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September 3, 2008

Condos of the Day: 153 Lincoln Place

153-Lincoln-Place-0908.jpg
153-window.jpgFifteen months after buying the Victorian mansion at 153 Lincoln Place in Park Slope for $5,500,000, the new owners have converted the former brothel into a swanky 10-unit condominium. Prices at the Lincoln Condo range from $900,000 for a lofty two-bedroom to $1,450,000 for a three-bedroom duplex. Clearly this was truly a gut reno (probably by necessity) so there's no historic detail to speak of in the interiors; the size of the building, however, means that the layouts are more interesting and, in some cases, spacious than your typical brownstone condo. We're particularly digging this bay-windowed bedroom. There's an open house on Thursday from 4 to 8 p.m. and on Sunday from noon to 4 p.m.
153 Lincoln Place Listings [Brown Harris Stevens] GMAP
No More Cheap Rooms at 153 Lincoln Place [Brownstoner]
Memories, Draped in Red [NY Times]




Posted by Brownstoner at 12:40 PM | Comments (43)
Categories: Condos, Park Slope

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Comments

that kitchen has at least 15 recessed lights! the hardwood floors are at risk of spontaneous combustion.

Posted by: z at September 3, 2008 1:08 PM

I live two blocks down from this place (Union and 7th). Nice area with lots of stuff. I'm curious what people think: is $900k too much for a 2BR condo of this type? My fiancee and I are just starting to research buying, and we have very little idea what constitutes a good deal. Not that we can actually afford $900k anyway, but I'm interested in learning more about the current market.

Also, hi, this is my first post, and all that.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at September 3, 2008 1:08 PM

$874 a square foot is insanity. You can get one of the waterfront condos in Williamsburg for that price, or any of the new buildings on 4th avenue.

Posted by: Polemicist at September 3, 2008 1:14 PM

*will not...give in....to polemicist's comment....*

Posted by: goldie at September 3, 2008 1:21 PM

Poley, Poley, Poley...Williamsburg? vs. Lincoln and 7th Ave? A new condo that will be falling apart in 10 years vs. a piece of history in a nice neighborhood near Prospect Park. Oy.

(C'mon in Goldie, the water's fine!)

Posted by: cobblehiller at September 3, 2008 1:35 PM

cw - you will have to run the comps for recent sales (my experience was based on the condo/coop market 2 years ago). when we were looking, we found that prices varied widely for 2 brs based on condo location and size of the brs, etc. but, almost as a rule, you couldn't find 2 *bathrooms* along with the 2br in brownstone brooklyn for under ~$700k, and were usually looking at at least 800s and beyond. good luck!

Posted by: i disagree at September 3, 2008 1:38 PM

How did they get 10 units out of that building? I'm too lazy to look on PShark but it looks like it's only 3 levels.

Plus, on listing only 3 pics: 1 of outside, 1 of the ho-hum kitchen and 1 of the lame LOGO?! ... puh-lease ... for $1.45MM we need more than that.

Also, I heard the floors have a "special finish."

Posted by: Mr Joist at September 3, 2008 1:54 PM

I live a block from this place. Terrific location. Nice looking building. Good subway access without being too close to Flatbush (unlike anything from Sterling to Flatbush, and in particular unlike those horrid condos on Park Place).

With the caveat that I haven't seen the units (yet), I think their asking prices are high for this market. It shouldn't be too hard to sell these apartments, but I would be surprised if they don't take a 10% haircut. These would have flown off the shelf a year ago, but right now... we'll see.

If the contruction is of good quality, this place should get buyers who would otherwise be looking at the Vermeil (which is at least 20% overpriced). Same area of the Slope but better location, and a more aesthetically pleasing building.

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 1:55 PM

It's actually $932 per sf for the biggest unit. I also can't figure out how they fit 10 units into this building, but the apartments seem nice and the location is very good.

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 3, 2008 2:04 PM

What services come with this building? (let the puns begin.)

Posted by: 11233 at September 3, 2008 2:08 PM

Naughty 11233, very naughty, but funny!

Posted by: cobblehiller at September 3, 2008 2:18 PM

I also think this place will steal "cleintele" away from the Vermeil because it's a lot better to live in an old whorehouse than on the site of a deadly airplane crash.

The Vermeil changed brokers again a while back...to Corcoran, which means they will stay way overpriced (part of the Corcoran playbook, apparently - when I see a Corcoran listing I always mentally deduct 20% from the asking price).

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 2:24 PM

I'm just curious - how are square feet calculated here? Is it interior square feet? I ask because it seems as if, in many smaller buildings (i.e. 4-unit coops, one per floor), square footage is calculated by using the exterior building dimensions, and then subtracting for common space (stairwell) but in other cities, it seems people count square footage as only *usable* interior space, that is the space inside the walls, not going to the exterior walls. Anyone know the answer to this?

Posted by: Miss Muffett at September 3, 2008 2:37 PM

Almost $1.5 million for a master off the living room, a teeny tiny kitchen (the photo is clearly of a different kitchen), and two additional small bedrooms seems like a lot to me, even for a cool building in a good location.

Posted by: PHer at September 3, 2008 2:47 PM

I'm all about nice old buildings, but this is a house chopped up into 10 apartments. Here is my biased analysis

_the Edge and Schaeffer Landing_
Similar size, better floor plans, high ceilings
water views, large windows, lots of light
doorman, elevator, all the services
easy access to the subway
great access to culture and restaurants
modern design
good public schools

_Former Whorehouse_
Inferior configuration, low ceilings
no views, limited light, small windows
no services
easy access to subway
hike to restaurants on Fifth Avenue
Minimal culture save for BAM and Southpaw
nice antique facade
good public schools

It just doesn't make sense. It's one thing to pay a lot for a townhouse that is yours, but people buying apartments very rarely place a huge premium on a facade alone. I absolutely guarantee these units won't sell for anything close to asking.

Posted by: Polemicist at September 3, 2008 2:57 PM

This place is two steps from a bunch of restaurants on 7th. Olive Vine [?], Chiles y Chocolate, that Thai place I always walk by, that Chinese place I always walk by, that Mexican place I always walk by, etc etc. Granted, the best restaurants in the Slope are on 5th, but there is no shortage of perfectly competent food options very close to this place.

I assume this place is zoned for PS 282, which as far as I know is more of a "not bad" than a "good."

Don't get me wrong, I think this place is overpriced. The prices just aren't as insulting as a lot of other places on the market right now (I am using the Vermeil as a whipping boy in this thread because it is so close to this place and I find their asking prices particularly aspirational).

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 3:06 PM

From our experience looking seriously at 2-3 br floor-throughs in PS in late 06-1st q 07, these prices are only slightly higher than I would expect. The only equivalent were 3-5 unit brownstone co-ops, with higher monthlies and many in need of at least cosmetic renovation. Prices (then) were about 850-1150k for 1000-1300 sf, if I recall.

These are pretty nice, I have to say, but the ones billed as 3 brs for 975k would be much more usable as 2brs with study or dining room. 17x18 is a pretty small living space.

Posted by: Bolder at September 3, 2008 3:07 PM

I didn't like the layout- the kitchen runs along 2 walls (at least in 2A and 2B- no center island, no subdivider. called it an eat in kitchen but it's actually a corner kitchen open to the living room. Uh-uh. Not for that kind of money.

Posted by: east river at September 3, 2008 3:08 PM

cobblehiller- really? falling apart? the anti-williamsburg mindset on this site is irrational. the waterfront has outstanding views and is much much closer to manhattan.
7th ave and lincoln place? that's special? how? yes, park slope has some decent shops and restaurants, but having lived all over brooklyn, i can't say that they are offering much besides convenience.

also, the commute from the slope blows. everyone who lives there gets stuck there all weekend. it is not convenient to run in and out of the city from the slope. and, driving - forget it! flatbush sucks 24/7 and will only get worse.

PS is interesting at first, but if you spend 5+ years in the area, it's just flat out boring. it defeats the whole purpose of moving to new york if you can't ever do anything easily.

anyway, i don't understand how your life is better if the outside of your building appears old. do you sit outside all year and just stare at it? a lot of brownstones that aren't falling apart have also been totally redone you know. they are new! the quality of renovations or construction depends on each developer and contractor. just hire someone and inspect it. the new buildings on the waterfront are killer. also, there is a big renovation going on of an old industrial building - 184 Kent that looks pretty good so far. http://curbed.com/archives/2008/07/07/summer_09_looking_good_for_williamsburgs_184_kent.php

also, a place like the Edge in Williamsburg is going to be off the hook. it'll have a pool that looks out to the river and beyond to manhattan for crissakes. they're going to have piers and gardens and park on the river. i'm not moving any time soon, but sheeeet i'd love that. http://www.williamsburgedge.com/

Posted by: wine lover at September 3, 2008 3:09 PM

It's been awhile since we saw posters showing symptoms of NHS (Neighborhood Hypersensitivity Syndrome). I was beginning to think someone found a cure!

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 3, 2008 3:41 PM

Hey winelover, try staring at the Novo all day!

Posted by: denton at September 3, 2008 3:50 PM

I walked by this building about an hour ago. Construction guy said realtors would be there tomorrow at 2pm showing them off, should anyone want to swing by.

wine lover - I'm pretty convinced that five years in any area, even in New York City, is going to leave you pretty bored with the surrounding blocks. Also, while I'm sure many of the Williamsburg condos are lovely, I'm not personally a fan of concrete shoeboxes. I'd much rather live in a brownstone even if I'm paying a little more for a little less space (and no water view). That said, it seems the consensus in this thread is that these particular condos are definitely overpriced.

i disagree - thank you very much for the info.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at September 3, 2008 4:08 PM

A lot of ink has been spilled about why it is better to live (or work) somewhere beautiful, inpiring, etc. even if you spend all day inside looking out. It shouldn't require much explanation.

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 4:09 PM

cwbuecheler - With what do you disagree? That these units are overpriced?

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 4:11 PM

Wine lover, thanks for the props.

Posted by: Polemicist at September 3, 2008 4:23 PM

lethacal - that was a thank you to commenter #6 whose username is "i disagree" :)

Sorry, shoulda made that clearer.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at September 3, 2008 4:27 PM

err, lechacal, not lethacal ... yeesh. Not doing too well today.

Posted by: cwbuecheler at September 3, 2008 4:31 PM

I see. Who's on first? (don't say The What)

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 4:31 PM

The Edge -- closing when?

Schaefer Landing? Seriously? Have you ever been there? I agree - the views are lovely and it's great if you never have to leave, but it's at least a ten minute hike up Broadway to the JMZ train at Marcy Ave and more like 20 to the Bedford Ave L. The area around it is DESOLATE. Absolutely no comparison.

Posted by: babs at September 3, 2008 4:34 PM

lechacal, you know DOWhat's out in left field!

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 3, 2008 4:39 PM

Would that DOWhat would be off in Potter's Field! JK! You know we love you DOWhat.

Posted by: wasder at September 3, 2008 4:54 PM

These could be cool if there was wallpaper. Lots and lots of wallpaper.

Posted by: Heather at September 3, 2008 5:24 PM

DOWhat used the term "oxymoronic" correctly today. The Twat is really trying his hardest to maintain the pretense.

Posted by: dittoburg at September 3, 2008 5:33 PM

"also, a place like the Edge in Williamsburg is going to be off the hook. it'll have a pool that looks out to the river and beyond to manhattan for crissakes."

Also, because Williamsburg is not a "ghetto" neighborhood, its all good, right wine lover?

Posted by: East New York at September 3, 2008 5:35 PM

Wasn't "oxymoronic" DOWhat's third name? Sorry, that was ozymandius...

Posted by: Biff Champion at September 3, 2008 5:51 PM

I checked this place out this evening (from the sidewalk of course). It's a very deep lot - the building goes back a ways, so I'm not too surprised that they managed to fit 10 units. Looks nice from the street. I'll definitely check out the open house. I'm in the market for a 3-bed (with all the patience in the world; if I have to wait two years then so be it). I think at this point I have seen every other 3-bed on the market in the entire Slope.

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 8:39 PM

I haven't been actively looking in a few months, but these prices would have been reasonable before all the freddie/fannie business.

Posted by: Paluka at September 3, 2008 9:42 PM

Freddie and Fannie have nothing to do with the softening price of real estate in Brooklyn, unless of course you count their role in the misplaced fears of an ignorant public. Fannie and Freddie have not stopped lending.

Buyers of NYC real estate chased their own greed for the last ten years and will chase their own fear for the next five. They will blame a lot of things, maybe including Fannie, Freddie, the President, the climate, Alan Greenspan and the price of oil. But very few will admit that it was their own bad judgment that landed them house-poor and underwater on a million dollar morgage, watching their equity evaporate as the receding tide of a long bull market washes out of their fringe neighborhood and leaves them stranded.

Posted by: lechacal at September 3, 2008 10:19 PM

I really really love Lincoln Park....and I havent even been to Coleman Pool yet! Can you imagine how I will feel when I have?! Probably I will wish that I could live there is what will happen...BBQing every night in our own little BBQ hut, sleeping under that stars with the water rushing over the rocks, waking up and swimming in heated salt water pool!!!!! .....eating Marion berries.....walking my dog....possibly seeing some sea lions?!
What?! No camping?!
---------------------------------
Jonty rodes

Virtual Bird Dog Blueprint
Virtual Bird Dog Blueprint

Posted by: Jonty rodes at September 4, 2008 1:01 AM

Folks:
Be careful on taxes. This is a J-51, not a 421a. Building had a huge pre construction assessment as a hotel. Net net: do your due dilligence on where real estate taxes will go. It is very likely benefits will take significant time to kick in. Figure only a partial abatement will last 10.8 years.
Marion

Posted by: MarionG at September 4, 2008 1:11 AM

Taxes aside for a moment...Even more interesting to compare Williamsburg to PS after the Radiac story on Gowanus Lounge and Curbed. Right near Edge, Domino and other developments. No thank you.

Posted by: cobblehiller at September 4, 2008 11:53 AM

lechacal I'm not really sure if your post applies here. I think very few people bought in Park Slope "chasing their own greed", unless you think it is greedy to want to live in a nice neighborhood. And your comment about "fringe neighborhoods" obviously has no relevance here.

Posted by: Paluka at September 4, 2008 12:14 PM

Went to the OH last night. Good in concept, but not the best in execution. The units are mostly big enough but too many rooms squeezed in to awkward spaces. Several of the 3BR units would benefit from being large 2BRs.

Several units will be quite dark with part of the living space mostly below grade. They do have windows but a good part is obscured by retaining walls close outside.

Master baths in several are very small, others OK. Similar story with kitchens.

Personally think the smaller units are better value than the larger ones. There were a lot of people at the OH. Will be interesting to see whether people are tempted at those price levels, now that financing seems to be taking another step backwards - hearing as much as 30% down required by some financial institutions now.

Posted by: cheeryfool at September 5, 2008 5:19 PM

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