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May 21, 2008
House of the Day: 144 Underhill Avenue
This 4-story, 23-foot wide brownstone at 144 Underhill Avenue is a beauty but it's priced as if it were on the other side of Flatbush Avenue. The more we look at the photos of this place, the more we like it—the woodwork, the multiple exposures, the old extension. (Don't forget the two-car garage.) It all adds up to one heck of a place. We just don't think the market's ready to bear a $2,750,000 asking price in this location yet.
144 Underhill Avenue [Brooklyn Properties] GMAP P*Shark
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Comments
Please, this price is completely ridiculous. Right now, you can get one of two houses on 3rd Street (20' wide, 4-story) in Park Slope for less than this house on Underhill. Out of touch, completely.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:32 PM
oh, and one of those 3rd Street houses is actually 22' wide.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:33 PM
Love that the house is semi-attached and has all those side windows. That has to worth something.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:40 PM
no way, jose. Keep dreamin'.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:40 PM
this is not the safest area.
there have been multiple drive by shootings this year on Underhill right near the playground.
that said, the house is great...for around 2 million.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:43 PM
This is a beautiful house. I'd even say that the outside is more stunning than the inside, which while retaining some detail, leaves much to be desired. The kitchen is on the 3rd floor--which is very impractical and expensive to change. This particular location does not merit the price tag, however, no matter how nice the house.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:44 PM
I'm a little confused about the layout. From the floorplans the kitchen in the photos is actually in the ground floor rental. The upper triplex has a small central 4th flr kitchen. That's not appropriate for a house at this price. The multiple satelite dishes on the roof indicate the building was more broken up at some point.
There are 2 narrower places for sale right around the corner for $1M less each.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:45 PM
that ivy is REALLY bad for the facade. i would bet there is some serious damage under there. it might look pretty, but it's just about the worst thing for the exterior of any home...
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:45 PM
You can buy a perfect home on Lincoln Place in PS for this price. Or 3rd Street.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:48 PM
according to the listing, the building is 19 feet wide, not 23 (that's the lot width). so this will probably go for below ask, but still over $2m.
Posted by: z at May 21, 2008 1:51 PM
Bad area of Prospect Heights. Lots of crime, desolate. Not worth $2.7 or anywhere near it.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:51 PM
I've never checked it out, but 144 Underhill is the Kurdish Library and Museum—that explains the glass display cases.
1:43's "this is not the safest area" is way off. Sure, there have been incidents in the past year, but I live in this nabe and have been out on this very corner at all hours and it's country quiet. I've never felt unsafe.
I have to agree with the other posters that $2.75M is too high. the place can sell for close to $2M though, although kitchen and baths that I can see on Brklyn Properties Web site appear in need of updates.
Posted by: Fjorder at May 21, 2008 1:53 PM
This is, I believe, the location of the Armenian Holocaust Museum. It was on the Prospect Heights house tour a few years ago. That use may explain the location of the kitchen (institutional use on first 2 floors with residence above). I believe the ivy-fears are overstated, altho there was a time when colleges were slaughtering ivy left and right.
Posted by: Putnamdenizen at May 21, 2008 1:55 PM
Cut that price in half, then cut a little more, and you're getting closer to a realistic price.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:56 PM
I really dont see a family spending 2.7 mil to live here.
Maybe a management company.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 1:58 PM
Holy Batman, that's a lot of ivy. That stuff is extremely damaging to the facade, factor in additional repairs. It also suggests physical neglect--my money says that the current owners have not been kind to their home.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:01 PM
so... which is it then, the Armenian museum or the Kurdish library?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:04 PM
hahaha ... do we still get to call people "urban pioneers" if they have $2.7M to spend?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:05 PM
"lots of crime" is an overstatement...the area had a bit of an ipod mugging spree for a few months in late 07/early 08...just around the same time a mugging spree hit beloved park slope. Hasn't been much of a problem since.
The gunfire incidents were obviously more troublesome....allegedly tied to a brownstone down the street, which is was recently put up for sale and is subject to a large tax lien. So hopefully that problem goes away soon too.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:05 PM
a plaque on the front of building says Kurdish Library, so i'd go with Kurdish, unless the Armenians are slow to update signs.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:07 PM
Brownstoner I still can not fathom how you chose your HOTD. There are several listings on the market which are cheaper/ better priced and are much better value but yet you choose these ridiculously overpriced listings. Are you trying to make people think that RE is still going thru the roof? I just don't get it with this overpriced HOTDs
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:16 PM
might want to read through this before you buy this place...
http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=40031&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:21 PM
i hear there is a gay disco/gymboree going in up the street, so that probably explains the $.75M markup.
Posted by: i disagree at May 21, 2008 2:25 PM
And when is Prospect Heights being designated a historic district? Isn't is possible, currently, for someone to buy any of these houses and knock them down or alter them?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:25 PM
Nice callback, i disagree! I would love to see the looks of confusion on the faces of those reading your comment who didn't see the discussion yesterday when that came up.
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 2:31 PM
This is a fantastic house.
Both on the outside and the inside, plus parking. I wish I could afford it. Although it would be a bit large for me and my small family. But I love it. Considering the ridiculous prices being asked for run of the mill houses on ugly blocks, this price seems only a little high. I bet they get close to ask, maybe even ask. It is reallly an unusually appealing house, to me anyway, and I'm picky.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:32 PM
1:43 There are drive by shootings I'd say the place is about 2M.....you mean to say that it is only 75,000 less than the listing price because people can get shot? Now I know this site is for asshats.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:33 PM
I would buy it except it has no recessed lighting, so take about 300000 of asking and then its a go.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:34 PM
Will some of the proceeds be donated to the kurds?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:35 PM
2:33...
Last time I checked, the difference between 2.75 million and 2 million was $750,000.
NOT $75,000!!!
And I'M THE A##HAT???!
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:38 PM
2:35, no whey!
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 2:42 PM
There were 2 other relevant posts on brooklynian about muggings and gun violence in the last month on this block:
http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42148
http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42036
And then there's the fact that there's a forclosure at 136 underhil that was discussed here a few weeks ago too.
So, I don't think the fact that Fjorder "feels" safe is enough to make 2.7 a reasonable price. I am looking in this neighborhood, but you do get a discount for risking your safety in hopes of continued improvement in the area.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:49 PM
Great. Now they're even driving the armenians out of PH.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:52 PM
"but I live in this nabe and have been out on this very corner at all hours and it's country quiet."
I almost always agree with you Fjorder, but I don't think "country quiet" is necessarily a good thing in a neighborhood once known for gangs and violence. It's improved immensely, but I find quiet corners in this city a little scary, to be quite frank.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:57 PM
and to follow that up, it's not that i don't think someone should buy this lovely home, i just don't think someone should be spending almost 3 million dollars to live in a neighborhood which has broad daylight drive by shootings at a playground.
when park slope was in a similar state of gentrification, you would be spending 400K for a house like this.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 2:59 PM
"when park slope was in a similar state of gentrification, you would be spending 400K for a house like this."
Exactly--well put.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:01 PM
These comments are so funny.
Either a property is too close to a busy street (horrors!) or it is too quiet.
I live in Brooklyn Heights and I find Prospect Heights more comfortable to walk in, in terms of a feeling safe, than Clinton Hill where there seem to be more idlers and loungers hangin' around.
It is definitely the up and coming star of brownstone Brooklyn.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:06 PM
2:59 / 3:01 - The 80's are over. Get used to higher prices.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:11 PM
I'll take Ft. Greene over Prospect Heights anyday. The blocks are too long and desolate in PH, and there is nothing going on. Ft. Greene and even Clinton Hill have designated historic districts, unlike PH. Considering that many listings are in the same price range, Ft. Greene by comparison is a much nicer and safe neighborhood with many more amenities.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:12 PM
Yes, I think most people would agree with you, 3:06.
Prospect Heights is farther along in the gentrification spectrum than Clinton Hill is.
Brooklyn Heights and Park Slope were sortof the hub for the intial wave in the 50's and 60's, followed by Carroll Gardens and Cobble Hill, then Prospect Heights and Ft. Greene and now Bed Stuy, Clinton Hill and Crown Heights...
I still think 2.75 million is a bit ridiculous when you can get something in one of the most established areas which are asking the same thing.
Greedy and out of touch sellers, if you ask me.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:12 PM
$2.75 million for this corner in Prospect Heights? In this market, when "fringe" areas are the ones that are suffering? I don't think so. I can spend 100K less and get a 22 foot wide, renovated brownstone on 3rd Street & 6th Avenue in Park Slope. I suggest the sellers drop Brooklyn Properties and get real.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:17 PM
"when park slope was in a similar state of gentrification, you would be spending 400K for a house like this".
2:59-
Try 75K- that's right- 75,000K. That was the homesteading offer in the 1970's.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:20 PM
For the EXACT same price, wouldn't nearly everyone here prefer this property??
http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=1267058
Does Brooklyn Properties not know about the usage of comps???
My lord!
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:22 PM
3:20...Yes I know that homes sold for 75K, but I don't believe Prospect Heights in 2008 is in a similar state of gentrification that Park Slope was in 1975.
Most of Park Slope was a pit back then. And very crime ridden.
I stand by my statement because I think Prospect Heights has made major headway in crime and think the neighborhood is probably similar to Park Slope of the early to mid 90's...
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:29 PM
Anyone notice how many properties on 3rd street have suddenly come on the market including that gorgeous building on the South side of 3rd abutting the open garden right below the park? Makes me think that supply is starting to pick up big time.
Posted by: Brooklynnative at May 21, 2008 3:32 PM
Agreed 3:22. But I'd prefer this other 3rd Street house, listed for almost 100K less than Underhill:
http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=1271190&ohDat=
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:34 PM
I count three properties for sale on 3rd Street.
Is that a lot?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:35 PM
Biff, you're "whey" comment was gorgeous! LOL.
I read through the thread on Brooklynian posted by 2:21 and am a bit stunned. Had no idea the area could be so dangerous. We were just at that playground with our kids a couple of weeks ago and thought it was really sweet.
Anyone know why the recent uptick in violence and gunplay? Not a pleasant development.
Posted by: Nokilissa at May 21, 2008 3:37 PM
All the prices in these run-down and none-too-safe neighborhoods are ridiculous. Why pick on Prospect Heights? When folks are willing to pay a million or more dollars in areas that just yesterday were poverty-stricken and where many people coninue to live below the poverty line, I would expect that you will see some crime.
The prices are so out of whack with the demographics that folks who have lived there all their lives could not even dream of buying a stoop let alone a whole house.
It is a weird thing that is happening now in Brooklyn. I have never seen anything like it.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:38 PM
Brooklynnative--that 3rd Street limestone house abuts the open garden lot that belongs to Safran Foer.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:38 PM
That "hill" in PS ain't looking so bad anymore, does it Nokilissa??
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:39 PM
"It is a weird thing that is happening now in Brooklyn. I have never seen anything like it."
***
So you've never been to Washington DC, Baltimore, Center City Philadelphia, Seattle, Los Angeles or San Francisco?
Seriously dude...expensive properties in former and current "ghettos" (um....the MISSION in SF for one) is not a New York City phenomenon.
The disparity in incomes is even more pronounced outside the U.S....Dubai, Buenos Aires, Madrid, Paris to name a few...
How about the year 1995 on 96th Street and Lexington Avenue. South of the Street, one of the wealthiest enclaves in the country...north of Lexington, one of the most impoverished...
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:43 PM
Biff gets the bon mot award for the no whey posting.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:44 PM
Awww, thanks Nokilissa. At least someone out there appreciates my cornball, Catskill-esque humor.
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 3:46 PM
Hey 3:39! That wasn't me!
It was Heather.
I like the hill.
Posted by: Nokilissa at May 21, 2008 3:47 PM
what drive by shootings? I live down the block and haven't seen/heard of any drive by shootings at the playground. You people dont have a clue what you're talking about. Last August some teenagers were shooting a gun into some of the backyards along Park Place but thats as close as we've come to "drive by shootings."
Posted by: clintonhillbuyer at May 21, 2008 3:50 PM
I have never seen anything like what is happening in Brooklyn today. None of the examples you cite are remotely comparable.
It is like we lost a war to another country and the winners are overtaking all our neighborhoods and throwing us all out. Brooklynites are like the vanquished. There is no place here for us any more so we need to pack up and emmigrate. It is unbelievable. From zero dollars to 2.7 million in how long? seven years? nine years? What part of Washington DC or San Francisco is like that?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:50 PM
3:44, merci beaucoup, mon ami!
Nokilissa, you can perhaps blame me for the confusion. I lumped you and Heather together in a different context under the "Multiple Price Cuts for Heights Houses" discussion. Sorry about that - you're two of my favorites.
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 3:52 PM
"Last August some teenagers were shooting a gun into some of the backyards along Park Place but thats as close as we've come to "drive by shootings."
ah yes, that is so much better than drive-by shootings.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 3:52 PM
No, no, no, Clintonhillbuyer, take a look at the thread posted on Brooklynian (Jan. 9th I think) which was cited by 2:21 on this thread.
Two incidents on the same day. One at about 2am and one at 10:30am. The park attendant had to rush the children playing at the playground into the brick structure/bathroom for safety! One kid was left in the swings alone. I almost cried reading that.
They were considered grudge shootings I think. But several shots were fired both times. THIS year.
Posted by: Nokilissa at May 21, 2008 3:55 PM
Ah. I haven't looked at that thread yet. Only have another minute or two anyway.
No lumping!
Posted by: Nokilissa at May 21, 2008 3:58 PM
Mr/Mrs 3:50
DC just bulldozed its entire southeastern section and built abunch of condos. Literly leveled blocks and blocks of rowhouses and public housing.
It went from a Ghetto to an expensive area in literally a year.
Same with DC Chinatown. They tore down a ton of blocks and put a basketball arena on top of it.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:00 PM
So what's the market-clearing price for this house? I'd pay $1.9 cash.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:05 PM
Nokilissa, it will take more than a minute or two to get through that thread! It's a bit of a doozy, but has it's moments. Take a look at it later if you get a chance.
I promise not to lump again, sugar. Get it, lump, sugar...never mind....
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 4:06 PM
You're comparing Chinatown in DC with all of brownstone Brooklyn? You nuts?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:09 PM
I lived near this house in Prospect Heights for 8 years and it's a much better neighborhood to live in than Park Slope, particularly the 3rd street area, which is where I grew up. Great grocery shopping, quiet, less crowded, better subway access, wider streets, actual diversity, closer to the BBG, museum, park and farmer's market. If I had 3 mil to drop, PH is the first place I'd look. But I don't, which is why I don't live in Brooklyn anymore.
Also, drive-by shootings? What?
Posted by: LZA at May 21, 2008 4:17 PM
Biff, please keep it down to one pun per thread. Clearly some people enjoy them, but I find the physically painful. Aaalllgh.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:19 PM
4:09 PM
im giving an example of two shitty areas in a different city (DC) to compare to what is happening in Brookly.
However in Brooklyn we didnt Bulldoze Bed-Stuy and Crown Heights.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:27 PM
4:19, you're right. That last one was painful, even by my standards. Apologies.
Countown to the first "too bad we didn't" response to 4:27...10, 9, 8...
Posted by: Biff Champion at May 21, 2008 4:30 PM
First of all, all of Brownstone Brooklyn has not gone from zero to 3 million overnight.
It's really just the fringe areas like Clinton Hill, Prospect Heights, Bed Stuy, Crown Heights, etc which have decided that they can do no work to improve crime or schools and ask the same price as those in other more estblished neighborhoods do.
Brownstones in Park Slope and Brooklyn Heights were over a million dollars 10 years ago in case you were unaware. Now from 1 million to 3 perhaps has only been in the last 10 years, but there are MANY other neighborhoods around the country which have experienced this...
Many neighborhoods in DC, Philadelphia, San Diego, LA, San Franciso were considered ghettos as early as 15 years ago. Now they are gleaming with million dollar homes.
Do any of you read the real estate sections in other parts of the country to keep up?
I just recently saw condos priced at 3 million in downtown St. Louis.
Seems you all are living in a time warp.
Cities are expensive these days. In the past 10 years the shift from suburban to urban has changed the face of America. Today, more and more people want to live in the urban core. It has thus shot prices up. NO ONE wanted to live anywhere near Washington DC 15 years ago. Now you'd have to pull people kicking and screaming to the suburbs of Maryland and Virginia. Everyone wants to be in Dupont Circle and Adams Morgan.
Ok, well not everyone, but a lot more than used to be the case.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:35 PM
10, 9, 8.... they'll get here soon Biff
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at May 21, 2008 4:38 PM
quote from prospect heights message board:
"yes, seperate incidents. The 2nd shooting appears on gothamist crime maps at 11:21am. Drivebys...across the street from a playground...really not good."
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:40 PM
"What part of Washington DC or San Francisco is like that?"
Washington DC = Dupont Circle
San Francisco = The Mission
Baltimore = Fells Point
Los Angeles = "downtown" better known as the former skid row.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:46 PM
Has anyone reading this bought a house in PH for $2M+? What are your thoughts on these places?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:49 PM
Is this area worse or better than Crown Heights in regards to crime?
We're looking to buy and looking into crown heights.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:53 PM
Prospect Heights is much better in the crime department than Crown Heights.
For the same money though, I'd reccommend at least looking in the South Slope. Crime is incredibly low there compared to these two areas, and you can find a hidden gem every once in a while for 1.5 million or so.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:56 PM
So much inflated real estate boosterism on this site. I can do without the propaganda. it's a drag. It must be realtors although I always thought most realtors were illiterate.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 4:57 PM
4:57 - I've actually thought this thread has been quite factual, in fact.
And even remotely on topic, which is also a rarity.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:05 PM
Yeah, how is this listing of all the incidents that make this price insane in any way boostering?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:17 PM
Prospect Heights has nothing on me, I live in Brospect Highs, It is an up and comer. I am an illerate real estate agent, Call me I can seell your dream homey for you. you very good money for me. I love America it great county.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:18 PM
perfect brownstones in prime park slope were going for 750k 20 years ago.
with inflation thats about 1.5 mil.
no jokes
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:27 PM
omg--penalties!
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:27 PM
I actually think that for the quality of life one gets in places like Park Slope, 3 million isn't totally obscene. Especially since homes there have cost over a million dollars for nearly 2 decades. These newer fringe areas, on the other hand have gone from 500K ro 2.75 million in 7 years.
THAT is what's not healthy for Brooklyn.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:34 PM
Anyone who uses the word "fringe" to describe Prospect Heights has never been to Prospect Heights.
Where do all of you losers live?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 5:52 PM
5:34, you do recognize that Underhill is exactly two blocks from the border of this magical Park Slope of which you speak, correct? We're not talking about Faux PH here...4 blocks East of Washington, or something.
If $3m is ok in PS, why is mid-upper $2m so impossible to fathom in PH?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 6:01 PM
Anyone who thinks that a neighborhood with two drive by shootings in the course of one day is not a fringe area is smokin crack.
where do YOU live...beirut?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 6:03 PM
6:01--those two blocks are very long and most likely equivalent to 5-6 regular city blocks. Also, the distance is irrelevant. "Location, location, location" is the major factor in the pricing of real estate, and this corner in Prospect Heights is not worth the same as a house on 3rd Street, or as one on Orange Street. It might offend you, but it's true.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 6:42 PM
6:03: I live in Bed-Stuy and Prospect Heights is not fringe. If you can't handle that some areas of Brooklyn are not chock full of rich white people, then you are living in the wrong city. Go back to Nebraska - the "fringe" state.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 6:47 PM
Prospect Heights does not/cannot command the same prices as Park Slope, just like Park Slope does not/cannot command the same prices as Brooklyn Heights. It's a FACT. It's the market.
Anyone who argues against this simple truth is a PH broker, owner, or a plain idiot.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 6:54 PM
"you do recognize that Underhill is exactly two blocks from the border of this magical Park Slope of which you speak, correct?"
would you like to use this same logic for 96th and lex as well...?
one block one way is the upper east side, one block in the opposite direction is east harlem.
big difference in price and crime stats, don't ya think?
you are new to new york, yes?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 7:15 PM
LOCATION, LOCATION, LOCATION
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 7:17 PM
Prospect Heights is about as fringe as you get. Fringe to me means the majority of residents are not wealthy, there is still high crime compared to other neighborhoods nearby and that retail and commercial is not yet up to the standards of those spending millions of dollars on a home (even though they are the minority in that particular neighborhood).
Prospect Heights seems to fit that bill to me...
If you'd like...please go take a look on the message boards and read about which streets are controlled by the Crips and which are controlled by the Bloods in Prospect Heights if you really don't think it's "fringe"
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 7:19 PM
if a person could read and write why in the world would they be a realtor? couldn't they get a real job?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 7:58 PM
7:19: If the only way you get your information is via message boards, you prove my point that you don't know Prospect Heights. It is not fringe. Perhaps, before you make an idiotic comment on this board, you actually visit Prospect Heights - and any other neighborhood you can't actually afford but feel comfortable commenting on - before you make an ass of yourself in public.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:08 PM
7:19: There are lots of brownstones and condos in Prospect Heights that sell well over $1 million, so those people who spend that kind of money in this area are not in the minority.
And you have not spent much time on Vanderbilt Avenue, Washington Avenue - or technically the north side of Flatbush Avenue - in the past few years to see that the retail and commercial options are more than adequate for people spending those millions.
As for the crips and bloods controlling the streets of PH, where do you come up with such nonsense? (oh wait, you trust the idiots on some message board instead of checking it out yourself.)
You are really clueless.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:15 PM
7:19, you are letting the whole world know that you are pretty clueless about Brooklyn neighborhoods. Prospect Heights,with its numerous cafes, bars, restaurants, cultural institutions and the like is not, and could never be considered fringe. Its stately brownstones, its tree-covered streets, its close proximity to rapid public transportation, its abundance of active and sustained cultural activities and its diverse residents (upper middle class, working class, poor, black, white, yuppie, artsy, hip-hop) all speak to a pretty well settled neighborhood. Park Slope, it certainly is not, but like Clinton Hill, it is a neighborhood that has arrived and will continue to attract new comers because of its quaintness. Visit the whole neighborhood before you make close-minded and simplistic comments.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:18 PM
I am 7:19 and I live at Lincoln and Washington.
IN Prospect Heights.
Since the average income in PH is around 40k a year, there is no way the majority of this neighborhood owns million and up condos or homes.
If that is REALLY the case, then you all better be ready of the "majority" of the neighborhood to foreclose.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:23 PM
If you live in Prospect Heights and still think it is fringe then you need to get out more. In no way is it fringe.
Do you own in PH?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:34 PM
7:19/8:23 doesn't own in PH, 8:34. It is obvious due to their lack of knowledge of the real estate market in their neighborhood.
The only people who make less than 40K and live in this area are the oldtime owners - who are not going to go into foreclosure, or the remaining pieces of ghetto trash who have yet to be kicked out due to higher prices. Gee, let me guess which one you are, 7:19?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:40 PM
First I must apologize to the Kurds - I knew it was some museum of people massacred by the Tu... oh now I will have to apologize to someone else. And when houses like this were costing 400k in Park Slope apartments in Manhattan were going for 185k, so I don't really understand the point. The amount of personal offense people take about people plastering high prices on houses in "undeserving" neighborhoods is simply bizarre. Either it sells or it doesn't. No morality or justice involved at all.
Posted by: Putnamdenizen at May 21, 2008 8:42 PM
Overpriced by quite a bit for this location. Period.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:47 PM
The ASKING PRICE is high, yes. But sellers realize that all buyers are going to bargain down, so they inflate the price to try to get a better SALE PRICE. Some may argue this approach, which is certainly fair, but assuming that a house will sell at or above ask is very 2005.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:54 PM
Where is Prospect Heights? I've seriously never heard of it...
- Manhattan resident
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:55 PM
This house, in this location is not worth a dime over 1.75 million.
Period.
Even then, it's no bargain.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:57 PM
8:55: look at the google map above and zoom out to get a perspective.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:58 PM
This asking price is not just "high". It's pretty ridiculous given the comps in more expensive neighborhoods.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 8:59 PM
i'm not saying it's the case, but i'm reminded in the post above...if a lot of people from manhattan have never even heard of prospect heights, doesn't that kinda make it slightly fringe-like?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:01 PM
Agreed 8:57.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:01 PM
I do not think that Prospect Heights is fringe. Many parts of Clinton Hill however, are definitely fringey, if not out and out fringefull.
Prospect Heights was never as down and out as the neighborhood now known as Clinton Hill. I know of nice people who moved to PH way before I knew of anyone with any money moving into Clinton Hill. In my mind there is no comparison, Prospect Heights is nice, Clinton Hill is edgy.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:03 PM
8:54 here. 8:59, agreed. But we all need to recognize the game the seller and/or their agent is playing. I think the ask is nuts and I would be stunned if it sold for this much. I bet the ask will come down in time and will sell for something around $2 (IMO).
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:04 PM
Yeah, that bloods/crips street by street analysis was great...the evidence of gang activity was soooo overwhelming that it took about three messages before it morphed into a discussion of a South Park episode.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:11 PM
Bloods, Crips, Kurds.. Lived in PH for a while. Great place to live. Anyone who feels unsafe in PH has no business living in NYC, and maybe even on the planet.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:13 PM
some of you who say prospect heights isn't fringe need to take a walk some time down lincoln place, st. john's, bergen street and some of the other side streets between washington and underhill. really not good. a LOT of drug and gang activity still going on. if you don't see it, you are used to it or something because it's still there in a significant way.
washington anytime after dark can be dicey and even vanderbilt getting up towards pacific ain't great late night...
anything east of washington is downright fringe-ville.
i like ph, but i just think it's not quite there yet.
i guess fringe can mean a lot of different things depending on who you're talking to though.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:14 PM
anything east of washington is crown heights
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:22 PM
Doesn't Prospect Heights have a massive chunk of vacant land and railyards in its northern section, which was bought by a developer to improve the surrounding blight?
The residents and PR machines of non fringe neighborhoods like the West Village, Park Slope, Chelsea or Carroll Gardens would not have allowed such a project to be built of such scale and magnitude without prior approval or consultation.
The fringe neighborhoods don't have the clout yet to band together and fight such things properly.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:24 PM
The trash in the section 8 housing live on the other side of Washington, near Grand and Classon. Some of those blocks are hit or miss and that is due to the trash that will soon be kicked out as rents rise and landlords up the rents.
Vanderbilt is not scary at all. Get a spine.
Thre are a lot of people in Manhattan who have never been to Brooklyn. Does that make PArk Slope fringe?!
Really people. Why did you move to Brooklyn if you are so afraid?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:26 PM
9:24 - that is the Atlantic Yards project and that was shoved down the throats of the local residents, including people from Park Slope who fought against the project. Teh city did a massive run around the local communities, so the idea that some non-fringe area could have prevented this holds no water. As such, your comments have no validity.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:44 PM
Most people, at this point in time have heard of Park Slope...
Let's get real here.
Prospect Heights is fine. It's great.
You are talking about it as though it's the best sh*t since sliced bread though. Take a look at the crime stats bud...the murder on Vandy...THIS YEAR...the drive by shootings on Underhill, and the section 8 housing between Underhill and Washinton. Blocks of it. A police office friend told me that St. John's between Underhill and Washington is a HUGE drug hub for Brownstone Brooklyn.
No one said anything about being afraid. PH is an urban neighborhood. That's also what makes it great. But you can still be based in reality when you are describing it.
Those threads about the drive by shootings were all from people who live in the neighborhood. We don't have anything to hide. It wasn't a set up from others trying to make our hood look bad. We were talking about what's going on. And we've still got a lot of work to do.
Stop ignoring that and do something to improve it instead of lying to yourself, telling yourself it's perfect. Why don't you start with the schools...they are not great, to say the least.
Another sign of a fringe neighborhood, btw...
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:46 PM
atlantic yards has major frontage on prospect heights. more than any other neighborhood. it really will not affect park slope in the same way it will affect prospect heights.
i do not believe for one second that if they were proposing atlantic yards down a non landmarked swath of 7th avenue that this would have stood a chance.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:50 PM
Being afraid is a good thing in Brooklyn. There are a lot of bad people here. People who do not really recognize the difference between neo-grec and queen anne. This is not suburban NJ or Conn. there are a lot of poor desperate, angry people living in the nieghborohhod who are not glad to see places selling $3 a cup coffe or organic foods. Brooklyn is a poor city. POOR, POOR, POOR. All you millionaires who want to buy here should understand most of your neighbors are DIRT POOR. if they were not dirt poor they would have hauled ass years ago to greener, healthier, pastures.
What is happeneing now in brooklyn is ridiculous, it is the young and rich being beguiled by the realtors to think that they are moving in to areas with like-minded people when actually they are moving into neighborhoods offically designated as blighted by the government.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:52 PM
9:52 = bruce ratner
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 9:56 PM
9:46: I live in Bed Stuy, you ass, and I am doing everything I can to throw the trash that lives there out to make it nicer for all the hard working people who live and work there. You have no clue. trust me, the person who buys this house, at any price, will work to clean things up.
Honestly, if you are afraid of PH, you shouldn't be living in Brooklyn cause you just can't handle it.
And the mention about your friend the cop is not only completely off the mark it reeks of MySpace tween stupidity.
9:50, you ass, they can't propose that kind of development on 7th Avenu because it would have cost too much. The plot was city owned, that is why they chose the spot. Teh city gave ratner a deal and he pushed out the development because he could afford to and he had city backing. He didn't use his slimy tactics on teh north side of Atlantic because there are too many homeowners who woudl have put up a royal stick and would never have sold out. ANd since that housing stock was extremely new could not be condemned IDIOT.
And people in Park Slope did fight against it, so you have no clue how things work in this city.
Are you all from the midwest or something?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:12 PM
I'm Bruce Ratner? You are high on crack my friend. Come down from your hallucinatory state and see the world as it is. These high as a kite prices for ordinary dirty old houses is a thing of the past.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:14 PM
10:14 = bitter renter.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:16 PM
I actually wonder, not at all sarcastically -- seriously! -- if this pricing isn't like that Bed Stuy sale on Madison for 900K-something.
Posted by: Heather at May 21, 2008 10:18 PM
only in brooklyn would people be ridiculed for feeling uncomfortable living in a neighborhood with consistent gunfire, horrible schools and a healthy drug trade.
and then be expected to pay 3 million for it.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:19 PM
Heather...perhaps a REALLY late April Fool's joke??
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:20 PM
10:19: Only an idiot like you can't read that the ASKING PRICE is $2.75 million and has not SOLD for that price and thinks there is a healthy drug trade and consistent gunfire in this area. Don't bother coming to Brooklyn if you don't already live here because you are realy stupid.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:33 PM
10:44 = spelling troll.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:51 PM
10:16
face the facts, you are an idiot.
I have not rented since probably before you were born. only loser assholes debate points by attempting to irrationally put themselves in a the "superior person" catagory with no possible proof. You are a speck of sand on the beach. No consequence, leave the real people to their own conclusions.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:56 PM
10:51 = 10:44
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 10:57 PM
I would pay $1.5 cash for it.
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 11:29 PM
"Clinton Hill is edgy"---really, not most of it. Have you been there lately?
Posted by: guest at May 21, 2008 11:36 PM
9:46...What murder on Vandy this year? The one in front of Fish & Crustaceans on Fulton? PH now extends North of Atlantic? Soon all of Brooklyn will be ours!!!
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 12:38 AM
did any of you know that RFK's daughter lives on Montgomery Place?
by the way, can someone explain "white flight" to me. I hear that happened to prospect heights in the 1950's.
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 1:23 AM
Based on comparables, this house is worth about $2.3M.
The safety issue regarding Prospect Heights is laughable--there are murders, robberies and bank hostage situations that have occurred in Park Slope--who the hell wants to live there??!! Prospect Heights has tripled in value over the last 7 years. Let’s hope that the thieving Park Slopers stay on their side of Flatbush! That means Library, Botanic Garden or Museum for you!
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 9:36 AM
You're right Park Slope, violnece/crime doesn't happen there:
http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42491
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 10:05 AM
uhhh....10:05, that link talks about a homeless man who died.
there was no crime involved.
there has not been a murder in park slope in quite some time.
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 10:34 AM
"there has not been a murder in park slope in quite some time."
Last murder in Park Slope - late 2005
Last murder in Prospect Heights - late 2006
big difference?
Posted by: guest at May 22, 2008 11:29 AM
Back story to this house--(also see last two sentences at bottom of page)
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/brooklyn/2008/05/23/2008-05-23_kurdish_museum_curator_hopes_her_museum_.html
Posted by: guest at May 24, 2008 3:37 PM
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