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November 24, 2008

House of the Day: 566 1st Street

If the sellers of 566 1st Street, a new listing in Park Slope, can get their asking price of $3,995,000 it would be a huge vote of confidence for the market there. The 21.5-foot-wide limestone house is a real beauty (though it almost looks a little too polished for our taste, but we nitpick...) and weighs in at almost 5,000 square feet (and it's a one-family!). If you're looking for an old house without having to forego any modern comforts, this could be the pad for you. Do you think the price is realistic? It feels a little 2007 to us.
566 1st Street [Brown Harris Stevens] GMAP P*Shark

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Comments

I love the look of this house.

Seems like if a house could get 4 million, this one could.

I just don't know how many people are looking to buy right now...

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 1:18 PM

4 might be a stretch, but should have no problem commanding somewhere between 3.5-3.8

Posted by: bktycoon at November 24, 2008 1:24 PM

What the heck is happening on 1st Street? There are tons of houses for sale (all limestones, I think) on that block.

Posted by: nyc87 at November 24, 2008 1:30 PM

Since we have become a Third World country with the very rich earning obscene salaries and everyone else living hand-to-mouth. Yes, I could see, for example, an ousted auto-industry executive wrting a check for this house out of his petty cash fund. The rich aren't hurting. Even if they never work again, the bonuses from the past four or five years could keep them living like oligarchs for the rest of their lives.
Meanwhile, what is the solution for this economic debacle? Tax the peasants!

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 1:38 PM

Wow, I have to say, this house looks lovely.
so much space.

Seems like the kind of house that someone would have money to afford, especially with the great location.

It should sell for close to asking.

Posted by: bkheightscoop at November 24, 2008 1:39 PM

quote:
What the heck is happening on 1st Street? There are tons of houses for sale (all limestones, I think) on that block.

Maybe cuz i moved in :(

*Rob*

Posted by: PitbullNYC at November 24, 2008 1:40 PM

Limestone...drooling!
the details are great...but I have some space planning issues with this house. I'm nitpicking, but for 4m, the should have done a floor thru master bedroom suite, with a generous bathroom. Would have been nice to have a tub in front of the fireplace in the back.
Laundry on the top floor, where the kiddies are, so you're not lugging clothes down a flight of stairs and throwing them down a dumbwaiter.
Garden Floor - WHY, oh WHY...would anyone give up the bay windows for a laundry room.
Parlor Floor - deck, should have gone to the back of the house and dining room open onto it.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at November 24, 2008 1:42 PM

can't beat a good limestone

Posted by: dittoburg at November 24, 2008 1:46 PM

Looks pretty sweet. I think it'll get close to ask, within 10%. In PS 321, very attractive for someone from the UWS with 3 kids at Dalton. You can finance about $1.2 Million of debt for what it costs to send 3 kids to private school.

Posted by: FatLenny at November 24, 2008 2:09 PM

This home is gorgeous and the location is incredible (I know this isn't in Brooklyn Heights, but I think HOBOKENROCKS might still be interested if the price is reduced to $800K).

BRG, what do you have against dumbwaiters? And please don't tell me it's the fact they always get your order wrong...

Posted by: Biff Champion at November 24, 2008 2:10 PM

At least you get what you're paying for here. A house and a price for someone who's really rich (and likely made millions off the subprime mortgage bubble one way or another).

Posted by: mopar at November 24, 2008 2:11 PM

I never forget a house:

http://www.delsonsherman.com/delson_sherman_apc/projects/parkslope_ls.php

We considered Delson / Sherman for a reno as well.

I think this is a fairly recent reno which makes me wonder - job loss?

Posted by: Mr Joist at November 24, 2008 2:13 PM

At least you get what you're paying for here. A house and a price for someone who's really rich -- no stretching to pay a high mortgage by squeezing four families into a one-family space.

Posted by: mopar at November 24, 2008 2:17 PM

Mr Joist, good stuff! I think the pictures in your link are even nicer - wow, I'm lovin' it. I wonder what the story is behind this sale (although it doesn't take anything away from the fact this place is a gem).

Posted by: Biff Champion at November 24, 2008 2:20 PM

gorgeous. Seems about right.

nitpicking, but an internal bedroom is NOT a bedroom.

Posted by: new2hood at November 24, 2008 2:22 PM

PS321 is alas getting very overcrowded so I find it hard to imagine that someone who buys this kind of house would easily yank them out of Dalton or some other such school. My guess is that the really wealthy people that commenters think are buyers for this house are the smart money who are waiting for prices to come down before overspending - after all, they are the ones paying the closest attention to the plummeting values all around us and are most aware of how quickly "value" can change.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 2:24 PM

'nitpicking, but an internal bedroom is NOT a bedroom.'

If those skylights are operable and they cover the ratios required for glass and air requirements for a habitable room, it is permissible.
Operable skylights act as windows.

Posted by: bayridgegirl at November 24, 2008 2:30 PM

Sorry Brownstoner, but if this house sells for the asking price it will indicate that one person has enough money not to worry about little things like market value. It will NOT be a vote of confidence in the market.
Now, if this house goes into a big bidding war, with multiple bidders, then you can spin that as a vote of confidence--still only by 3 or 4 people, but whatever.

Posted by: shillstoner at November 24, 2008 2:31 PM

MM, even people with lots of cash on hand are looking for ways to spend less of it.

Posted by: FatLenny at November 24, 2008 2:33 PM

This is a great house. Wonderful combination of original charm and details with modern a updating. There are, however, some major obstacles to achieving anywhere near the asking price.

A Corcoran listed limestone on 4th Street, park block, is priced at $2.6M. It is essentially the same house without the renovation. Even if someone put in $1M of renovations (and I don’t think the 4th Street house requires that amount of updating), it’s still going to be $300 to $400K less than this HOTD.

It has a very personal and idiosyncratic floor plan. I am not sure what to make of the English basement. The laundry room is huge and takes up the bay windows in the front. A real waste of light and space. Next, you’re faced with a warren of closets, a small bedroom and strange small media room in the extension. I am not sure what the architect was thinking, but the ground floor level is very odd and it’s way too expensive to undo given a $4M asking price.

The master bedroom is in the smaller of the two rooms on the second floor. An office and library take up the front room with the bay windows. Very beautiful and ordinarily not a big deal, but the library has enormous built-in shelves which limits flexibility in making this the master. Finally, the upstairs bedrooms are also oddly configured with what is normally a larger bedroom and a smaller bedroom or office in most townhouse floor plans with a smaller room that can only be accessed through the larger room. The current owner uses the smaller rooms as the actual bedroom with the larger rooms as a study and/or seating area.

This reminds me of the renovation on 14th Street in the South Slope originally on the market for over a year at $3.2 and now reduced to $2.8. Nice renovations, but the layout choices are so personal that you need someone with the exact same idiosyncratic taste. I don’t believe the value carries over.

At this price, I would also want a larger yard.

Posted by: sachi at November 24, 2008 2:40 PM

Actually went to the open house yesterday. The attention to detail is astonishing - everything is beautifully done and the floorplan works well for a one family with kids (there is a dumb waiter in case you were wondering how to get the dirty laundry to the garden level). I doubt a lower priced property could be easily (or cheaply) brought to this level of perfection. I envy the prospective buyer.

Posted by: Nilso at November 24, 2008 2:57 PM

sachi - 1) when you have three additional bay windows that get beautiful light, why would you care about the street level bay windows. 2) Not everyone is obsessed with having a huge room in which to sleep in - this floor is obviously laid out as a private master suite with a nice study that is basically for the heads of house, not public use. I personally would much prefer this lay out than one giant bedroom - permits you to work while spouse is sleeping. 3) The point of the small bedrooms off study is that one child sleeps in each little room and has the study as their own play area/place to do homework. 4) The media room is perfectly located right on the garden with big doors out to it. 5) Bay Ridge Girl - the laundry is on ground floor because there is a maid's room there who presumable will be doing the laundry! This is a WONDERFUL lay out, and far more original, classy and functional than most.

price seems steep however.

Posted by: gkw at November 24, 2008 3:01 PM

full disclosure - I went to school with one of the architects and think her work is absolutely wonderful. I dream of having her come up with some clever ideas for my house.

Posted by: gkw at November 24, 2008 3:03 PM

Wah Wah Wah laundry is out of the way.... HIRE someone to do it then, geez you just bought a 4 million dollar house. DUH.

Posted by: billyboomer at November 24, 2008 3:10 PM

I agree with you gkw...I think the layout is one of the things I like MOST about this house.

Some people on this site have such rigid ideas of the perfect layout that they don't seem to be open minded to something a little different.

If I had a need (large family) for a big house like this, the layout would be exactly what I'd look for with a bit of privacy for each member of the household.

Seems much more civilized and classy than some of the more "open" layouts I see.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 3:10 PM

I agree with gkw, on the layout. I think this may be the nicest house around, period. Pictures are beautiful and if it's as nice as the write up makes it sound, this one is pretty special. The price is a tough one, but this might be worth it.

Posted by: rodeo at November 24, 2008 3:12 PM

Re the bedrooms, I assume this is a luxe version of typical brownstone bedrooms. They were suites with a fireplace and a sleeping alcove under an arch. The bed goes in the alcove under the arch. These bedrooms may in fact be original.

Posted by: mopar at November 24, 2008 3:23 PM

BIFF, For that house I will give 1 million in cash. But they have to move it to BH for me.. LOL.

Posted by: HOBOKENROCKS at November 24, 2008 3:23 PM

HOBO, I don't know. Even as a resident of BH, I think I might prefer it exactly where it is. It's more in context with the block and scrumptiously close to the park.

Posted by: Biff Champion at November 24, 2008 3:29 PM

This is my fantasy house. The details are impeccable. LOVE the layout. If there is a house worth $4M this is it.

Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 24, 2008 3:34 PM

If it stays in the SLope than I will only pay 800k... Isn't the slope a longer ride to Manhattan than BH.. I need quick acess to Manhattan.

Posted by: HOBOKENROCKS at November 24, 2008 3:40 PM

HOBOKEN..you should reconsider Park Slope over Heights. The people are alot nicer in the Slope. If you want to be surrounded by spiteful, snobbish people, then the heights is for you.
:)

Posted by: bayridgegirl at November 24, 2008 3:48 PM

I think Mr. Joist at 2:13 may have hit the nail on the head. A little ACRIS and Google cocktail leads to a big Lehman Brothers headache.

Posted by: johnife at November 24, 2008 3:54 PM

FatLenny - yes, people with lots of cash are looking to save it - by not paying today's (still) crazy prices. There are buyers out there, and pent up demand, but prices need to come down, even for beautiful homes like this one. They are starting to - another HOTD on 3rd St just chopped 500K off ask yesterday (from 2.995, it's now 2.495) so this will gradually ripple through entire market...

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 4:10 PM

I have never been to the Slope though I hear it is a very nice place. My biggest concern is how long it takes to get to my family in Manhattan... Though, I will make it my business to check Park SLope out.

Posted by: HOBOKENROCKS at November 24, 2008 4:13 PM

I'm kinda shocked at how people are salivating over this house. There are beautiful details and impeccable finishes in this HOTD but it is hardly original. Seems like there are a lot of people who have previously turned up their noses at gut renos that don't maintain "brownstoner" standards.

Stone tiles in the parlor hallway, sleek modern kitchens, contemporary bathrooms and their ilk seem contrary to the professed aesthetic of this crowd. Granted the mahogany wainscoting throughout the house and the library are an acknowledgment to the original style but other than that and what appears to be original staircase and mantles, this place has been stripped.

Personally, I like sleek finishes and would love to find a brownstone in need of a gut renovation so I don't feel guilty about stripping it of its period detail. The architects did a very nice job of putting in great finishes but not having it become cold and uninviting by using nice warm woods and the beautiful wainscoting.

I do agree with BRG and others that the space planning is a little off. For $4 MM, I expect a powder room on the parlor floor. Especially with the amount of floorspace that this place offers. Also I've had a dumbwaiter. Previous homeowner had it put it with their last renovation. It was a real pain in the butt and my wife and I much prefer doing the stairs instead. Eventually we ripped it out to get more space in the bathrooms.

Posted by: Ozymandius at November 24, 2008 4:16 PM

Looking at this closer, I don't think it is worth 4 million.
The location is great, but the house is just not that super-posh. For one thing it only has three bathrooms, no powder room on the parlor floor and guests would need to use the bedroom bath upstairs or downstairs. The bedrooms are peculiar and oddly placed. And why have that ridiculous street-view laundry? Is this for a rich person who finds it thrapeutic to do their own laundry? Odd.
For four million, I think the pampered rich would expect more. This is a 3 million dollar house.

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 4:27 PM

The room in the photo above is gorgeous. The rest was a bit of a disappointment to me. I've gotta say, it's kind of sterile looking. What's with that hallway? It looks like a doctor's office. Give me a good fixer upper any day so I can pimp it up!

Posted by: rh at November 24, 2008 4:39 PM

Sam, at the risk of sounding like the broker (who I actually know from a prior transaction), take a look in person and judge.

Posted by: Nilso at November 24, 2008 4:41 PM

I went to the open house as well. Again, it's a beautiful house and a great location, but there are certain aspects of the house that may not appeal to most people. At this price point, the ground floor/English basement is a turn-off. If you're paying for the renovation, this is a waste of space.

I also think it is hard to justify that this house is $1.4M nicer than 4th Street. Given market and comps, I'd say this will go in the mid $3s

Posted by: sachi at November 24, 2008 4:54 PM

For four million the master suite should have his 'n hers bathrooms. There should be a nice powder room at the foot of the Garden level stairs. The front room should not be a laundry, the front parlor should be expanded to take up the full width, its current dimensions are un-palatial, and there should be a knock-your-socks off roofdeck or rear deck/lap pool tour de force. It needs something out of the ordinary (besides a formal laundry).

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 5:09 PM

"un palatial" ???

We are talking about a 4 million dollar house here, not the Emirates Palace in Abu Dhabi.

People pay this much (yes even in today's economy) for 3 bedroom apartments in Manhattan.

If this were a year ago, this place would have sold for 5 million, easy. No, it's not a year ago, so that comment has little validity, but it's still a total gem.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 5:19 PM

11217 - please, show a comp for "5 million easy" a year ago. I think that assertion is absurd. Your bullishness, against all evidence to the contrary that prices are going down, is astounding.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 5:33 PM

The center parlor with the staircase certainly is beautiful, as is the library. I want a dedicated room for books. Was very underwhelmed by the kitchen, however.

Don't know if it's worth that much money, but it only takes one person to think it's the perfect layout, finishes and house for them.

I'm with rh, would love the opportunity to get this one before the reno, and have that much money to play with.

Posted by: Montrose Morris at November 24, 2008 5:35 PM

Detective johnife @ 3:54 PM:

Bummer if that is the case. Yes, yes ... bloodthirsty investment banker and all that but it would suck to work so hard on a reno like this (especially with class act architects like D/S) and then have to sell it because you lost your job. Don't wish that on anyone. That said, I'll be surprised if it goes for more than $3.4MM.

Posted by: Mr Joist at November 24, 2008 5:36 PM

Well Ms. Muffet...I do think this house is more than half as nice as the "Connelly Mansion" which sold for 8.5 million last year.

I don't see how my statement asserts that prices are going anywhere but down. That doesn't mean I don't think this is one of the finer houses in Park Slope.

A house on my block sold last year for 3.5 million-ish I believe it was.

I certainly think this house is MUCH nicer and larger.

But it's not last year. Which was my whole point.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 5:52 PM

I hate that hallway. Something about this house screams sterile. Kitchen - for the money, eh. And I would expect some knock-your-socks off exterior space for this price. I'm sure they sunk a ton of money into it, but it's just not my taste. I'm sure it's someone else's though.

Love the woodwork, though.

Posted by: Architerrorist at November 24, 2008 5:53 PM

But wasn't the Connelly house way bigger/grander? I just don't think that house can be used as a meaningful comp at all. There are lots of limestones near the park, and they are what I'd use as comps. Seems the last few years, they've been selling in the 3 million range, but to bump this up to 4 mil at this time seems a huge stretch.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 5:55 PM

Here's a comp. although if I recall the house needed a total renovation...

5. PARK SLOPE $3,600,000
536 1st Street GMAP
Originally listed at $3.2 million; 4,720-sf 1-fam. Deed recorded 2/19.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 6:06 PM

How much do you think they spent on the reno?

Posted by: cgguy at November 24, 2008 6:10 PM

I honestly have no clue how much a renovation like this would cost.

I do think one like in the HOTD given that it's a 5000 sf house would have cost more than 400K though.

I'd say closer to double that if I were to guess.

There was a time on this blog, where a lot of people said you couldn't renovate a house like this for under a million dollars. I always thought it was an absurd figure, but who knows.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 6:19 PM

I must point out that the downstairs hallway looks a bit like a passageway in a law firm.

The furniture is duller than dust, possibly bought to show the house or maybe the owners taste and the interior decorators could not come up with anything better?

The yard is unfinished...simply built out but the softscaping is lacking...depressing.

The sales agent's photos is right out of a Barnard or Brandeis 1965 yearbook.

I doubt they will sell this house at the asking price at this time. It might look a bit better with more decorating. It looks almost like a spec house with a lot of high quality woodwork.

BTW, the ground floor with the large laundry room: it is the housekeeper's dayroom as well. Note the floor is heavily set up as her realm. Or, if the bedroom is used as an au pair's room, a non-live-in maid would have a large enough laundry room that could function as her little day-realm from which to stage things (and watch TV of course)...

Posted by: BrooklynGreene at November 24, 2008 6:55 PM

Probably more than double -- so, $800,000, maybe even a million. And not to everyone's taste. And selling at perhaps the worst time since, say, 1995-1996. I'd say this time around, it will be even worse than 1995-1996, because it's not as if the bid-side has just dried up, I think people are looking for significant cuts. All of a sudden, we're in a different world, it looks like. I don't know what these folks' situation is, but if they get an offer in the high 2s, they should take it and run. Brownie is right, $4 million has a 2007ish feel.

Posted by: cgguy at November 24, 2008 6:59 PM

Interesting what people consider conveniences and priorities. I would never ever lose the coat closet under the stairs to gain a powder room. Let guests use the stairs, whatever, it won't kill them. We don't have a coat closet on the parlor floor and it drives me absolutely crazy. I hate not having that. Coats and clutter constantly sitting out in plain view. Hard to do a really gorgeous, formal room with that. A coat closet on the parlor floor would be worth the same money to me as a powder room, seriously.

Posted by: traditionalmod at November 24, 2008 7:12 PM

I would want both a powder room and a closet!!! If you're doing a renovation of that scale, you should be able to fit in both. It's all in the space planning....

Posted by: Ozymandius at November 24, 2008 7:24 PM

But if you look at the floorplan, it's hard to see where you could fit a powder room on the main floor, except in the miniscule coat closet area. There's a reason that few of these center stair townhouses have parlor floor powder rooms. It would have to be carved out of the kitchen, which is already fairly small.

Personally, this place makes me drool. But I doubt these folks will recoup their investment, which is a shame any way you look at it.

Posted by: Park Sloper at November 24, 2008 7:31 PM

This is an extremely interesting property because it was obviously designed for one particular family's needs and then, when the renovation was done, the family had to sell. I do not think they will get their investment back in this market. Most people don't buy into other people's eccentricities. This is a layout with two bedrooms with no windows but a laundry room with a large bay window. It makes little sense except to the family who obviously had it custom made.
Who knows? There may be a sacked Lehman Bros CEO out there with a hundred million in past bonuses saved up who will want to add this to his collection of homes. I don't know, perhaps the kitchen and that dangerously cantelevered table will appeal more to him than it does to me. A lovely house, weirdly re-done, not to everyone's tastes, they just need one buyer, well, two to get the full asking price.

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 7:52 PM

Put the closet directly under the stairs and accessed from the hallway. Put the powder room where the closet currently is and have it take up the space used by the dumbwaiter.

Don't need a dumbwaiter if you put a laundry upstairs. Don't really need it even with the laundry in the basement.

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Posted by: Ozymandius at November 24, 2008 7:59 PM

Just took another look at the photo of the staircase. Closet isn't going to fit under it.

Posted by: Ozymandius at November 24, 2008 8:02 PM

I don't see why everyone is making such a big deal out of the laundry room being in the front of the house. It's partially below grade and there are plenty more rooms from which to enjoy the view. I'd love a bright and sunny laundry room (Even though chances are if I could afford this house I woudn't be doing my own wash).

Posted by: TownhouseLady at November 24, 2008 8:04 PM

townhouse lady, you just don't put something as utilitarian as a laundry room in one of the most important front rooms of a rowhouse.

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 8:19 PM

most important front rooms? looks like the basement to me.

where is that light from -- the one in the center hall? anyone know?

Posted by: Ringo at November 24, 2008 8:38 PM

"townhouse lady, you just don't put something as utilitarian as a laundry room in one of the most important front rooms of a rowhouse."

Says who???? Who died and told you there is only one way to live in a house...? I don't get it.

And the way you people talk about the exhaustion of going downstairs for laundry, what the hell exactly are you doing to your clothes??! Sh*tting in them? I do maybe 2 loads of laundry every two weeks (sure a ton more if you have an infant) but in that case you are what, probably 35 and are more than capable of walking up and down a couple flights of stairs. My mom did it, her mom did it. Even rich people know how to walk up stairs, believe it or not.

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 8:43 PM

11217: it's time for your meds now. really. you need to take them for your own good.

asshole

Posted by: sam at November 24, 2008 8:50 PM

I NEED NEED NEED to know how they got their woodwork to look that good.

Posted by: dt at November 24, 2008 8:54 PM

Don't get me started, don't EVEN get me started...!!

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 8:56 PM

cgguy - this is NOT such a bad time to sell. Here's what's good: there is demand out there, and prices are still very high, so even with deep discounts, many sellers can still do very well. A truly bad time to sell will be a year from now, or possibly even further out. If I were a seller, I'd get out while the getting is still (relatively) good.

Traditionalmod - I've seen 16 footers with *both* coat closet and powder room on parlor. It can certainly be done with good planning. I'm all about maximizing relatively small spaces.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 9:26 PM

Also, can someone please explain why some rooms are called "study" instead of "bedroom"? I always thought study in NYC was a euphemism for a room with no windows, but these studies all have windows. If this was discussed before, my apologies - don't have time to scrutinize the whole thread...

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 9:50 PM

I'm just curious...so what do we think the folks who can afford a place like this (we all admit there are quite a few of them in NYC) will be doing with the cash they're still bringing in every month....20k, 30k, 40K, 50k a month...are they going to be stockpiling it now?

Do we not think some people will still want to invest in high quality properties in what some people view as the capital of the world?

I'm serious. Is everyone just saving a ton right now? I know I'm trying to...

Posted by: 11217 at November 24, 2008 9:53 PM

11217 - I've known some smart investors in my life, and yes, they do stockpile cash at times like these since "cash is king". Or, perhaps they start investing where prices *have* come down - i.e. the stock market (see: Warren Buffett). What they don't do is sink millions into overvalued assets when it's clear that values must come down. Of course, there are still buyers that want to invest in properties in NYC, but only at the right price - that's why I think this is not such a bad time to sell: even at a big discount, a lot of sellers can still make a lot of money.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 10:08 PM

And where are people getting the theory that this place was bought by a rich buyer who has to sell quickly? According to Property shark, it last changed hands in Feb 2001 so I'm sure they paid a small fraction of their current ask. Even if they poured a lot into the renovation, and this went for a 25% discount (if not more!), they would still profit handsomely.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 24, 2008 10:29 PM

"so even with deep discounts, many sellers can still do very well."

....yawn :-()

"Even if they poured a lot into the renovation, and this went for a 25% discount (if not more!), they would still profit handsomely."

....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Posted by: Aussie at November 24, 2008 11:08 PM

"I'm kinda shocked at how people are salivating over this house. There are beautiful details and impeccable finishes in this HOTD but it is hardly original. Seems like there are a lot of people who have previously turned up their noses at gut renos that don't maintain "brownstoner" standards."

Ozymandius, people love original details with modern kitchens and baths. And in this case, with the exception of that unfortunate doctor's waiting room back hall, the spatial integrity and placement of details of the original house and period have been respected. For instance, in the kitchen, the cabinets are placed as they would have been at the time. They don't meander everywhere with little step-ups and step-downs and flourishes for the stove, microwave, and refrigerator. The details are clearer on the architect's web site. I wouldn't be surprised if the reason there is no powder room on the parlor floor and no master his and her baths (yuck!) is because the owners kept the original layout.

Also, love the curtains in the bedroom, must copy that look.

Posted by: mopar at November 25, 2008 12:05 AM

I don't get why on the fourth floor in the back, a bedroom is pushed into the interior accessed through a study when, IMHO the space would've been better optimized by swapping the two spaces making the interior room a sitting room. In the front, I would've swapped the bedroom and study. The smaller room would be a hugh walk-in closet and the closet space would be a nice reading nook.

Posted by: i_heart_brooklyn at November 25, 2008 1:42 AM

Aussie - makes sense that you're falling asleep. You need to be dreaming if you think prices aren't coming way down!

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 25, 2008 9:55 AM

Miss Muffet, looking at the layout of this house (not layouts of other houses) the only place to put a powder room on the parlor floor is the closet area under the stairs. As somebody else pointed out as well. So that's why I said I'd rather have the coat closet. Because I yearn for a coat closet myself. I also don't believe every house that exists is capable of having a powder room crushed into the parlor floor. I have a friend with a stunning West Village townhouse and she doesn't have a powder room on the parlor floor. It simply didn't fit in a harmonious and appropriate way in the layout. Because like me, she doesn't like bathrooms opening directly onto the living room.

Posted by: traditionalmod at November 25, 2008 11:27 AM

OMG, bathrooms opening directly onto LR. The horror! Could not agree more.

Miss Muffet -- prices in these "prime" areas may not fall as much as you think. You'd be amazed how many rich folk there are who are able to pay cash, and meanwhile, far fewer folk will be selling -- only those who must.

That's assuming that life is business as usual. Now that Citibank has failed, it appears likely the entire banking system will go under. The city is cutting train service to "marginal" neighborhoods. Basically, every worst nightmare is coming true.

If the government can't continue to borrow, and we have total collapse, then I suppose prices on brownstones in "prime" areas will fall substantially. Only then I'm not sure if you'd still want to live there!

Posted by: mopar at November 25, 2008 12:12 PM

Mopar - whatever. Prices ARE starting to come down. Prime properties in PS are starting to get price cuts of several 100Ks- because the prices were too damn high. Sellers have been overreaching, period. I don't see things becoming dirt cheap, but I do predict a return to rationality i.e. in the 500s psf, not a ridiculous number when prime PS homes were trading in the 300s as recently as 2001. You and others can keep saying "no, prices won't come down very much in prime areas" but they will come down substantially. I actually think we don't disagree - we're just coming at it from different angles. That is, I agree that prime areas will still be expensive relative to fringe areas, and you agree that prices will come down. It's just where we meet in the middle that is open to debate. Only time will tell.

Posted by: Miss Muffett at November 25, 2008 12:43 PM

Oh hi, Miss Muffet! Yes, we agree prices are going down! But something is worth whatever people will pay for it. There's no inherent price. And often the going rate is 10 to 15 percent more than a true comp in an up market, and 10 to 15 percent less than a true comp in a down one. Prices rarely drop 50 percent overnight. Cheers and have a good night!

Posted by: mopar at November 25, 2008 8:14 PM

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