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November 10, 2008
New F Trains Leaving the Station
Now that some old asbestos-filled Redbirds are being used as makeshift reefs in the Atlantic ocean, there's room for a new train in town. Control Geek spotted the shiny new cars at the 15th Street/Prospect Park West station this weekend. F train riders will now be treated to the automated announcements and periwinkle blue seats that L train-ers have become accustomed to.
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Comments
booo... i dont like the look of the new trains actually and the automated voices that say when trains are coming in never work do they? i avoid the L at all costs though. also the benches on the new trains that have no little division i find make it more conducive for obnoxious leg spreaders to hog up space. plus the lighting on the new trains is so unflattering for most skin complexions. ick. people look much prettier in the lighting of the old trains, specifically the 70's brady bunch orange ones.
-r
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 11:28 AM
These new trains rock.
Posted by: SnarkSlope at November 10, 2008 11:33 AM
Agree with Pitbull. The lighting is ever so much more flattering on the soft yellow/orange trains. And I too prefer the little groupings on the orange trains, and the slight cup seats are MUCH better for seating more people with less leg spreading.
Posted by: Nokilissa at November 10, 2008 11:47 AM
Yes, but pitbull, instead of having three indentations for 3 butts...when really only two will fit - having a long bench which is 'adjustable seating' makes way more sense.
As for lighting, I don't need to appear attractive on the subway. I need to get where I'm going! In fact, I really don't want anyone looking at me on the subway! I prefer to read and 'pretend I'm invisible'!
Posted by: cobblehiller at November 10, 2008 11:50 AM
I agree, the old orange trains are much better. These newer trains have less seating capacity and tend to crowd up much more. This will make my commute all the more suckier.
Posted by: jwald at November 10, 2008 11:51 AM
These trains, which I used to take all the time when I lived on the UES, allow for a lot more people to stand comfortably. So theoretically this should help with the overcrowding on the F train, which I've heard is pretty horrific.
Altho on the 4-5-6, it just caused people to be crammed together like sardines, but I think that's also because the 4-5-6 is both the busiest subway line in the city (in the entire country, actually) and also substantially thinner than most of the other trains. The modern Q and N trains are gigantic compared to the modern 4-5-6 trains. So if the F is a wider line, it should be beneficial.
All that said, my favorites are still the orange-and-steel ones from the 60s or 70s (I think) -- the ones where some of the seats face front/back instead of side/side ... it creates a more interesting, but less functional, layout.
Posted by: cwbuecheler at November 10, 2008 11:58 AM
Never thought I'd hear the day when people would be complaining that we get brand spanking new clean and more energy efficient subway cars.
Proves that some people really will complain about anything.
Posted by: 11217 at November 10, 2008 11:59 AM
If I had my way all seating would be flip seating and would only able to be used by pregnant women as well as those who physically need to sit. There can never be enough seating during peak hours and rather than have 10% of the people sitting but taking up 30% of the space I would welcome a more equitable distribution of space.
Alternatively perhaps there could be one car per train with seating during peak hours allocated to those who are infirm or pregnant etc and all the rest were standing room only.
Posted by: 99luftballons at November 10, 2008 11:59 AM
One of the most annoying things is those people who are seated and wait until the train has come to a full stop before getting up to get off, people entering the train already streaming in. Eliminating seating will also eliminate those jackasses that push their way on just to get a seat.
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 10, 2008 12:06 PM
I do kinda wish there were no seats at all, so I didn't have to witness at least once a week a Hasidic man throwing pregnant women and 90 year olds to the ground to get a seat.
Posted by: 11217 at November 10, 2008 12:08 PM
i dont take the F but the L is the true horror train according to everyone who takes it during rush hour. i take the R and couldnt ask for a lovlier commute in the morning (8am) and at night (530). i don't think i've ever had to stand up yet in the four months i've been taking it. maybe it has to do with the locations i get on and off tho (union street in PS / prince street in soho). oh to the person who said seats should only be used by pregnant women and the disabled. um hells to the no. i love sitting down and reading on my commute. sometimes i wish i had a longer commute! (well not really).
-r
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 12:11 PM
you people who want to eliminate seating are absurd. i refuse to pay 81 dollars a month to ride on a subway where i cant sit my ass down and relax.
-r
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 12:15 PM
I agree that the lighting and ambiance of the old orange trains is far superior, but the RIDE on the new trains can't be beat.
Apparently it's computer controlled acceleration and deceleration, so the days of being stuck on a train with a 'jerky' driver (stop, start, stop, start, stop) are gone.
Posted by: Fort Greene Place at November 10, 2008 12:25 PM
cw: The 4/5/6 are the old IRT (Interboro Rapid Transit)lines (along with the 1/2/3/7) The gage on that line is narrower so the trains are not as wide.
Posted by: 11233 at November 10, 2008 12:28 PM
FGP - Agreed. The overall experience of the new trains is superior. You can hear what the "announcer" is saying, you don't get a lot of jerky stops and starts, and the sound insulation is dramatically superior. Also the air conditioners actually work.
Altho it does get annoying when the computer (or conductor, unsure who controls it) decides to broadcast like six or seven PSAs in a row for no apparent reason.
"Ladies and Gentlemen, this is an important announcement from the MTA and the New York City Police Department ... backpacks and large bags will be searched if you are black or of middle-eastern descent."
Posted by: cwbuecheler at November 10, 2008 12:30 PM
11233 - Yeh, I knew they were a different model, but didn't know why. Thanks for the info!
Posted by: cwbuecheler at November 10, 2008 12:33 PM
i dont like the robot ladies on the new trains. they are kind of annoying to the ears. much prefer the old trains with the conductor being cranky and yelling at people to not block the doors hahahah. there is one conductor that comes to mind... usually the rush hour 1 train going uptown. he has a major attitude problem but it's funny.
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 12:34 PM
legspreaders suck. i cherish my offpeak commute times which minimizes exposure to such assholes.
Posted by: 11214 at November 10, 2008 12:45 PM
and the excuse that leg spreaders always use is that it's to let their genitals breathe. wtf does that even mean!?
-r
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 12:48 PM
this is how to deal with a legspreader if you ever find yourself next to one: place your leg that's furthest from him [i say him because this is almost always a male] on top of and across your leg that is closest to him so the bottom of your shoe is right next to his leg and if he gets any closer he will have a nice treadmark from the bottom of your shoe. unless they have filthy clothing [ie construction workers] they don't like this one bit. i never move my leg if they ask me to or say excuse me. i will only move my leg if they de-spread. if they re-spread, i respond in kind. works for me every time.
Posted by: 11214 at November 10, 2008 12:58 PM
11217 taking lessons from propjoe i see.
Posted by: goldie at November 10, 2008 1:00 PM
Whenever I sit next to a leg spreader my leg that is touching him develope a nervous twitch where I can't stop it from moving (toe planted on the ground back of the heal bouncing up and down very rapidly). They pull their leg away because my jiggling leg is intolerable to lean against.
Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 10, 2008 1:04 PM
or people with big large numb butts that dont even realize their butt is right in your face. sorry but the last thing i want to smell on the train is what you had for dinner last night.
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 1:04 PM
A discussion on legspreading. Hmmmm. Where could this lead to??
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 10, 2008 1:06 PM
perhaps it could lead to people behaving like civilized humans who share the planet with others as opposed to behaving like selfish schmucks?
Posted by: 11214 at November 10, 2008 1:11 PM
Anyone remember that sketch on SNL "transit workers"? Ellen Cleghorn is being taught by Harvey Keitel how to make announcements for the trains and she's doing it too audibly so he keeps making her do it again and again until you can't understand what she's saying?
http://snlarc.jt.org/detail.php?i=199301165
If anyone has a link to this clip I'd be forever grateful!!
Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 10, 2008 1:17 PM
"11217 taking lessons from propjoe i see."
Nope. Just callin it like I see it.
Posted by: 11217 at November 10, 2008 1:25 PM
Townhouse- That SNL sketch is classic and spot on. Thanks for the tips on how to handle legspreaders (aka. man-sitters). I will put them to use.
Posted by: jwald at November 10, 2008 1:32 PM
ok let's not be sexist here. ive witnessed many female leg spreaders on the train too!
-r
Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 10, 2008 1:36 PM
Actually I think the "gage" -- the distance between the rails -- is the same on the IRT (numbered lines) as the BMT and IND (lettered lines). The cars are wider on the lettered lines though, meaning they hang further over the edges of the rails. Numbered trains could run on lettered lines, but there would be a huge gap between the platform and the car. Lettered trains would not fit on numbered lines because of the platform and tunnel clearances, but were it not for that they could use the same tracks.
For what it's worth, I like the really old F trains with the gray floors and seats and the yellow walls. I suppose their days are numbered though if the R160s are coming.
Posted by: zgori at November 10, 2008 2:37 PM
I love the hang-on bars that these things have on the ceilings. A huge plus for tall people who get stuck in the middle of the train between the two doors at peak hours.
Posted by: ronvalron at November 10, 2008 2:54 PM
zgori: The gage is different. Each line used a separate gage when they were independently owned and operated. Once consolidated, the MTA could not change the gages without making significant changes to the system and creating massive disruptions. Thus, you couldn't use the IRT trains on the non-IRT lines and vice versa.
Posted by: 11233 at November 10, 2008 3:03 PM
zgori is right. IRT and BMD/IND trains have the same gauge. I've seen old 7 cars running on the B/D at W 4th st.
Posted by: 11215 at November 10, 2008 3:25 PM
Townhouse Lady and 11214, thank you for your suggestions! I am still laughing, and wondering if I could actually implement either of these undoubtedly effective tactics. Drives me crazy these people. A close second to the folks who shove onto the train from the platform the moment the doors open, or don't see fit to stand to the side - no thought to those who must get OFF first. Occasionally I have confronted one of these persons with a comment like: "Would it be easier if I simply disappeared?" But of course this risks a "yes" response.
And pitbull, you might be right, there are some women who spread... but you must admit it is easily a 9 to 1 ratio (or better) man to woman transgression
Posted by: Nokilissa at November 10, 2008 6:42 PM
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