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December 2, 2008

Closing Bell: Gassing it Up in Brooklyn

It's practically free! Go out and drive around in circles! The NY Daily News reported today that the cheapest gas in the city is right here in the borough of Kings. "Brooklyn had the lowest gas prices in the city for 17 out of the 30 days from mid-October to mid-November, even though the average prices from Aug. 18 to Nov. 18 were the same in Brooklyn and Queens: $3.38 per gallon," they write. Last week, you could catch a gallon for $2.19 in Williamsburg.
Photo by peechaspeechas.

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Comments

i bought gas this weekend in jersey for $1.63/gal. thought i drove through a time warp for a quick sec...

Posted by: benno at December 2, 2008 4:07 PM

I love my NJ gas. 93 is under 2 bucks.

Posted by: Adam Dahill at December 2, 2008 4:08 PM

If you went to Jersey then you did!!! :)

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 2, 2008 4:08 PM

I paid 1.75 in Jersey over the summer.
Road trip on the horizon for me...Woohoo...good times!!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 4:15 PM

Sorry, meant to say.

I paid 1.75 in Jersey over the weekend.
Road trip on the horizon for me...Woohoo...good times!!

But according to benno, sounds like I got ripped off.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 4:27 PM

It was that flashy Cadillac BRG.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 2, 2008 4:30 PM

I know it was her beige cadillac
Crushed velvet seats
Riding in the back, oozing down the street
Waving to the girls
Feeling out of sight
Spending all my money on a saturday night
Honey, I just wonder what you do there in back of your beige cadillac

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 4:41 PM

I actually prefer high gas prices. It cuts down on emissions and is the only way we'll draw attention to the fact we've passed peak oil and desperately need to find more sustainable, environmentally friendly alternative energy sources.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 5:25 PM

Biff, the price of gas, should not be the indication that as a society we need to find alternative energy sources.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 5:30 PM

"I actually prefer high gas prices."

Do you own a car?
Or are you just really rich and don't care?
Or do you love supporting the lifestyle Oil Barons?

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 5:32 PM

BRG, the unfortunate the reality is most people don't think about the issue until the price of gas becomes unaffordable and it directly hits them in their pocketbook. Let's fact is; most people are incredibly shortsighted and sweep issues under the carpet until they're forced to deal with it. The amount of personal / credit card debt Americans have is insane. People don't worry about the long term as long as they can afford what they want today.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 5:34 PM

"Do you own a car?
Or are you just really rich and don't care?"
I care a lot. But I care about future generations and how they will survive more than I care about some tool in a Hummer driving two blocks to pick up a pack of cigarettes.

"Or do you love supporting the lifestyle Oil Barons?"
No, I prefer people buy less gas and we eventually become dependent on alternative energy sources. I don't usually drive, so you're likely forking over a lot more money to the oil barons than I am. But that statement really makes no sense. That's like me asking you if you prefer low gas prices and increased oil consumption and damaging the environment and running out of fossil fuels so the youth of today have to deal with the problems we caused.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 5:40 PM

I know, I meant "the unfortunate reality" and "Let's face it"...

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 5:40 PM

Biff, I agree with most of what you said. But I still disagree about gas prices should be higher in order for us to think about alternatives.

Over the summer, gas prices were at record highs..are we drilling off shore? Is there an electric or hydrogen powered car in every driveway?

"Let's fact is; most people are incredibly shortsighted and sweep issues under the carpet until they're forced to deal with it"
Interesting line...especially coming from you!!!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 5:42 PM

"Biff, I agree with most of what you said. But I still disagree about gas prices should be higher in order for us to think about alternatives."
- It shouldn't have to be that way, but that's the only way the majority of people will think about the problem.

"Over the summer, gas prices were at record highs..are we drilling off shore? Is there an electric or hydrogen powered car in every driveway?"
- Because the high prices were over a relatively short period. If they stayed that way, it's likely something beneficial in terms of other solutions (other than myopic solutions of keeping prices low and using our reserves) would have come of it.
Please watch this if you can:
http://www.whokilledtheelectriccar.com/

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 5:47 PM

I agree with you about people driving their car two blocks, but that's more of a social issue. As a society we've conditioned ourselves to get our asses in the car and drive as opposed to walking. I think change should be made to the mindset, not the price of gas.

Biff, I prefer people use public transportation. Across America, people have become so dependent on their cars. I think we should be doing more to address changing how people view public transportation and make it more common.

I do drive my car, yes, so judge me!!

People do drive cars...Does that justify the high gas prices that we were subjected to.

I think we should def. find alternatives, I'm not arguing there.
What I'm arguing is the price of gas.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 5:54 PM

"- It shouldn't have to be that way, but that's the only way the majority of people will think about the problem."

Biff, the majority of people will never think about the problem. They deem it as out of their control. They have a 'there's nothing can do about it' attitude. What needs to change is car manufacturing. If the only cars available are hybrids or those sourced by alternative fuel, the masses will have no option but to buy that.

We're getting into sociological issues here.

I'll watch the vid later...I don't have speakers on this computer.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:00 PM

"If the only cars available are hybrids or those sourced by alternative fuel,"

should have said 'powered by alternative fuel"

My brain is a little fried today.
And Biff is also irking me with this topic.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:04 PM

The mindset will only change when the price of gas goes up and stays up. That's reality. Just take your statement, "Does that justify the high gas prices that we were subjected to." That we're subjected to? People in Europe would love to be "subjected to" the relatively bargain basement prices Americans pay for gas. In my opinion, the efforts to find alternative energy sources is inextricably tied to the price of gas.

Dependency on cars was quite intentionally set up primarily via suburbanization, by oil companies, car companies and those in cahoots with them such as city planners like Robert Moses.

I'm not judging people who drive, as long as they're doing their best to minimize their carbon footprint.

Here's another fantastic documentary on the subject, if you can find it...
http://www.endofsuburbia.com/

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 6:05 PM

"What needs to change is car manufacturing."
Yes, that's one thing. And personal energy consumption and a return to urbanization are other, more controllable things that people can do.

"If the only cars available are hybrids or those sourced by alternative fuel, the masses will have no option but to buy that."
Definitely, refer to the two movie links I posted. They're documentaries well worth watching.

"And Biff is also irking me with this topic."
Reality bites.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 6:09 PM

Sorry all but Biff is right. There's no incentive to develop cheaper energy sources and more fuel efficient cars when crude & gasoline prices are this low. And there's no will demonstrated by the masses when they are enjoying cheaper prices.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 2, 2008 6:14 PM

"The mindset will only change when the price of gas goes up and stays up."
-SO WRONG!!!
-The mindset should change when we realize that we are depeleting our resources and polluting our environment, but I realize as a society we are selfish. It'll change when we realize we've used up all the f*cking oil in the world.

I'll say it again.
GAS PRICES SHOULD NOT BE THE FACTOR ON DETERMINING WE LOOK FOR ALTERNATIVES!
(yes, I'm yelling)

"That we're subjected to?" Ef you...I think faster than I type.

"In my opinion, the efforts to find alternative energy sources is inextricably tied to the price of gas."
-So, WRONG!!!
-The efforts to find alternative energy sources will be tied to our humanity as a society and being responsible for our planet.

"Dependency on cars was quite intentionally set up primarily via suburbanization, by oil companies, car companies and those in cahoots with them such as city planners like Robert Moses."
- I agree with you on this point.

You're giving me a reading assignment for tonight....great!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:14 PM

DIBS...not you too....I can't argue with you both. I'm beat.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:16 PM

"The mindset should change when we realize that we are depeleting our resources and polluting our environment, but I realize as a society we are selfish. It'll change when we realize we've used up all the f*cking oil in the world."
- Exactly...I think you just supported my point. Low prices will lead to continued consumption and lack of motivation to change and ultimately to using up all the oil in the world. The mindset SHOULD change, but that's not the reality. The mindset WON'T change until people can't afford what's available today.

"GAS PRICES SHOULD NOT BE THE FACTOR ON DETERMINING WE LOOK FOR ALTERNATIVES!"
- Should not be the factor, but it IS the factor.

""That we're subjected to?" Ef you...I think faster than I type."
- I wasn't criticizing your grammar; my point is that words like this perpetuate the belief that we are ENTITLED to cheap gas.

"The efforts to find alternative energy sources will be tied to our humanity as a society and being responsible for our planet."
- You have more faith in humanity. I think the fact we've failed so miserably in saving the planet and our natural resources is evidence that nothing will change until it's too late or we're absolutely forced to change.

"You're giving me a reading assignment for tonight....great!"
It's not a reading assignment; it's a watching assignment if you can find those two films.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 2, 2008 6:43 PM

I can't respond in length...we're delving into sociological issues and the mind frame of the masses.....let's continue this tomorrow. I want to get out of here.

I don't drive my car during the week, but tonight, I think I'm going to take it for a joy ride around the hood, maybe park underneath the bridge, keep it running, while I laugh and yell, F**k you, environment, F**k you, Biff Champion, this mother f*cking gas is cheap.

No, reading??? ....Darn ;)

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:56 PM

^^of course I won't do that...and lose a parking spot :)

No, I'm be a responsible human and only drive my car on an as needed basis.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 6:57 PM

^^^Also, I'm be a terrible english teacher.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 2, 2008 7:00 PM

BRG, I'm sorry, have to agree with biff and dibs. I do own a car, btw. 30mpg hwy.

In order for alternative sources of energy to be developed, oil prices need to remain reasonably high. Personally, I'd like to see oil at around $90 per barrel, which would allow for the creation of alternative sources, while not killing people at the pump.

We're a free market economy, so people respond to price incentives. Look at the cars they drive in Europe; fun but efficient. These effin' trucks should be banned. I'm very unhappy with oil at its current level, it will kill all reasonable alternatives. Note what is happening to the stocks of drillers and such.

At the same time falling oil prices are stimulating the economy at a time it is needed, nevertheless it's a glorious opportunity for Obama to slap a gas tax of twenty or thirty cents a gallon to keep the deficit in line.

Posted by: denton at December 2, 2008 7:13 PM

"^^^Also, I'm be a terrible english teacher."

Obviously :-)

Posted by: denton at December 2, 2008 7:14 PM

there are lots of people across the country who would take public transportation if it was an option. for them, it's a gov't thing that that they have little control over, so for them, raising gas prices do hit them, and they probably have no recourse against it if they want to go to work. also, there's the fear that if there was public transportation into some suburban areas that "undesirable" people would be given access to their neighborhood and bring it down. unfortunately, that's a real sentiment.

Posted by: wine lover at December 2, 2008 9:03 PM

Yo Biff, I didn't read your entire debate here, but I'll just say that I AGREE 100% that high oil prices are the best thing for America right now. If we are EVER to rid ourselves of our reliance on petroleum - RELIANCE, that is, not our entire consumption - we need high prices to do it. And when you think about it, energy prices should be high, because they represent alot of value. Bring on the electric car. That'll kill Dick Cheney's buzz.....

Posted by: slopenick at December 2, 2008 11:59 PM

I agree that high oil prices will be a catalyst to finding alternative sources. Alternative sources have to be found but it can and should be done without punishing people. Everyone who drives isn't an inconsiderate, non-earth loving boob. Truck drivers are working transporting things we need and providing for their families. Access-a-Ride, charities and other foundations that use vans and mini-buses everyday don't have the option of taking mass transit - their people need to be in a created controlled environment. Suggesting these people and others like them have to suffer needlessy by paying artificially sustained high prices as an incentive is insensitive and dangerous. Who are we to decide who gets to go broke.

Posted by: i_heart_brooklyn at December 3, 2008 1:05 AM

Some people have to drive, but one can make intelligent choices about what one chooses to drive. Escalades, Tahoes, Hummers, Yukons, etc., are disgusting vehicles that should never have been allowed to drop thru the 'light truck' loophole. And now the geniuses that designed these vehicles are sucking up to Congress right now looking for billions of your money.

Posted by: denton at December 3, 2008 6:44 AM

Thank God for low gas prices at this moment. As bad as the economy is, can you imagine what it would be like if gas were $4.50 per gallon? Long term cheap gas is not a good thing, but short term it is a blessing.

Posted by: Suburbandude at December 3, 2008 8:39 AM

It's only cheap because of the economy!!!!

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at December 3, 2008 8:59 AM

Sorry, but the "high gas prices is good" people are missing the fact that the high prices over the summer dramatically increased the price of food, clothing, construction, transportation--just about everything for absolutely everyone. You seem to think that the price of gas only affects people who drive, but it practically bankrupted many business and charities right here in the city. We like to think we aren't affected because we don't drive, but the truth is that city residents are totally dependent on gas.

And, yes dibs is correct--the price of gas is only down because the demand for it has crashed due to the crashing economy.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 3, 2008 9:29 AM

shillstoner, you have no reason to assume we missed that. It's obvious we're all affected by high gas prices in many ways. But that is not the point. The point is there will be no gas left, if not in our lifetime, than certainly in the next generation's lifetime at current consumption levels. The higher prices on everything else you mentioned might just be another catalyst for action. The argument to keep gas prices low so we don't have to pay more for food, clothing, etc. is like arguing we should keep chopping down trees in the rainforest or else lumberjack jobs will be lost. Or we should drill in protected areas of Alaska to provide Americans with jobs and allow us to consume more oil.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 9:44 AM

Biff, read the comments above--yours included--and there is a definite "let them eat cake" holier-than-thou attitude about the poor schmucks who need cars and are affected by high gas prices. My point is that we are all affected, Higher gas prices may be a "catalyst for action" but at what cost and to how many people? Rather than making the average schmuck suffer, why not subsidize the cost of gas (when it is unaffordable) and force the oil companies and car companies to find working alternatives.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 3, 2008 11:42 AM

shillstoner, we're definitely on different wavelengths. Subsidized gas? The "poor schmucks" have been paying very low prices for gas for over half a century and it's now led us to an energy crisis. That's CRISIS! It's our fault for buying the gas guzzlers, moving to suburbia, not pressuring enough the government to find solutions, not reducing our own carbon footprints, etc. etc.

You really think oil companies are going to put themselves out of business by working on finding a feasible replacement for the product they're selling us? Open letter to Exxon Mobil, please find a cleaner, cheaper product for us to buy since we can't seem to incent anyone else to do it...

Please see the movies referenced above if you think the car companies and oil companies have any interest in changing the status quo.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 12:11 PM

Biff, you are blaming the victims. The people who caused the crisis are the oil companies and the car companies, not the consumers. The consumers bought what they were told to by the industries. We'd already have solar power and battery cars if those industries hadn't crushed their development. So, yes, a subsidy to help consumers buy gas until the industries can be forced to find new solutions. With all due whatever, your condescending urban elite crap won't get anyone anywhere.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 3, 2008 1:27 PM

shill, get a grip. People were "victimized" into buying their giant SUVs and minivans and McMansions? Look at the average home size now compared to the 50s, then the 60s and so on. The "victims" are consuming more and more. You can mislabel this urban elitism and ignore the problem if you like. Keep rooting for low gas prices. Let's fully subsidize it and give the gas away? Too extreme? Ok, let's subsidize it partially and fix the price at 25 cents per gallon. What would happen shill? Wanna hazard a guess? Bye bye oil by 2015 or sooner.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 1:39 PM

And last thing, I am absolutely not taking the blame away from oil companies and car companies and suburban developers and urban planners. I agree with you that they are the most guilty parties. That is exactly the point of the movies I posted. But they are not going to change or be pressured to change until the public stops celebrating every time the price of gas drops and starts considering ways to limit their consumption and pressures the government to pass laws and provide incentives to make a change. Oil and car companies have no reason to change in a way that will cost them or cut into revenues (not that the American car companies are making anything, which is their own fault).

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 1:43 PM

You are indeed taking the blame away from those that caused it and placing it on the victims. Why are people consuming more and more, because they all just woke up one morning and said 'gee I want a bigger one!'? No, because the industries spent trillions of dollars to convince people that that is what they needed. And now everyone does need gas to survive, even today's sheep who are convinced that what they need is an all glass condo in Williamsburg. So, again, subsidize the gas and force--yes force--the industries to create solutions.

Posted by: shillstoner at December 3, 2008 2:08 PM

"because the industries spent trillions of dollars to convince people that that is what they needed."

And people are obviously so stupid that they couldn't think for themselves and felt forced to buy the gas guzzlers. Just like they're forced to buy big homes and forced to not recycle and forced to run up credit card debt and have no free will or ability to think on their own.

Obviously you're the condescending one here.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 2:13 PM

Biff, you obviously don't understand society as a whole, or the mindset of the masses. You're looking at it from a completely economical standpoint, try looking at it from a sociological view.

Shill...please keep going, I'm with you on this one. I'd love to really join this conversation, but have no energy to engage a person who is blinded into believing that PEOPLE SHOULD PAY MORE TO FILL UP THEIR CARS, SO AUTOMAKERS AND THE GOV'T FINALLY REALIZE THEY NEED TO FIND ALTERNATIVES.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 2:42 PM

Raise the gas tax. Gas should be expensive. And if you have a gas guzzler pooh pooh on you. I don't really care. Maybe next time you will buy a real car instead of some crap SUV.

Posted by: billyboomer at December 3, 2008 3:28 PM

BRG, yes, because you are a sociologist who roots for low gas prices and drives a gas guzzling Cadillac and has no concrete solutions, we should all be listening to you.

Let's make gas 25 cents a gallon, as I suggested above and keep partying until we run out of gas, have no alternatives and then scratch our heads like monkeys asking what happened?

Let's tell the big oil companies to come up with something different to sell us because they'll listen.

Let's tell the car companies to build electric cars because they've been listening.

Let's tell people not to build bigger houses because they haven't been doing it for decades.

Let's tell people not to buy big cars and switch to the more efficient, smaller ones in Europe, because they've been doing that.

The consolation to all of this is you and shill are so clearly in the minority in this thread in your opinion on this. You too can keep on going...the blind leading the blind...

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 3:33 PM

billyboomer, thank you for another voice of reason! It's nice to see when someone gets it.

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 3:34 PM

"BRG, yes, because you are a sociologist who roots for low gas prices and drives a gas guzzling Cadillac and has no concrete solutions, we should all be listening to you."
- Biff, don't judge ME and my choice of vechile. I drive a 10 year old Caddy. WHY?? Because I don't want to buy a new car and contribute to the over production of automobiles that are filling up landfills. Before this car feel into our laps (we've only had it for one year), we were looking at hybrids.
You're way out of line on this one. I'm not judging you and how you live our lifestyle.
Tell me, how do you heat your home? Are you burning logs in the fireplace? or is your gas fired boiler kicking in.
Back off!!

"Let's make gas 25 cents a gallon, as I suggested above and keep partying until we run out of gas, have no alternatives and then scratch our heads like monkeys asking what happened?"
- 25 cents a gallon is purely absurd. You can't find a better solution. How about realizing that we need to find a solution NOW purely for the sake of neccessity. I agree we shouldn't wait to scratch our asses. That's why, I don't think the price of Gas should have a bearing on jump starting a solution.

"Let's tell the big oil companies to come up with something different to sell us because they'll listen."
- Yes, let's tell them, and tell them repeadetly until they do listen.

"Let's tell the car companies to build electric cars because they've been listening."
- Again, let's tell them.

"Let's tell people not to build bigger houses because they haven't been doing it for decades."
- Okay, you're taking on alot of causes here, Biff.

"Let's tell people not to buy big cars and switch to the more efficient, smaller ones in Europe, because they've been doing that."
- Yes, Biff, I agree, let's tell them. Now you're getting it. We need to change people's views (not by raising prices on Gas), but by letting them know about all the social issues afflicting the planet. Through media, propoganda, marketing, it can be acheived.

"The consolation to all of this is you and shill are so clearly in the minority in this thread in your opinion on this. You too can keep on going...the blind leading the blind..."
- We are the sound of reason for the average person. I'm sure more would like to speak up, but are bullied by your overpowering insistence of letting the working people carry the costs of finding a solution to this problem.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 3:57 PM

"It's nice to see when someone gets it."

Biff, it's you that's not getting it today ;)

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 4:26 PM

Ok, I'm exhausted. And I prefer to end no a nice, happy note, even if at my expense. Nothing like ending happy, or a happy ending. At least I know I'm getting the former today, since it seems I'm not getting the latter...

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 4:31 PM

"end ON a happy note"

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 4:32 PM

Truce...for now.

"Ok, I'm exhausted."
And rightfully so, you've posted more that 5x today.

"At least I know I'm getting the former today, since it seems I'm not getting the latter"

Seems that way, doesn't it?
Could be an illusion!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 4:37 PM

Yes truce! Please! (If you ever wanted to see me beg, this is it)

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 4:44 PM

"(If you ever wanted to see me beg, this is it)"

(Yes, I do! No other way?)

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 5:11 PM

Well, where there's a will, there's always a way...

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 5:25 PM

"Determine that the thing can and shall be done, and then we shall find the way."

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 5:37 PM

"I want you, to show me the way"

Peter Frampton

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 5:51 PM

Show me the way
To the next little girl
Oh, don't ask why
Oh, don't ask why

For if we don't find
The next little girl
I tell you we must die
I tell you we must die
I tell you, I tell you
I tell you we must die

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 6:04 PM

Ok, if you and I are finding the next little girl, this might be a happy ending after all!

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 6:10 PM

Touche, Biff, Touche!

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 6:20 PM

“If you want a happy ending, that depends, of course, on where you stop your story.”

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 6:22 PM

BRG, check out the Condo of the Day thread now. I think we've finally gone too far!

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 6:34 PM

We've gone too far today....TODAY????

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 6:41 PM

Perhaps her relative works for Exxon Valdez or General Motors and is trying to silence us! Please...other 'Stoners...remember this message if we disappear forever!!!

Posted by: Biff Champion at December 3, 2008 6:44 PM

ssshhhh....
Zip
....
....
....
....
....
Silence.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at December 3, 2008 6:57 PM

Biff, I have a question. I noticed in most, if not all of your posts, you blame the consumer for high gas comsuption - bigger vehicles, bigger homes, etc. I get that. But you didn't address people who have to drive. People who live in middle America who don't have access to mass transit or carpools. Charities who MUST transport their people to doctors appointments, family gatherings, whatever. Trucking companies who transport goods we all need - food, medicine, clothes... Surely, you're not blaming these people too??

Posted by: i_heart_brooklyn at December 4, 2008 12:35 AM

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December 2, 2008

Closing Bell: Gassing it Up in Brooklyn

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