Open House Picks

Did anyone notice the last photo of the Crown Heights place? It seems to be between two long cinderblock buildings on either side. One seems like it might be a church or synagogue, but it was a real turn off for me. Maybe it looks better in real life.

But, I can't understand what people are thinking. If I had 1.4 million to spend, why in the world would I want to spend it to live in this place? Sure, it seems like a lovely house, but I'd rather buy a house in the suburbs for way less than half this price. The run up in prices is based on this ridiculous notion than anywhere in Brooklyn, as long as it's Brooklyn, is somehow worth 3x as much as anywhere else despite a neighborhood's lack of amenities, good schools, or anything else.

Brooklyn neighborhoods used to be the best bargain around. Middle class people bought brownstones and could live with rental income and raise a family. But all perspective was lost -- now a house in a middling location in Crown Heights can ask 1.4 million and people think it's a bargain if you get it for only 1.1 million. NOT. Until these homes become affordable for middle class families again, these prices are ridiculous, and it astounds me that there are still buyers silly enough to pay these kinds of inflated prices.

Posted by: CGfan at December 19, 2008 2:14 PM

Here's the broker's pitch for the Park Place house:

"...a fabulous investment. Come discover the next "IT" neighborhood, now what everyone will be flocking to in the next couple of years."

I actually don't disagree with that -- I could definitely imagine Crown Heights becoming a neighborhood people flock to in the next few years.

But, in the real world, the reason to look in a neighborhood that has yet to be "discovered" is to purchase a bargain. It's completely irrelevant that this was once a mansion for rich people -- there are plenty of former mansions all over the country in so-so neighborhoods that no one wants to live in. In fact, there were plenty of former mansions in Park Slope and Fort Green that middle class buyers willing to buy in an "undiscovered" neighborhood bought for a song many years ago.

Park Slope, Cobble Hill, Carroll Gardens, Fort Green all became neighborhoods with homes only rich people could afford only after lots and lots of middle income people bought houses there. But now fringe neighborhoods, propped up by the bubble, expect these kinds of prices. The only house here most people I know could afford is the $499,000 one. Believe it or not, half a million dollars is alot of money to spend on housing if you aren't rich and for most people, even professional working ones, even that is a stretch.

If the housing market does crash, communities like Crown Heights will greatly benefit if there are a slew of $300,000 "starter homes" that all the people who have regular paying but very stable jobs -- non-profit professionals, teachers, postmen, city workers, accountants -- can buy. They are priced out of this market, and not silly enough to pay half a million dollars or more for a small 2-bedroom apt. in a fringe neighborhood instead of moving outside the city where less money can buy a nice house with a decent public school to send their kids. Cheap housing prices -- I mean authentically cheap, not "cheap for Brooklyn" because it's "only" a million dollars -- will keep them here, but not what we see here.

Posted by: CGfan at December 19, 2008 6:07 PM

theandreewlee, I know more than a few families who have moved from Carroll Gardens (renting) to Maplewood when they wanted to buy. And if not Maplewood, somewhere else other than Brooklyn. They loved Brooklyn, and would have moved to neighborhoods like Crown Heights had they been cheap, but they were already much too expensive. They likely would have been willing to do the hard work of trying to improve the local public schools in the neighborhood and living with the lack of amenities if they could have purchased an appealing home for less than in Maplewood. But when the choice is paying 30% more for a fixer upper that then needs another $100,000 more in renovations plus no amenities versus buying a nice home you can actually afford in a pleasant NJ town with good schools, the choice is a no-brainer. Despite being long-time Brooklyn residents, they haven't drunk the "Brooklyn or bust" kool-aid and aren't blinded enough to overpay for the so-called "cachet" of claiming they live in Brooklyn instead of NJ. But then, I've been living in Brooklyn since the time when residents were dismissed as the "bridge and tunnel" crowd, Manhattan friends wouldn't visit, Williamsburg was a place you'd go to only if you wanted kosher meat, and it was far from cool to live here. It's not Brooklyn that's special, it's finding an affordable home in a community of like-minded people. If I were looking now, I'd have a much better shot at finding that in Queens or New Jersey.

Posted by: CGfan at December 20, 2008 11:00 AM

cwbuecheler, congratulations on finding a house you like. As long as it's something you can easily afford, in a neighborhood you like and would be willing to live in that house for many years, what happens to the housing market over the next few years is less important.

However, the Flatbush house listing seems to say it is a one-family with a basement with "summer kitchen", which tells me this is an illegal apartment, so you should go in knowing that your rental income could very easily be nothing, not more than the $700 the tenant is paying now. And, if it is indeed an illegal rental, you really might not want the risk or hassle of having a tenant at all. I'd advise against it, in fact, it's just not worth it.

So, if you do like it, make an offer that assumes no rental income and is whatever you can afford to pay, not a stretch. It's very possible, in this market, that it will be accepted, and if not, I promise you there will be another house out there for you eventually -- it just means this one wasn't the right one. Good luck.

Posted by: CGfan at December 21, 2008 5:53 PM