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October 17, 2007
Co-op of the Day: 69 Pierrepont Street FSBO
Undeterred by the tougher market, one seller in Brooklyn Heights has chosen to go the For Sale By Owner route. Of course, it helps when you've got a sweet pad to work with, which is the case with this two-bedroom in the beautiful 40-unit co-op building at 69 Pierrepont Street in Brooklyn Heights. We're liking what we're seeing—open living area, nice prewar details, nice light. Given that the apartment measures in at 1,200 square feet, the asking price of $949,000 doesn't seem crazy on a psf basis. The most recent apartment in the building to change hands went for $875,000 but that could have been a smaller or less attractive unit for all we know. How does this price sound to you? In case the NYT listing expires, the owner can be reached at Pierrepont2BR AT gmail DOT com.
69 Pierrepont 2 BR FSBO [NY Times] GMAP P*Shark
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Comments
Stoner & Readers:
This is an acceptible price. (even with the high maintenance).
I've said it. Its gotta be true.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:02 PM
I think it looks like a bargain, to be honest.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:06 PM
prices like this will make those condo developers in fringe hoods cringe. this is priced to sell in a world class neighborhood. seriously, why would you buy in oro if you can live here?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:12 PM
If by "world class", you mean boring, then yes, Brooklyn Heights is world class. Zzzzzzzz.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:19 PM
Great location. Nice pad. Sigh.
Posted by: Carol Gardens at October 17, 2007 1:19 PM
I had looked at the 875K 2BR in early summer, and this one appears nicer. Looks like a fair price.
1:19... How is Bklyn Heights any more (or less) boring than any other neighborhood in NYC?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:30 PM
I'm with guest 1:12. Here, you have great, old, pre-war bones, views, quality reno-- why on earth would you choose shoddy, cookie-cutter new construction over this? I love Ft. Greene, but Oro is on Flatbush, not South Portland, with nasty traffic and commercial buildings all around. This will move fast.
Posted by: Rehab at October 17, 2007 1:32 PM
I smell a bidding war.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:36 PM
I smell a broker.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:38 PM
sorry, fsbo, the brokers only wish they could sell this place b/c it will be gone after the first open house - easy money.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:55 PM
Seriously Beautiful. Price seems fair
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:58 PM
Looks nice, but it only has 1 bathroom, and it is in the master bedroom...think that has to account for a slight drop in price
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:58 PM
What is with the picture of a naked dude sitting on a stool?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 1:59 PM
I think this is a fair price, but really, it's hard to deny that Brooklyn Heights is an exceptionally boring neighborhood filled with banker types and with a serious dearth of good restaurants, bars and stores. That being said, it is incredibly beautiful and extremely convenient and I would certainly choose it over park slope in a second.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:00 PM
1:38...your post just signifies that not only do you not read the posts (because as someone pointed out, this home is for sale by owner) but you've basically now invalidated every ignorant "it's a broker" comment made thus far and into the future.
it's just nonsense.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:02 PM
He's not naked. he's wearing a pink shirt.
And it's a painting.
Looks like over the past two years, Park Slope has surpassed Brooklyn Heights on condo and co-op prices.
A place like this on a prime Park Slope block would be going for more than this.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:04 PM
Looks nice and I'm sure it will sell; but I don't know that developers in "fringe" neighborhoods need to cringe. A couple of things going against this place; no doorman, only 1 bathroom, window AC units, no gym or other amenities, high maintenance. Full disclosure ... I bought an 1800 sq ft apt in BellTel for $70K less than this an am pretty happy about it. Like I said, I'm sure this will sell (and probably quickly at that price) but you still get quite a bit more at the "fringe" at cheaper prices
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:05 PM
Not to mention the tedious and invasive COOP BOARD approval you'll need to move in to this place.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:15 PM
That price? That location? I'll take two!!!
Posted by: GHB at October 17, 2007 2:20 PM
Co-ops are what have essentially saved the New York City market from the housing crash that has affected the rest of the country.
Your comment on them shows your ignorance on the matter.
76% of homeowners in New York City live in co-ops, btw.
And most Condo owners I know are scrambling to set up boards to institute some regulations as they see their buildings being taken over by renters and college students.
But you don't like them, clearly.
The only logical conclusion to that would be because you would not be accepted by one. It's ok. Neither was Barbara Streisand.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:21 PM
Why so defensive 2:21?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:29 PM
You know 2:21 coop defender, let me tell you what the problem with coops is. I have the money, and I'm looking for a nice apartment just like this one, for my parents who are 65 and 67, so that they can live there when they are in town to visit me and the rest of their family. I could plunk down that $949K cash right now for this coop. I could plunk down more than that if there were a bidding war. However, this coop and most others do not allow the pied-a-terre. So I don't bother. I'll take a prewar condo, of which there are many, btw, over a prewar coop. Screw the boards and all those restrictions when I'm paying $1 million for my apartment.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:33 PM
2:33... I own a pied-a-terre in a co-op on Montague St., and had no problem with the board process. There are more than a few buildings in the Heights that do allow pied-a-terre purchases.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:38 PM
I think they'll be fine without you, 2:33.
Clearly your personality is not the right fit for a co-op. You are correct.
They usually prefer people who know how to get along with others. Not bitter, nasty people who talk about how much money they have and just sat through the largest run -up in home prices in history with a million plus bucks sitting in the bank at 4.75% interest.
Sounds like a bit of a false economy to me.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:38 PM
Actually 2:38, re-read your first post and then tell me who is the "bitter, nasty" person who takes a simple and well-known critique of co-op boards waaaayy too personally. You'll notice my initial comment was completely neutral! What's up?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:42 PM
Why would you assume my money is sitting in the bank at 4.75? huh? And I mention my all-cash situation because that's actually considered a negative in purchasing a coop--everyone knows coop boards don't like all-cash buyers. And for anyone who is really that naive and thinks coop board approval is not intrusive, please:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/18/realestate/18home.html
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:47 PM
I've lived in a co-op for years and find nothing tedious nor invasive about it.
I find it a great experience to work with neighbors to better our living arrangements.
Sounds like you just aren't cut out for it, 2:33.
You must turn a lot of people off cause we allow pied-a-terres in our building and as someone else mentioned...a lot of places in the Heights do as well.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:47 PM
Again, seems that your ad hominem attack on me is indicative of your own issues. You are the one taking my initial comment very personally. Adios and be merry!
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:53 PM
Actually, many coop boards are bitter and nasty - some aren't and are friendly - but the problem is that it is hard to really find out what they are like at the contracting stage, before it is too late.
And I think that coops like this go for less then condos because of the coop boards - they cut down on the pool of potential buyers. Not just due to their prudent and often perfectly reasonable financial requirements - but sometimes due solely to strange assumptions about lifestyles - as I found out when trying to sell my coop to perfectly reasonable non-smoking, single, well-employed for years people, not young and not old, not pied-a-terre users, with no debt, for all cash or with only a very small mortgage, with no pets.
Although I was a board member, I support the movement to make coops have to state reasons for rejections of buyers, as I believe that it would cut down on bad behavior by shining some sunlight on the process.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 2:55 PM
Buildings should all be filled with nothing but pied-a-terre's.
It would create such a sense of vibrance and community spirit!!!
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:08 PM
I'm on a co-op board (a brooklyn heights co-op board even), and we've had 2 sales in the past year both all cash. Fine with us. Why would we care?
But yes, we do want full-time residents.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:08 PM
Pretty apartment, pretty location. Good schools. I suspect it will sell for just south of 1mm this weekend. Wouldn't it be great if the owners would report back (please? as someone thinking about FSBOing myself)
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:10 PM
Paid all cash for my co-op in Park Slope.
Me thinks the million dollar baby just doesn't like to play with the other children.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:10 PM
This is when FSBO works: nice apartment, clean and "staged", priced at 5% under what a broker said they could get. You can sell in a weekend, and even without a bidding war, take home more money
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:14 PM
I wonder about park slope vs BH prices. I think PS prices may be higher -- and I find that rather unbelievable. Private schools are better , the public in BH seems to be getting better while PS seems to be getting worse (in our experience). And BH may be getting that park. I've lived in PS for 8 years now but I think if I had to buy now -- and if it's cheaper -- I may look at BH instead.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:19 PM
The only thing BH has over Park Slope is a closer commute to Manhattan by about 10 minutes.
In terms of schools, restaurants, bars, park (Brooklyn Bridge Park if it ever gets built will be done in 10 years), housing stock and community spirit...Park Slope wins hands down.
If you work on Wall Street and don't like to eat or drink out in your own neighborhood, BH is definitely the better option for you, though.
Lovely apartment though. Will sell fast.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:29 PM
Living in the slope, I often looked in the heights when moving (both to rent and to buy), but I always stayed in the slope because I find the combination of narrower streets/taller buildings in the heights makes the streets feel darker and more closed-in. (of course, if you can afford the river view, that wouldn't really matter as much.)
In addition to the slope's advantages mentioned by 3:29, it isn't really clear that the finished park in the heights is actually going to be much of a park when done - the news coverage on it indicates that it may be more commercial space (hotels, condos, other commercial use) than park.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:38 PM
OK. Asking your advice. I have a 1,500 sq foot 2 bd/2-1/2 bath (remodeled). Split bedrooms, master with 2 large walk-in closets, eat-in kitchen (granite counters/maple cabinets), den (could be easily converted to legal and large(10x12) third bedroom. High ceilings, high floor central location. maintenace is $2.1K -- what do you think it is worth? I keep looking at these and they are so much smaller and not as nice as mine. I have no idea...
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:44 PM
1.25 million.
I'd say 1.5 but the maintenance is awfully high.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 3:51 PM
3:44 -- location?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 4:06 PM
"But yes, we do want full-time residents."
This is why people are going the condo route. Freedom, privacy, etc.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 4:12 PM
Nothing wrong with wanting a building with people who actually live there.
Otherwise, maybe you might want to try Miami or Vegas?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 4:31 PM
People are buying condos because those are what's being built now and many people who are new buyers don't have enough saved to be approved by co-ops.
This will change in 10 years when all these new pieces of crap are filled with renters and students.
It's the old money vs. new money.
Difference is that the old money (and I don't mean old, age-wise) are the people who think more about their future, like things of quality and don't just spend their bucks willy nilly on glass boxes that are going to fall over in the next hurricane.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 4:40 PM
Gee, it seems you are unaware of the large amount of PRE-WAR condo conversions that are already out there, and the ones that are just now being converted.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 4:44 PM
Gee....pre war condos make up less than 2% of the owner market in New York City so I can't imagine how I could be so unfamiliar.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:01 PM
4:40 what the hell are you talking about? i sold a small house in PS to move to a condo (actually 2x the living space). renters and students? in our condo, there are no students - huh on that comment? and only one apartment that has a renter. all other are owner occupied by adults with jobs. my husband and I plan on living in our 2000 sq ft space with a patio and backyard for a very long time. also, it was professionally inspected by an inspector we brought in. it's very well made.
looked for 2 years before I bought it. the issues for us were space, layout, central A/C, convenient commute to our jobs, lots of wonderful things to do (eating, shopping, bars, etc...), and playgrounds and easy manhattan access to do great stuff with our toddler as well.
so even tho this is in child accomodating BH, this is one of those spaces that would drive us crazy with a kid. just TOO small. too small does not over come lovely "bones" or a great exterior.
some people care more about an enjoyable lifestyle and prefer not renovating, having central air, having laundry in their apartment, having a clean big space and new appliances. hence condos.
also, i got 2000 sq. ft for $950K and my cc:'s are $350 - there's a tax abatement, so taxes are at $50 ish / month.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:07 PM
Won't argue with 3:29 on each and every point in the BH vs PS debate (some I agree, some disagree) but I strongly disagree on the commute. If you're lucky and maybe on the flatbush lines, it's a 10 minute difference in the ride itself. But the walk from the subway can be much longer in the slope. And don't even think to compare the commute for people further down in the slope who need to take the F. BH is a much smaller neighborhood and you're pretty much within 5 min walk of every major line in the city. Trips to midtown from BH can be 20 min compared to 45 min from parts of the slope. Cab rides are much shorter too. Now, this advantage assumes you need to go to Manhattan regularly, but for those who do, having an extra 45+ minutes every day (back and forth) not spent on commuting is a big lifestyle difference. And, as much as we all love the cultural offerings of brooklyn, sometimes it is nice to be able to enjoy the rest of new york city, too.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:14 PM
1200 sf is too small for 2 parents & 1 toddler?!
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:16 PM
"there's a tax abatement, so taxes are at $50 ish / month."
have fun when that shoots to nearly 1000 a month in 10 years.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:24 PM
I'd give up a somewhat longer ride on the subway to live in an actual urban enclave rather than, what is essentially a bedroom community of Manhattan.
Part of what makes NYC so special to me is being able to walk to any number of shops, restaurants, bars and a huge park within a 5 minute jaunt of my house. While I might have to sit on the train longer for work, EVERYTHING else is more accessible.
That's why so many people in Manhattan gravitate towards Manhattan. Just like there, you are able to walk everywhere and enjoy what your own neighborhood as to offer. It's also a big part of the reason why BH has and always will be a bit stodgy. People have beautiful homes there, but that's all...they live there...they don't really have an active community, per se.
We all have different priorities, though.
I see the benefit to both.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:29 PM
"1200 sf is too small for 2 parents & 1 toddler?!"
Maybe they're contestants on the biggest loser??
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:30 PM
That's why so many people in Manhattan gravitate towards Manhattan
I meant towards Park Slope.
But obviously a lot gravitate towards BH as well. Like I said...everyone wants something different.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:32 PM
Reasonable price at first glance, but a 1200 ft place with just one bathroom is strange. Also that bathroom is only accesible from the Master Bedroom. Dealbreaker for me if I was in the market.
Posted by: cwh812 at October 17, 2007 5:32 PM
Actually there is a door from the bathroom into the bedroom AS WELL as the foyer, if you'll notice...
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:33 PM
OCTOBER 17, 2007 - BROOKLYN HEIGHTS— It's very unclear where things stand with the Brooklyn Bridge Park plans, but the planning process is starting "for how the park will be used." There will be some public meetings starting October 30 to deal with what kinds of activities will be in the park, funding and whether programs in the $150 million park should be free or whether people should pay. No word on when there might be an actual park, plus the condos that are part of the plan.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 5:52 PM
where do you buy 2000 sqft for 950? I'd love to see a link to this. Views? etc
Anyway, here's my issue with condos. As much as I like new stuff, I hate all condos 15-20 yrs or older. So I figure: how great is that Two Trees condo look going to sell when I sell? It all seems so dated already. Also, sure original owners are involved, etc. But as people sell (or can't sell and lease), you'll see a lot more students, shares, etc.
You may not like co-op boards, but you can't argue that their value have held up historically. Show me an 80s condo and a prewar that was sold in the 80s and compare how much they are worth now.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 6:03 PM
5:52. are you quoting curbed.com as if it's an actual news story?
It's that all that unclear on where things stand with the park. Coalition, City and State finally all on same page with same schedule
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 6:24 PM
I can really only speak to "mom scene" in PS and BH. I lived and loved PS for some time. It's lovely, park is lovely, and has great amenities. It's also very open-minded as long as you do things just the right way (from G-diapers to a certain music class to breastfeeding). I found it a hard place to parent even tho I often held similar beliefs.
I moved reluctantly to BH and found the parenting scene much easier. Maybe one thing is that while children are central to people's lives, it isn't the only thing. People leave their children with a sitter, go out to dinner in manhattan, and DON"T talk about their kids!
Also, people in BH use Manhattan more. I found most people I knew in PS spent most of their "off-time" in PS. Clearly, this is because there's just nothing to do in BH! But I enjoy seeing Manhattan again.
(also, can't compare schools but PS8 is fantastic)
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 6:35 PM
Can I get a closer look at the naked guy in the stockings?
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 7:18 PM
Hey 3;14 your little theory about a FSBO is wrong. My wife sold her Gramercy Park one bedroom for about 75,000 more that what a broker told her to list it at. SO she walked away with alot more money than some BROKER told her and no broker fee. God bless this country and don't listen to brokers.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 7:21 PM
The guy in the painting is not naked--I think he's wearing beige khakis.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 7:33 PM
Oh darn.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 7:51 PM
a lot. A LOT. two words people! learn it. live it.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 9:14 PM
I must be the lone voice of reason. Basically we're talking a million bucks for a 2 BR apt in Brooklyn. And the maintenance is high. And this is a bargain. Please God, please, if you're listening, please make this ridiculous bubble burst. I mean, take care of the gang rapes in the Sudan first, then this bubble. The fact that upper middle class people can no longer afford to buy property that is not even big enough to comfortably house their families is insane. I feel like I'm in a horror movie where I'm the only sane one left and everyone else has taken a crazy pill.
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 9:53 PM
yep 9:53, you speak the truth. We are all desensitized. And if you dare complain about these prices, people say you are "entitled."
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 10:43 PM
The love lane condo is going in behind this.
Get ready for 2 years of construction...
Posted by: guest at October 17, 2007 11:10 PM
9:53 I hear you. We are in the weird situation of having what we thought was a huge chunk of cash which still has not been enough to buy much in NYC. All my friends in other markets are shocked when I tell them how hard it is to find a decent house in the 1.5 million range (granted, in prime Bklyn, but even in not all that prime i.e. South Slope). That said, I do sense changes in the market - a number of places we've looked at are lingering - deals are falling through as people trying to buy houses can't sell their apartments, can't get mortgages etc. and even the brokers we've talked to are starting to concede that they can't be too aggressive with prices. My sense is that there's a weird lag time right now, where some brokers/owners are still trying to price properties too high, but these properties are lingering on the market. This will be an interesting winter...
Posted by: housesearcher at October 17, 2007 11:15 PM
I can't fathom why anyone would ever live in a co-op, unless they can't afford their own house of course.
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 8:56 AM
8:56 - just giggle a little at your good fortune and the voice that has evolved from that. Try to remember to open your eyes - you'll be happier for it.
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 10:33 AM
As someone who used to live in Park Slope and who now lives in Brooklyn Heights, I cast my vote for BH. While Montague may not measure up to 5th or 7th, it has the basics. For great restaurants and shops, it's a short walk to Smith and Court Streets, which are I think are superior, especially in terms of restaurants, both classic and cutting edge. (Not to mention the great places on Henry, and Jack the Horse.) If we're dying to go to a park, we walk down to the park in Dumbo, and sit by the water. Or we jump on the 2/3 and are sitting in Prospect park in 15 minutes. Ditto for taking the 2/3 to the Brooklyn Museum, BAM, or hell, even to Central Park, if I want. And if we're missing a Park Slope restaurant we liked, we jump in a cab, or walk down to Jay St. and get the F. Or a ten-minute bus ride into Red Hook for the places there. And of course, a much shorter trip into the city and home on weekends if have to go there.
And many people have also mentioned the easier work commute during the week.
And while there is certainly a lot of old money in BH, and with that comes a certain snobbiness, it's not nearly as bad as the smug, over-entitled, stroller mom/hipster dad holier-than-thou attitude so prevalent in the Slope.
BH is certainly less social, but we can get that within 5 minutes of our apartment, then return home to peace and quiet (well, relative to NYC, anyway.) And this place is on a great block, on a great street.
Posted by: bhguy at October 18, 2007 10:35 AM
Amen 10:35. I happen to love Park Slope and all that it offers, but smug is the perfect word to describe those PS boosters here and in RL who think anyone who lives outside may as well be living in a soul-less exurb. We're talking other Brownstone Brooklyn neighborhoods, for pete's sake. Save your breath for the legions of Manhattanites who think all of 718 is the same gray outer-borough hinterland, and leave Brooklyn alone!
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 11:15 AM
where is brooklyn heights?
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 2:06 PM
In Manhattan
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 2:48 PM
"I can really only speak to "mom scene" in PS and BH. I lived and loved PS for some time. It's lovely, park is lovely, and has great amenities. It's also very open-minded as long as you do things just the right way (from G-diapers to a certain music class to breastfeeding). I found it a hard place to parent even tho I often held similar beliefs. "
This is the best. So basically, lady you don't have enough self esteem to do what YOU want with your kids because you are too susceptible to judgements from others around you? Wow. I don't envy your child.
Gonna grow up to be a pathetic sack just like his momma.
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 2:56 PM
Wow- you don't even know this woman- you can sum her up from that? Why? The obvious question is: can you explain why it would be a hard place to parent even though I often held similar beliefs? Perhaps because people are harsh and judgemental and think that they know you when the don't. Because there are people who assume that in a few sentences they have enough to justify being disrespectful? I'm sure that your attack of this person is not the sum of who you are.
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 5:43 PM
Why does this happen on this site? What is the lack of respect about? I would like to know what a person like 2:56 dreams of for this planet?
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 5:47 PM
2:56- YOU don't envy HER child?- sheeesh!
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 6:17 PM
2:56... pathetic. Anyhow, a very nice apartment.
Posted by: guest at October 18, 2007 6:22 PM
I'm starting to think some people post these bizarre personal attacks just for the shock value. Doesn't really make sense otherwise. I wish the discussion could stay on the topic at hand, real estate in Brooklyn - though perhaps that brings up all kinds of other issues. Anyway, this looks like a very nice apartment - my gripe is mainly that maintenance seems very high, and I would be factoring that into a not insignificant mortgage carrying cost...
Posted by: housesearcher at October 19, 2007 8:48 AM
Not to get too 101, but why do people like 2:56 need this kind of outlet? What do they get from it? It's so mean, unwarranted and unjustified. I would like to try to understand and not be quick to judge the meanies but I always think Psycho-blogger- Qu'est-ce que c'est Fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa far
Gorgeous apartment!
Posted by: guest at October 19, 2007 9:40 AM
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