House of the Day: 462 Henry Street

the house look stunning.

i love it.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 1:37 PM

Very high end renovation? The cabinets look like they might be expensive, but the appliances (Kitchenaid) and the bathroom, while attractive, do not look particularly expensive.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 1:41 PM

The house is actually an owner's duplex with two rental apartments on the top two floors. The parlor floor is done very well, but the rentals and need some serious work, especially the top floor. From what I saw yesterday, I think this thing will go for closer to $2.2mil.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 1:52 PM

Not everyone (even some of us who like to cook) has a fetish about high-end kitchen applicances. I, for one, would rather see care put into the stuff you can't see that matters - plumbing, electrical upgrades, etc. - in a reno. Place looks nice. No idea about the price over there.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 1:52 PM

I'd live in the duplex - but I'd never rent that wierd apartment with the curved step-up flooring between the kitchen and the living room - what is that all about?

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 1:58 PM

10 blocks to that crappy subway line and they want that much money? Crazy

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:03 PM

yes, this will sell at this price or above. even I think it's a good deal, and I never think anything is a good deal

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:04 PM

the answer to this, is YES. cobble hill is a landmarked nabe with very little for sale and an excellent school.

expect rents to rise, so will income from apts.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:06 PM

is it zoned for PS29? if so, they'll get something around this

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:10 PM

I went for the open house. There were droves of people all over the house, never been to such a well attended open house. The owners duplex is nice though not as high end as it looks in the photos. The rental units were quite awful.

The house at 259 Henry is larger on a larger lot too.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:14 PM

Nice owner's duplex (although those Prudential Elliman photos -- wow do they make things look much larger than they actually are). The rental apartments are almost completely devoid of detail. They've turned the third floor apartment into a weird white box with a bizarre stage-like platform that makes no sense at all. They've effectively lowered the ceiling. And that top floor apartment is half white box, half pre-war brownstone. And what's up with that recessed ceiling on the top floor? Does the roof slope, or is there a higher ceiling up there somewhere? But the area is prime, prime, prime. And how bad is this market, really? I think it'll fetch the price.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:18 PM

I always find it interesting that the people who are kitchen appliance snobs often eat out and order in. Many don't even know how to boil pasta, or are so busy working for the dough to buy Sub Zero that they don't have time to cook.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:19 PM

It always amazes me that people who would be challenged to cook a hard-boiled egg correctly can be so obsessed with the brand of the stove.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:32 PM

I'm aware of the waste line step-up bathroom issue, except in this case, it is nowhere near the bathroom.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:42 PM

I made the original fetish comment - and I agree - it isn't what you make your decision on. If you want a higher end range (or other appliance), you buy a new one, plug it in, and sell or donate the old one.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:44 PM

Frankly, if you are renovating a place with a mind to sell, it doesn't really pay to put in the high end stuff, in my opinion, as long as what is there is OK (like kitchenaid). Anyone who really cares about that stuff is more likely to prefer one brand or model over another one,and you likely won't have installed the one they want. Like paint colors, it doesn't pay to go all out on them - as they are easy for owners to change. Unlike the harder to do stuff - like plumbing and electrical.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:51 PM

What cracks me up most about so many of the high end kitvhens are the range hoods which often don't even vent outside, but just recirculate the filtered air making them effectively worthless.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 2:55 PM

I used to live in this neighborhood and I absolutely love it--but paying over 2 mil to live in a 2-bed, 1 bath apt seems a little extreme to me.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:10 PM

Hmmm...I don't quite understand the over-emphasis on appliances. If I were moving to a new home, I wouldn't want someone else's appliances, I'd buy new ones. When I do my kitchen over, I'm buying good quality appliances that are not over the top... e.g., KitchenAid or GE Profile. They do the job admirably. Same for painting...it used to be routine to repaint a house when moving in...if only to freshen up the place. So why worry about what colors the rooms are painted?

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:13 PM

i lived in cobble hill - quick walk to the F, no?

also, i can walk a block in less than a minute, so don't think that it's a real concern.

the appliance thing is total nonsense! ridiculous!

stick with solid american brands like GE - they work and work well. the fancy stuff is fine i guess, but many could care less.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:16 PM

Have KitchenAid/ and GE in the last 5 years and are both are crap. That said the appliance in a non issues when looking at property in this area. You usually put in your own eventually. But what disturbs me more from the photos - Where did the fireplaces go? Having lived in CH browonstones most of my life, there not being there is a little like missing a limb, even if there are non-working.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:24 PM

"i can walk a block in less than a minute"

So, can I, but should I if I paid $2.5M? In the worst heat of the summer, in the snow, in the rain, after working ten hours and then trying to get home from the kind of Manhattan job that allows one to buy such a house, I don't want to ride the worst subway line and still have to walk so far. Therefore, a house closer to the subway and on a better route is worth more money.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:26 PM

BTW....Just doing a little research here for all the appliance snobs in the crowd...

Kitchenaid Series II dishwasher = $1400 bucks
Bosch Dishwasher = $850.00

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:27 PM

We have a mix of appliances in our kitchen. All domestic mid-range brands, and then one European, the Bosch dishwasher. The one we are least pleased with is the Bosch dishwasher. It cleans well, it's quiet, but the design flaw in many Bosh dishwashers (and Bosch clothes washers too from what I hear) is they don't drain completely so hot water mixed with food micro-particles sits in a well in the bottom of the dishwasher and after about a day it start to smell, as my husband finally described it, like the Mouth of Hell. Yes, I do rinse out the filter. That's not the problem. The filter doesn't even ever have any food in it. We rinse food off dishes before putting them in the dishwasher. The problem is simply the stupid design.

It also costs a lot more money and is a PITA to repair European appliances. To each his own, but as for us, this dishwasher is the last European appliance I ever buy. We were far more happy with our high-end Kenmore dishwasher we'd installed in our old place.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:30 PM

by the way guys look up on nyc.gov 489 henry st it actually sold for 3.6 million so yes i think this is a good deal

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:32 PM

by the way guys look up on nyc.gov 489 henry st it actually sold for 3.6 million so yes i think this is a good deal

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:34 PM

Thanks, Rehab - a puppet stage it must be! I know a 4-year old who would love that!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:36 PM

Actually, when you work 10 hours, mostly at a desk more or less (or many, many more hours per day, as I was doing to afford my first apartment purchase), you really need that 10-15 minute walk to and from the subway - it is likely the only exercise you are getting during the week. The fresh air is good for you, too - the only fresh air you get all day. Make that "to" to subway, as you know you take a taxi or a black car home when you work late...

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:39 PM

How do you find that info on nyc.gov?

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:40 PM

KitchenAid makes more than one dishwasher model...different price points. Ditto for Kenmore & GE.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:46 PM

nyc.gov/acris click on "begin using acris" then click on "search property records" then click on "parcel identifier" and put in block 323 lot 3 and you will find it

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:47 PM

Enough with the Appliances already! Sheesh.

Nice house, but as 3:10 points out, the buyer will be shelling out
2.5m for a 2br 1 ba duplex.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:49 PM

on the whole, 3:46 kitchenaid and kenmore...the nicer models are just as expensive and high quality, if not moreso than their european made counterparts.

that was the point.

don't argue with things that aren't there.

if you hate kitchenaid because you have a gripe with the company...that's fine. that's your right.

but to suggest that because someone has inferior appliances simply because of that, is ignorant, at best.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:50 PM

I live across the steet (not the mentioned comp) and the walk is a very pleasant 8 minutes, about 4 blocks, to the subway. Not at all unpleasant unless it's raining and you've forgotten your umbrella. :)

I don't think the distance to the subway should have any effect on the price of this one. And this is coming from someone who spent 5 years living *above* the subway station before this, so considers myself among the spoiled- who normally complain about a 10 minute walk to the subway like some of the above posters...

BB

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 3:57 PM

I thought kitchen Aide was high-end.
Shows you what I know.
I think this house is high end too.
perfectly nice.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:01 PM

Interesting note on the new home sales data released today:

"Regionally, the northeast is the least important part of the country for new home sales, but it is also the strongest. There were 65,000 new homes sold in that region last year, up 3 percent from 2006. But the other three regions were all down at least 26 percent, with the west (California, there you go) off the most at 32%."

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:01 PM

"I live across the steet (not the mentioned comp) and the walk is a very pleasant 8 minutes, about 4 blocks, to the subway"

You cannot live across the street and get to the subway in 4 blocks. Look on the map.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:14 PM

I absolutely love my 10 minute walk to the subway. It is often some of the only exercise I get during the day and it is a lovely walk which gives me a chance to clear my head. A short walk to the subway would mean very little to me when buying a house. But that may not be true for everyone.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:16 PM

This is just a few houses in from caroll gardens.

And the duplex is 2 bedrooms.

The walk to the subway sucks.

Speaking of subways, I loved that article on commutes in the NY Times. The most unhappy commuters are those who take the subway! If you read the aticles online, the commuters who take metro north for 45 minutes are all happy and love the down time. goes to show you...

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:20 PM

Nothing like the beautiful houses in Park Slope.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:30 PM

Henry street is to me the most beautiful Block all the way from the start to the end in Carroll Gardens. No problem with the asking price with this street you could not ask for a nicer block.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:31 PM

On the OTHER side of the BQE is NOT a schlep. It is a very nice walk and everyone could use the exercise. Everyone should live on the other side of the BQE!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:32 PM

Until you have live on "the other side" you don't know what living really is.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:34 PM

The subways are pure torment.
By far the worst thing about NYC.
Pure grundge and uglyness.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:36 PM

The folks who buy this house will probaly not use the subway very much. I find the distance away from the subway a plus. I think that in general that is why Carroll Gardens was always nice. No subways.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:41 PM

If I buy this house I will no longer commute. I will just stay at home each day and play with my appliances. They're lovely appliances.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:41 PM

"The folks who buy this house will probaly not use the subway very much."
WTF do you mean?

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:45 PM

After I buy this house I am going to buy the MTA and then create a new subway stop and a new subway, which I will call the Me-line, because it will take me to and from where ever I want to go.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:52 PM

of course this will sell at this price.

geez people, do you know anything about real estate? appliances, subways, zzzzz. it's a nice house in cobble hill -- one of the most expensive areas of brooklyn. zoned for 29. Yesssss. this will sell.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:57 PM

That is an excellent idea.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 4:58 PM

BTW, I'm the commenter who originally called the Kitchenaid appliances. My parents happen to have that fridge, and I have that range --great products the both of them. I've had the range since it came out almost two years ago, and I've never had an issue. My parents, who renovated about a year ealier, got a Viking, and indeed have had to have it serviced a couple of times. The Kitchenaid is a great gas cooktop, and the oven heats evenly for a full sie--we use one if not both of them every day. Since we're on the subject, I went with the Fischer Paykel dish drawers, which are a revelation.

I also think I have a handle on those cabints--higher-end Kraftmaid (Home Expo, not Home Depot)--the crown moldings look very familiar.

I think the place looks great. I pointed out the appliance brands because the writeup said "very high end" renvo. To me, "very high end" means stuff that I can't afford. If you all disagree, so much the better, as far as I'm concerned!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:01 PM

you guys are crazy - first of all there are two bathrooms in this apt - one on parlor and one on garden. there is a small study which could probably be used as a bedroom and there is a playroom which could be a guestroom when necessary. the walk to the subway from this location is negligable. there isn't really any place in carroll gardens or cobble hill that is that far from a subway. Finally, if you look closely, the garden is modestly landscaped. I can see shrubberies and a small tree around the grass - I'm sure it's lovely in the summer (or will be lovely as the pants grow a bit more) - you just can't tell at this time of year...

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:03 PM

i love riding the subway.

great place to pick up guys.

for me, at least.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:09 PM

I bet this place already has offers.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:16 PM

Subway commuters may hate their ride more, but we still stay in the city (rather than up on Metro North) because (1) you can take the subway anytime - you don't have to wait for your scheduled train (when there's no subway delay, that is), (2) for many, the ride is a hell of lot shorter than a subway to Grand Central and a 45-min ride (again, when there is no track work or other delay), and (3) it is a much cheaper commute.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:19 PM

489 Henry st sold for $3.6 but it was a beautifully gut renovated 1 fam. since it would cost about $1 million to make this place as nice as 489 Henry i guess it is a good deal, but maybe a bit overpriced. but since there is no inventory in the hood i'm sure it will sell for ask or very near it.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:26 PM

The BEST thing about the subways...and you oftentimes forget this until you're trapped in the burbs somewhere....is being able to go out on Friday night and have 7 beers if you want!!!!!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 5:37 PM

I think these prices are insane.
Why pay $2.5 million to live in this small dump in Cobble Hill no less. Eventually the recession will cause people to wise up. They have been buying like lunatics just because they think prices go up 20% a year. It makes no financial sense to buy this for the money.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 6:23 PM

The toys in the playroom are worth at least 1 million. Are they included?

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 6:30 PM

says who, 6:23?

it may not make financial sense to you, but for someone who makes plenty of money and likes cobble hill, this makes excellent financial sense to them.

in the long run, they will own a multi-million dollar home in one of the best cities in the world, and you will still be complaining that you do not.

makes sense to me.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 7:14 PM

i have only bosch appliances in my private subway car

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 7:23 PM

What a steal! A real steal! If this house were in the far superior neighborhood of Carroll Gardens, just a few blocks over, it would easily command over $5 mill. Guess you're getting the "other side of the tracks" discount here!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 7:26 PM

Do respectable people over say, 45, use the subways other than at rush hour? This is a serious question. I used to live in the city and back then, well, you dont want to know. But I mean, if you have dough and own a house would you really use the subway except maybe to get to the office in the Financial District or Midtown? I'm not talking about airheads, I'm talking about substantial people that can afford a 2 million plus house.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 7:27 PM

As a reply to 7:14, 6:23 here. I already own a townhouse in Brooklyn Heights. It just doesn't make sense to own at these prices when you can rent for far cheaper.

As for who uses the subways, my neighbor [whose bonus was well over $15 million] and his wife use the subway often to get into the city to dine or whatever. Everyone is different.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 7:37 PM

Any chance of water taxi service from Cobble Hill in the not too distant future? I thoroughly enjoyed the ferry commute from DUMBO -- until they shut it down for the winter, that is. Think there's a market for it in Cobble Hill/Carroll Gardens? Would be great to get more regulars on the boat.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 8:05 PM

might make sense except neither cobble hill nor carroll gardens lie by the water.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 8:09 PM

Of course older people with money use the subway! At all hours! (Ok, not so much past midnight, but mostly because they are older and tired by then - I know, I'm pushing 50.) It isn't just about money. It's about how to get there fastest. If you took a cab or drove during much of the day or evening, you'd be giving up a lot of your time.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 8:17 PM

Not true. Parts of CH and CG are as close to the water as they are to the F train. Have you ever been to the area.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 8:22 PM

i see drew barrymore on the train all the time.

she has the money to afford a car or cab everywhere she goes.

it takes all kinds to make up this world.

sadly there are too many like 7:27 who are too closed minded to realize that there are many different types of people who make up this world, and their differences is what makes it so special.

but people continually like to make assumptions, generalizations and stereotypes for people.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 8:28 PM

Hey 8:09 - go stand on Congress and Clinton or Amity and Henry and let me know if you see water. Lots of it so close you can touch it ya moron.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 9:01 PM

WARNING
This is a little off topic...But, can someone estimate what we should expect to offer for a 4-floor "regular" townhouse in prime Fort Greene that needs a real reno?

Basically, by “prime” I mean “prime commuting walking distance and decent shopping”--anything south of DeKalb and west of, say, Clermont. By "real reno" I mean, new everything like windows, electric, heat/hot water systems, bathrooms and kitchens but the bones are decent with some details still intact…maybe new interior woodwork around windows and doors.

We have looked at a couple of places and don't want (can’t afford) the really big houses like on South Portland and the park. And we don’t like the smaller ones on Carlton between Greene and Layette…saw one and its “garden” floor was really only a cellar with windows. We’re more in the market for an in-between sized brick rowhouse like on Lafayette or something.

The backyards in most of FG are not that deep unfortunately, but it is more the convenience to all the trains in FG and the feel of the neighborhood we like. Truth is, we live here now and don't want to leave.

Are all prices in prime FG near the trains well north of 1.6 even for places that, frankly, need a real reno?

Also, what’s the opinion out there (aside from “After AY…”). Is it worth dropping 1.75 to 2m on a basic double-duplex or owner-duplex-plus-two-rentals in prime FG? Is it dumb to consider something north of 1.25 for a prime location needing a reno? Is the nabe going to remain “golden” or at least stable through this downturn?

Feedback please. Thanks!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 9:39 PM

You should offer 1.6m, buy some nice appliances, hope for a water taxi, and cover your ass. Why would you change the subject like that?
Me, me, me.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 9:55 PM

yes all kinds. airheads and substantial people too!

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 9:55 PM

9:39--I think you should post your question on the Brownstoner FORUM (just copy and paste it).

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 10:12 PM

I'm 53 and if you think i could get my wife to walk in her fancy shoes to the subway at night to visit friends in Manhattan or go to Lincoln Center, you are crazy. No one who has a little cash and is not congenitally cheap takes the subway at night. Certainly not ladies if they are dressed up. It's gross and smelly and iffy. Plus the subways don't really run on the weekends any more. The whole system is a dysfunctional mess. A private car, car service, or cab is infinitely better and gets you there faster. That is not the politically correct answer but it is the truth. The trains are fine if you're 30, or if like the mayor, your caravan of SUV's drops you off at the express stop.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 10:33 PM

Hey 9:01... there's no public access to the water in CH, CG. No water taxi.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 10:54 PM

I HATE the subway. The trains are always crowded and are running with less frequency than ever. I've been taking them for years, and I will continue to do so because I have no other option. If I ever become rich, I will stop taking the subway. There is no doubt about it. Anyone who says they actually "enjoy" or "like" the subway is lying.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 11:08 PM

10:54 - Wouldn't that be part of the development package for a water taxi service. IE foot of Atlantic Ave comes to mind.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 11:09 PM

10:33 is whipped.

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 11:14 PM

10:33??

you mean the guy married to goldie hawn in overboard??

Posted by: guest at January 28, 2008 11:18 PM

well, sure, women who wear shoes that one can't walk in probably as a group don't take the subway that much at night (though I see plenty who do), but that certainly isn't all of us women...

and don't tell me cabs arent' smelly - whoever invented those stupid tree-shaped air fresheners some use shot be shot...

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:24 AM

The traffic is so extremely congested getting through Atlantic Center and downtown Brooklyn to get to the bridges, it is not a faster option to take a car service. The only time I take a car service to Manhattan is if I'm going to some odd location in Manhattan with a weird subway line I can't figure out how to get to. Or if I need to make phone calls during the commute.

As for wealthy people never taking the subway, where did anyone get that? That kind of thing is always stated by people who know nothing about the very wealthy. They might know wannabes maybe, but not the truly rich. I know some people in Manhattan whose wealth is many times greater than the single most wealthy person in Brooklyn, I can promise you, and they always take subways.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 11:39 AM

Thank you 11:39 regarding your comments on the wealthy and lifestyle choices. We often come across misguided ideas on this website. As I have stated, there are some very wealthy individuals who will fly in, rent a nothing car (whatever midsized car the rental place has) and drive themselves to stay with friends in their moderate homes...it's not always (or even "ever") the Pierre (which is blech frankly), limos, and rich enclaves.

Posted by: guest at January 30, 2008 1:49 PM

$710/sqft. That's a no-brainer.

Posted by: guest at January 31, 2008 5:14 PM