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September 16, 2008

Condos of the Day: 122 Fort Greene Place

122-Fort-Greene-Place-0908.jpg
The brick townhouse at 122 Fort Greene Place was purchased for $2,400,000 in May 2006 and has now been reborn as a four-unit condo ranging in price from $999,000 for a 1,420-square-foot two bedroom to $1,450,000 for a 1,403-square-foot two bedroom. The conversion's kinda strange: Some of it looks quite beautiful, while others parts look plain ugly. Go figure. Regardless, some of these prices seem mighty high for a floor-through apartment on only an okay block in Fort Greene.
Teri Cavanaugh's Listings [Corcoran] GMAP P*Shark




Posted by Brownstoner at 12:39 PM | Comments (21)
Categories: Condos, Fort Greene

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Comments

Purchased for $2.4MM in May 2006, renovated and being offered at a total of $4.8MM in September 2008. That would be a nice return for a flipper, but good luck getting $1,000+ per sf. for these in this environment.

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 16, 2008 12:45 PM

Dream on. I agree that some of the units look pretty nice, but pricing is loco.

Posted by: in context at September 16, 2008 1:12 PM

are the prices that off if compared to 1 Hanson Place? Is that an unreasonable comparison?

Posted by: newatthisbk at September 16, 2008 1:23 PM

newatthisbk, here is the comparison to 1 Hanson, courtesy of Streeteasy:

12 active sales listings: $938 per ft² (avg)
174 previous sales listings: $849 per ft² (avg)

The two buildings are an apples to oranges comparison, anyway, but I still think the units above are overpriced.

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 16, 2008 1:35 PM

I think these are exceptional layouts actually - other than the hideous tile that covers the kitchen/dining area in apt 1 and the terrace in apt 2, they seem much more interesting than 99% of the condos I see listed here. although prices seem too high to me, that might not be the case for someone who's been beaten down and discouraged by an endless parade of skinny rectangular living rooms with lame little open kitchens at one end and is driven to irrational exuberance by a the site of something decent.

Posted by: gkw at September 16, 2008 1:47 PM

And by the way, I believe the Streeteasy square foot figures represent the initial asking prices, not the actual sales prices per sf. If I'm wrong, please let me know.

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 16, 2008 1:52 PM

I used to live on this block. It's not bad at all, and incredibly convenient to transit. I think there's only one SRO left.

It's not to be confused with the block of Fort Greene Place between Fulton and DeKalb, which is totally sketchy.

Posted by: zinka at September 16, 2008 2:06 PM

Really crazy pricing. That $1.45 million 2 bedroom top floor walkup wouldn't rent for more than $3,500. So, based on the "cost of ownership" calculator on Corcoran (which assumes you'll get a tax deduction at the top income bracket), the monthly ownership cost is nearly twice the rental cost. If you expect prices to increase steeply over the next few years, paying such a premium could (in theory) be worth it...but given what we are about to face in NYC, one really would have to be crazy.

Posted by: aishling at September 16, 2008 2:15 PM

I wonder if the developer's using the lot's proximity to the Atlantic Yards project as a reason for the pricing?

Posted by: cwbuecheler at September 16, 2008 2:22 PM

Zinka's right, that's a nice block and a convenient location. I think the prices are quite high, but no other house on the block has the 35 foot extension off the back with the additional fireplaces/mantles. it allows for unique layouts and more windows on lot lines etc. I doubt that would be allowed again (this lot is probably R6B). Pretty unique layouts and lots of room. Real 2BRs. Price is high, but, imo, looks much better than most anyting else this size.

Posted by: 1842 at September 16, 2008 4:25 PM

I'd love to find out where the Real Estate experts that post and comment get their credentials. How could anybody classify this property as a flip, as the first commenter did? In my opinion, it is nice to see that this developer really put some thought into these condominiums. If you, as a buyer, are so driven by market sq/ft prices then go buy one of the market level condominiums at those prices, they are all the same. I think this property has more to offer than the other 1-4 family conversions in the area. It would be nice to see more developers be a stray from the same old crap.

Posted by: bklynNY4sale at September 16, 2008 5:15 PM

Seems pretty high - and extremely large! 1,400+ sq ft per floor? What, is the house 20' x 70'? Or are those square footages exaggerated?

Anyway, the ppsf seems high. Once you're in the range of a million bucks wouldn't you be better off looking at One Hanson or the Forte? Isn't the Forte selling for like $700-800psf?

I'm looking at selling my Fort Greene apartment soon, and was figuring on pricing it at about $600psf. Granted, it's a co-op, but is the difference really that big? Am I lowballing myself?

Posted by: sdrubbins at September 16, 2008 5:23 PM

bklynNY4sale, I never claimed to be a Real Estate expert and furthermore, my use of the word "flip" wasn't meant in a derogatory way. If there's a more appropriate word for buying an old building, fixing it up and selling the units, then I suppose I should have used it. I agree the developer did a good job. I just don't think the units will sell for close to what they're being priced at. And if you don't think Corcoran is known for overpricing, you shouldn't be going around questioning the opinions of others! You really think the 2-bedroom is going to go for $1,450,000? Seems you're the only one here who believes it.

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 16, 2008 6:06 PM

WoW. I think we have looked at every apartment in Brooklyn-including 1 Hansen and Forte [which both feel a bit like hotel living]. My mouth hit the keyboard when I looked at the pictures/layouts above. I am really looking forward to seeing these in person-I got so excited I called the realtor and she confirmed that the building is twice as long as any building on the block- [which no other house on the block will ever be approved to do]. There are windows on all four sides of the condos. With some of the postings above I wonder who of the negative responses have actually looked at whats available?? Do you know what condos that have been done by a "flipper" look like? Not this. These are stunning condos, and at least from what I see from the pics so far, these should be priced higher than the norm-cause the norm aint so pretty.

Posted by: lucybklyn at September 16, 2008 6:13 PM

We'll see about the price Lucybrklyn, but I agree with everything else you've said. Pretty unique to have such a large floorplan and all those windows. Cool to be near the Williamsburgh Savings Bank tower too imo, and BAM. AY construction will be a bit annoying, but I like the location overall, especially long term.

Posted by: 1842 at September 16, 2008 6:44 PM

I live down the street too. The penthouse that is $1.45 Million comes with a private roof deck that is HUGE and NICE. That's most likely why the price is high. I thought it was a three bedroom? I don't know why they call the study, a study? Anyone?

Posted by: flyonearboy at September 16, 2008 9:35 PM

Lucybrklyn, what is the difference between a "flipper" and the "developer" who bought, fixed up and resold these units? It's a sincere question. Seems some people don't like the word "flipper" (although "developer" to me often has negative connotations).

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 17, 2008 8:04 AM

I saw these condos about 6 months ago, so they are not new on the market. I looked most seriously at the top floor. The developer definitely did a good job - the details are great and bathroom and kitchen were really nice.

That said, the place felt really small for what they are asking. Yes, it's a three bedroom, but since the top floor was likely a modified attic, the ceilings in the two front rooms (of the top units) slant down and get low towards the front of the building making the front rooms feel very small. In the one "master bedroom" (towards the back), the windows were really small and it was hard to imagine getting much furniture in there aside from a bed. It also has no dining area at all, and the living room isn't big enough to be a living / dining space.

To top it off, the deck felt, to me, really overshadowed by the Williamsburg Bank Building behind it. It totally was blocking all the light when we went to see this place, not to mention that hundreds of units have views onto the deck which makes it feel really exposed.

Since you can get a 4 or 5 story house in the neigborhood for around $2M, I couldn't imagine justifying $1.45M for one floor. Obviously no one else has been able to either, since not one of the four units has moved in the last 6 months.

Posted by: Gravy at September 17, 2008 4:28 PM

Hey Gravy. Those condos haven't been on sale for 6 months. I know because construction workers were walking in and out of the place 6 months ago still in the thick of construction activity. I didn't see open house action until late summer... I agree about the Williamsburg Savings Bank being close to the roof deck...but we live in NYC. Large buildings loom.

Posted by: flyonearboy at September 17, 2008 11:30 PM

OK, Ladies and Gents,

I have been watching this for a while now, and I have inside info. That rear extension is 17x42 with windows on both sides, and the original structure is 21x42. I have wondered about the SF cost, but if you do the math the SF cost is competative with anything else around the area, and less than most units at Hanson One building. I know there is an upcoming open house...I will self inspect and make my personal interpretations.

The garden apartment/ground...has 9 foot ceilings in the extended portion of the building. Very unusual...!!!!

I saw a few detailed photos a couple of weeks on a website CondosBrooklyn.com or something like that, which looked very impressive! Corcoran seems to have the listings, and new photos are up...?

One must see...!

So, I concur with the individuality of the property...!!! The developer is either crazy or a Hero for dealing with DOB and condo conversion in a complex building as such.

Posted by: Manhattaner at September 18, 2008 11:19 PM

Let me tell you what $2M buys you in park slope in 2008. It buys you a typical 20x40 may be up to 50FT building, a couple of years of construction and DOB complications (R6B), 1 million dollars in construction costs, may be soft costs as well (if lucky) and loan interest rate of who the heck knows, additional to all above....and surely white hair. I have a full set of those...

At the end of day, it's all worth it.

Posted by: Manhattaner at September 18, 2008 11:31 PM

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