House of the Day: 162 Bergen Street

The catch is its overpriced

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:34 PM

under $2 mill its a buy...

Boerum Hill is a great area with so much character...

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:38 PM

Isn't this the place nokilisa said was already sold? S/he thought it had only just been on the market briefly because it had ben relisted.

As for the charm: is that wall to wall carpeting on the parlor floor? I'd assume that means having to put in new wood floors at significant expense. I've always thought the floors to be the hardest thing to put back in and make look original.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:39 PM

I am not sure if people understand how hard it is to get a good rate on Jumbo mortgages right now and that is if you can quilify. They are not giving million dollar loans to people who cant afford it any more.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:42 PM

Kitchen pics? Bathroom pics? Must need some work.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:50 PM

According to REalplus there was an offer accepted two days ago, on May 6.

Also, it hasnt really been on market for six months - for a good long stretch last winter it was off the market, then popped on again in early April 08.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:51 PM

since when is 1 block from the projects a "great location"?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:51 PM

According to REalplus there was an offer accepted two days ago, on May 6.

Also, it hasnt really been on market for six months - for a good long stretch last winter it was off the market, then popped on again in early April 08.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:51 PM

loathe the location. sure i am not alone. when looking to buy years ago (when houses in this neighborhood were more like $400K), thought wouldn't live here for free because of the projects. living that close to the projects sucks. sucked for $400K and now super sucks for $2.3 million. no reason to buy this.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:53 PM

1:53 = lifelong renter

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:55 PM

"sucked for $400K and now super sucks for $2.3 million."

Although it wouldn't suck as much if you bought for 400K and sold for 2.3 million as many, MANY people in this area have done.

You are kindof a moron, aren't you 1:53?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 1:56 PM

It is a beautiful home. it is a little close to the housing projects but it's the city, everybody lives next to everybody else. the interior plasterwork here in particular is just lovely.
Please please tell us how much it foes for when it sells. 2 million seems like so much money. I love Brooklyn, but I gotta say if I had that kind of money I would be tempted to wander further afield. But who knows? I don't, so I stay in Brooklyn, which is now home to the rich and fabulous (who woulda guessed it?)

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:02 PM

Please, I don't think 1:53 is a moron - everybody has the right to decide for themselves what streets they are comfortable living on. Some people are looking for a place they want to live, not what will gain them the most equity over time - and the run up in equity in the last 10 years was quite unpredictable anyway - shocked everyone I know, even me who bought 'high' in 1999.

Also, of course this needs a lot of work. The last line of the broker's write-up tells you that pretty clearly: "This grand "lady" is just waiting for the right person to appreciate her gracious potential." They don't talk about potential if it doesn't take a lot to get it into shape.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:03 PM

The kitchen layout seems strange (off of a hallway), there's no bathroom on the ground floor, and there are no pictures in the listing of the kitchen or the bath. There's no lack of people who want to buy houses, if they can afford them, this place must be priced too high.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:03 PM

The projects are really not that bad.

I've lived on Wcykoff between Bond and Nevins (literally sandwiched between Wyckoff Gardens and Gowanus Houses) and NEVER have I had a problem. It's actually a really nice, gorgeous block.

Our neighbor just sold for 1.4 or something and it was just a really basic, two story house. Nothing spectacular like this one.

And even though Bergen is only one more block north, it feels a world away from the projects.

I've never felt unsafe, even late at night. It's a very urban feel.

People who are afraid of black faces (of which it seems like there are too many here) should not consider this property, but those who enjoy fine, urban living in an extremely convenient location, it might be great.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:08 PM

There are projects all over the city its part of city living... Let me guess:

1:51 and 1:53 you have a rental...great job...

The projects are not a big deal unless you are hanging out in them at 2 in the morning.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:09 PM

In New York, you almost always live close to the projects - that's just the way it is.

That being said, I live 2 blocks down on Bergen and have had absolutely no problems with noise or crime from those projects 1:53 seems so afraid of.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:10 PM

The only place I can think of in Brooklyn which is NOT near the projects is Park Slope. Gowanus, yes, Park Slope proper, no.

So if you don't like projects, Brooklyn probably isn't for you.

And neither is Manhattan, in that case also.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:14 PM

2.14 - no projects in greenpoint either

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:19 PM

Are there projects in Prospect Heights?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:22 PM

Does it really matter since a contract was signed?

This discussion seems moot.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:25 PM

funny how all those defending the projects live nearby.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:25 PM

"Are there projects in Prospect Heights?"

I thought Prospect Heights WAS the projects.

No?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:27 PM

"funny how all those defending the projects live nearby."

I hate to point out the obvious, but how would someone who didn't live near the projects be qualified to speak about them???

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:28 PM

Ahem, perhaps the reason this house didn't sale for 6 months is because the British owner was busy evicting the current tenants. I had been living there with a group of great people for a very long time. It was an ugly process forcing us to move. The guy who had the lease had been living there for more than 15 years and had taken care of the property while the owner sat in London and collected a hefty rent. It was a group of international artists, photographers, a teacher, dancers, living there. It's sad to see this area subject to further gentrification. I'm sure a trader or trust fund baby will find it as lovely a place to live as we did.

ps: it hurts to see my furniture used in their advertising pic. boohoo.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:31 PM

I saw this house at an open house months ago. It went into contract soon after. Obviously, the contract fell through--wonder why? House needs a lot of work, rickety stairs, tiny, tiny extension kitchen, needs all new bathrooms, plaster repair, etc.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:33 PM

I was wondering why the furniture was so ugly, 2:31.

Now that I know it was of a renters "collection" it makes a little more sense...

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:34 PM

There was originally a contract on this house months ago. It fell through and just went back on the market.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:35 PM

St. Johns between 5th and 6th ave is mostly public housing. It just looks like a row of brownstones.

Also Sunset Park has no projects same with Bay Ridge.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:40 PM

I just called the realtor also as I really like the look of this place.

I can say that Dave speaks the truth.

Seems there is more than one party already interested.

Not surprising. This place looks GORGEOUS.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:41 PM

I'm refinancing a $1.5m Jumbo loan and I've talked to six banks, all of which have offered me rates in the 5.625% - 6% range. These rates are available to anyone with a 680 credit score or higher. 1:42, you are an idiot and have no idea what you are talking about.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:42 PM

"St. Johns between 5th and 6th ave is mostly public housing. It just looks like a row of brownstones."

So even Park Slope's projects are beautiful??!!

Figures...

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:42 PM

Boerum Hill is a great nieghborhood. I've lived there off and on since the early 1980s and the change has been remarkable - for the bettter. If 1:53 PM and others are worried about crime they should visit the site below which provides crime stats for the 84th precinct (Boerum Hill). If you're looking for context check the the same stats for the 76th precinct (which covers Carroll Gardens + Cobble Hill). You'll see that Boerum Hill's numbers for serious crime (i.e. murder, rape etc) compage favorably. Before everyone jumps all over me, let me say that I've lived in Carroll Gardens too and think that it and Cobble Hill are also great, safe neighborhoods. As an aside, I've lived in NYC my entire life. The only I ever got mugged was on 5th Avenue and 46th St.in Manhattan. Two kids pulled a knife on me. in broad daylight. The year was 1978.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloads/pdf/crime_statistics/cs084pct.pdf

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:54 PM

the view from all the rear windows of this house is of the massive public housing complex a few blocks away. Kind of a depressing view for a $2 million house.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:54 PM

1:53 here - sorry, no renter. bought a brownstone in cobble hill in 1996 - probably way before any of you even considered buying in Brooklyn. sold that and went on to buy more properties. have lived in several neighborhoods and my preference is not to live near a project. doubt that this is a shocking conclusion to most people. also, yes, would definitely choose Greenpoint over Boerum Hill. The neighborhood cannot escape the ghetto. If you like living next to projects - go for it. Just saying MANY will prefer no projects to projects. And, considering how desolate Brooklyn can be, it's more dangerous in Brooklyn. Also, you have to consider the public schools in the area and how they are affected.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 2:58 PM

"And, considering how desolate Brooklyn can be"

Brooklyn is a city of 2.4 million people.

More people than in Phoenix, Houston, San Diego, Boston, DC, Baltimore, Miami, Seattle, San Francisco and Dallas.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:09 PM

"St. Johns between 5th and 6th ave is mostly public housing. It just looks like a row of brownstones."

that isn't true. They're not public housing. There was a public housing program in the 80s that purchased these properties and then sold them at favorable prices and rates to qualifying applicants. Those people now own those properties outright if they haven't already sold them to others.

It's like the housing lottery winners that have been discussed here. Those people sometimes have some restrictions on turning over the property, but sometimes they just win big.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:11 PM

2:31 bitter renter of the day.

You don't need a job in finance or an inheritance to buy a place. You just need a real job or 2 and an attitude other than that of those artist types who think the rest of the world owes them cheap housing. If you had any real talent, you'd be making money off it. If your work sucks, it's a hobby, not a way of life.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:15 PM

You are correct about that, 3:11.

I have a friend who lived there and last year sold her "housing project" for 550K.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:15 PM

3:15 - you are wrong. many quite talented artists make hardly any money at all, but produce various forms of art the rest of us enjoy. Those who choose to do that do it despite the lack of monetary compensation, and society is the better for it.

No, I'm neither a bitter renter nor an artist - did the finance thing and bought - but I recognize the various trade-offs people make.

And I didn't get bitter from that tenant's posts at all.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:21 PM

2:58 totally agree with you. public shool is major concern for families w/ children. I rather buy in park slope for $2mil. The building is tiny anyway.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:21 PM

I think it's kind of charming that someone thinks that THAT furniture is helping in anyway with the marketing of this place.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:21 PM

I just bought in Boerum Hill. I think Boerum, Cobble and Carroll has such great character that cant be matched...You have Brooklyn Heights and Dumbo all close by with Downtown Brooklyn as well (which is only going to get stronger) just north as well...Its a quick subway stop and a ton of restaurants....

I like Park Slope as well and think thats a great area with unbelievable amount of amenities, I just wanted to be closer to Manhattan...

But for people to rip this area they dont get it and probably rent in Windsor Terrace and just cant afford it and are bitter..

Williamsburg is not for me but I understand why people live there and the ones I know love it so I respect what they have there as well...

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:23 PM

Just because you call something Carroll Gardens or Cobble Hill instead of Boerum Hill doesn't mean you aren't living near the projects.
You think it is so far to walk up Warren St. from Hoyt (Gowanus Houses) to Court or Clinton?
Can you tell me how many feet away from projects make you feel so safe?
Fact is area whether you call it Carroll Gardens, BOerum Hill or whatever has low crime stats for NYC.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:25 PM

1:53,

You can say things as many times as you want, but that won't make them true. Check the crime stats as posted above and you'll see there is more going in Greenpoint than in Boerum Hill. At least what gets reported. If all were doing is going on opinin, I'll agree with Dave in Bedstuy. The most problems I ever had was when I lived on the upper west side.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:27 PM

Living near projects sucks, end of chat.

Next...

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:34 PM

newbie pinheads suck, end of chat.

Next

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:39 PM

Dear 2:28, a.k.a. Self-Styled LogicMaster 2000:

Must one eat the poo to know it tastes foul?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:40 PM

Many people who buy a $2.3 mil home will send their children to private school.

I know 4 people who own brownstones just like this one on either Bergen or Dean within 2 blocks and all of their children go to private.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:42 PM

3:40 = racist bigot

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:42 PM

Thanks for enlightening us 3:34. so let's rule at living in neighborhoods like like Chelsea, Upper West Side, lower east side etc. Living there must suck since they have public housing. Suggest you focus on 5th Ave through Park. 59th to 79th St. That's about the only area I know that's not near public housing.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:43 PM

daveinbedstuy is the biggest jag off on this board . . . except maybe Polemicist when he's off his meds.

seriously, get a life.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:45 PM

3:42, WTF you talkin' bout' Willis?

poo = racist?!

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:51 PM

all public housing is not the same. I lived on 24th St in Chelsea for 10 years across the street from safe (but ugly) public housing.

some housing projects are more dangerous than others however, and the ones we're talking about are not good.

I mean, can't people think at ALL? You don't have to rule out living near any housing, but you can decide you'd rather not live across the street from a seriously dangerous area

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 3:54 PM

Dorks...the lot of ya.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:02 PM

"Have you ever contributed something worthwhile to someone posting in The Forum???"

Yes, and here it is:

daveinbedstuy, please cut out your tongue and swallow it whole.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:04 PM

Everyone should move to South Dakota where the entire population is white and house prices will stay the same forever.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:05 PM

2:42 - can you tell me a little more about your re-fi? I've talked to chase about re-financing a jumbo and we have good credit and they said couldn't get a rate better than the one we already have 6.62%

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:08 PM

I just got approved for a 30 year fixed mortgage (jumbo) for 6.15%.

My fico score is above 800, though.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:09 PM

3:21

What are you talking about? You contradict yourself.

"3:15 - you are wrong...Those who choose to do that do it despite the lack of monetary compensation, and society is the better for it....I recognize the various trade-offs people make."

If they choose to do it despite the lack of compensation and you recognize that people make trade offs, then why should they get to live in someone else's property? Do you even know what 'trade off' means? It means if you insist on calling yourself an artist regardless of your ability to sell your work, you get to do your crappy art, you get to be pretentious, you get to have people like you applaud your choice, but you do not get to hijack someone else's property because you cannot pay the rent or purchase price.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:26 PM

I am wondering exactly what are the banks you people who say you're getting the low 30-yr fixed jumbo rates from. Is this with points? We have great credit (and a big down payment) and are being quoted well over 7% everywhere. Can someone name names please? otherwise I call bs.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:30 PM

1:53 you are a piece of Crap I know you live in Park slope because that is where all the bashers Live or maybe you are from New Jersey. Great house very nice location. If not sold already then it will sell soon.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:47 PM

4:26, happy with your life choices? In news from planet Earth, many extremely talented artists lived in life-long poverty; and many marginal neighborhoods have been made palatable to the bourgeoisie by artists willing to live in them first, who then get --unfairly, in my view --priced out.

For the record, I've made a ton of money in finance and own real estate, so save your juvenile epithets; but one final observation: for all the "bitter renter" talk, it sure seems to me that the edge has slowly crept out of the nay-sayers voices, and into the over-stretched owners and the always-hideous brokers. If I had bought RE ten years ago in brownstone Brooklyn, had made millions in unrealized capital gains, were totally happy with my urban existence, and rock-solid in my finances, I'm not sure why I would come on here and yowl "angry renter" every time someone pointed out a house appeared overpriced.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:48 PM

2:42 is a liar! He can call other people idiots for posting facts and make up his own but anybody who has tried to get a 30 fixed Jumbo the past couple of months know that the rates are high and going higher. If you need 1.5 mill fixed fo 30 you are paying at leat 7 percent. 2:42 is not facing reality.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:49 PM

2:14 Park Slope is not near the projects right? Well what do you call all Of Eastern Parkway? and how about the other side of Prospect Park what would you call that? Ohh and wait what about those wonderful Kids walking thru Park slope after school. That said I would rather Live In BH or Bococa any day over Park Slope. Nothing but Haters on this site.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:53 PM

"2:42 is a liar"

no he's not.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:55 PM

4:53: What "Kids" do you speak of?

Do you mean the ones walking back to the projects in Boerum Hill?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 4:59 PM

None of the areas you mention, 4:53 are in Park Slope.

"Bococa" as you so lovingly refer to it, is, however riddled with projects.

Boreum Hill has two major ones, in fact.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 5:00 PM

3:23 I am with you. Great Area BOCOCA is. Park Slope is Nice But i Like being Closer to Manhattan.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 5:03 PM

I used to live at Smith near Bergen (F train) in Carroll Gardens and I used to live near Berkeley and 7th (2/3 or Q Train) in Park Slope.

By far, the shorter commute to Manhattan was from Park Slope.

I suppose if you live in South Slope the commute is longer, but certainly not anywhere near the north.

Now I live in Manhattan so it's a non issue.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 5:09 PM

I have a 790 FICO 20 percent down and a stable income. You cant get a 1.5 million fixed 30 year for under 7 percent. Maybe one of those ghetto 7 year interest only ARM's for 5.7-6 but if that is what you need to afford it you have no business buying a brownstone. You have to wonder what will happen to all the people who cant refi when the ARM comes up and were depending on the value to go up in order to do so.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 5:18 PM

"Park Slope is not near the projects right? Well what do you call all Of Eastern Parkway?"

Eastern Parkway. There may be projects waaayyyy down near the end in ENY, but there aren't any near Park Slope. Unless you are inferring that any building with black people living in it is a project. In which case, please go back to Idaho.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 5:35 PM

All of you with your hysteria about projects are pretty pathetic. The boerum hill projects are simply NOT dangerous. I know they once were, but everyone feels and is completely safe in BH now, and some of the prettiest blocks in BOCOCA are there.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 6:39 PM

Beams in a brownstone!

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 8:05 PM

We live in Boerum Hill (6 yrs now) but are moving out of area (probably to Queens). Boerum hill is a great area. The only reason we are moving is schools. Private is just too much.. and prices have gone up so much, we are priced out.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 8:10 PM

Wow! I lived in this house for 6 years!
Moved out in 1997. It's an amazing place, an awesome house with great details, and the location was perfect.
shame I'm not in the market.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 10:18 PM

Brownstoner, can you please keep doing the feature where you revisit houses on the market 6 months ago? A broker we are working with just admitted that a house in prime PS that was on market for 1.7 last fall *finally* sold for 1.4. I'm also going to see a few others that have been lingering, and the sellers are seeming more negotiable. I am really curious about what a house like Bergen goes into contract for. What with all the uncertainty about mortgages and the economy in general, it seems like the prices are finally coming down - and as a buyer (not a bitter renter! I just sold my apt for a huge profit!) it seems that brokers are rather desperately clinging to high prices in the hopes that it will inspire buyers to at least get close to ask - but many don't, and some sellers are finally starting to cave in... Hell, they are still making buckets more than what they paid, so they might as well before things go down further! (I know, they might not, but they might, and a bird in the hand...)

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 10:38 PM

I'm really not seeing the value proposition here. This would command MAYBE 10k/month in total rents. Price to rent ratio of 19-20 is crazy.

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 10:57 PM

10:57 - value/rent ratio is totally out of whack right now, which is one of the reasons many argue that a correction is inevitable. Others contest whether this is a useful metric, but historically, it's been a metric that has been meaningful until the last few years when things ran up out of all relation to rents. I know for my own apt which we bought in 2002, the mortgage at the time (with 20% down), was very close to what the rent would have been - indeed, renting was probably a bit more expensive. Currently, the sales price has more than doubled (about a 106% increase), but rent value (according to rental brokers we spoke to, since we considered renting before selling it), has only gone up about 30% in the time period. I know, equity is what everyone wants, stability, pride of home ownership, etc. - but do people really want this at the expense of sanity and being a slave to a huge mortgage if a year from now, that mortgage could be 10-20% (if not even more discounted)?

Posted by: guest at May 8, 2008 11:14 PM

I'm sorry to hear about the ugly eviction process. I'm sure some of the people lived there when I was there. I moved out when the owner doubled the rent. It felt like the writing on the wall. I'm glad that you were able to afford living there for 11 more years.

I'm a professional artist, I make a living from my work. The enviornment and low rent at 162 Bergen let me concentrate on my work. I hope everyone who lived there has found good places to live and work.

Posted by: guest at May 9, 2008 7:24 AM

if thats 2.3MM why does that pancake chest horse faced hag named Alex and her beard husband Simon keep claiming that their dump is worth 2MM???

Posted by: guest at May 9, 2008 10:42 AM

"that isn't true. They're not public housing. There was a public housing program in the 80s that purchased these properties and then sold them at favorable prices and rates to qualifying applicants. Those people now own those properties outright if they haven't already sold them to others.

It's like the housing lottery winners that have been discussed here. Those people sometimes have some restrictions on turning over the property, but sometimes they just win big."

They have security guards out front so I always assumed it was still government owned. Is it still government run?

Posted by: guest at May 9, 2008 10:46 AM

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/10/nyregion/10Shot.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&oref=slogin

Posted by: guest at May 10, 2008 12:32 AM