Open House Picks

The price is wrong on the Prospect Place house. The listing price is $1.95 million.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:30 PM

Crown Heights house is insanely priced.

Corcoran is on crack about this one.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:36 PM

The house at 205 12th Street was listed with Corcoran just a few months ago for $999. Their website said it was "SOLD" (see link below). If so, why is BP selling it for $450K more just a few months later????http://corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=1058630

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:41 PM

Really, 1:36? Total gut renovation with all new mechanicals, central zoned AC, gourmet kitchen with two ovens and two dishwashers, in the Crown Heights house. If you buy a place for less then you're the one shelling out the dough and the time to do all that work. That said, they might have done TOO much updating for any house in this location. Sometimes you don't get back what you put into it unless you stay in a house many many years and let the market catch up to your total investment.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:42 PM

Hey, that's true 1:41. Now I remember that house. Is it a quick flip or what the hell?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:42 PM

because, 1:42, the previous owner hid $500,000 worth of gold and rubies somewhere in the house.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:43 PM

That Wellington Court house seems like a great deal on a quiet street. It seems that the broker has actually taken the fact that it's at the end of the street closest to the subway into account. Moved 200 feet it would go for close to 200k more. If I didn't already have a house in this neighbohood, I'd consider this as a way to get an affordable house in Victorian Flatbush.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:43 PM

boring line up.

Brownstoner, what were you up to yesterday rejecting postings left and right?
I had at least two postings zapped.
Is it a technical glitch or censorship?
I can see stopping hateful posts, but mine
were just regular, maybe a little snide, but nothing out of the ordinary. What gives?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:43 PM

Even if it's right next to the tracks and needs TLC, that Wellington Court Houseis a good deal. Madison, like Fillmore, tends to underprice. I bought through Fillmore (under the radar) and, I think, saved myself more than a few pennies.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:46 PM

Brownstoner the Prepect Pl house is listed at BHS for 1.95m.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:49 PM

Hysterical!

On the Prospect Place house link, they wrote:

"Façade, roof and windows have been recently updated; now the fun work of renovating the interior begins."

The FUN WORK?! I needed a laugh today.

Thank you, BrownHarrisStevens!

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:50 PM

12th street house is in Gowanus, not Park Slope.

very overpriced.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:50 PM

the ditmas park house is cute...how far is that from Midtown via train....anyone know.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:55 PM

no pics of the crown heights house???
Renovated and all, I still think it's priced too high.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 1:57 PM

The Wellington Court house is far enough from Avenue H. The above poster is right - it's an entry into a neighborhood that is becoming less and less affordable. Opportunities like this, in DP and in Brooklyn, generally, are few and far between these days.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:03 PM

i like crown heights. but does anyone in their right mind want to pay $300K more for this place than for other million dollar houses that have sat on the market?
didn't think so, especially so far down on the parkway

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:06 PM

Saw the 12th street house ages ago, when it was listed by corcoran. It had been listed at 999 for months, and the agent was making all sorts of "price is negotiable" noises. I think it sold for around 900 K.

Cute place but small - what are they thinking?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:09 PM

The Park Slope house at $3.3ml is too high.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:09 PM

The Wellington Ct house is not an express stop on the Q. If you time the trains - this would be easy because they run right next to the house, you could catch the local that pulls into Newkirk a minute or two before the express and be in midtown within 45 minutes. There are also numerous express bus options with midtown only runs. Although you can't completely buffer the sound of the train at grade level, there are excellent insulation products and soundproof windows that will make a huge and worthwhile difference. The house seems to be priced with all of this in mind. Good way to get into a great family friendly neighborhood.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:12 PM

BROWNSTONER--you have to correct the price of the Prospect Place house. It is $1.95, not $3.25.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:12 PM

Re: The Wellington house, I'd guess 45 minutes to midtown via the B.

Madison may tend to price houses well like Fillmore, but the firm has none of the negatives that I keep hearing about Fillmore. I've never heard anything negative about Madison unlike Fillmore. Isn't Fillmore the one that listed a row house last week as a "raised ranch"?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:15 PM

i'm sorry but 12th street between 3/4th for 1.45m? what are they smoking?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:16 PM

It would be really interesting to find out what the heck happened with 12th Street house.

Streeteasy shows:

08/14/2007 Listed in StreetEasy with Corcoran at $999,999
11/06/2007 Listing no longer available

And Corcoran shows the house as SOLD (presumably in November):
http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=1058630

And NOW it's listed with for $450K more with BP???

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:20 PM

I am assuming they are hoping to sell 12th Street to a developer who will tear it down and build a little condoplex.

A little late in the game for that sort of thing, but that's my guess.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:23 PM

I REALLY hope they get asking for the 12th street house. I live down the block and I would love to delude myself that my place is worth that kind of dough too!

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:28 PM

so much for a spring listings spree. . this is really, really slim pickings

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:29 PM

The Park Slope house at $3.3ml is too high.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:31 PM

I saw the 12th st house too.

The listing says its a 20x45 building

Its not, its 20x32

FREAKIN TINY ! !

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:41 PM

I thought the same thing, 2:32, the Ditmas house is insanely cluttered. Huge turnoff.

Please people, everyone - it doesn't mean you're bad parents if you don't let your kids have every single one of their toys the entire time you're trying to sell. The more money you make from selling, the better off financially your whole family will be. Financialy responsiblity is considered good parenting too.

Secondly, storage units do not cost that much. Use one. Pack up all your junk and put it in there. If you're selling you have to pack anyway. Only keep what you'd take with you if you were going on a month-long trip somewhere. Get down to the bare necessities.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:41 PM

Agreed that the Crown Heights place is way overpriced. That price might be possible in 30 years, after gentrification has had more time to clean up the neighborhood.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:47 PM

The desertified yard with the Ditmas house doesn't help much. How difficult is it to put away toys for a picture?

I kind of like the murals. Someone who buys the house is going to have children, so that's OK. That someone is going to want to believe there's a place to put the kid's things, though.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:51 PM

Packing away clutter is not just for kid stuff it, all of your clutter should be packed away. All of the houses featured should be staged to sell in order to get the most money. You'd think that with the commissions that the agents earn on each sale, they'd have somebody on staff to do this.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:52 PM

As usual Corcoran wins the Overpriced Listing Award. Glad to see they are still singlehandedly trying to keep this bubble from bursting.

I feel sorry for anyone who bought in Crown Heights. Speculation has stopped and these people are going to be upside down for YEARS to come. I'd hate to be sitting on a white elephant in that crime infested hellhole for the next decade or more that it takes to get your investment back.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:57 PM

The really good brokers will do the staging themselves, 2:52. I think too many sellers only care about commission and don't pay attention to negotiating the rest.

If I used a broker I'd rather pay a full commission and get staging, professional photos and professional floorplan, than get NOTHING for a lower commission with some rinky dink firm.

Not that all the bigger firms offer those services, because they don't. It's a broker by broker thing. Wherever they're from, just be sure to ask about the services they'll give you - don't only ask them the commission they're charging. A lower commission means nothing if you can't sell or you have to lower your price a lot more to sell.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 2:58 PM

The Ditmas House is very nice but it is literally on the subway tracks. You look out onto the subway tracks and when you are outside, you can't hear yourself think. The sound proofing is pretty good inside though. Thus the huge discount for the nabe. The house is nice though and actually has a decent amount of details.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 3:02 PM

The Wellington Court house has been on the market for a while (8 months at least). It is cute, has been tastefully if not always expensively (standard fare vinyl replacement windows) remodeled by a proud DYIer, has a large backyard, but the proximity to the train kept us away.

The asking price has trickled down a bit, making it a rare, "affordable" property in D.P.

Dan Shapiro, a strange fellow and perhaps not entirely scrupulous broker, will be sure to tout the fact that a police captain or the like lives right across the street.

All in all, it is fairly discounted for the subway noise, is in a decent neighborhood and on a charming block.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 3:06 PM

It's the dirt and toxins that would bother me more being right next to the subway tracks, not the noise. For some reason traffic and trains and sirens don't bother me. Voices, TV and music bother me terribly.

The house is cute in a simple farmhouse way. But they need to make some effort to show they are realistically trying to sell the place. It looks like crap. I'm being cruel to be kind. I'm just not that forgiving when people make zero effort to clean up and stage when selling, because I worked my mother lovin' a** off when we were selling.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 3:09 PM

The DP is no where near as cluttered as some of the other crap I've seen for sale at this price point.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 3:17 PM

Yeah, you people are totally exaggerating about "clutter". This is nothing compared to the recent Prospect Heights Corcoran listing at 166 Prospect Place, or many others for that matter. Give me a break.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 3:36 PM

Why would anybody's standard be the worst on the market, not the best?

There's no good excuse not to declutter any property at any price point during a slow market. Sorry.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 5:18 PM

To the commenter, who called me a strange fellow and "perhaps not entirely scrupulous broker", this is far from courteous. I can prove everything I have said about the house and neighborhood. Ditmas Park, a multicultural community, prides itself on our ability to get along and our innate charm and civility. I am sorry, if you don't like the house or me, but be polite.
Perhaps you should consider another neighborhood

Dan Shapiro

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 5:36 PM

Go get 'em, Dan!

Now, how about ringing up your client in Ditmas and telling them to shovel some of their crap into a storage unit or the garbage? Paint rooms neutral colors, pack up the family photos, ditch most of the toys and provide hidden storage for the rest. In short, make it possible for people with teeny, tiny imaginations the ability to envision *their* family living there.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 5:52 PM

Somebody's been watching WAY too much HGTV.

Or is that you, Clive?

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 6:10 PM

The 12th Street house closed last Friday! A quick paint job and a price increase of $450K in a down market.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 6:34 PM

The DP house will sell at or close to ask without staging or storing anything. There's just so little inventory, people will bite at anything. Especially at this price.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 6:39 PM

RE: Crown Heights

That would explain the two beds in the master bedroom as well.

Posted by: guest at February 15, 2008 10:03 PM

The 12th Street house is ridiculous. Property shark lists the total square footage as 1,420 sf and it's in a dubious area (calling it PS is a major stretch). I know everyone loves to point to Corcoran's prices, but they seem downright cheap compared to Brooklyn Properties these days - remember, BP is the broker that took 799 carroll practically weeks after it closed at around 2.2 and is now trying to flip it for 2.9!

Posted by: guest at February 16, 2008 1:10 AM

BklynDahl is right on about 12th st

When i saw it, it should have been getting beautiful south facing afternoon sun.
The rest of the block was.

Instead, it was in the shadow of the HUGE building being built on the corner.

very depressing

Posted by: guest at February 16, 2008 11:29 AM

i love the 12th street house.

adorable.

Posted by: guest at February 16, 2008 11:38 AM

Anyone who is buying now, beware of a true market downturn heading New York's way. I know it's been discussed ad nauseum on this board and I've always been on the fence about it. But now even analysts are predicting an up to 20% downturn in NYC RE. This includes Manhattan and prime Brooklyn. I would still argue that brownstones, being in such limited supply, will hold their value better than condos. But they will not be immune.

Not worth my time going into all of the facts and figures behind this prediction b/c I'm just making a friendly warning.

We were buyers (in the prime Brooklyn brownstone market) up until a few weeks ago and finally decided to back out and continue renting for the next 6 months to a year. No need to risk losing 20% on a $2mm property- that stings too much.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 10:01 AM

"No need to risk losing 20% on a $2mm property"

But you only lose if you sell.

Arent you going to buy a house and live in it for the next 5-10ys?

Timing is a fools game.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 10:25 AM

Smart move 10:01! Why buy now??!! Just wait, this shit is gonna crash.

"No need to risk losing 20% on a $2mm property"

But you only lose if you sell.

Arent you going to buy a house and live in it for the next 5-10ys?

Timing is a fools game."

Nice statement asshole. Timing is NOT a fools game. It's saves you from great pain.

The What

Someday this war is gonna end...

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 10:30 AM

I moved to NYC in 2002.

That is the first time I heard the phrase "NYC is over priced, im waiting for prices to come down"

I agree the prices are insane, but as long as people with more money than us are prepared to pay these prices, things wont change.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 12:03 PM

"Timing is NOT a fools game"

You'd think that coping and pasting from Bloomberg, you would have learnt something.

tell us how timing is smart mr tWhat?

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 12:16 PM

Just returned from 88 Prospect open house. The place is a total dump. Warped walls throughout the house, no detail, needs a gut renovation. Can only really see it as a condo conversion. Overpriced wreck.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 3:55 PM

I also went to the Prospect Place open house in Park Slope. However, I only saw the parlor floor. I took one step up the first floor staircase, became totally disgusted with the general state of the place, turned around and left. What little I saw of the house was horrible. The walls leading up to the second floor were indeed wavy and dinged up, and the place just looked awful all around. I am surprised that Brown Harris Stevens would take such a listing. The open house did look well-attended, though.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 6:24 PM

Of course the open house was well attended. All the open houses for everything right now are well attended. Like it or not, people ARE still buying. Sure there are opportunities with some motivated sellers to pick up some bargains now and in the next year, but anybody like 10:01am sitting around waiting to buy a house that's both awesome AND is at a 20% discount, dream on. Or, properties that were shooting too high to begin with. In which case you're not buying 20% below market, just 20% below original asking price. Not the same thing.

The only reason so many brownstones were for sale the last few years were because longtime homeowners were cashing out. None of the newer younger homeowners cash out unless there's a divorce or they get transferred. Just look at what's on the market right now. Not much! And you think if the market drops even more everybody's going to say, "oh look honey, I know we planned to live here at least 10 years, but now we can make even less money so let's sell now". Mmmm....right. That makes sense.

Posted by: guest at February 17, 2008 8:56 PM

Curious if anyone went to the 12th street OH this weekend...Any info to share?

Posted by: guest at February 18, 2008 8:24 AM

way overpriced

Posted by: guest at February 18, 2008 10:59 AM

Prospect Pl is a POS

Posted by: guest at February 18, 2008 11:10 AM

"tell us how timing is smart mr tWhat?"

I'm not The What but Robert Shiller correctly timed NASDAQ's demise in the late 90's. Heed taken could have made you very wealthy or saved you from bankruptcy. I'd call that smart.

Joe Kennedy and Jesse Livermore correctly timed the Crash of 1929 and made millions. I'd also call that smart.

Failure to comprehend the extreme likelihood that, after inflation, you will never see these home prices again in your lifetime is NOT smart. We're euphorically waking up from the biggest U.S. housing boom on record. You can wait 10, 25 or 50 years and you would never see ROI. Not smart.

Homes at these prices will depreciate like cars to a much lower intrinsic value. They may blip up during subsequent good times but not like 2003-2008. The high cost of housing in New York was already built in before this boom took off so arguments on that premise are futile. Excess price fat will be trimmed dramatically.

Guest at February 17, 2008 10:01 AM just made the smartest decision of his/her life. -20% is highly optimistic in real terms. We were not prepared for the upturn and we will not be prepared for the downturn.

Posted by: guest at February 18, 2008 1:37 PM

Hey 1:37 how long have you been waiting for housing to crash? Ha, Ha.

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 6:12 AM

Three years, 6:12. But that's not nearly as long as you'll be waiting for it to bottom and rebound (never will). Ha...ha...ha...ha...the joke's on you Jack!

Man, the gold and cash I'm saving while only paying $975/mo (free utilities) for a floorthrough. What is that, your maintenance?

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 7:11 AM

To anyone who thinks the NY housing market can't be affected by the real estate downturn because "New York is different", please check fairly recent history. In the early 90s, MANHATTAN real estate prices fell 30-40%.

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 10:59 AM

7:11 -- (BTW, is that where you work?) I own my place dude, maintenance, whatever.

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 11:12 AM

Hey 7:11

If you bought 3 years ago instead of sitting on your hands, you'd be looking pretty good now.

No?

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 11:17 AM

The one thing that hardly ever gets mentioned on this board is the still skyrocketing cost of quality reno. work. Places that are well renovated will tend to retain their value (even with grante countertops).

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 11:20 AM

The Eastern Parkway property will sell for around $1mm. 1:36 et. al. Here's the deal. It is well located. One block to the 2/3 one block to 4/5. Twenty minutes to Wall Street. Second, it is located 1 1/2 blocks from the Lubavitch headquarters. Third, the children of the hasidim and the children of the black middle class that chose to buy homes in the 60s and 70s are coming home to be near their families. They have the income and know the pluses and minuses of the hood.

I'm glad you can't afford to buy that property.

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 12:37 PM

I bring my work home on occasion, 11:12. How much is your maintenance, may I ask?

No, 11:17. If I would have bought three years ago AND S-O-L-D in 2006 or 2007, I'd be looking okay now. Paper equity is worthless (whether AY gets built or not). You have to sell, then rent, to look good. Otherwise you just jump right back into the fire of "tulips". It's a pyramid scheme - ya gotta get out before it collapses to it's intrinisic value (incomes and rents - calls for a 25 to 50 percent collapse from top)

I prematurely called the top in 2005 but not by much. The top is now behind us. We are on our way to the bottom. I'm not sitting on my hands - I'm sitting on a pot of cash and gold. Otherwise, I would have been sitting on a depreciating asset. I would not be looking good at all in that case.

Homes at prevailing prices right now are for emotional investment only. The ROI game is over for at least a decade.

Posted by: guest at February 19, 2008 1:05 PM