Pols Rallying for Residential Parking Permits

I hope this works out. I used to live in Park Slope, where I would get home late from work and then spend three hours finding a parking space for street cleaning day. Now I live in BedStuy. Easier parking, but I have to move my car four times a week. Must be a more logical way.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:01 AM

If you had ever lived with such a system you would know it's a horrible.

Suddenly you can't take your car ANYWHERE... anywhere you go in NYC is a neighborhood.

worst plan ever.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:08 AM

What makes you think parking permits will make parking easier?

How do you go about allocating spaces? I live in a 4 family brownstone where every tenant has a car. Are each of the tenants entitled to permits or only the owner of the building?

If everyone is entitled to a permit, doesn't that leave you where you started? With residents fighting fellow residents for parking spots.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:25 AM

I worry about having guests over - my family that lives on long island - people have a right to visit neighborhoods too. Imagine never being able to drop in on someone or have someone work on your house because of permit parking. Leave it to free enterprise. People who want to park make the effort to get a legal spot.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:34 AM

People need to start buying smaller cars.

And insurers need to stop giving breaks to large vehicles- if you start to base insurance on the real weight and bulk of a vehicle people will change habits.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:34 AM

No, 10:25, it doesn't leave you where you started because, in a neighborhood like Boerum Hill to use the examples above, you have eliminated the park-and-ride folks and the people who commute by car to downtown Brooklyn. There will almost certainly be more permits than parking spaces, so a neighborhood parking permit will be a 'hunting license.'

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:39 AM

The density is such that they should only allow 2 hour parking in all of Brooklyn heights.

I live on henry st, and all the parking spots are taken by 10:01 on tuesday. Most of the people who have cars are afraid to move them because they'll never find another parking spot.

Because the streets are narrow, trying to load/unload requires parking on the sidewalk in a no-standing zone on top of the bike lane or next to a hydrant (but those are often occupied).

So very few people benefit from the current system -- the people who need cars to go to work can't park them, the people who only need cars on the weekends are afraid to move them, and the people who don't have cars can't unload stuff from a taxi near their houses

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:48 AM

I bought a commercial building in park slope back in 1992 on 5th avenue. Back then it was so easy to find parking. Half the block was empty. Now its insane! I find myself driving around for at least 30 minutes for a spot. 10:40 is lucky to have a driveway. Its a rarity in that area.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:48 AM

There is no reason at all to own a car in Brooklyn unless you have a weekend house or a job that requires you to haul stuff to work. For other errands, you could take a car service everyplace you ever wanted to go even every day, or rent a Zip Car a few times a week, and it would be cheaper than owning a car. If owning a car is not economically wiser, then it's a status or luxury item. Then yes that's yuppie by definition.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:54 AM

I have lived on a street with permit parking before, in CA. If it's like what we had, permit parking may not allow you to park long term anywhere in the entire Slope.

You'll get one or two permanent guest passes you have to give to guests to put in their car. But one person has to stay with the car while the other gets the pass from you otherwise the car gets a ticket. If you have more than one or two guests arriving in cars, like when you have a big party, you have to go stand in line at the DMV and pick up guest passes with a specific date on them that expires. I would hope it's all electronic now. It should be.

Permit parking will still allow 2 hours of parking during commercial business hours. So businesses that have some employees driving in for their jobs in Park Slope, will have their employees out moving their cars every two hours. Creating congestion.

Don't misunderstand what permit parking is. Permit parking does NOT mean nobody is allowed to drive to Park Slope anymore so the streets will be free and clear. It just means more restrictions, rules and ticketing. One thing I think it could do, which would be good, is encourage more people to take public transportation when they are shopping or going to restaurants in Park Slope. People in other neighborhoods who own cars will drive their car to Park Slope every single time, even though there's no reason they couldn't have taken the subway.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 11:07 AM

it will be abused just like city employee and fire dept. parking permits

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 11:20 AM

Yet one more reason that I'm happy to be car free!

It's one thing for the city to establish such a plan. It's a whole other thing for the city to enforce such a plan. What's the city's enforcement capabilities on this one?

And, will the city limit the # of permits issued to match the number of spaces available? In Boston some neighborhoods have six cars for every resident space. I never heard anyone say that parking easy when I lived there.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 11:41 AM

"People in other neighborhoods who own cars will drive their car to Park Slope every single time, even though there's no reason they couldn't have taken the subway."

Yes, there is a reason. I live in Crown Heights, and on weekends I DRIVE to Park Slope to shop, specially if I plan to purchase lots of stuff. I'm not schlepping a bunch of bags on the subway. I'm on the G-dmned train enough during the week!

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:06 PM

If you NEED to take a car why not take a car service. It is still cheaper than owning.

Gas + Insurance + Maintenance + Payments + Tickets + Parking =less than the costs of a car service. Not to mention the time saved looking for parking.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:25 PM

Resident only parking schemes are the stupidest things in the world. Every city I've ever seen them used in, they've eventually been applied all over the city and each resident would only get a permit for their specific "zone". So you can park outside of your house (whoopee) but er, woops, you can't drive anywhere else in the city because you will never find a legal parking space. What's the point of that? In a crowded city like ours, people who want a car should have to pay for a private parking garage in order to park it. Otherwise all the valuable street space will be taken by people who want to use the public streets as their personal driveways, hogging the limited amount of space we have for their own selfish use. The idea would be particularly damaging to Brooklyn because we do not have very good subway connections between the various Brooklyn neighborhoods. If we implement residential parking permits, forget about driving from one Brooklyn neighborhood to another to visit the shops or have brunch. Everyone will just have to get on the subway and go to Manhattan instead, because we'll never be able to park anywhere except for outside of our own little houses.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:33 PM

Bill De Blah Blah and his on-the-take wife have two cars...

The list of Brooklyn's politically wired on Thompson's payroll includes Paul Bader ($90,000), husband of Congresswoman Nydia Velázquez; Nickolas Perry ($30,000), son of Assemblyman Nick Perry; Pinchus Hikind ($91,855), brother of Assemblyman Dov Hikind; Chirlane McCray ($75,000), wife of Councilman Bill de Blasio; - from http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0331,barrett,45867,5.html

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:39 PM

Count me against permit parking and congestion parking. Fees fees everywhere theres fees. Parking fines are already too high and unfair. That doesn't solve the problem and neither will this.

No matter what they come up with, some people (perhaps) will be helped and some will be hurt. My guess, is that more people would be inconveninced than helped for many of the posted reasons.

However, we "all" will pay for it.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 12:54 PM

"Gas + Insurance + Maintenance + Payments + Tickets + Parking =less than the costs of a car service. Not to mention the time saved looking for parking."

Gas: I can afford it, I drive an environmentally responsible, small SUV.

Insurance: Two over -40 drivers, no accidents ever, great driving record. Even in NYC, my insurance is manageable.

Maintenance: We service the car regularly, which over time amortizes (to some degree) maintenance costs.

Tickets: Haven't had many. We're pretty careful.

Parking: I live on a side street in Crown Heights, which has a much better parking situation that Brooklyn Heights, Park Slope, Boerum Hill, etc. No problems here.

Car service: Not my car/Car could be smelly/Inconsistent service and prices/Not all drivers are safe/Drivers sometimes belligerent/Car not always large enough to transport large items for a home/.

I think I'll stick with my car.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 1:40 PM

Why exactly should parking be free? Parking is a cost of having a car in a city, if you're not willing/able to pay for it you maybe shouldnt have a car. And sorry, public transportation in Brooklyn isnt so horrible that you cant get from one place to another--and have you heard of cabs/car services? If you love your car so much maybe New York isnt the place for you.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 1:44 PM

In response to this:

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So you can park outside of your house (whoopee) but er, woops, you can't drive anywhere else in the city because you will never find a legal parking space.
-----

Although I am opposed to parking permits, this may be a reason to support them. In a city where public transportation is so easily available, you should NOT be driving from one hood to another.

Cars should really only be used by people who need to regularly leave the city, in which case being able to park outside your door is a good thing.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 1:48 PM

Mark me down as against a residential parking permit zone. I have a car in Brooklyn, and for whoever keeps saying that its cheaper to rent, they don't have any idea what they are talking about. I live in Park Slope, and I'm sorry, but the parking situation is not that bad. This is NYC, people, not Orange County. Yes, you have to look around for a parking space, but if you do, you can find one. As others have said, a residential permit plan would prevent me from going anywhere else - say to drive my son over to visit his friend in Windsor Terrace - and people from coming to see me (I can just see explaining the system to my father in law from New Jersey!). What's the purpose of having a car then? This whole idea that everyone is coming from outside the neighborhood and using up "our parking" is ridiculous. It's not "YOUR" parking. It's everyone's parking - just like the parking spot you use when you go somewhere else. If you can't find a space quickly enough, quit complaining and rent one.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 1:55 PM

What 1:55 said......

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 2:07 PM

I would be in favor of a $15 to $25 per month fee to park overnight on the street, available only to those whose cars are registered and insured in the area.

The money would stay in the area in the form of additional spending on amenities -- parks, libraries, streetscape, schools. Perhaps the city would even pick up the cost of sidewalk repair in areas with permits.

The goal would be to influence some of those who do not need a car not to get one, and those who have two or more to get by with one. Those not carrying their share of Brooklyn insurance fraud would have to start doing it.

The hardest thing about parking where I live is finding a legal spot when you come home late, especially if the next day is alternate side.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 2:20 PM

I too am against a residential parking. for all the good reasons mentioned above. And for all the snarky anti-car-owner commentators, may I say that in my family we have three little kids; one toddler and two babies. That means three big ass car seats to go anywhere. Cabs are not an option. Subway and buses are impossible. We need our car. When the kids get bigger, maybe we'll do zipcar.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 2:28 PM

I grew up in the middle of Boston, and we've had permits since the 70s. Yes, parking is impossible, but do-able if you're a resident. And it gets rid of all the other people who'd want to park downtown. Guess what? People take the train.

I'm in favor of it because then all the cheaters with out of state insurance will have to get NYS plates if they want to park. No more PA and SC license plates.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 3:13 PM

Permit parking is just a way for nimby nimbsters to lock up the spots in their hood on the cheap. I say that you have no more right to cheap parking outside your stupid brownstone than someone driving in from Canarsie for the day.

If you REALLY want to open up spots, charge out the ass for the permits.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 3:39 PM

"I would be in favor of a $15 to $25 per month fee to park overnight on the street, available only to those whose cars are registered and insured in the area."

This is the STUPIDEST idea yet advanced here.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 3:49 PM

That's all we need, pols "helping" us find a place to park. RUN FROM THIS!!!
I am sure the town meeting is going to be full of car-haters who believe people should walk or ride bikes and should be punished for owning a car AND RUINING THE PLANET!!!!
It will provide a new stream of revenue for the counterfeiters who can sell stickers from all over the Boro to folks who like to ocassionally leave their neighborhood and visit other neighborhoods.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 3:53 PM

$15 to $25. It should be $200/month, or there won't be enough spots. Then the money can go to enforcement and improving public transportation and the buses.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 5:02 PM

parking permits in the mentioned neighborhoods will trigger surrounding neighbors to apply for permits for neighborhood or become the replacement park-n-ride nabe.
It will have a chain reaction.

If the nabe is having parking problems before Congestion pricing, it just means the status quo will be kept.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 6:05 PM

I live in Manhattan. I don't own a car, nor do I want one. My biggest issue with potentially moving to Brooklyn is that I can't just hail a cab from anyplace. Those days will be over if I move.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 6:27 PM

Would love to see this come to Williamsburg. I am a block from the L, and my street is full every day with New Jersey cars. On the days when I do need to drive, which isn't that often because its such a pain to find parking in all the Garden State parking lot that I would rather walk 2 miles from the subway stop, I have to park under the BQE if I get home before those Jersey people go back home which could be as late as 7:30. I'm all for congestion pricing, raising the Hudson tunnel tolls to lets say $50 each way, and then putting in residential parking if it would just keep those freaking Jersey people from taking up every single spot in Williamsburg. Don't they have a PATH train and NJ Transit???

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 7:30 PM

While living in Washington, DC several years ago I had to have a zone parking sticker to park in my neighborhood. It definitely did not guarantee a space, but rather served as a parking spot hunting license.

However, there were many advantages to the permit program...most significantly it cut down on the number of commuter-parkers and forced residents to register/license their cars in DC, generating revenue through the licensing and permitting process (permits were less than $50/year). As the permit rules were only enforced M-F, 8a-8p it did not keep you from visiting friends, visiting other neighborhoods, or driving around town in general; but it might have made you more cognizant of your timing. Having a dinner or weekend party didn't require permits for guests but unless I was willing to pay the $20/daily fee to park in the garage at the office (or move the car every two hours to avoid a ticket), I took public transportation to work.

While neighborhoods in downtown are leading the rally for parking permits, neighborhoods like mine - Kensington - need them as well. In our search for parking (one car, a hybrid at that) we see the same out-of-state plate cars on our blocks every day and as we're located between the F and Q trains the commuter-parker numbers are creeping higher and higher...even my own brother-in-law drives in from Mill Basin to catch the Q, he claims it faster than taking the Express Bus or train-bus that would be required from his own neighborhood.

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 8:36 PM

As a current Brooklyn Heights resident and a past DC resident, 8:36 above has it correct.

The permits are only enforced during business hours M-F -- the permits are only there to keep commuters from parking. And even during those business hours you were able to park for up to 2 hours in another "zone".

Also, the zones were quite large. All of NW DC was divided into 6 zones. As a comparison, I could imagine all of Dumbo, The Heights, Cobble Hill, Carroll Gardens, and Red Hook as one zone.

In my 10 years in DC, all of those years with a car, not once did the permits ever really put a crimp in my life.

Let's hear it for Parking Permits!

Posted by: guest at January 29, 2008 10:11 PM

An addendum to 8:36 & 10:11 -- 8-8 is not "business hours." Years back, I drove to Adams Morgan (in DC), which was then not as safe as today, to have dinner. Drove around for about 45 minutes before finally finding a non-resident meter. Maybe 8-6 is more workable.

Posted by: guest at January 30, 2008 7:36 AM

OK, I have a company car, necessary for site visits all over the tri state on a almost daily basis. The car is mine to use on evenings and weekends for personal use. Where does permit parking leave me on days when I can use the subway instead?

Posted by: guest at January 30, 2008 8:43 AM

Well, 8:43, unless your company registers the car in your neighborhood, you better have company-financed, off-street parking too.

Posted by: guest at January 30, 2008 9:36 AM

just charge alot of money for curbside parking and use it to fund mass transit improvements and bike lanes.

and motorcycles are REALLY easy to park. we must all learn to adapt to the realities of 21st century life.

Posted by: guest at February 3, 2008 3:51 PM

Residential Permit Parking is a horrible idea. Congestion Pricing and RPP are two entirely separate matters. Linking them together is false and is only for political purposes. Think about it: if you regularly commute to Manhattan, then you are already committed to garage parking in Manhattan. If the $8 fee makes you change your mind about that, then are you going to make your commute even more miserable by driving from your house to Park Slope or Brooklyn Heights, then searching for street parking, then taking the subway?! NO. You will follow the path of least resistance. You will either use public transportation if that is an option, or you will suck it up and pay the $8 if you don't have an option. The point is that neighborhoods that have good subway access and plenty of amenities are the LEAST in need of help. True, these neighborhoods are being used to some extent by people in other neighborhoods with poor public transportation as a weigh station to Manhattan, but these same people are already NOT driving to Manhattan, so congestion pricing will have no effect on them. The answer is BETTER public transportation to poorly serviced neighborhoods. RPP is a sham!! Congestion pricing ALONE will alleviate BOTH problems if the funds are used for better outer borough public transportation. There is also a lot of commuting between outer boroughs and very poor public transportation between them.

RPP should not PRECEDE congestion pricing; if it is determined to be useful at all (and this should be through study, not emotion or NIMBY-ism) then it should only FOLLOW congestion pricing.

RPP will balkanize NYC and make neighborhoods who already have it all have even more of it all. The rest will be left out. And do you think another level of bureaucracy is good for NYC? It's an EASY sell to people who live in an RPP zone, but it is very bad policy for New York City.

Posted by: guest at February 4, 2008 1:04 PM

Boston, Chicago and Washington D.C. all have neighborhood parking permit systems. Last I checked the sky has not fallen from above those cities. Residential streets are typically by permit only and the commercial streets are meetered. Visitor pay for the right to park, or they take public transportation. These systems help reduce traffic, improve air quality, and make our streets safer. What is there to debate?

Posted by: guest at February 4, 2008 3:10 PM