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September 10, 2007
House of the Day: 135 Joralemon Street
The house at 135 Joralemon has been of great interest to Brooklyn Heights residents since it was ravaged by a fire on the eve of 2005. After sitting untouched for more than a year and a half, the house was finally purchased in September 2006 for $2,400,000. The buyer must have been a professional flipper because the house was reno'd and on the market by early this past summer (after being featured on the Brooklyn Heights House and Garden Tour in May). After more than three months of no takers, the price was cut last week from $5,950,000 to $5,750,000. It's all still pie in the sky for most of the buyer universe; we suspect that it's not a big enough reduction to make potential buyers sit up and take notice. What do you think this place is worth?
135 Joralemon Street [Brown Harris Stevens] GMAP P*Shark
Recovery Underway for Joralemon Burn Victim [Brownstoner]
Ode to 135 Joraleman [Brownstoner]
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Comments
Stoner:
Why do you tease us like this?
Or is your audience the same demographic who flys NetJets and consults Robb Report for their next purchase. If so, you should have your ad rep contact the folks at LVMH, Merc Benz, etc.
Please remember, this is Brooklyn. Most of us came here because we chose no longer to afford the insanity in Manhattan.
I emplor thee to begin "keeping it real."
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:23 PM
We only do one of these extravagant listings every couple of months or so for that very reason...this one's of special interest because of the fire and how long it sat vacant in such a fancy nabe.
Posted by: brownstoner at September 10, 2007 1:29 PM
Or is your audience the same demographic who flys NetJets and consults Robb Report for their next purchase?
Yes.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:33 PM
If I had the capital I would love to be someone who rescues gorgeous burned-out houses. Not crazy about the 1970's woodsy kitchen, but to each his own.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:36 PM
Lets see, purchased at what we can probably now see was the tip top of the market for $2.4m. Perhaps 800k spent to renovate it. Add another 200k for the flippers time management fee. Total: $3.4m.
Less a 20% decline in prices from the peak means that a reasonable price today is about $2.8m and the flipper is facing a loss.
But if he keeps clinging to the idea of sucking $1.5m in profit out of signing papers and handing the keys to his project manager, then he better also have some more money in the bank to pay $10k a month to keep the place tidy and empty while he waits for the market to boom again!
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:41 PM
I love this house. After the fire, I thought it might have to come down, so I'm glad someone restored it. Yeah, only the megarich can afford it now, but it's fun to take a peek inside via the listing.
Posted by: Carol Gardens at September 10, 2007 1:42 PM
I have always loved this house, as much for its location -- right at the end of Sidney Place so that as you walk up that also unique block this house is at the end -- as for its anomolus appearance in this part of the Heights, where there are far fewer frame houses and this one has larger more modern stone (or maybe brick and stone) to either side. Back when it was really run down looking, this house evoked (for me) the old children's story The Little House by Virginia Lee Burton.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:42 PM
RE is all about location and comps. If you want to understand brownstone pricing in Bed-Stuy, fix your high/low markets for Brooklyn Heights and Bushwick. Everything's on a continuum. It's just a matter of figuring out where the property you are interested in falls on that line.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:44 PM
1:23, I couldn't disagree more. If it wasn't for Brownstoner I never would have looked at the listing for this absolute beauty. Wow. I can't afford 1/4 of this listing price, but it helps me learn what to look for in my own budget - and how to be classic but creative with my own reno.
I wonder if they got the smell out, though - there's nothing that permeates the bones of a house like the smell of a fire.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:45 PM
I actually think the reno costs were closer to a million dollars. Every little thing was done. Functionally and structurally, the house is brand new.
It is a thing of beauty for a very wealthy collector of antique furniture perhaps or for someone who likes the idea of living in an 1830's house that is up to the minute in terms of all the modern conveniences. I think the price is a little aggressive but it is a one-of-a-kind house in Brooklyn Heights in perfect condition.
Posted by: sam at September 10, 2007 1:50 PM
There are several homes for sale in Brooklyn Heights that are in the $4-8 million range. I don't think that any of them have sold in months.
I love the house too but agree that the kitchen is not what one would expect to see in a house of this price.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 1:57 PM
Even though it's cute and in a pretty good location, it's a wood frame and kind of small for an asking of almost $6 million.
I think you can get a bigger brownstone on the corner of Hicks and Joralemon for $4.5 million that's still on the market.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:00 PM
From all the evidence out there, the luxury market is not the one in trouble. This seller won't have to discount this house. Those high-end properties (which would include this one for its location and its top of the line renovation) are flying off the shelf. They're selling. Anybody see the piece in the NY Times recently about wealthy New Yorkers being so eager to stay in the city AND have lots of space that they are buying 3 Manhattan condos and combining them? THAT's expensive. This house is a bargain compared to having to do that just to get 4 or more bedrooms in NYC.
You can't compare the $1 to 2 million brownstone market in the up and coming neighborhoods, to the luxury properties of Brooklyn Heights. They're two different worlds completely, with totally different buyers. People who spend several million to buy a house in Brooklyn Heights don't even look in the other neighborhoods, much less buy there. These are people who fully expect to spend this amount of money. I'm not the realtor here! Just someone who pays attention to the RE news.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:01 PM
Sorry, 2:00pm, but the wood frame comment is totally subjective. I agree with Sam: many people would pay a premium for an anti-bellum wood frame house.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:02 PM
I used to live in the Heights and walked past this house in poor condition, pre-fire , for years. I am glad that this house was restored. The prioce is another story . .
Intersestingly I picked up a book titled Renovation from the 1980's and the leading photo was this house, saying this type of project is not for the faint of heart.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:05 PM
They're "flying off the shelf"? Evidence, please -- and a random article from the NYT, based on research done long before the market turmoil of the past few weeks, does not count.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:07 PM
Couldn't pay me enough to live in that ossified museum.
Let's see, some design stupidities: a kitchen with low ceilings, too large for comfort but too small to dine or congregate in; the impracticality of having the kitchen a floor below living area, (I'd have to hire a cook...come to think of, maybe the megarich do;) three closet-less bedrooms sharing a bath too small for a catbox; etc.
Total waste of resources.
What did it look like after the fire?
Posted by: cmu at September 10, 2007 2:10 PM
As far as these properties flying off the shelf, just go look at the NYT listings for properties in the $3 million+ range in Brooklyn: http://realestate.nytimes.com/sales/NY/BROOKLYN_County/Brooklyn_Heights_Dumbo_Cobble_Hill
You'll see at least ten BH brownstones priced at $4 million+ that have been on the market for six weeks or more. I can't see how this guy expects to get $5.75 million for a place this small.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:14 PM
This is a really unique house and Sydney Place is one of the nicest streets in the entire City. Earlier poster mentioned another property at Hicks + Joralemon. Hicks is a traffic nightmare and totally congested in the AM. It's a honkfest. I would pay a premium to live on one of the places (i.e. Garden or Sydney) because they are so peaceful. Would be interested to know what the garden is like though. The house is sandwiched between some taller buildings.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:18 PM
2:14pm: The luxury house market in Brooklyn Heights means $5 million and above. Not $3 million and above. $3 million prices are often found in Park Slope, Cobble Hill, even Crown Heights. It's a lot of money but it's not in the luxury category. We were supposed to be discussing the luxury market of Brooklyn Heights, remember.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:25 PM
Who says? There are 3 townhouses on Brown Harris Stevens that are listed for $4,400,000. They look pretty luxurious to me. I think that this house is priced a bit high. I'd put it just under 5.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:35 PM
I saw the house on the house tour, the rear is very attractive. there is a wooden porch with thin, 1830's wooden columns, and a very large rear yard. An artistic landscaper could screen the views of the apartment houses next door with trellises or plantings.
This is a formal house, the parlors are upstairs and the kitchen and dining room are on the garden level. The house had never been broken up into a 2-family, so the layout remains as it always has been since it was built. The attic bedrooms are great with their dormer windows facing straight out to Sidney Place. There is a reason this house in in every picture book on Brooklyn architecture. It is a beauty.
Posted by: sam at September 10, 2007 2:44 PM
If I had the money (which I don't)I still would not buy this place. This house is for someone (with money) who likes to be the center of attention.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 2:55 PM
cmu, have you ever been in a brownstone? The kitchen and dining are on the garden level, which has low ceilings. I know that some recently-arrived suburbanites like to destroy their homes and plop the kitchen on the parlor level, but that is not the way it is supposed to be. I bet you want a master bath with his and her sinks too. Hey, wahy not a 3 car garage too.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 3:37 PM
Um, no- you're the only person that has ever been in a brownstone. What is wrong with a home evolving? Are you seriously so rigid that you don't think that a room can be used for anything other than its original purpose? Why? These are houses not museums. If you read up you will find that many of the brownstones were altered by their early owners to suit the trends of the day. What you think is original may not be. Do you have a mix of Italianate, Second-Empire, Renaissance Revival? Would you know if your home had been changed 10 years after it was built, 20, 30? Incidentally- all garden levels do not have low ceilings.
2:55- Have you seen this house? It's nice but it isn't going to make anyone the center of attention.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 4:06 PM
I also saw this one on the BH House Tour - I remember loving the huge back garden (total blank slate) and the character of the house. I hated the kitchen and bathrooms. They were so generic, so cheap cabs-pro-style range-SubZero-tumbled marble, so boring and could be transplanted seamlessly to any random new condo development. I thought they did a real disservice to a historic and unique property like this. At House Tour time, the developer/restorer wanted $6 mil and was entertaining offers directly or through any broker you wanted to bring to him.
Will be interesting to track the sale price on this - through Corcoran and BHS alone, there are quite a few $4 mil-plus townhouses that have been sitting idle.
Posted by: zeebee_in_bklyn at September 10, 2007 4:13 PM
Zeebee's comment confirms one of the concerns I had after looking at the BHS photos. It's hard to tell online but I had my suspicions about the quality of the finishes -- particularly the parlor floors and the kitchen cabinets. It's so penny-wise and pound-foolish to undertake a high end renovation and then wimp out on the finishes. Really puts off the kind of buyers who can afford this kind of price.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 5:06 PM
This house is worth every penny.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 5:15 PM
"This house is worth every penny."
Ha, thanks Mr. Owner.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 5:36 PM
What impressed me about the kitchen was how roomy it was. I'm not a real cabinet/appliances maven so to me that was rather secondary. I think one can never guess what a very wealthy owner will want in a kitchen so often putting in a simple generic kitchen-as a place holder- is the best way to go. I thought the bathrooms were very well done and so were the finishes such as the plasterwork, the doors, and the leaded glass work.
It is an early house, so there is no elaborate woodwork and parquetry. Anyway, it is a miracle that the house survived and I tip my hat to the developer/restorer.
Now the house needs to find a new owner who will make it a real home again.
Posted by: sam at September 10, 2007 5:46 PM
This place won't be worth Jack Point Shit once Atlantic Yards is built....
Am I right? :)
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 8:13 PM
yes, you are absolutely right. This restored house in Brooklyn Heights will be worthless once the new buildings over the Atlantic rail yards are built.
Now the nice men in white jackets will be with you soon, you be nice to them and tell them about the rabbits. OK?
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 8:27 PM
Someday this war's gonna end. That'd be just fine with the boys on the boat. They weren't looking for anything more than a way home. Trouble is, I'd been back there, and I knew that it just didn't exist anymore.
Captain Benjamin L. Willard - Apocalypse Now
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 8:55 PM
The wealthy new owner needs to re-landscape the front and rear gardens, replace the French doors on the parlor floor with French doors that more closely resemble the originals (ie: more glass, less wood) and install louvered exterior shutters on the original hinges (pintles).
He would then possess a museum-quality residence of the first order.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 9:42 PM
Let's talk about crotchless panties instead of houses. How bout it?
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 11:09 PM
This is massively overpriced:
Once you get it, you've spent 6MM in total. You get roughly 3000 sq feet -- this is priced at roughly 2x the top PSF prices in the heights.
Assuming your opportunity cost is 8%, after taxes, you are paying at least 500k PER YEAR to live there.
Not even an MD at a broker-dealer can be assured of making that after taxes each year.
And the house isn't even that impressive -- for 6MM you should be able to have a fantastic house and wow the neighbors.
Posted by: guest at September 10, 2007 11:20 PM
I agree with 9:42 - shutters and more glass in the french doors would be gorgeous. But I wonder if Landmarks would be cool with that? Sometimes they get so hung up on how the house looked in 1940 that they won't acknowledge how it probably looked in 1840...
Anyway, I'm loving that New Orleans style front porch. I can see Truman Capote sitting out there having cocktails (he was the original Brooklyn Heights booster!).
Posted by: guest at September 11, 2007 10:26 AM
I can't believe that someone paid 2.5 million for the house in its prior condition. The former owner was a bagman who inherited a real estate portfolio. If his father had not left him these properties he would have ended up living in the subways.
I would be surprised if he even has a bank account. Maybe his live-in girlfriend attend to those details.
Anyway I think the purchase price was far less regardless of what was recorded.
Posted by: sam at September 11, 2007 12:01 PM
I repeat. This house is worth every penny.
Posted by: guest at September 11, 2007 12:16 PM
I love that kitchen. The exotic wood on the floor is amazing, and I love the curved shelves on the end of the counter. The warm woods are so refreshing compared to the boring sterility of kitchens over the past few years. By the way the 70's and 80's are absolutely what's chic in truly fashionable interiors now. It's the cutting edge, the latest. In Manhattan anyway.
Posted by: guest at September 11, 2007 1:00 PM
First, the owner is a contractor. His crew did all the work so I doubt the renovation cost him even 500k. House is sandwiched between two large buildings and on a very noisy section of Joralemon St. It's a charming little house but it's little, poorly located and therefore WAY over-priced.
Posted by: guest at September 11, 2007 2:43 PM
Well gee, you know, that's the benefit of being a contractor! Do you begrudge a doctor for not having to pay another doctor to treat his own family member?
It's not the actual cost of the renovations that determine the increase of a property's value. That value is determined by the quality of the work and quality of materials no matter who did the work or how much it cost. This anti-capitalism attitude here Brownstoner is stupid.
Posted by: guest at September 11, 2007 6:52 PM
No matter. The house is still WAY overpriced. It's too small, poorly located and the quality of the finishing is average.
Posted by: guest at September 12, 2007 8:17 PM
Brooklyn Heights.
Close to Manhattan.
Far from interesting.
Posted by: guest at September 13, 2007 12:31 AM
Taken off the market on November 10...
Posted by: guest at November 14, 2007 12:48 PM
11/16/2007 Listed in StreetEasy with Corcoran at $5,275,000
02/07/2008 Price decreased to $4,950,000
$1mm price chop. How much lower will it go folks
Posted by: guest at February 11, 2008 8:31 PM
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