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October 6, 2008

Quote of the Day

quotation-icon.jpgI had two really hard core Manhattanites out to Park Slope for brunch yesterday. ALL they talked about was how they wanted to move out here...they commented that the men are hotter, the stores were cuter, the people were nicer and that it was greener and prettier. Even though the economy is in the toilet, it doesn't change the fact that there are some really spectacular things about Brooklyn, and some people as they tire of Manhattan will consider it more and more, I believe.

— by 11217 in Sales: Turner Towers Spread Gets Full Asking Price




Posted by Brownstoner at 3:31 PM | Comments (33)
Categories: QOTD

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Comments

I couldn't agree more. I was myself a hard core Manhattanite for many years until I discovered Brooklyn. My reaction was the same. People are nicer, it is greener, it is prettier. It just feels civilized compared to Manhattan. I moved about a year ago in charming Cobble Hill and I love it. Now, each time my friends come over to visit from Manhattan, they have the same reaction. Since I moved, 3 of my friends have already followed. We are all very well paid professionals so it's not even a money issue but a real choice based on quality of life.

Posted by: brownie77 at October 6, 2008 3:37 PM

I much rather prefer Brooklyn as well. I have had friends over from Manhattan and they always say that they can't believe that Ditmas Park is in Brooklyn. Although so far only one of them has purchased a house out here. We usually get people leaving Park Slope or from places other than New York.

Posted by: Chaka at October 6, 2008 3:45 PM

and in other news, people go to bed earlier when they get older.

Posted by: Prodigal_Son at October 6, 2008 3:46 PM

I liked Brooklyn when I attended Pratt (briefly) in 1995, and though it took thirteen years, I'm glad to be back, and definitely prefer it to living on the UES (let alone the time I spent in Southern California).

"the men are hotter"

Why thank you. Thank you very much.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at October 6, 2008 3:54 PM

The men are not hotter in Brooklyn. Nice, but not hotter.
Sorry guys!

Posted by: ks8000 at October 6, 2008 3:59 PM

I wasn't in brooklyn this weekend so I don't know which men they are talking about!! ;)

ks8000 it depends on what flavor you like!!!!

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at October 6, 2008 4:01 PM

i'll agree with greener and prettier. really depends on where they live in manhattan for the other comments. store quality is debatable depending on where you are in manhattan, but overall as for people's looks, i see better quality overall in manhattan....of course im comparing to park slope where i live. p.s. just feels older and tired looking. (yes, of course im the exception. *ducks*)

Posted by: goldie at October 6, 2008 4:27 PM

I can tell you that I most definitely agree that the men are hotter in Brooklyn. I was SHOCKED how many gorgeous men we saw yesterday on 5th and 7th Avenues...

At least 3 you could "write home about..."

Everyone has their preference for hot so it's highly personal, but these guys were incredibly sexy. I can picture one of them perfectly still...

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 4:36 PM

"I can picture one of them perfectly still..."

11217, I would think you would have preferred to picture one of them in motion. :-)

Posted by: Biff Champion at October 6, 2008 4:42 PM

Very good one Biff...

And you would be correct.

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 5:05 PM

Funny, Biff. Now that should be the quote of the day.

Posted by: Susan Elkins at October 6, 2008 5:10 PM

I moved to Brooklyn because even the best neighborhoods were pretty darn cheap. And since I work in Manhattan, I can shop and eat out there whenever I wish. Now that Brooklyn is so expensive, I'm not sure I would have made the same choice. It has its moments but once you are even slightly off the beaten track it is pretty hideous, even scary.
Prices will be coming down but it is possible that many will be opting to leave NYC entirely. It happens. It's a cycle. I would recommend buying when its cheap. It seems pretty darn obvious that trying to save money in the US is completely ridiculous.

Posted by: Inigo at October 6, 2008 5:18 PM

11217 and Susan, I'm hoping you can both make it to our End of The World Party on October 16th at Union Hall. A bunch of us Brownstoner regulars (and some irregulars) will be gathering around 6:30 for drinks. We can debate whether or not 11217's quote is accurate, or if it's more like the men are greener, the economy is hotter, the stores are nicer and the people are in the toilet.

Posted by: Biff Champion at October 6, 2008 5:40 PM

"Prices will be coming down but it is possible that many will be opting to leave NYC entirely"


Where will they go? And why would they do that? Many bought high...you think they now are going to sell low?
Will the lefty liberals of NYC move to the booming economies in Houston or Dallas? I'm not saying people aren't going to leave, but I dare say that NYC is going to be creating more jobs (or at least hopefully losing less) than many other places in the U.S. during this extremely severe economic crisis.

People don't leave just to leave. They must work, and who in the world wants to leave now and go into a situation where you are the newest person on the block in a new city.

I think I'll stay right here for the time being.

I don't understand some of you people. You loved New York, brownstones and Brooklyn up until a month ago. Now that the economy stinks, you don't like it anymore?

You probably weren't meant for NYC in the first place then.


Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 5:44 PM

Sorry that sounded like a rant, but I did't mean it as such. I'm just frustrated that in a matter of a month, many people here seem so lukewarm on a place they loved not 30 days ago. And many of these same people probably would have no idea we are even in an economic crisis, if the news didn't tell us so every minute...

It's that darn hot guy from yesterday...he's getting me all riled up again...

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 5:46 PM

And the info below would actually say that your statement "It's a cycle" is not completely accurate on the influx of people to NYC. There seems to be a couple of off years, but in general this does not look cyclical to me...

1698 4,937 —
1712 5,840 18.3%
1723 7,248 24.1%
1737 10,664 47.1%
1746 11,717 9.9%
1756 13,046 11.3%
1771 21,863 67.6%
1790 33,131 51.5%
1800 60,515 82.7%
1810 96,373 59.3%
1820 123,706 28.4%
1830 202,589 63.8%
1840 312,710 54.4%
1850 696,490 122.7%
1860 813,669 16.8%
1870 942,292 15.8%
1880 1,206,299 28.0%
1890 1,515,301 25.6%
1900 3,437,202 126.8%
1910 4,766,883 38.7%
1920 5,620,048 17.9%
1930 6,930,446 23.3%
1940 7,454,995 7.6%
1950 7,891,957 5.9%
1960 7,781,984 −1.4%
1970 7,894,862 1.5%
1980 7,071,639 −10.4%
1990 7,322,564 3.5%
2000 8,008,288 9.4%
2007* 8,295,029 3.6%

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 5:49 PM

I'm actually kind of excited by the economic crisis ... it might move real estate in neighborhoods I actually want to live in, into the realm of possibility for my fiancee and I.

Course, if I lose my job and end up riding the rails and getting into knife fights over cans of beans, that would kind of suck.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at October 6, 2008 5:50 PM

1920 5,620,048 17.9%
1930 6,930,446 23.3%
1940 7,454,995 7.6%


Looks like even in the Great D. people were still moving to NYC. Interesting...

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 5:57 PM

Hey Biff, yes fun. Will you be flying the Brownstoner flag?

Posted by: Susan Elkins at October 6, 2008 5:59 PM

11217 - I don't understand some of you people. You loved New York, brownstones and Brooklyn up until a month ago. Now that the economy stinks, you don't like it anymore? You probably weren't meant for NYC in the first place then.

You make some good points but wow, patronizing much? Can you let some other people in to the discussion without turning this board into a personal chat session and firing off barbs at anyone who dares to disagree?

Posted by: HellsBelles at October 6, 2008 6:29 PM

You're right, 11217. Lived here since the day I was born on 1954 and ain't going nowhere for no one.

Posted by: denton at October 6, 2008 6:38 PM

Last I checked, Hellesbelles, anyone can comment on these threads. I'm simply stating my beliefs. If you don't agree, feel free to say so. I am but one voice on this blog of many. I fail to see how I'm unwelcoming of anyone who disagrees, however simply because I have a strong viewpoint. I welcome it, in fact...but there are times when people are right and there are times when they are wrong.

To suggest that the population of NYC is cyclical is false. I showed you information to prove that fact. It also shows that even during the Great Depression, people did not leave the city in greater numbers than they arrived.

Can we stop tiptoeing around everything in this world and actually call things as we see them?

People in NYC are so insulated sometimes, it almost sounds like some people never leave. To suggest that people are wanting to leave for greener pastures, don't leave the city much. The rest of this country...in many areas anyway are hurting BADLY. Even in LA, people have seen their home values plummet 30% or more across the board. I have friends in Arizona who's home is worth about a third of what they paid for it 2 years ago. Things out in much of the rest of the country is dismal, so I was simply stating that if you have the temptation to leave (which is totally valid) you might want to go out there and see what the rest are having to deal with...$4 gas, etc etc etc...it's not pretty. And jobs are SCARCE!

Posted by: 11217 at October 6, 2008 7:18 PM

OK, OK 11217...you have made your point. Brooklyn is unsinkable, it is the best, the Dodgers are bums.... blah blah blah. But the reality is that people will pursue what is in their own best interests. If you were born in 1954 and have lived here all your life then of course you would not leave even if a meteorite hit the Navy Yard and flooded half of Brooklyn. But if you are still young and ambitious and opportunity beckons in Dallas, or Abu Dabi, you go like lightning. There has been an unrealistic spike in prices in Brooklyn over the past four to five years, Now we will see a correction. this is a good thing. although some that have bought recently will suffer. It's about money and business not about "love" or "loyalty". Brooklyn got too expensive. Now it will probaboly be too cheap. That's the way markets work. I have seen it happen before and I am seeing it happen again.

Posted by: Inigo at October 6, 2008 7:43 PM

Oh boy! What a day!

Big changes are in the air.

11217: I have never encountered anyone on this blog in more denial than you. Did you just buy? Are you in your twenties or maybe early thirties?
Take a chill pill kid.
Buckle your seat belts, and in another three or four years you will know a lot more about what you are talking about.
Meanwwhile.... wheeeeeeeeee!


Posted by: sam at October 6, 2008 8:46 PM

I don't think 11217 is denying that NYC will undergo some big changes. He's disagreeing that people are going to flee it like rats from a sinking ship, mainly because the rest of the country is, for the most part, in an even worse state. It'd be like rats fleeing a sinking ship in order to board a sinking ship that's also on fire.

Kind of like the great depression, as he points out ... yes, some people left New York then, too, but more people came in than left.

For those being hit hard in New York, if a killer opportunity comes along, they're going to bolt. That's not really in question, is it? That happens even during good economic times -- in fact, it may happen more frequently, since good opportunities come along more frequently when the economy's humming.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at October 6, 2008 9:08 PM

So what are you saying cwb? That folks are more likely to leave the city in good times rather than bad? That in bad times people are trapped like rats on a sinking ship?
I think you are a bit demoralized. Or perhaps you should rething your similies.
Educated new Yorkers are not trapped like rats. Even the ones that have bought too high will find a way out of it. But it is true that the markets are crashing around us like collapsing construction cranes. Are you too foolish to grasp the seriousness of the situation? If you are, most are not. So don't get in their way as they look for the exits.


Posted by: sam at October 6, 2008 9:21 PM

I'm with 11217. Anybody who is down on Brooklyn now because the "value" of real estate is down is not a true lover of Brooklyn. 11217, I hear you. There are some serious fair weather Brooklynites around here.

Posted by: wasder at October 6, 2008 11:53 PM

I'm not denying we're experiencing incredibly challenging times (I'm pretty certain that occupation-wise, I'm closer to what's happening in the economic markets than most others). But let's not underestimate the power of mob mentality and psychology in this. I'm not at all implying to be reckless: do whatever you can to hold onto your job, live as modestly as you possibly can right now, invest safely and smartly, etc. I appreciate 11217's contributions to this blog and, quite frankly, I don't understand the anger some are directing towards him. His original quote did nothing but express his and his friends' passion for Brooklyn. His subsequent posts don't seem to indicate a denial of the financial crisis as much as a love of NYC.

I think one can still try to be positive and realistic at the same time. There's nothing wrong with believing that we will get through this, the sun will continue to rise and life will go on.

Posted by: Biff Champion at October 7, 2008 8:06 AM

Biff--nicely said. There is nothing to be gained from sitting around and bemoaning the situation. Many of these things are beyond any of our control. I for one am not going to let an economic downturn destroy my appreciation for Brooklyn. There are many more things to worry about in life than property values. I think that this crisis is separating the people who live in Brooklyn because they love it from those who saw it just as an investment opportunity.

Posted by: wasder at October 7, 2008 8:22 AM

Biff,

Isn't it pretty to think so?

Couldn't resist ;)

But I think we'll be singin' a different tune in November if this thing comes down team Palin...

Posted by: Nokilissa at October 7, 2008 10:07 AM

I've lived in one borough or another my whole life. I've traveled to four of seven continents and visited many different states. You couldn't get me to live anywhere else but right here - come hell or highwater.

I didn't buy in brooklyn to make a deal. I bought in Brooklyn to make a home. And I've found that not worrying about what my house will be worth in 10 years keeps me very happy.

But that's just me.

Posted by: italiana71 at October 7, 2008 10:21 AM

I vote Italiana71 @ 10:21 for quote of the day!!

Posted by: TownhouseLady at October 7, 2008 10:37 AM

I second that vote THL. Great quote Italiana!

Posted by: wasder at October 7, 2008 10:58 AM

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