited by the picture!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 10:52 AM
benson, excellent post.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 10:53 AM
"I'd like to go back to the DILF in the red hoodie."
Nokilissa, back off. I was/am the first female to get dibs on him (10:42)!!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 10:54 AM
I nominate "i disagree: for QOTD!
Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 11, 2008 10:54 AM
BRG, that line is a total set up...
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 10:56 AM
cobblehiller, BRG always knows what she's saying...I quite certain her wording was intentional, but good for you, sometimes the hidden meanings are quite tough to find!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 10:57 AM
Bayridgegirl,
had to read your post thrice to realize you weren't referring to Dave with dibs! I thought you wanted Dave on the hot hoodie guy... I was like, huh? There's a visual!
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 10:58 AM
What, I look forward to your future comments with your phony indignation when you're once again called out as the racist (and homophobe and misogynist) you are.
Biff just because you like your Ass barbecued that means I don't have to subscribe to that crap! Misogynist????? No Ass Ranger I love women and I think you're the real misogynist! Taking hits to the back maybe a woman will do you some good! Racist?? OK Dumbass if you what to paint me as such go right ahead (pun intended).
This issues are still in play! The Great depression 2 is coming you're way and boy I can't wait! Have fun 2009 will be a bloodbath!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end..
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 10:59 AM
"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife (husband). The 9th Commandment, Nokilissa.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:01 AM
"Misogynist????? No Ass Ranger I love women and I think you're the real misogynist! Taking hits to the back maybe a woman will do you some good! Racist?? OK Dumbass if you what to paint me as such go right ahead (pun intended)."
I think within one poorly written paragraph you just proved my right about everything I accused you of being. Interesting, I haven't met anyone who claims he loves women after accusing virtually every one of them of being a prostitute and/or demanding sexual favors from them (as well as from male posters). Anyway, thanks for bringing the dialogue back up to a higher level.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:05 AM
meant to say "proved ME right"...two can play at the poor writing game!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:07 AM
I think we should have an "Ass barbecue" as our next party!!!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:07 AM
eww
Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 11, 2008 11:09 AM
"BRG, that line is a total set up..."
....hhmmm, I'll never reveal what I mean by what I say.
"cobblehiller, BRG always knows what she's saying..."
-Biff, not always, but thanks for the compliment....I guess.
"I quite certain her wording was intentional,"
Most times! :)
but good for you, sometimes the hidden meanings are quite tough to find!"
oh, hidden meanings, hidden feelings.
Hide and Seek is a game for kids.
Ok, back on topic....red hoodie man is hot!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:10 AM
Maybe The What can bring his "special sauce" to the Ass BBQ? Comes in regular flavor and the special "white asshat" version.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 11:11 AM
"Biff just because you like your Ass barbecued "
Biff (very close to beef) on a spit!
Hee Haw...let's party people!!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:15 AM
Hmmm. Wow. I really don't see it with the red hoodie guy.
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 11:15 AM
I'll pass on any What "special sauce" benson.
Nokilissa please feel free to chime in on that one since you're lusting after the DILF above.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:15 AM
Whoah...off topic but...
Wells Fargo is at 5.125% today for a 30yr.fixed conforming mortgage.
Damn!
Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 11, 2008 11:16 AM
I figured it out...Red Hoodie guy looks to be about 5'8" or so - he's too short for me. Is that "heightist" of me to say?
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 11:19 AM
"Biff just because you like your Ass barbecued"
No, I prefer my donkey steaks with a nice Bernaisse sauce, with white truffles on the side.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:20 AM
Elitist.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:21 AM
cobblehiller, these folks would like to have a word with you...
http://www.lpaonline.org/mc/page.do
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:24 AM
Biff...I bet she's making "little people" cookies right now and enjoys biting off their heads!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:26 AM
Ladies, ladies! - he's cute- but look at his kids. The one standing is looking off in the distance sadly and the poor little kid in the stroller looks near meltdown, while he's on the cell phone. They look like 3 people who would love nothing more than to get away from each other.
I suggest we call child services or an ice cream truck. Or Mom. Of course that's just my profound psychological analysis based on my huge experience with just about everything in life. Heh heh heh.
You guys could draw straws-maybe DIBS wants in on that? :-)
thanks noki, benson- had a lot going on, needed a break. I do confess to miss butting heads with you,benson!
Posted by: bxgrl at December 11, 2008 11:28 AM
"Biff just because you like your Ass barbecued"
Yes, Biff likes his Ass barbecued and his spare rib fried.
Cobble, go to town with this one. ;)
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:29 AM
For an active thread, this is amazingly boring. I like it better when you all bitch about kitchens.
Posted by: Heather at December 11, 2008 11:31 AM
Ok, I of all people will get this nonsense back on topic with the following segue. We've been speaking of little people. The story states the following:
"Neighborhoods further out in Brooklyn grew more diverse, with white populations shrinking slightly in Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights and Bensonhurst, and the Asian population increasing by 34 percent."
Given white populations are shrinking in Bay Ridge, does this mean that BRG is shorter than she used to be?
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:31 AM
"For an active thread, this is amazingly boring. I like it better when you all bitch about kitchens."
Heather, perhaps can you segue into that based on DIBS reference to baking cookies?
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:32 AM
What makes you guesstimate 5'8" cobblehiller? He looks to be significantly taller than the women behind him, and the 6 or 7 year old next to him only comes to his waist or a touch higher... I would have guessed 5'10 or 11.
But really, I'm not a big height needer.
He's just so shaggy-headed and adorable. A little stubble at the jaw... sorta of looks tired, but taking care of the kids well. Reminds me a little of my first college boyfriend minus the permanent joint at his fingertips.
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 11:35 AM
Asians are actually getting taller. It's because of their diet as compared to that of their parents. I know a lot of Asians ove 6' tall.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:35 AM
"Given white populations are shrinking in Bay Ridge, does this mean that BRG is shorter than she used to be?"
I'm insulted that you think I'm white :)
You Elitist Asshat
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:35 AM
The What does sound a little contradictory today. Yesterday he advocated blacks should mug, rob, and murder each other so white people won't move into black neighborhoods. Now he's decrying white flight. I think he's just in favor of slow, positive change and people not taking advantage of each other -- DIBS! What about the wife's feelings?
Posted by: mopar at December 11, 2008 11:36 AM
"For an active thread, this is amazingly boring. I like it better when you all bitch about kitchens."
I wonder if red hoodie man has red knobs on his range.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:37 AM
^^^^and another one, cobble.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:37 AM
You're right Heather. Unspeakably boring.
Pitch something into the fray would you?
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 11:38 AM
"I'm insulted that you think I'm white :)"
Well if you're Asian, then you've shot up 34%.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:39 AM
BxGrl;
Thanks!! Likewise for me. Looking forward to your getting back in the arena.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 11:40 AM
ooooooh! Stop it Bayridgegirl! You're killin' me here.
I bet he does.
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 11:40 AM
mopar...she met me before she became the wife and knew the whole story. I'll be the godfather. It's a hispanic thing. White people wouldn't understand!!!!
And the Hipanic population is growing as well. My Mexican bf is built like the proverbial "brick shithouse."
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:40 AM
I'll bet he cooks too. And not just grills, but cooks.
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 11:41 AM
"mopar...she met me before she became the wife and knew the whole story. I'll be the godfather. It's a hispanic thing. White people wouldn't understand!!!!"
Poor What just had a heart attack.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:43 AM
"I bet she's making "little people" cookies right now and enjoys biting off their heads!!! "
Heh heh heh! I'll never tell!
Nokilissa, I think it's the bent elbows. When I push my sister's stroller my arms are straight because I'm so tall. In fact, it's kind of annoying to push a stroller for any length of time because the handles are soo low.
I don't mind the scruffy so much - Better Half vacilates between a 'well-scrubbed & trimmed' and a 'I just rolled out of bed, hair sticking up, and haven't seen a razor in a month' - but on him it's not a pose!
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 11:43 AM
BRG are you Kanarsee Indian???
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:43 AM
"The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"! This is my main problem with Gentrification! When things don't "work out" and the Asshats leave everything get worse!!!!!!"
Ok, this one I'm not going to leave alone, or laugh off. What, your self hatred is showing. You spend so much time being a homophobic, misogynist, racist that you've decided that you might as well hate everyone equally. If every non-black person left Crown Heights, Bed Stuy, or any other predominantly black Brooklyn neighborhood tomorrow, they'd do just fine. Are you insinuating that black people are all so irresponsible and helpless that we'd all revert to chaos and anarchy? I don't think so.
Everyone I know, who has either held on during the bad old days, and is still hanging on, or chose to come back or join our communities since then, is very, very committed to not only keeping what we have now, but improving it. For ourselves and families, not to make it attractive and desireable to others. Because we, as a black community, are certainly not all poor, not criminal, not all unemployed, and not all concerned with impressing other people. We in Crown Heights North, did not work like dogs to get our neighborhood landmarked to impress white people, or make it "good enough" for them to want to move here. We, and by which I mean an organization that was about 95% black at the time, did it for US, because we are proud of our neighborhood, and wanted it protected, for now, and for our future generations, no matter who happens to live there.
I resent the implication that we, as a people, cannot be self sufficient, or self governing, or cannot be trusted with our own communities. I expect that from some of the less enlightened who post here. You demean yourself even further, if that's possible, by doing it yourself.
Montrose Morris, PBA
Posted by: Montrose Morris at December 11, 2008 11:44 AM
on a wolff range, presumably.
Posted by: Heather at December 11, 2008 11:45 AM
MM...correct...it wasn't the white necomers or the black necomers that cleaned up or gentrified; call it what you may, Bed Stuy. It was the black folk that lived there for countless generations. Frankly if more white folk newcomers moved onto my block I think it wouldn't be cared for to the extent that it is now.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:48 AM
Is that denton??? He has one of those ranges. It's such an environmentally unfriendly piece of equipment we've heard. But its more lusted after than a young white gigolo.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:49 AM
nice bit of racism, dave!
Posted by: z at December 11, 2008 11:50 AM
I'll bet he cooks too. And not just grills, but cooks.
Noki: You are now officially obsessed dear!
Actually, the cooking thing is sexy to me. I like a guy that can cook, and not just heat things up, really cook.
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 11:51 AM
MM, I had very little chance for QOTD as it was, but you've totally erased that for me now. Seriously, what a powerful post and knowing someone of your caliber feels the same way as me (you just express it infinitely more eloquently) confirms, at least to me, that my views are justified.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 11:51 AM
"The What does sound a little contradictory today. Yesterday he advocated blacks should mug, rob, and murder each other so white people won't move into black neighborhoods. "
OK That's it! Where is the comment?? I advocated that blacks should mug, rob, and murder each other so white people won't move into black neighborhoods???????? Where in the ferk I said such garbage???!!!
This is the book that I''m reading now..
William Bonner & Addison Wiggin - Empire of Debt - The Rise of an Epic Financial Crisis
Here is a excerpt:
Let us begin by noticing that this is a comic opera that seems as though
it might veer into tragedy at any moment. The characters on stage are familiar
to us—consumers, economists, politicians, investors, and businessmen.
They are the same hustlers, clowns, rubes, and dumbbells that we
always see before us. But in today’s performance they are doing somethingextraordinary, they are the richest people on the planet, but they have come
to rely on the savings of the world’s poorest people just to pay their bills.
They routinely spend more than they make—and think they can continue
doing so indefinitely. They go deeper and deeper in debt, believing they
will never have to settle up. They buy houses and then mortgage them
out—room by room, until they have almost nothing left.
They invade foreign
countries in the belief that they are spreading freedom and democracy,
and depend on lending from Communist China to pay for it.
But people come to believe whatever they must believe when they
must believe it. All these conceits and illusions that we find so amusing
in the Daily Reckoning (www.dailyreckoning.com), come not from
thinking, but from circumstances.
I remember not too long ago (October) people was running around like "Man on Fire"! I did not hear a peep from most of you, it was very quite. Now since everyone thinks everything is OK (The bottom is in) nonsense. The Asshats are back to pounding their chest and "claiming" victory. I want to see the expressions on your face when Obama cannot stop the onslaught of a collapsing Mutant Asset Bubble. You see dumbasses you need more debt to fund more debt. Buh bye.....
The What (Party like it's 2009)
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 11:53 AM
"Males living with children are fairly uncommon."
What about males that act like children (as exhibited in yesterday's heated topic)
"Only a little more than half of the population “5 years old and older” lived in homes where only English was spoken"
Only a little more than half of Brownstoner posters speak english.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 11:58 AM
z...which part? I posted a lot of crap today...some of which I actually believe and some which was, crap.
If you're referring to my 11:48 post then that I truly believe is the case.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 11:59 AM
I think he was kidding about your white gigolo comment, No z?
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 12:02 PM
English speaking & posting lessons from BRG. NOW I'VE SEEN EVERYTHING.
Besides, homes where "only English was spoken" are, by definition, less educated.
Let's see where that one takes us!!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 12:03 PM
I recall an article in the Times, about demographics. It stated in the next 20 years or something there would be 500,000 more Asians, 500,000 more Hispanics, like 100,000 more whites (I may misremember though), and the same number of blacks, but African and Caribbean blacks would be even with blacks raised in the country.
The thing I tell visitors to Brooklyn when we're out is, the thing to notice is the number of Hispanics and Asians in the city.
Posted by: infinitejester at December 11, 2008 12:07 PM
the notion that white residents are less likely to care for their homes than black residents is troubling. if someone said the reverse, they would be run out of town.
Posted by: z at December 11, 2008 12:08 PM
Hold on! I want to show the INSANITY that's going on right now. The whole world is nut and things like this will speed up our destruction!
Fannie, Freddie May Waive Appraisals for Refinancings (Update2)
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601009&sid=amYW0UdC2LdY&refer=bond
Dec. 10 (Bloomberg) -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the mortgage-finance companies seized by the U.S. government, are considering forgoing new appraisals on refinanced loans to help struggling homeowners, their regulator said.
“If they refinance someone, rather than doing a loan mod, do they need a new appraisal if they already have the credit?” Federal Housing Finance Agency Director James Lockhart told reporters after a speech in Washington today. “That’s an issue that’s being discussed. They’re looking at it.”
Fannie and Freddie, which own or guarantee $5.3 trillion of the $12 trillion U.S. home loan market, must consider that some homeowners who need to refinance owe more than their property is worth and wouldn’t qualify for the necessary mortgage insurance, Lockhart said. Another consideration is the issue surrounding the valuation of refinanced loans on the companies’ balance sheets.
“It sounds like a disaster,” said Paul Miller, an analyst at FBR Capital Markets in Arlington, Virginia. “What you’re doing is postponing the problem into the future and not giving the system time to fix itself,” he said, adding that regulators are bowing to political pressure.
Are you kidding me?????????!!!!!!!!!!!! On a 1003 you place the Apprised value down! Now we just put IDFK (I Don't Ferking Know) and that's it!!!!! 2009 can't get here fast enough!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 12:09 PM
"I had very little chance for QOTD as it was"
Biff, has an epiphany!!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 12:10 PM
"Besides, homes where "only English was spoken" are, by definition, less educated."
Oh, you gone and done it now, DIBS!
One word....Asians!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 12:13 PM
I happen to agree with most of what Bonner and Wiggin say in this excerpt from Empire of Debt. Looks like a good book. But it's really easy to say that the world is run by idiots who screwed us and everyone else in the process. But then what? One can only be the town crier of doom, the wild-eyed guy with the sandwich board hailing the end of the world, for so long before it's just street theatre. Nobody wants to hear from Cassandra or the boy who cries wolf forever.
I'd like to see ideas for fixing it. OK, we can't personally fix the macro economy, but we do have an effect on our micro economies. Instead of endlessly crowing "I was right", how about some ideas on keeping our neighborhoods up while the economy is down? How can we really prevent real or perceived race conflict, upsurges in street crime, what can we do with less police protection? As we go into 2009!!, with all of the changes to Brooklyn as documented by the census figures, how do we keep what we have, change what we need to, and manage to all get along, and prosper.
I'd really like to know.
Montrose Morris, PBA
Posted by: Montrose Morris at December 11, 2008 12:16 PM
"What you’re doing is postponing the problem into the future and not giving the system time to fix itself,"
Typical. Why fix it now, that's too much work! Same with Social Security, same with the tax code, blah blah blah ad infinitum.
Same as it ever was...same as it ever was...
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 12:16 PM
z...i'm just saying that new homeowners to the block would definitely be less conscientious than the ones that are there currently. I will amend my original statement and include asians, hispanics, american indians, blah, blah, blah.
Sorry if I offended you.
WHAT..stay on topic or get the hell off of here.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 12:18 PM
"One can only be the town crier of doom, the wild-eyed guy with the sandwich board hailing the end of the world, for so long before it's just street theatre."
Too true MM. After the collapse of the bubble (if it is as bad as the worst case fears) there has to be something else besides ranting, some way of picking up the pieces. Ranting does work well in terms of getting people to focus on a particular issue but it doesn't help much in the "fixing the problem" department. I am sure that some people will just take the attitude that they didn't cause the problem and screw the people who did, but unfortunately that is not the way our society moves forward. Sometimes we have to help pick up the pieces whether or not we did anything to break them in the first place.
Posted by: wasder at December 11, 2008 12:26 PM
I would like to hear from the DILF himself. I wonder if he is a Brownstoner reader?
Posted by: wasder at December 11, 2008 12:30 PM
I got excited - a topic about brooklyn census data, and over 100 posts at lunchtime. But alas, just inane banter.
Posted by: A Guest at December 11, 2008 12:30 PM
If you morons was listing to the "Nut" with the sandwich board, we would not be in this mess. The retards miss the point! You need INCOME to support DEBT!!! If take on more DEBT than INCOME that is called INSOLVENCY! Like AIG, Bear Sterns, Fannie Mae, Freedie Mac, Lehman Bros. Citibank, Like inert the next fail institution here!
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 12:32 PM
Come on A Guest...we all made at least one solid point somewhere along the line.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 12:32 PM
Montrose and all;
The What is a fear-mongerer, who knows not of what he speaks.
The fact of the matter is that the level of indebtedness in the US is not that high, when one looks at it from the perspective of debt-to-gdp ratio. I suggest you Google this topic, and you will learn the following things:
-the debt-to-gdp ratio in the US had been declining until recently, and historically speaking, is not that high. It was much higher after WWII and into the 50's, for instance.
-in comparison to other industrialized countries, the debt-to-gdp ratio of the US is not that high - it comes in the middle of the pack. For example, the ratio is much higher for Japan. During their "lost decade" of the 90's,Japan took on massive debt to splurge on infrastructure, in the hope that it would stimulate their economy. It did not work for them, and I am afraid that Obama is going to make the same mistake. See Amity Shlaes' column in the NYP today on this topic.
That is not to say that the recent problems are not real. Clearly there was too much leverage in the financial and housing sectors. If you look at other sectors, however, including manufacturing, materials, IT, etc., the level of debt is manageable.
The comparisons to the Great Depression make for great headlines, but is true hyperbole. The unemployment rate during this time shot up to 25%. We're not even close to there.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 12:35 PM
"What" I actually see the reverse of white flight. With everyone jumping on the green bandwagon and many of those Mcmansions going into foreclosure in the burbs it will cause people to downsize and move to Urban areas with better public transpotation.
With the new age of technology in NYC I also see lower crime in the coming years. Cameras will be everywhere in the coming years helping the NYPD combat criminals.
Posted by: sebb at December 11, 2008 12:37 PM
I'm with you, A Guest.
I love this kind of data, and find it really quite interesting yet the thread is filled with nonsense. I'm not surprised.
I'm not even going to start a discussion about it, because it seems pretty clear, not many are interested in the topic at hand.
I've sent it to a couple friends and we've been discussing it over email. Nice to have people who actually like to talk about important things from time to time.
Posted by: 11217 at December 11, 2008 12:37 PM
BRG - are you referring to the fact that asians have the highest average education of any race in the US? I'm guessing most of them speak two languages though, no?
Posted by: dittoburg at December 11, 2008 12:38 PM
haha it's all cool DIBS - was just hoping for a way to pass the rest of the day at work! if you guys get bored can you do some hipster/stroller mom bashing while you're at it!
Posted by: A Guest at December 11, 2008 12:38 PM
benson, please do not try to confuse the What with actual facts.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 12:39 PM
Montrose again, with a great post, 12:16pm
"we all made at least one solid point somewhere along the line."
Not me, my only solid point was about Red Hoodie Man.
"I would like to hear from the DILF himself."
I would like to hear from the DILF, myself!!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 12:39 PM
DIBS, not so fast. there may be some basis on which to say that newcomers are less conscientious than the conscientious people who've been there a while. but i don't get why when you discuss these careless newcomers, they're of all races except black. and why assume that because people "are there currently" that they're conscientious or that they have any greater investment in their neighborhood than people of any color or ethnic background who have sacrificed much to be there? assuming as if everyone else but black folks are newcomers, and all black people are invested old-timers is weird and just not true.
and there's been discussion in this thread about black professionals who are "returning" to these neighborhood and driving positive change. "returning" is a weird way of putting it - i am willing to bet that for the most part, the black professionals are newcomers too. they just happen to share an ethnic (actually, ethnic isn't the right word, given the diversity of black ethnicities, so, really, it's just color) commonality with a majority of the "old timers." so, it's just because they're black that they're positive forces for change? and if they were white professionals they'd be less conscientious?
Posted by: i disagree at December 11, 2008 12:40 PM
Oh like me rip this apart!
"The What is a fear-mongerer, who knows not of what he speaks."
What was October a blur??? I nailed that!
"The fact of the matter is that the level of indebtedness in the US is not that high"
Really??!! You can't be that delusion Benson! People brought house with no money down, 500 credit scores, 1 day out of Bankruptcy and other nonsense! Credit Card debt is very bad and people are losing their jobs!!!!
"-in comparison to other industrialized countries, the debt-to-gdp ratio of the US is not that high - it comes in the middle of the pack. For example, the ratio is much higher for Japan. During their "lost decade" of the 90's,Japan took on massive debt to splurge on infrastructure, in the hope that it would stimulate their economy. It did not work for them, and I am afraid that Obama is going to make the same mistake. See Amity Shlaes' column in the NYP today on this topic."
No he is not! Google the name Paul Volker Dumbass!!!!!!!! Volker is Obama's economic advisor. The Mutant Asset Bubble is dead on Jan 21, 2009!
"The comparisons to the Great Depression make for great headlines, but is true hyperbole. The unemployment rate during this time shot up to 25%. We're not even close to there."
I love when the retards roll this out. The 25% unemployment rate was in 1934! 3 Years after the market had crashed!!!!!!!!!! Unemployment is around 12% now, don't beLIEve with the Government says!
"benson, please do not try to confuse the What with actual facts."
Yeah Benson, please do not try to confuse the What with actual facts. Now put your helmet back on...
The What
Someday this delusion is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 12:49 PM
I will just post this. Unemployment Huh?
KB Toys Files Bankruptcy, Citing ‘Sudden’ Sales Drop (Update1)
Email | Print | A A A
By Steven Church
Dec. 11 (Bloomberg) -- KB Toys Inc., the 86-year-old toy retailer, filed for bankruptcy three years after leaving court protection, blaming a cash crisis caused by a “sudden” drop in sales at its 277 stores.
The company, based in Pittsfield, Massachusetts, exited bankruptcy in 2005 after closing hundreds of stores. KB Toys said in court papers today it owes as much as $500 million to creditors and has as much as $500 million in assets.
“The liquidity crisis is directly attributable to a sudden and sharp decline in consumer sales,” Controller Raymond Borst said in court documents filed in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Wilmington, Delaware.
The company is controlled by Prentice Capital Management Inc., which acquired a majority stake when KB Toys left bankruptcy, according to court documents.
KB employs almost 11,000 employees, about 6,500 of whom are temporary workers brought in for the holidays, Borst said in court documents.
The retailer’s debt include $190 million owed to lenders and $27.2 million owed to a toy company in Hong Kong.
The case is In re KB Toys Inc., 08-13269 U.S. Bankruptcy Court, District of Delaware (Wilmington).
To contact the reporter on this story: Steven Church in Wilmington, Delaware, at schurch3@bloomberg.net.
Last Updated: December 11, 2008 11:16 EST
The What (The sandwich board says to "Suck me off")
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 12:52 PM
"With everyone jumping on the green bandwagon and many of those Mcmansions going into foreclosure in the burbs it will cause people to downsize and move to Urban areas with better public transpotation."
Not with gas at 1.50 a gallon
"With the new age of technology in NYC I also see lower crime in the coming years. Cameras will be everywhere in the coming years helping the NYPD combat criminals."
The real criminals are in Government and Wall Street....
The What
Someday this war is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 12:55 PM
i disagree...i was talking about my specific block. far be it from me to make gross generalisations. You're point about "returning blacks" is probably largely true.
I'm sorry if my observation about the situation on my specific block raised concern that I was generalizing. I wasn't trying to.
What...try and comprehend what benson was saying before commenting about something completely different...debt of consumers vs. the US government.
Did you see our hedge fund returns..I posted thim in the other thread
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 1:03 PM
"The Mutant Asset Bubble is dead on Jan 21, 2009!"
We now have an official date posted by the What at 12:49
Time to start planning a big party. There will be two reasons to celebrate that date.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 1:15 PM
"Did you see our hedge fund returns..I posted thim in the other thread"
I give you my money and you turn around and lose 16%?
We are a nation of retards... We are a nation of idiots.. We are a nation of delusional masses...
The What
Someday this idiocy is gonna end...
Posted by: Return of The What at December 11, 2008 1:17 PM
it's not just you DIBS. the entire gentrification monologue is filled with gross generalizations, sloppy mischaracterizations and irrational outrage. i usually find it tiresome and pointless to engage, but on occasion it seems necessary to dress some of it down.
Posted by: i disagree at December 11, 2008 1:19 PM
DIBS, a guest is Hannible. I don't know why she's bothering with us here. She could be whining in Carroll Gardens in the hopes that an evil landlord gives her a free apartment.
Posted by: mopar at December 11, 2008 1:20 PM
Brownstoner,
We are all guilty of giving The What too much importance
To be fair, he was treated as a Cassandra regarding the financial meltdown and there are still some on this site who don’t realize the horror show most of us are experiencing and will continue to experience and possibly worse
However, If you want the WHAT to go away then the smartest course of action is to simply ignore his posts and not comment on them
I wanted to read this posting for feedback on the census and found very little on topic
I have enough of my own doom & gloom thoughts, thank you, and really do not need to read doom and gloom vitriol written with such mirthful glee .
Brownstoner, I enjoyed the site more when the What was relegated to the Forum section
Everytime I read a posting from The What it is like finding a turd in my drink
Please consider limiting him to the Forum and those who enjoy his brand of postings can follow him there
Before anyone tells me to go back to Ohio, I was born & raised and have lived all my life in NYC(all boroughs except the Bronx) , I am emotionally as well as financially invested in this great neighborhood (Fort Greene, Wallabout, Clinton Hill & Bed-Stuy) and have no plans on being part of a new wave of Flight
Again, Brownstoner, Please reconsider limiting The What to the Forum
Posted by: ESP1967 at December 11, 2008 1:29 PM
Yes What but up nicely since inception in 1993. Also up 3 & 5 years. You just can't comprehend the whole long-term investing thing can you???
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 1:30 PM
QOTD "Everytime I read a posting from The What it is like finding a turd in my drink"
I gotta ask, where and how often??? Please "out" the restaurant as well.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 1:38 PM
Why ban the What? I don't agree with everything he says, but this board wouldn't be half as interesting without him.
Posted by: mopar at December 11, 2008 1:48 PM
I must concur with Dave on his nomination for QOTD. That was a genuine belly laugh.
But I disagree strongly with your plea to Brownstoner ESP1967. Free speech is a beautiful thing. If you don't like what the What has to say, skip along. Truly. It is an easy enough undertaking. I do it all the time.
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 1:49 PM
Actually it is modification of an old saying
"finding a turd in my milk"
which I guess if the farmer was not careful when milking the cow was a possibility
Posted by: ESP1967 at December 11, 2008 1:51 PM
my main gripe with the what is that i'm developing repetitive stress injury in my index finger from using the mouse wheel to scroll past all his long-ass comments.
Posted by: z at December 11, 2008 1:51 PM
Yesterday was the anniversary of the invention of the mouse. Anyone want to guess how old it is?? Clue: It has nothing to do with when PCs first appeared.
1968...40 years!!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 2:00 PM
DIBS, that is neither on topic or even on our off topics, you've created a new realm of off-off-topics!
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 2:14 PM
' Anyone want to guess how old it is??'
If you're going to tell us to guess, give us some time!!!
Gees...don't throw in the answer.
Elitist Asshat!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 2:15 PM
z brought up the mouse first in the thread above me. Don't come waltzing in here after your long lunches and start telling me i'm off-off topic.
And I threw in the answer so I wouldn't get a bunch of assinine posts from people like you two.
:)
PWEA (Pompous White Elitist Asshat)
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 2:33 PM
'And I threw in the answer so I wouldn't get a bunch of assinine posts from people like you two.'
Well, can you have thrown in the answer/explanation to 'what the Census says about us' so I wouldn't have to read a bunch of assinine posts from people like you!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 2:38 PM
I love the idea of waltzing in after a long lunch, sorry to disappoint you - but it was a BLT at my desk with the Huffington Post. While I eavesdropped on our Managing Director while he was consolling a London employee who just let a long time employee go. It's all fun and games until someody loses an eye...
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 2:41 PM
Areas in NY change. When my great uncles came to NY from VA in 1901 they lived on 66th and CPW. The Lincoln Center area was a Harlem type of area in those days. To tell you the truth that area was not all the great until after Lincoln Center was built in the 1960s. Just take a look at west side story. It is very common for areas to change ethnic groups. North Brooklyn is beginning to have a larger new white population move in while many of the natives are moving out of state for a change. Bedford Stuyvesant and Crown Heights is starting to look like it did in the 1950s. Many upper middle class African Americans are moving into these areas along with whites many European born that have no prejudices against people that don't look like themselves. Together the new along with the old timers (who seem very happy to pass the torch) in these communities are reviving these grand neighborhoods back to there original state.
Posted by: Amzi Hill at December 11, 2008 2:45 PM
Benson,
If you put off-balance sheet items like Medicare and Social Security on the govenrment's balance sheet (the way a Company would have to report their health care + retirement obligations), those debt to income calculations won't look as good.
Posted by: Boerum Hill at December 11, 2008 2:54 PM
Boerum Hill;
I agree 100% with what you are saying. Once again, however, if you compare the US to the other indistrialized nations, we out looking pretty good.
Most of the other nations have more generous social welfare plicies than the US, AND they have an older population. Indeed, Japan is starting to enter into a demogrpahic tailspin.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 3:04 PM
Not that I'm counting or anything, but so far Dave has 34 comments on this thread. I don't feel like counting any others, but no one else here thinks this is getting out of control...?
Have you all never heard of aol instant messenger?
You've basically ruined every thread today with these asinine posts. About 5 are related to the topic thanks to a couple select people throwing everyone else off topic with their personal and rather childish banter.
Every once in a while fine, but REALLY....34 posts just on this one thread??
Posted by: 11217 at December 11, 2008 3:31 PM
can we get back to the dilf in the red hoodie?
Posted by: new2hood at December 11, 2008 3:39 PM
At least a few of my posts, specifically the first one, actually had something to say about the topic. So far you are 0-1 not that I'm countin or anything
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 3:41 PM
oh, 11217, shall we rewind to yesterday!!!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 3:47 PM
I agree with 11217. I'm not against a joke here or there, but it is out of control. This site used to be a great place to engage in a debate on the issues of concern to those of us who care about Brooklyn, real estate, etc. Almost every thread today degraded into the "truffles and dildos" genre, yet again, interspersed with the What's rants.
Posted by: benson at December 11, 2008 3:48 PM
"Oh no Dumbass! That was "white flight" and it brought on urban decay in New york during the 70's and 80's. No one made the White people to flee the city, racism was the main culprit behind that. Don't sit up and slide that piece of crap here! And guess what??!! The same thing will happen when the Great Depression 2 sets in! The "nice White People" are going to call U-Hall and pack up and leave! Then our neighborhood will go back to the "Bad old days"! This is my main problem with Gentrification! When things don't "work out" and the Asshats leave everything get worse!!!!!!"
What, white flight was certainly done by the late 1970s, not the 1980s. I agree it was caused by racism but here we are a generation or two later. If the Asshats were the same as their parents Bensonhurst and Howard Beach would be the hot new nabes, not BS, FG, and CH.
I'm disappointed you are contradicting yourself today. You always said in the new depression white folx would get run outta the hood which would revert to its rightful owners. I can dig that pov. But today you do a flip flop.
cobblehiller, I'm 6'3" and I can cook. Got my nice Wolf stove hooked up. You'll have to come over and see what I can do, that is, when I get water in the kitchen!
Posted by: denton at December 11, 2008 3:53 PM
"The Lincoln Center area was a Harlem type of area in those days. To tell you the truth that area was not all the great until after Lincoln Center was built in the 1960s."
It was known as "San Juan Hill" at that time. I have some relatives who once lived in the area.
Posted by: East New York at December 11, 2008 3:54 PM
BRG,
Yesterday I was having a conversation (primarily with Cobblehiller) which was about the topic at hand. Or at least related to the topic at hand.
A joke here and there is great, but you all have literally taken over every thread with nonsense. 100's of comments in some cases of back and forth between 3 or 4 people so that the "real" comments get lost in the shuffle. That's a shame.
It's too much, and if you are too blind to see that, then you are even more immature than I had thought.
Posted by: 11217 at December 11, 2008 4:05 PM
Don't tempt me Denton, don't tempt me!
Of course you will understand when I tell you...I just wanted you for your stove! : )
Posted by: cobblehiller at December 11, 2008 4:07 PM
"Yesterday I was having a conversation (primarily with Cobblehiller) which was about the topic at hand. Or at least related to the topic at hand."
Yes, I read the MATURE conversation you were having!
"A joke here and there is great, but you all have literally taken over every thread with nonsense."
A mature person would see that it's not EVERY Thread. We confine our banter to one or two. Mr. B can delete every single post if he chooses to, from every single thread, and has not yet.
"100's of comments in some cases of back and forth between 3 or 4 people so that the "real" comments get lost in the shuffle. That's a shame."
Yes, it was a shame, yesterday. 220 posts between the same 3 or 4 people full of vile nonsense.
"It's too much, and if you are too blind to see that, then you are even more immature than I had thought."
Yes, I read plenty of immaturity yesterday.
Here's my post from the thread that YOU ran amok yesterday.
"WOW!!! Thank god I had work to do yesterday.
While this thread disintegrated early on. I found some of the posts amusing, a few defusing and many dehumanizing.
What a disarray and petty display of inappropriate shallowness.
Everybody, have some Egg Nog! And spike it a little.
Congratulations, Wasder! Another girl to the mix, you will be blessed. Please share the news when she arrives.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 9:00 AM"
Should I cut and paste all the 'mature' comments you made in that thread...oh, wait, I can't find any!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 5:02 PM
BRG, 11217 is going back and forth between this and the other thread arguing with the two of us. He clearly enjoys this much more than trying to constructively contribute to a discussion in one of the numerous threads we haven't participated in.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 5:19 PM
sam's being rude in the parrot thread 11217.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 11, 2008 5:21 PM
The What was rude to MM in the QOTD 11217. Blog Patrol better get over there pronto!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 5:22 PM
Biff, Census says, I need you to look at something, before you doze off.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 5:40 PM
BRG, looks like another hidden meaning there! I have a holiday party tonight - yes, they still exist. I then plan on going through a couple of proposals after that. Could be a late night!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 5:48 PM
Biff, silly, no hidden messages ever :)
Holiday parties are still being held. I went to a holiday party last night, and going to 4 next week.
I'm wearing a red sweater to all of them!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 11, 2008 5:56 PM
Holiday parties are still being held, but this is a WORK-related holiday party, which is much less common in 2008.
I love red sweaters!
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 11, 2008 6:23 PM
And I love red hoodies ;)
Posted by: Nokilissa at December 11, 2008 8:11 PM
Nokilissa...I'll give the red hoodie after I take it off of him!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 12, 2008 8:54 AM
re-write:
Nokilissa...I'll give you the red hoodie after I take it off of him!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 12, 2008 8:55 AM
I think Noki is more interested in what's under the red hoodie than the red hoodie itself.
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 12, 2008 9:17 AM
I don't care what Noki is interested in, she's only getting the red hoodie!
I'll tell her what's underneath!
On topic:
The influx of red hoodie wearing, hot looking guys in diverse neighborhoods is welcome. The trend should be, they move to south brooklyn.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 12, 2008 9:29 AM
Should they leave their wives and kids behind in north brooklyn?
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 12, 2008 9:32 AM
I like kids. No kid should be left behind.
It's those damn wives!! I unzip the hoodie, they zip it up!
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 12, 2008 9:48 AM
BAAAHHH!!
oh, red hoodie man, you just disappeared from the front page!!
I'll come visit you.
Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 12, 2008 9:50 AM
No Child Left Behind!
Ok, I'm done here. Off the front page, out of mind. Unless it's an exceptional QOTD (or yours).
Posted by: Biff Champion at December 12, 2008 9:54 AM
Can't we all just get along?
Posted by: italiana71 at December 12, 2008 1:10 PM
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