Wednesday Links

let the comments begin!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:14 AM

Is that part of the "stroller mafia" I've been reading about on Brownstoner?

If so, which faction?

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:30 AM

Is that part of the "stroller mafia" I've been reading about on Brownstoner?

If so, which faction?

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:31 AM

Fucking repulsive. There's nothing wrong with this playground that you couldn't fix with a machete and a strong right arm.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:47 AM

yea, i'm sure you have a strong right arm wanker

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:49 AM

Sunshine, I'm so huge that it *takes* a strong right arm.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:52 AM

Man, I hate getting upset by this picture, but it's hard. I live in PS and have to deal with these stroller moms and their suffocating sense of entitlement everyday.

From the stroller mom's perspective, you have "rights" only so long as you satisfy one of two conditions:

1. You're a baby or little kid
2. You're either pregnant or the mother of a baby or little kid

If you fail to satisfy either 1 or 2, then you are human trash.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 8:56 AM

Funny. I actually like kids and have raised three of them myself. So, I'm not someone who objects to the "stroller mafia" because I'm some idiot hipster who objects to procreation in general. However, as fond as I an of kids and the whole procreation thing, I don't understand why many of the people in Park Slope have to be so damned obnoxious about kids. Having kids is about cherishing those early years. It should not be about being rude to other adults around you who happen not to have kids. Not that I understand the appeal of such rudeness in the first place, but it apparently has some appeal because so many PS mothers take great satisfaction in being rude to others.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:01 AM

God I really hope people like 8:56, 8:47 etc are just trying to be trolls. Because if not I seriously (no seriously) suggest you immediatly seek out psychiatric help. I know you don't think you need it but really (no really) you have some deep seated problems that need immediate attention and while you can't see it, everyone else know it.

There is nothing in the picture except a playground and strollers - there is nothing "entitled", judgmental or otherwise controversial in the picture (some might even call it sweet) and while I am no expert, I don't even think that the majority of those strollers are expensive.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:03 AM

9:03, if you spend a little time in PS, you'll interpret that photo differently.

Trust me on this one.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:06 AM

I levitate my children around the hood, thus avoiding being labelled a "stoller" mum.

Dumbest juxtaposition EVER

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:11 AM

9.13 - your mom likewise

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:24 AM

Its wonderful news that so many obsessional misanthropes will not be procreating.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:26 AM

The stroller mafia is no joke.
But it's nice some dads at the playground

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:30 AM

I am convinced that the PS stroller mom phenomenon that everyone gripes about is real. At first I didn't, but eventually I couldn't deny the testimony of my own eyes and ears. These moms are really, really unpleasant and seem to think they're owed the world. What I wish is that someone could figure out why these women feel this way and how they ended up here, in PS--or are they the way they are because they ended up in PS?

ATTN sociology grads: There's a dissertation here!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:31 AM

Look Putnamdenizen, you move to a "edgy" neighborhood and pay outrageous rent/mortgages and complain about crime??!! ( I will reframe from using profanity).

"The southside of Clinton Hill continues to be the scene for targetted slayings" First stop using east/west/north/south to describe a neighborhood. Tagged for who?! You don't know the circumstances of that shooting.

"Making it harder to get guns would be a help. It looks like our Supreme Court may rule that the second amendment guarantees an individual right to have a gun, which will make this harder."

Nope nope, If people were allowed to carry guns, the crime rate would drop overnight. I think people should have to right to defend themselves.

Putnamdenizen please throw your computer in the garbage!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:37 AM

The "stroller mafia", "nasty PS mother" etc... is purely urban legend. Sure there are a few nutty moms in PS, but there are nutty moms (and Dads) everywhere and there is nothing particularly nuttier about the moms in PS then anywhere else.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:38 AM

I count five men and two women in the picture. My guess is that they could probably kick all the pussy assed loser trolls here without blinking. They hold you down while their kids take a dump on your face.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:44 AM

The whole problem is lame, sheep-like behavior. Kids can walk pretty much the length or width (Flatbush to 9th or 5TH to PPW) and back to their house by the time they're two years old. Mine did. If the neighborhood weren't clogged with lumpen three to four year olds folded awkwardly into these things the whole issue would be 50% less noticeable.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:44 AM

9:44, the issue is noticeable because it's manufactured. it's spoiled rich single kids who had everything handed to them on a silver platter by their suburban stepford mommies who think that this city is simply here to be their trustifarian playground.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:47 AM

You anti "Stroller Mafia" people are such tools. Learn what it is like to sacrifice for your children and work so you can actually have a family and take them to a park once in a while. If you are so full of hatred and bitterness because you see parents with their children, maybe its best you are not procreating.

This generation of total losers is so self absorbed and egocentric that they actually spew hatred because someone has a child.

You are all intolerant, pathetic, wannna-be-hip, losers!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:50 AM

9:44 and pedestrian traffic would be brought to a screeching halt - since even if a 2yr could regularly walk 20 blocks (they cant) they walk at a snails pace compared to an adult (and this applies to 3-5 yr olds as well) - you should be in Gov't - proposing more solutions that are worse than the problem.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 9:52 AM

What dude - its "refrain"

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:01 AM

"The What, you really are an imbecile. Compare crime rates in the U.S. to any country with stronger gun control laws and you'll see the vast majority of them have lower crime rates than America."

First, New York State has the toughest gun laws on the books! If you are caught carrying a unlicensed hand gun, thats 3.5 years in state prison! No if ands or buts about that! However people still use unlicensed hand guns and kill people. Why you ask? Most of the time people shoot people who don't have a handgun. If everyone had a gun, people wouldn't be so fast to use one. The odds would be equal. Look at the shooting last night, a UNARMED man was shot and killed. Image if this person had a gun too, maybe he would be alive today. If punks knew everyone was carrying guns, this city would be much safer.

Putnamdenizen I grew up in Bed Stuy and know whats going on. Unlike you with your Johnny come lately crap!

The What

Someday this war is gonna end..

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:05 AM

PS stroller moms are the worst new fascists. Your children shall rebel in the future and you'll ask yourself cluelessly: "Where did I go wrong?"

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:06 AM

Pedestrian traffic would be made worse by eliminating 50% of the strollers that clog sidewalks, store doorways and aisles, etc.? That's a dubious argument. As for whether two year olds can walk ten blocks, or walk faster than a snails pace, if yours can't it's because you assumed they couldn't.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:08 AM

Even if 10:06 WANTED to procreate, who would fuck him?

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:16 AM

10:08 makes his kids run. RUN or no dinner!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:18 AM

Remember: An armed society is a polite society!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:20 AM

THE WHAT, I'm going to assume that you had a lead water main at your crib in Bed-Stuy growing up... because that would explain the brain damage. Everyone packing heat would just result in gunfights and more people dead. But since you escaped to the burbs, you wouldn't have to worry about that--SELL OUT!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:22 AM

10:20 = future serial killer

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:23 AM

10:08 - please post a video on you tube of your 2yr old walking at anywhere near the pace or distance of even the most out-of-shape adult.

Video or it didnt (doesnt) happen

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:25 AM

10.06 - kids rebel when they become teenagers? - no way, can't believe it!

dingdong

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:25 AM

Wow, strollers and kids at a playground? What's next - people caught drinking alcohol in bars?

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:29 AM

Ah Biff. (Oh boy I'm trying to chill) Also this includes Ad Hominem attacks! I will not respond to attacks on me (if I can help it).

Must take more meds....

The What

Someday this war is gonna end....

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:41 AM

10.35, we're talking about real encounters, not your imagined internet scores.

"lol" - you're a myspacing 15 yr old.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:41 AM

10:35: You sound like quite a catch.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:48 AM

It's not the Stroller Moms who are dangerous fascists. It's the other story that nobody seems to care about: Doctoroff is now allowed to continue influencing public money as a private citizen. It's this friendly unaccountable subsidy-sucking leeches like Doctoroff who are bleeding us dry as hipsters and stroller moms knock each other around.

If you don't like Stroller Moms, then don't go to bars in Park Slope. But whether you like Doctoroff or not, your taxes are paying his mortgage.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:48 AM

Another Park Slope “stroller mafia” discussion? Some perspective is needed. The PS stroller mafia is bush league compared to some Manhattan parents. To whit:

- A woman and her 3-year-old (non-stroller) arrived at the entrance to preschool at the same time as me and my kid (w/ stroller). I was about to open the door when she did (graciously, I thought), ushered her kid in, went in herself, and let the door slam in my face
- I’m in the elevator with my kid and I’m giving him animal crackers as a snack when some stranger with her kid starts commenting “Oh, animal crackers, that’s an interesting snack” (translation: I can’t believe you’re feeding your kid that, you tramp )
- I’m trying to get my kid in his stroller and he’s having a tantrum. Another mother pulls her stroller up along side me (close enough so that I could poke her kid’s eyes out without fully extending my arm) and starts commenting to her daughter on the fact that my son is having a tantrum. I almost punched her (the mother) in the face.

All of these incidents happened at my kid’s preschool, where you might expect some level of civility since these parents will have to see the people they’ve annoyed every day. But that doesn’t seem to phase them at all. Parental behavior is even worse in Manhattan museums, playgrounds, etc. I’ve been to PS, and while some of these parents are a royal pain in the ass they are no comparison to their Manhattan counterparts.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:01 AM

Another Park Slope “stroller mafia” discussion? Some perspective is needed. The PS stroller mafia is bush league compared to some Manhattan parents. To whit:

- A woman and her 3-year-old (non-stroller) arrived at the entrance to preschool at the same time as me and my kid (w/ stroller). I was about to open the door when she did (graciously, I thought), ushered her kid in, went in herself, and let the door slam in my face
- I’m in the elevator with my kid and I’m giving him animal crackers as a snack when some stranger with her kid starts commenting “Oh, animal crackers, that’s an interesting snack” (translation: I can’t believe you’re feeding your kid that, you tramp )
- I’m trying to get my kid in his stroller and he’s having a tantrum. Another mother pulls her stroller up along side me (close enough so that I could poke her kid’s eyes out without fully extending my arm) and starts commenting to her daughter on the fact that my son is having a tantrum. I almost punched her (the mother) in the face.

All of these incidents happened at my kid’s preschool, where you might expect some level of civility since these parents will have to see the people they’ve annoyed every day. But that doesn’t seem to phase them at all. Parental behavior is even worse in Manhattan museums, playgrounds, etc. I’ve been to PS, and while some of these parents are a royal pain in the ass they are no comparison to their Manhattan counterparts.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:02 AM

10:35... sounds like you're into a little Strap-on action administered by the hot 20 somethings.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:02 AM

It really is crazy this knee jerk hostility towards mothers and children - but of course it comes from the denial and fear about adulthood that Americans enjoying their protracted post-adolescence suffer from. When I was pregnant with my first child I was actually repelled by mothers' besotted looks of love they gave their children - and completely traumatized by the idea that I was destined to have the same stroller as everyone else. I did however understand that what I was reacting to was the imminent loss of identity that comes with parenthood - identity that in this city is very wrapped up in how hip and happening you are. there is simply no way to look hip with a stroller. The great news is that when you have children - even though the transition can be very traumatic - you sooner or later don't give a shit what you look like, and succumb to the reality that so many people in their 20s and 30s try to resist:: we are just one link in this chain of life. That's why having children generally gives you a more forgiving and less petty perspective on things. And why this anti-stroller mom vitriol sounds to parents like the desperate cries of those "who doth protest too much..."

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:05 AM

11.02 - thanks for pointing that out! I hadn't noticed the particular wording.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:09 AM

No kidding, dude. When I first met my wife...damn she was hot. And tight! Two kids later, her body is so different. It's not her fault. She exercises like crazy and has tried to get back to where she was, but there's no fighting mother nature I guess. I still love her like crazy, but am I attracted to her in the same way? Well, no. To be honest, it's kind of hard to feel much when we're having sex because she's so "loose" now. It's like just dipping my 'equipment' in freestanding water or something. Bummer. That's why I have a hard time every summer keeping my eyes off the young hot thangs in their short shorts.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:17 AM

PS stroller mafia bashing again, sigh. Nothing but re-runs on these days.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:17 AM

11:17, you've pretty well summed up the last 20 years of my life.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:24 AM

11:17 - is this a joke? or are you really that repellent?

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:27 AM

Makes me think of Eliot Spitzer. Hell, who can blame him for hitting that hooker. She was young, hot and in great shape. I'd hit that!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:28 AM

Nearly all PS stroller mom's are Manhattan transplants, so it is not surprising that Manhattan is rife with this self righteous breed as well.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:29 AM

11:17, you express yourself a bit more crudely than I would, but I can't deny the fundamental core of truth in what you say. I alternate between thinking "Oh well, that's just life" and feeling really depressed about it. I've never cheated on my wife and hope I never do, but I'd be a liar if I said I didn't think about it sometimes. And PLEASE don't mention the hot young "thangs" in their short shorts again. It's painful to see them!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:34 AM

10:06 here. When stroller mommas are out in the playground, ever wonder where their hubbies are? Most of them don't even qualify as milf, sorry. Husband strays and she never knows. I agree with 11:17. Soon as she's maried and pushes out that little Damien between her legs, sex goes down. They're like fish, not only because they rank, but because they have a instinctive view that men are only for procreation. That crotch is a big trap and we always fall for it.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:36 AM

calling someone "self righteous" is just as bad as calling someone or something "pretentious"

makes the person look self righteous.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:36 AM

OMG this is hilarious. This is the crap that people think all the time but never, ever fess up to. A violent backlash will begin any minute now...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:38 AM

The What is still a ghetto ass punk bitch. Even more so for running away to New Jersey.

Stoller dads are HOT. Push it. Push it real good!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:39 AM

Oh yeah, those hot young thangs in those summertime short shorts. Damn. They look irresistible compared to the frumpy, sack o'potatoes PS stroller moms.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:42 AM

I nominate this thread for the Brownstoner Hall of Fame.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:45 AM

11.17, c'est la vie

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 11:58 AM

Any Moms wanna tap me? I am a handsome, studly 30 something single guy in the Slope. Beefcake materials. I kid you knot. Please tap me. I'll take you to Ozzie's afterwards and let burb your kid while you get a latte...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 12:03 PM

Brownstoner: Get your shit together and fix this double post issue.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 12:04 PM

11.27 = naive in the extreme

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 12:06 PM

Yeah, you have to love that skull and crossbones on the last stroller! Whoever rides in there must be DANGEROUS! better get some iron crosses on there too.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 12:38 PM

"My 12-year-old daughter and I live in southwestern Bed-Stuy"

Eh, excuse me. Where is "Southwestern Bed Stuy" at? Do you and your Daughter use a compass? I moved to Lodi NJ, please tell me.

The What (I have to go to the drug store, I ran out of meds)

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:05 PM

"My 12-year-old daughter and I live in southwestern Bed-Stuy"

Eh, excuse me. Where is "Southwestern Bed Stuy" at? Do you and your Daughter use a compass? I moved to Lodi NJ, please tell me.

The What (I have to go to the drug store, I ran out of meds)

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:06 PM

I always wonder where those stroller mom's husbands are....because I got to get out of their apartment before they get home.

Some of you may see frumpy 30 somethings, but when you strip off the sweats alot of those Moms will blow your mind (and alot more)

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:15 PM

I really dont find stroller moms to be that annoying - I have a problem with those f'ing Blacks...so loud, and pushy always making a scene, blocking sidewalks hanging out....

Thats ok to say...right????

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:19 PM

Lock up your short shorted teenage daughters, Park Slope Fathers. The dirty old men are out there...

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:32 PM

I can't stand the gays, personally. Or the Filipinos.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:37 PM

yep always one asshole

Anyways I'm a dad and I live in the slope with 3 children... I have agree I hate to see a 5yr old in a stroller. Let the kid walk so he doesnt grow up to be lazy and thinking that he or she is entitled to special treatment.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:40 PM

"Trust me 10:16, plenty of chicks fuck me. Most of them are hot 20 somethings whose bodies have not been distorted beyond recognition by childbirth. And they don't have scars from C-sections either. lol

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:35 AM"

What a damn misogynist. I'm a female not from PS and I wish I met you in person so that I could spit on your face, you coward who hides behind ananymity.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 1:58 PM

LOL...anytime you're ready, bitch. But beware, I'm apt to bend you over afterwards. I like 'em feisty!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:07 PM

Park Slope MILFS are hot!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:08 PM

10:35/2:07 = fat kid in basement with microcock

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:11 PM

Some are really nice moms, but fat! Lard ass stroller moms.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:11 PM

doesn't seem very mysogynistic too me, in fact he seems to love 'em as long as they're 20.

you're probably transferring your misandry.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:15 PM

http://curbed.com/archives/2008/03/26/carroll_gardensboerum_hill_attacked_by_strollers_skateboards.php

read this idiots.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:21 PM

I am 11:27 and am not naive, I just find it really gross that anyone (i.e., 11:17) would talk about his wife like she was a piece of discardable meat on this lame-ass blog.

Keep it to yourself you sophmoric sexless American idiot (who probably wears a baseball hat).

And as a brooklyn mother, I can tell you that most of you stroller DADs look and act like you had your balls chopped off a long time ago. I wouldn't touch you with a ten foot pole. Thank god I married a man who remains a man even after becoming a father. And who would never dis me on some time-wasting, dork-magnet blog (even if he does dream of fucking other women).

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:33 PM

Yes, how tasteless it is when people blurt out the truth that way. The bastards!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:37 PM

2.33 - thats the point - he does think about it even if he doesn't act on it. thats why you are naive in your earlier post (which you now seemed to have realized). BTW, I'm dutch.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:38 PM

Did you even read the post, 2:33? He said he loves his wife like crazy IN SPITE of it all. And let me tell you, I don't know any man who's been married for more than five years who doesn't think of having sex with his wife as a chore. As one friend put it:

"I think I've had sex with my wife at least 2000 times now. What's the point of 2001?"

It's just the way men are. We like variety. Blame evolution.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:40 PM

2.33 - thats the point - he does think about it even if he doesn't act on it. thats why you are naive in your earlier post (which you now seemed to have realized). BTW, I'm dutch.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:41 PM

people please - can we all carry own being politically correct apprently non-libidinous hyprocrites. its so much more polite. Moms really don't want to know. You're gonna be making life hard for 2.33's husband.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 2:43 PM

I'd like to hook you up to a polygraph and see you say the same

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 3:45 PM

Well, and he missed the point completely. No one said you shouldn't love your wife. Love and sex ain't the same thing. The idea is to love your wife and bang your neighbor's teenage daughter.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 3:57 PM

"Mr. What,

Did anyone ever tell you about maps?

Southwestern Bed Stuy = near the Nostrand stop on the A/C trains, rather than near the G train or the J-M-Z."

There is no east/west/south/north thing. This is a form of divide and conquer. Clinton HIll is Clinton Hill. Thats it.

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

BTW I will chill because I can see the end of the war. It's still far away but I can see it.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 4:07 PM

I love how people here are implying that it is the Husbands who are out f^cking around on their stroller Moms - well they might be, but Mom is too (what the hell do you think that 1x a week "me time" babysitter is for) and I can tell you those 35+ moms love to get all nasty and perverted too. So you losers keep ogling on that annoying 20 something bimbo and when you get home and look at your wife just remember that there is a decent chance she found someone like me to give it to her the way you used to....

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 4:26 PM

Sounds like a win/win to me. If you'll keep my wife busy while I bang a 20 year old, I'll gladly pay you an hourly rate. Thanks!

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 4:52 PM

I've got news for you 4:52, she ain't 20. See you in prison.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 6:29 PM

ahhhhhhhhh the fucking stroller mafia! i am sooooo glad i don't live in slope.

Posted by: guest at March 26, 2008 10:14 PM

yes 3:57! love your wife and do nice things for her but definitly bang the hot teenager next door. now that's the way to live a happy and fullfilling life!

Posted by: guest at March 27, 2008 12:50 AM

No one said you're ridiculous to love your husband. Nor are you ridiculous to love your kids. The point was just that love and sex have nothing to do with each other. Your husband still loves you as much as he ever did, I suspect. He just doesn't want to fuck you anymore, and fucking someone else, for him, is just like masturbating into a void. It doesn't reflect a lack of love for you or the presence of love for another woman. It reflects nothing. It's just exciting and feels good.

Period.

Posted by: guest at March 27, 2008 7:21 AM

Do you like food, Kuroko? Yes? Tell you what, then. For the rest of your life, I'd like you to eat chicken every night for dinner. And I want you to find creative and inventive ways to make chicken interesting and satisfying every night.

I have no doubt that you can keep chicken interesting for quite some time. There orange chicken, lemon Tuscany chicken, and so on. You can also "flirt" with interesting side dishes if that will help. But I'll be interested to see how you're doing ten years from now when I present you with a nice New York strip steak, or some ravioli stuffed with beets and ricotta cheese, covered with a light touch of truffle oil and poppy seeds.

Bon appetit!

Posted by: guest at March 27, 2008 9:06 AM

3:47- finally someone says something intelligent. love and do nice things for your wife but also bang your neighbors teenage daughter as well. that's called living life to the fullest.

Posted by: guest at March 27, 2008 9:09 AM

"Love manifests itself in the actions we take. Turning to others for sex instead of finding new, creative, intimate ways of keeping your sex life alive is an act against your Love for your spouse."

Turning to others for sex is itself a way to keep your sex life alive, and it may even benefit sex within your marriage. It's no more an act against your spouse than is asking someone else to scratch an itch that you can't reach.

"It's an amazing feat of moral flexibility to seperate Love and sex..."

It's not a feat to separate love and sex. They come that way, separate. It's an amazing feat of social construction to combine them into a single, prohibitive package.

"...and to characterize any partner, spouse or mistress, as a "void" solely present for your masturbatory pleasure. Again sounds very lonely."

Presumably the partner is there for their own pleasure, same as you.

Posted by: guest at March 27, 2008 9:12 AM