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December 16, 2008

Co-op of the Day: 195 Prospect Park West

195-Prospect-Park-West-2008.jpg
185-PPW-floorplan.jpgWe'll say this about the floorplan at 195 Prospect Park West: It ain't cookie-cutter! The 1,400-square-foot three-bedroom may be short on right angles but it's got park views to spare. The baseboard heating is a bit of a bummer; the kitchen has an Eighties vibe but looks decently done. Price? $950,000 with a reasonable monthly maintenance of $898. What do you think?
195 Prospect Park West [Corcoran] GMAP P*Shark




Posted by Brownstoner at 12:43 PM | Comments (41)
Categories: Co-ops, Park Slope

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Comments

I'm digging it. Some of the finishing choices aren't my thing but the building and the layout are pretty nice.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 16, 2008 12:51 PM

I actually really like the kitchen, and the floorplan is fun.

$898 maintenance is reasonable? It seems really high to me, but I don't fully understand what maintenance charges are paying for.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at December 16, 2008 12:51 PM

Isn't this next to the movie theater- doesn't it face away from the park? 206 PPW is the building that has park views. These buildings are great. The layouts are nice and the light is good.

Bartell Pritchard square is full of uproarious drunks all night banging and shouting and fighting (at least is was a few years ago), and these curved buildings take in all that noise.

Posted by: Park Place at December 16, 2008 12:51 PM

is this a loud street, and $/sq.ft. in line with comps? i dig the atypical layout and view, but calling the 4th floor the "top of the world"? i despise these brokers more with each passing day.

Posted by: goldie at December 16, 2008 12:55 PM

But do planes fly overhead?

Posted by: TownhouseLady at December 16, 2008 12:57 PM

Maintenance is pretty reasonable for 1300 square feet. $1 per square foot used to be reasonable now it's the norm, if you add in doormen, $1.25. Maintenance pays for bldg mortgage, heat, water and sewer, bldg repairs, legal and accounting. Just like common charges at a condo without the mortgage interest deductible.

Posted by: DeLepp at December 16, 2008 12:59 PM

DeLepp - thanks much for the info!

Posted by: cwbuecheler at December 16, 2008 1:02 PM

Not to quibble, but the "bedroom" off the living room" feels more like a den (no closet). Is it on top floor? If so, lack of outdoor space (roof deck) is a bummer, since that's often consolation prize for shlepping up so many stairs. Yes, the park is nearby but it's not the same as private space.

I think the price would have seemed reasonable last spring, but now it's a whole different ballgame. And I agree that the maintenance seems high, esp since this seems to have no elevator.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at December 16, 2008 1:02 PM

I wonder what this place would go for on the north end of the park. 200k higher?

Posted by: bktycoon at December 16, 2008 1:08 PM

I like the layout, but question. Can you replace baseboard heating and if so, with what? Radiators? Cause I hate, hate, hate baseboard heating.

Posted by: Heather at December 16, 2008 1:16 PM

Oh THL, you ARE incorrigible. The broker boasts that the mortgage is almost paid off. If I was shopping, I would want to know if the co-op board plans to reduce the maintenance when that happens.

Posted by: altervoce at December 16, 2008 1:17 PM

I'm not a big fan of baseboard heating but I'd rather have that than radiators. No clanking, no hissing, and more control than "off" and "on."

Posted by: cwbuecheler at December 16, 2008 1:19 PM

not familiar with baseboard heating? why so down on it?

Posted by: goldie at December 16, 2008 1:19 PM

Very nice apartment. But very busy spot and not facing the aprk. I'd say 850K max.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 16, 2008 1:22 PM

I hate it too, Heather, and am always surprised by the number of people here who support it or don't get the dislike of it.

I mean, this is a blog supported and controlled by a guy who can't stand granite or recessed lighting. So our understandable distaste for an unattractive, highly visible tin box that snakes around the whole room, leaving no place for baseboard detail or the lovliness of the contrast between a white/cream baseboard, a dark hardwood floor, and a crisply painted wall in a contrasting color can't be understood? People! ;)

Oh, and cwbuecheler, with newer radiators, the control one has is much better than just on and off. I was stunned by the difference when we replaced them in my old apartment.

Posted by: Nokilissa at December 16, 2008 1:34 PM

Goldie--

These electric baseboards, like most, are pretty ugly and obtrusive. Plus it effects how drapes hang and what you can put directly against a wall.

Posted by: tinarina at December 16, 2008 1:34 PM

Nice apartment but there are streets nearby, plus a big noisy park, and the airplanes, there may even be a subway somewhere nearby.


Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 1:34 PM

Maintenance is very reasonable. Must be low/no underlying mortgage.

I don't understand people who think this is too high. The $1 psf figure seems out of date to me. That was standard before the 18.5% post-9/11 tax hike, before the double-digit water rate hike, before electricity rates shot up, before heating costs jumped... basically that's a standard that's ten years old.

Meanwhile, I have no idea what this kind place goes for in this market. 950 strikes me as high.

And I hate baseboard too.

Posted by: Ringo at December 16, 2008 1:45 PM

Yeah, it's the wall arranging thing, the fact that you need to watch where you put electronics and musical instruments, not to mention furniture, they tend to accumlate dust and pet hair, are impossible to clean well and the fact that electric heat is kinda expensive and inefficient. I could go on and on. Seriously, can you retrofit and put in radiators?

It is true, Nokilissa, people always seem to accept baseboards... and will even demonize those through the wall heating/cooling units, which I have to say, also annoy me but are far preferable.

Posted by: Heather at December 16, 2008 1:48 PM

Maintenance is extremely reasonable. Isn't this supposed to be a 1,400 sq. foot place? I haven't seen maintenance for a place this size under a thousand bucks in some time. Though those may have all been elevator buildings.

That said, I too think this is a two bedroom place with a den off of the living room. For most tastes, the kitchen will most certainly need to be redone in order to move past the Wallstreet, Less Than Zero (or insert any other 80's movie here) feel, and the location is busy and loud.

Seems to be about 90 to 100k overpriced (they should have set it at 860k imo to have generated immediate buzz and interest)

Posted by: Nokilissa at December 16, 2008 1:57 PM

Nokilissa - don't elevator bldgs always have much higher maintenance? Walk-ups, in my experience, tend to have much lower maintenance costs, hence this seems high. Agree with the baseboard problem - yuck!

Posted by: Miss Muffett at December 16, 2008 2:11 PM

I doubt those are electric baseboard units. When people renovate in pre-war apartments like this they remove the old radiators and install modern fin-coil units that operate off the building's steam.
What is unusual is that the partment has central air. There is nothing grosser than window a.c.'s.
This is a beauty.

Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 2:16 PM

Right, Inigo. But it's unlikely to be steam either. Most likely this is standard hydronic heateing, where 180deg water made up by the building's boiler is passed thru copper tube/fin coil.

Other than radiant heat, which is unlikely to be found in an apt., imho hydronic is better than steam. It's quieter and it's not dehydrating the way steam is. It is visible tho, just like rads.

Posted by: denton at December 16, 2008 2:23 PM

Some of the companies that make custom wood radiator covers also make attractive wood covers for baseboard heaters. That's probably what I would opt for in this instance.

Posted by: StuyMom at December 16, 2008 2:29 PM

Some buildings have steam, some have hot water, my understanding is that there are modern baseboard units that can work off either one. I would replace these with smaller units on the market now. To my eye, they are way better than radiators.
In terms of the maintenance, condo people may not know that in a co-op, the maintenance includes real estate taxes.

Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 2:53 PM

Nice apartment and great for proximity to the park and subway. But having buses from three different lines circling under your windows, plus all the other traffic noise, plus Pavilion patrons sucking up all the curbside parking, are all drawbacks. By the way, how on earth was the Pavilion permitted to open in an R district? It had been waaaay more than two years since the Sanders closed, so reactiviation of a grandfathered legal non-conforming use shouldn't have applied.

Posted by: Sparafucile at December 16, 2008 3:17 PM

If you do not wish to live near buses and restaurants I don't think you are really a city person.

Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 3:23 PM

I think this is a pretty great, civilized layout, although it's pretty ugly in the state it's in.

Posted by: gkw at December 16, 2008 3:25 PM

"If you do not wish to live near buses and restaurants I don't think you are really a city person."

I can't thank of a response to that that wouldn't violate the new ban on insulting comments. So I'll just say that many people came to brownstone booklyn in order to live on a quiet, tree-lined block of brownstones where we could walk to restaurants and buses but would not have to see or hear them from our homes. People who like living above buses and traffic and crowds live in Manhattan, not Park Slope.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 16, 2008 3:35 PM

Oops. The Pavilion's actually in a C1 district, which still doesn't allow theaters.

Given the choice, I think most people would just as soon do without bus noise, drunken rowdies, and restaurant odors, so it's reasonable to note this and think it should be reflected in the apartment's price.

Posted by: Sparafucile at December 16, 2008 3:46 PM

Shill,
There are restaurants and buses in Brooklyn too. It is part of the scene. Being too squeamish about seeing buses outside your windows is kind of anti-urban.
If you really want tree-lined streets with no traffic what the heck are you doing in an over-crowded city like Brooklyn? You can't escape city life if you live in the city no matter where you are. Especailly in Brownstone Brooklyn, this is central casting city life.

Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 3:57 PM

Inigo,
have you been to park slope? Or cobble hill? Or many other brownstone areas? Ever walked the side streets? Quiet. Trees. No buses. Few pedestrians. Few cars. No stores or restaurans. There are lots of buses, cars, people, and restaurants on fith or seventh ave, but not on the side streets. Which is why most people prefer to live on the side streets and not on the avenues. It's pretty basic.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 16, 2008 4:07 PM

Not many cars or people in Park Slope?
Ha!
Park Slope, Vermont maybe.
Ever been on a sidestreet when the garbage truck is collecting garbage and thirty impatient drivers are inching their way forward? Or when a delivery truck parks and stops the flow for about fifteen minutes? There are advantages to wider streets. Prospect Park West is not exactly an undesirable street.

Posted by: Inigo at December 16, 2008 4:17 PM

A. Garbage trucks are once every few days, not constant.
B. this place is not just on PPW--it's on the traffic circle!

Posted by: shillstoner at December 16, 2008 4:25 PM

Speaking as someone who lives on seventh avenue, I can assure that park slope's side streets are, by and large, MUCH quieter than its avenues.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at December 16, 2008 4:27 PM

A lot of us actually like living near stores and conveniences. One of the more annoying facts about Park Slope life in my mind are the long blocks you have to slog up to get milk and beer in the snow... not to mention, their quiet utopias are a perfect mugger's paradise.

Posted by: Heather at December 16, 2008 6:37 PM

heather youre being sarcastic, or convincing yourself of your decision.

Posted by: goldie at December 16, 2008 6:43 PM

How is steam heat "dehydrating"? The term implies taking water vapor out of the air, and there should be no difference betw steam and hydronic. If anything, the small inevitable leakage of steam from the vent before it closes should slightly hydrate the room. Anyone know for real?

Heather, time to run, not walk from PS.

Posted by: cmu at December 16, 2008 7:07 PM

That is a really low maintenance, probably explains why the price feels a little high. But look at it this way: The $600 you save on maintenance would let you take out another 125k in financing. I'd rather tie up my money in a low interest rate mortgage than a sure-to-rise monthly payment.

I don't think this is particularly overpriced. But that kitchen is going to turn a lot of people off. 899k would get this done in a heartbeat.

Posted by: Bolder at December 16, 2008 7:52 PM

I really like this place, even after reading all of the above comments.

I would consider giving up my 2 family, 2800 sq ft. ESH home with an award winning garden, garage, and private parking spot on a private street, one block away from the beach for this place.

I love Rockaway but I have a kid now so being closer to the city and park are a major plus.

Heck I can even deal with that freaking kitchen and baseboard heating.


Posted by: BlueBerry at December 16, 2008 9:28 PM

I lived on 15th street right off the square and it really is a cavern of sound. We kind of liked it. We called it "The Song of 15th Street". It sounded something like this "I told you not to call me on my cell phone - I be at school all day - I know it's 2 in the morning that why I told you not to call. Dumb B*%ch" or once "I am Hispanic MF, We are the best, you are sh*&t. We are the Hispanic Peoples" all with the clank clank of bums digging through the recycling bins and the whirl of skateboards in the background. I heard all of this from my bedroom on the 4th floor. We would wake up laughing sometimes saying sleepily did you hear that? Anyway, I really loved this street from the guys at Royal Deli to the Connecticut Muffin and 12th Street Bar and Grill, Jaya Yoga and Pumpkin Market. I do not miss the F train, but this is why I moved from Alabama (where in '95 I paid $295 for 1 bedroom beautiful apt) to Brooklyn and where I plan to stay.

Posted by: sbbrock at December 17, 2008 8:34 AM

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