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August 26, 2008

Closing Bell: Top of the Toren

To celebrate its topping off and reaching the 50% sales mark (that includes units in contract), there was a little party at the Toren (a Brownstoner advertiser) this afternoon. We managed to thumb a ride on the construction elevator and snap these photos from the roof. Not a bad day to take in the views.
Toren Really Showing Its Skin Now [Brownstoner] GMAP
Toren: Naked No Longer [Brownstoner]




Posted by Brownstoner at 4:00 PM | Comments (48)
Categories: Development, Downtown Brooklyn

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Comments

I'm really into this building. I think it's really going to be a great addition to the Brooklyn skyline.

50% sold in a couple months, in what The What" calls the apocalypse ain't bad.

Posted by: 11217 at August 26, 2008 4:00 PM

woo hoo!!!

Posted by: onevalianteffort at August 26, 2008 4:06 PM

It's not 50% sold. There was a long thread about this claim a week or two ago-check it out>

http://curbed.com/archives/2008/08/18/construction_watch_brooklyns_toren_now_onequarter_skinned.php

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 26, 2008 4:13 PM

http://curbed.com/archives/2008/08/18/construction_watch_brooklyns_toren_now_onequarter_skinned.php

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 26, 2008 4:15 PM

No where near 50%, closer to 10% sold, some more in contract, but even counting that, still only about 30% --check streeteasy. Also, if they are counting the "affordable housing" component as part of the % sold or in contract, then they are really in trouble. On the upside, expect more parties to celebrate the building (and attempt to generate some sales interest).

Posted by: LOL at August 26, 2008 4:29 PM

prove to me it's not 50% sold or close to it.

actually better yet, walk me through the logic that tells you that an apt in contract is not sold. if someone has put a deposit down on an apt, i guess since it's not "sold" the developer can go and sell that apt to someone else. hell why not go into contract like 20 phuckin' times on the same apt. you can 'cause it ain't sold right?

Posted by: friend_or_foe at August 26, 2008 4:37 PM

Based on his other comments, I think ReMiXxed works for Forte (or owns there), so of course he's trying to lie and say this place hasn't sold. Toren is about 1000 times nicer looking than that total piece of crap, Forte.

Posted by: 11217 at August 26, 2008 4:47 PM

76 market rate units + 42 below market units = 118 units in contract out of 240 units = 49.xxxx% in contract.

Posted by: onevalianteffort at August 26, 2008 4:48 PM

those vies are fake. in fact the entire building is fake. it's just a hole in the ground and is 0% sold.

Posted by: BrooklynLove at August 26, 2008 4:49 PM

BrooklynLove, apparently the Brooklyn Bridge is also a fake, based on the picture posted today under Tuesday Blogwrap!

Posted by: Biff Champion at August 26, 2008 4:51 PM

Its all real baby. You jealous?

Posted by: onevalianteffort at August 26, 2008 4:52 PM

Those views are freakin' sweet. I personally don't dig on high-rise living, but if I did I would check this place out. Folks on this board seem to generally have a warm fuzzy place for this building. Maybe because the developer seems to have put some thought into making the building not look like a boring piece of crap? I have to admit I can't find anything bad to say about it (you have to be OK with being in a high-rise far from the "big" park, but it's not like either of those things aren't out in the open). I sure wouldn't mind looking at that view every evening.

Posted by: lechacal at August 26, 2008 5:00 PM

I agree with you lechacal. I applaud the developers doing something a little different and also appreciate the killer views. I would check out the apartments if I was looking to move.

Posted by: Biff Champion at August 26, 2008 5:05 PM

the building is straight off the hook and a harbinger of more great things to come in downtown brooklyn. these are exciting times.

Posted by: BrooklynLove at August 26, 2008 5:05 PM

What's with the layouts for the 2 bedrooms with the master a door off the living room? That is hardly a luxury design. It still looks like an office building to me -- particularly as it is practically in Metrotech. (Of course, Belltel takes some sort of perverse pride in that.)

Posted by: BH76 at August 26, 2008 5:09 PM

Yeah, funny thing about downtowns...they do indeed mix residential buildings with office buildings.

I don't see office AT ALL when I see this building...in pictures nor in person.

Posted by: 11217 at August 26, 2008 5:18 PM

Wonder how long those views will last...

Posted by: denton at August 26, 2008 5:46 PM

I'm proud to say this is my view minus 2 floors. If I'm not mistaken, this picture was taken on the 31st floor. The 31st floor is the highest cemented floor that is safe to walk.

My view on the 33rd floor shows more of the East River in front of the downtown business district. Even 2 floors makes a difference, trust me. Wish I could have afforded the 37th floor for what I'm sure is an incredible view.

This view should be protected since it is overlooking landmarked status neighborhoods. Though, with respect to Downtown Brooklyn, nothing is set in stone. And that is a good thing, rapid development.

I'm shocked (No I'm Not) we got the same idiots claiming that the building isn't 50% sold when I went to great lengths to explain to them on the last thread that it is.

76 units in contract, 42 affordable units in contract = 117/240=49.16% in contract

I can explain where StreetEasy got it wrong with sales figures but is isn't worth it. Trust me figures above are correct.

Toren price points were excellent out of the gate and as a consequence, they are increasing prices every Amendment (5 in total) and showing up arrows as opposed to decreasing prices like other developments in the neighborhood.

These are the facts now you can continue to post bad statistics.

Anyone disputing this total doesn't have the real figures and for some reason want to diminish the Toren accomplishment to date. What their agenda is is beyond me.

Posted by: Junkman at August 26, 2008 5:58 PM

Correction

This is the top floor. All I can say, it looks much better in person.

Posted by: Junkman at August 26, 2008 6:01 PM

This is indeed the top floor, but there won't be any apartments or even common roof space there. Just mechanicals and elevator shaft.

Posted by: brownstoner at August 26, 2008 8:47 PM

The views are going to be killer, that's for sure. Now if only there were private outdoor spaces to enhance the experience.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at August 26, 2008 9:29 PM

I can't believe that a building with views like these didn't bother to put in a common roof deck. A staggering mistake.

Posted by: zinka at August 27, 2008 12:46 AM

you crack me up zinka. i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that the developer didn't make a mistake by not including a roof deck. anyway, why do you care? this location is horrid, right?

Posted by: BrooklynLove at August 27, 2008 7:13 AM

The wind current in this location is amazing at times. Although I would love to go to a common area with a view like this, it isn't practical.


Posted by: Junkman at August 27, 2008 7:53 AM

The Forte and Toren should not be compared. I have been to both. The simple facts are these. Forte is in an actual neighborhood - Fort Greene. It is less than three (safe) blocks away from the Atlantic Avenue, Nevins Street, and Dekalb subway stations. It is three blocks from Fort Greene Park. It is a very short walk to great restaurants, shops, and hang-out spots in Fort Greene, like those on Dekalb and Fulton. Fort Greene a heterogeneous mix of families and younger people. Fort Greene is actually getting better by the day, as opposed to merely hoping for it. The solid plans for arts development in the BAM cultural district can only be a plus. New restaurants and shops are popping up on both Dekalb and Fulton regularly. Forte is quiet as it is not on a major roadway like Flatbush. You can safely walk from the subway to the Forte as it is not in a desolate area. I could go on. That being said, I have no plans to move to the Forte - I just got out of grad school and cannot afford anything. I have a great friend who does live there and enjoys the area immensely. Forte may not suit everybody's tastes. No place does. But honest people cannot deny what Forte's Fort Greene neighborhood has to offer.

Posted by: LogicalCalm at August 27, 2008 7:57 AM

I would also like to compliment Brownstoner for taking a stroll on the upper most regions of the Toren to take those pictures. It is very scary up there walking on tin and unstable footing. My hat is off to you guys since you went beyond the call of duty.

Posted by: Junkman at August 27, 2008 8:00 AM

Don't understand why one has to belittle the Toren location to compliment the Forte's. The fact is both areas are going to be immensely improved in the coming years. The Toren neighborhood will be radically different in a few years. Radically.

If you have done your research of the area and account for the present construction and that which is imminent your comments about the Toren neighborhood would be more accurate. City Point will be a magical building, tallest in Brooklyn, and will be across the street from the Toren on the way to the R train. Also walking through Metrotech to get to the A is anything but dangerous.

http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2008/01/more_details_on_1.php

Let's be accurate. Surely a graduate student like yourself can appreciate a little homework before commenting. Those of us who have purchased in the Toren are not hoping that the Avalon Bay Luxury Condos will be built, it is being built. That goes for City Point and a multitude of projects that are presently being constructed in the area.

Lastly, I agree with your comments about Fort Greene and its environment. When BAM construction begins, this area will take off even further.

http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2008/06/norten_design_f.php

plus Ratner's 80 Dekalb

http://www.observer.com/taxonomy/term/56597

plus many other projects

One doesn't have to degrade one area to build up another. Both are in good position to be something very special in the near future.

Posted by: Junkman at August 27, 2008 8:23 AM

I cant stand 95% of the new construction in my fair borough (these guys have been trained to put up any crap and get away with it all) and am pretty ambivalent about many of the new occupants.....but this development seems pretty good looking to me....not into high rise living, but if i were, i would really like this place...i think the other crappy buildings immedeately around the toren will suffer in comparison.....which is probably something those attached to those projects will HATE and decide to blog about to death using dumb logic. if you dont want to face facts....blog it to death.....YOU WILL EVENTUALLY WIN!!YOU WILL EVENTUALLY WIN!!!

Posted by: slappy at August 27, 2008 8:56 AM

junkman. avalon bay's job is a rental w/ like 600 apts. they don't build condos. that only leaves oro, citypoint, and catsimatidis' jobs as for-sale in the immediate vicinity. heaven only knows what's going on with oro (forget about oro II). but citypoint is at least 2 years from being finished. and given that the cat man isn't a real estate guy who knows when his job will actually get built.

Posted by: friend_or_foe at August 27, 2008 9:43 AM

BL 7:13: This location isn't great, but is not nearly as bad as the Tillary cluster or Bridgeview. It's at least close to the subway.

Why do you say it's not a mistake that they didn't put in a roof deck? Why should people who buy on lower floors never get to see these views?

Posted by: zinka at August 27, 2008 10:08 AM

Agreed with Zinka. The amenities of Toren are great, but are segregating. The true amenity of the building is it's height above the lower buildings. But alas, this will only be for the duplex and higher unit owners.

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 27, 2008 10:33 AM

Regarding the difference in location of Forte and Toren:

If Forte is already located in a great neighborhood as was said (which I believe to be true also) and Toren is arguably a nicer building in a much more up and coming area, which do you think has the better chance for appreciation in the coming years...?

My bet is on Toren. Forte was already priced high and was ugly the day it was built and will only get uglier over time.

Toren's facade does not look dated to me, and the potential for growth in that particular area would seem to bode extremely well for significant appreciation.

You aren't going to get much more for Forte units 5 years from now than you would today.

That's my opinion. In a downmarket, you buy a nice property in an up and coming area (or something in a blue chip area). Not a mediocre building in an area which has already just about peaked.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2008 11:06 AM

I hope Forte, Oro, Toren, all the damn buildings in Brooklyn do well. Its only going to benefit the neighborhood, right?

Posted by: onevalianteffort at August 27, 2008 11:17 AM

EEk 11217, I'm not biased toward any new building. Like onevalianteffort posts, I also think that anything to boost Brooklyn is a plus.

Sadly your opinions are tainted in your love of your new purchase. Congrats! Your biased makes your comments even more petty.

Toren, Oro, Forte', Hanson Place etc will all double in value once BAM, Barclays, CityPoint and the likes are built. When someone buys a property it is because THEY like it. If they are looking for a flip then in THEIR opinion it is worth it.

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 27, 2008 12:17 PM

To 11217. As someone said earlier, there is no need to disparage. Neighborhoods that are great need only speak of what they have to offer in order to sell themselves. To say that Fort Greene has peaked is obviously inaccurate. Hyperbolic statements do not add to a rational fact-based discussion of any matter. What would be helpful is if people like you, 11217, tell others about your own personal Brooklyn real estate success story. I also believe that the era of selling a few years later hoping for an easy profit are behind us. Also, I've seen quite a few young families at Forte. They may have considerations besides the aesthetic which you find objectionable.

Posted by: LogicalCalm at August 27, 2008 12:18 PM

"Sadly your opinions are tainted in your love of your new purchase. Congrats! Your biased makes your comments even more petty."


I live in a brownstone co-op. I would never consider new construction for myself. Not my thing at all, but I do like Toren as an observer.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2008 12:27 PM

I was giving my opinion on the Toren and Forte. I never said it was the word of the lord. I was giving my impression, just like everyone here has the right to do.

Just because you don't agree with me doesn't mean one of us is right or wrong. It was an opinion. I think Forte is incredibly ugly and I think the Toren so far looks great.

I'm allowed to think that and still love Brooklyn, Ft. Greene, BAM (which, btw is already there and not being built...the core of BAM already exists, they are just adding to it). I do not wish anyone ill will and hope the people who bought at Forte the best.

Not everyone likes brownstones (where I live) and a few people dare I say it, hate them.

I like them though and am confident in my choice. Plenty of people come on here saying that they are money pits and outdated and I would never dream of discounting their opinion. We all like different things.

Am I supposed to say I love everything, so as not to hurt anyone's feelings who bought at Forte? I don't agree with that. People in this country need to learn to speak up a little more and stop being so afraid of what other people think.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2008 12:36 PM

"there is no need to disparage"


I thought that was the motto of this website...?

Not sure why people are all of the sudden defending Forte, when 99% of new buildings on this site are TRASHED.

Posted by: 11217 at August 27, 2008 12:37 PM

Randomness...

Whole Foods should bail on Park Slope and move on into Downtown Brooklyn.

Posted by: onevalianteffort at August 27, 2008 12:44 PM

Not sure if this is fact BUT when I was taking a tour of Belltel on Saturday, the saleswoman made a point to say that Whole Foods had a preliminary contract to have a store at City Point. Don't know if this is fact though she did appear to be up on what is happening in the immediate surroundings of BellTel.

I don't know why I said Avalon Bay Luxury Condos. Obviously they are rentals. I'm taking pain killers for kidney stones and cannot be held responsible for anything I type in today.

Correct, City Point around 2 years which in my time frame is very soon. I figure to move into Toren in around a year and another year is just fine.

Remember, behind City Point going west is the Willoughby Square Park, Sheraton, Loft, Indigo Bay, 47 story 384 Bridge, 51 story Residential Tower on 107 Lawrence St., 80 Dekalb, to name a few. Most of the above are active sites.

Anyone walking in the area can see a lot is happening. This may create an oversupply in the short run but i can guarantee that eventually all will be filled with individuals who will take great pride of the neighborhood and do what is necessary to keep it on its positive course.

Posted by: Junkman at August 27, 2008 1:31 PM

zinka - i just get a kick out of how you come on here and make sweeping statements re these new developments as if the developers are clueless, and you're in the know. do you think they just throw a bunch of darts at a board in order to pick amenities? or that the sponsor woke up one morning and said "aww F it, i don't want a roof deck here." these decisions get researched extensively in a development of this nature.

same reason why it makes me chuckle when you firmly dismiss developers' decisions to build multi-million dollar buildings along the flatbush and tillary axis as ill-conceived.

Posted by: BrooklynLove at August 27, 2008 1:34 PM

yeah i'm not sure i understand what's meant by segregation through amenities in toren. isn't there a 6th floor roof deck, pool, gym, etc. that's open to all the residents? how does not having a deck on the roof segregate? ostensibly if you value a view on the 30th floor, you'll pay the price differential between the same type of apt on the 10th floor and the 30th, no? but can you really call that segregation?

Posted by: friend_or_foe at August 27, 2008 2:30 PM

"Toren, Oro, Forte', Hanson Place etc will all double in value once BAM, Barclays, CityPoint and the likes are built."

So Toren and Oro, for example, with units currently listed averaging $748/sf, will sell for $1496/SF?

Poor me a nice, tall glass of that Kool-aid you're sipping.

Posted by: SnarkSlope at August 27, 2008 2:40 PM

Why not? http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9804E0D9103AF933A15751C0A9639C8B63&fta=y

why wouldn't it happen to real estate? I have a friend who purchased a wall street condo for 1200 per square foot...who would think that was possible?

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 27, 2008 3:07 PM

One more thing, check out this chart across the us it is obvious why real estate is the one investment that will (eventually) MAKE YOU MONEY!

http://creativeclass.typepad.com/thecreativityexchange/
images/2007/11/03/real_estate_bust.gif

Posted by: ReMiXxd at August 27, 2008 3:26 PM

http://www.mediabistro.com/unbeige/original/koolaid-thumb.jpg

Posted by: SnarkSlope at August 27, 2008 7:14 PM

Here's a lesson to all you bloggers, Oro, Toren, and Avalon are all sandwiched next to the projects. They all have LOW INCOME HOUSING inside their buildings. I personally would not pay 600-800 thousand dollars to live in a building with SECTION 8 residents. You guys can lie to yourself all you want, but by the end of the day when you try to sell these units and the buyer finds out there's section 8 people in the building, good luck buddy.

Posted by: parisedevil at August 31, 2008 4:55 PM

In response to Parise Devil:

Section 8 is a government program to assist low-income families with rent. The keyword is RENT. Oro and Toren are condos. The only rental building is Avalon.

Does it hurt your assh()le talking out of it so much?

Do your research before you rant!

Toren has 42 below market value units. I believe a household can make no more than $160G's to apply. The units are set aside for civil workers or whoever can scumbag their way in.

Posted by: onevalianteffort at September 1, 2008 5:39 PM

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