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June 20, 2007
New Development: Greenwood's Shangri-La (Not)
Brooklyn Properties and Brown Harris Stevens are sharing the brokering duties on a new 15-unit condo listing at 710 Sixth Avenue in Greenwood Heights with an illustrious past. The six-story (plus setback) building just slipped under the wire of the rezoning in 2005 so it's no surprise it doesn't exactly blend in. There were lots of violations during construction including weekend work. To cap it off, the architect of this place is the charmer who told members of CB7 that "all your crappy little houses will be gone in 5 years replaced by my beautiful buildings." Beautiful ain't exactly the first word that leaps to mind, is it? As for pricing, the two ground-floor duplexes are asking about $400 a foot while one of the top-floor units is listed at about $750 a foot; most of the apartments on the other floors are priced in the mid- to high-$600s. Interestingly, parking spaces here are going for $30,000, a good deal less than the $75,000 price tag over at The Dewitt.
6th Avenue Condo [Brown Harris Stevens] GMAP
Shangri-La Homepage [Brooklyn Properties]
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Comments
That looks a lot better to me than some of those ramshackle houses in that area.
Posted by: hi! at June 20, 2007 12:51 PM
Sorry Mr. B, it's definitely in Greenwood Hts, not the South Slope.
Ahem.
And fugly too boot! Yellow bricks?
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 12:51 PM
I have dirven by this a couple of times and I must admit that this is a very ugly building
Posted by: anon at June 20, 2007 1:11 PM
"Greenwood Hts"? YES, we all understand the political reasons that name came to the fore but c'mon... amongst ourselves, can't we do a little better?
RESEARCH CONTEST: please find the first published appearances of the fake names "South Slope" and "Greenwood Heights"; a one way ticket to "Nolita" to whoever has the best answer(s).
that said-- for the historical record, thank you-- there is a wondrous range of Architectural Monstrosity in this former non-man's-land, as well as neat brick & wood row houses & cool shit like the Con Ed power station, the Hasidic elementary school & ... more! long may the weirdness be at least a little obscure.
wwib
http://whowalkinbrooklyn.com
Posted by: who walk in brooklyn at June 20, 2007 1:20 PM
I heard from a local who has lived here for 35+ years that Greenwood Heights was traditionally the name of the area between prospect avenue & 38th street (where sunset park begins) BUT only goes from 5th avenue west. So technically the hideous shangri-la is not in Greenwood Hts. Also, I resent the use of the word 'ramshackle' for the small frame houses in this area, ours is terrific.
Posted by: elizabeth e at June 20, 2007 1:33 PM
And don't make me throw down about this again...
Some additional info: http://tinyurl.com/ypqmze
Basic boundaries in my book (and from what I can tell from the old maps is the Expressway to the North, along Green-Wood Cemetery to the South to the 30's, say the end of the Cemetery at 38th St., 3rd Ave to the West and 20th St/MacDonald Ave to the North East.
That being said, others have said that it's any area adjacent to the Cemetery, but that may be too "loose."
And even more debate as if this is a legit "area" (again, don't get me started...see posts on the above link's thread).
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 1:47 PM
ugly name for an equally ugly building
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2007 2:10 PM
I live 3 blocks away on 6th ave and i love the area. So don't get mad at me when I say that 'out of context' is a good thing in this instance. A lot of these houses (especially as you get closer to the Con Ed station) are poorly kept frames. I believe there's one across the street from this that still is showing fire damage.
So I won't comment on my opinion of the design (or the yellow stucco) but having something shiny and new there is a good thing, and maybe it will be a kick in the pants to some of the nearby homeowners to spruce up a bit...
Posted by: greenwood slope at June 20, 2007 2:40 PM
Brother LIB, we'll happily throw down in, say, "Parkville" or fucking "Nottingham" anytime, tho' not New Utrecht which seems a bit... "sketchy" (you know the term) sometimes.
elizbaeth e.: props for defending your modest home & others like it 1000%. note how even people who like to think of themselves as well-intentioned use words like "ramshackle" or "shabby" when describing others... just as so many "good," non-racist people often call corners with local teenagers or even Brooklyn natives on 'em "sketchy." (so i was being ironic above.)
re: 35 years = not enough. seriously, we can go round & round on all this but Greenwood Heights as a RESIDENTIAL area is bullshit, & a recent invention. pls find me all the Bay Ridge, Park Slope, Sunset Park savvy (pre-1980) Brooklyn literature that has ever-- ever-- mentioned that 'hood. (i'll buy you an egg cream if i'm wrong; it happens.)
make no mistake, wwib SUPPORTS the preservation movement there & also vigilance against DOB corruption but fronting pre/post Prospect Xpwy isn't going to help when the Ghost of Kenny Wisdom is on your ass because you were supposed to meet him ...
wwib
http://whowalkinbrooklyn.com
Posted by: who walk in brooklyn at June 20, 2007 2:58 PM
wwib, to joust with you...I have seen tax maps, circa 1850's at Green-Wood Cemetery that use "Greenwood Heights."
I have seen revolutionary war maps that say the "Heights of Greenwood," as well as the slightly earlier "Heights of Gowan."
Back atcha, bucko.
When do I get my egg cream (and hell, where can you still get a good one?)
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 3:33 PM
And just for giggles & shits, from a BMT map from the 1950's documented in this wiki:
http://tinyurl.com/2krrka
Scroll down.
Your jab, wwib.
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 3:47 PM
Or is that "shits & giggles?"
Never happens to me ;)
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 3:49 PM
OK, I'll stop after this...
http://tinyurl.com/33pvhr
Look for the second battle line (atop Battle Hill what's now Green-Wood Cemetery), where it says "The Heights"
Just sayin'
Posted by: lostinbrooklyn at June 20, 2007 3:59 PM
Issue #1 of 2: Where does all this snobbery shit about the names of neighborhoods come from? Who gives a crap what the nabe is called now, as opposed to what it was called "back in the day?" The hostility that revolves around new names of these evolving nabes is psychotic. Anyone that simply fixates on what the nabe "should be called" is just being an asshole. period. This building is in a neighborhood that has been called "Greenwood Heights" since at least the early '90's, possibly earlier than that. The moniker Greenwood Heights is imprinted on a Hagstrom atlas I've had since 2001. This nabe used to be called Sunset Park by longtime residents, (and still is by some) but if you look at a map, you'll notice that Sunset Park is at 42nd street. This building is between 22nd and 23rd streets, and I think it was appropriate to come up with a different name for the area, being that it's 20 blocks away from the park. (By the way, the Hagstrom atlas shows boundaries of the Prospect expressway, 3rd avenue, PPW/McDonald Rd./Ft. Hamilton Pkwy, and 38th street that make up the Greenwood Heights nabe. If you hate the name Greenwood Heights, then just call it Sunset Park or north Sunset Park. I don't give a shit, and I doubt that anyone else does either. But it DOES make sense that this nabe should have a different name than Sunset Park. OK?
Issue #2 of 2: Don't you all think that there is an incredible amount of negativity thrown up against 90% of all the new development happening in Brooklyn on the Brownstoner thread? I live nearby this new building. I know who the architect is, he ain't exactly the salt of the earth, and I would really do my homework before buying into a place like this. BUT, that said, new development is good for this area. New restaurants are opening up. The schools are improving. Most everyone's real estate values are escalating (including the properties of many longtime resident owners who should be thankful for the infusion of cash and interest in the area.) drug dealers and criminals are slowly being cleared out. The police presence has improved greatly. Many of you all think it's "ugly" "ratty" "fugly" or whatever, but the reality is, these kinds of places are selling and bringing more affluence and dollars to the hood, which I personally find to be preferable to old, decrepit structures rotting away in a state of perpetual apathy.
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2007 4:13 PM
Anonymous at June 20, 2007 4:13 PM
I second that. I have lived in this nabe for 3 years now. I also look forward to more shops and restaurants.
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2007 5:47 PM
I have lived here for 9 years and I can tell you that it was just fine - thank you very much - before all the development. (and I consider myself a newcomer) For some of us, this is our home, not some investment or some temporary place we hope turns out to be cool. The majority of my neighbors and friends here are life long residents, born and raised on this street, we don't want our property values to go up so that we all have to move out because we can't afford it, we are pretty much working class and living on paychecks that don't allow us to frequent the new restaurants and hip bars (not that we would want to). Perhaps some of you should just think about who and what and how you are all so enthusiastic on displacing.
Posted by: Anonymous at June 20, 2007 6:46 PM
I have lived here for 9 years and I can tell you that it was just fine - thank you very much - before all the development...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
beautiful post but you know, there's no reason with people only it for the $$$; f-u-c-k them-- maybe they get what they "deserve," maybe they don't. if you can conceive of a life w/at least some other values, it's v. difficult to relate to them. also, there's a HUGE amount of revisionist BK history going on; even at its supposed nadir, many many parts (not all, & for a # of reasons there was a substantial efflux) of BK were ** wonderful. ** that very much includes the 1970s & '80s. that BK was neither Manhattan nor the LI/NJ suburbs didn't bother a lot of us in the least.
LIB, we're going in circles... i still have nightmares about BK revolutionary history so I very well know where that name comes from; I'm also near-certain (but your egg-cream is waiting if i am wrong) from around 1850 to I will even say 1995, ** nobody ** ever used that term to refer to the 'hood. for a # of reasons I can't give away my sources at the moment but I do (truly) appreciate the links (txxx).
#???-- re: the flux of names, there's a certain truth to what you say but it IS important-- i have a lot to say about it but gotta run right now. (i will say the fact that A LOT of the bullshit real estate renaming is overtly racist/classist-- important to add that bc it happened to poor peoples not generally thought that today-- is a big reason.)
thanks for dialogue--
wwib
http://whowalkinbrooklyn.com
p/s: wwib book club bonus question: what writers of the past have asasyed a near-Joycean vision of Brooklyn? where is "Greenwood Heights" in their work?
Posted by: who walk in brooklyn at June 20, 2007 10:24 PM
Anon at 6:46: LOVE YOU. You are a real Brooklynite.
Lost in Brooklyn: Love you too, baby, to bits, but I gotta tell you, Greenwood Heights as a name for a neighborhood is brand spankin new. What we used to call a real estate neighborhood. Areas like that, in-between kind of neighborhoods once populated by working-class immigrants, have historically been identified by their parish. So welcome to St John's! (Unless you were Polish of course)
Posted by: Anonymous at June 21, 2007 12:24 AM
http://www.brooklynproperties.com/house185.htm
Posted by: Anonymous at June 21, 2007 7:23 AM
(I'm 7:23 -- Oops, sorry,wrong thread!)
Posted by: Anonymous at June 21, 2007 7:30 AM
I don't get it sometimes, this site has become a gossip column. Look its here for the public to learn about new things going up, going down etc.. its for your benefit, not for people to go against oneanother because they don't have anything else better to do. If you are smart individual who is in the RE market and you know what your doing, you don't need a site like this to make decisions for you. Some people think its crap and the smart ones will believe that they are buying something that noone else has and that my friends can be taken to the BANK! So be on this site if you will but if you don't have the bucks or the brains to make your own decisions go find a hobbie or something because some of you people are pathetic! greenwood heights, sunset park whatever, all developers pretty much suck, don't take it personally because in the end its all about the big fat Dollar Bill. PLay the game or SHUT UP!!!!
Posted by: Anonymous at June 21, 2007 10:41 AM
I don't get it sometimes, this site has become a gossip column. Look its here for the public to learn about new things going up, going down etc.. its for your benefit, not for people to go against oneanother because they don't have anything else better to do. If you are smart individual who is in the RE market and you know what your doing, you don't need a site like this to make decisions for you. Some people think its crap and the smart ones will believe that they are buying something that noone else has and that my friends can be taken to the BANK! So be on this site if you will but if you don't have the bucks or the brains to make your own decisions go find a hobbie or something because some of you people are pathetic! greenwood heights, sunset park whatever, all developers pretty much suck, don't take it personally because in the end its all about the big fat Dollar Bill. PLay the game or SHUT UP!!!!
Posted by: Anonymous at June 21, 2007 10:43 AM
Congratulations to the South Slope – this is just what we needed. A modern luxurious building with very nice finishes, hope other developers follow.
Posted by: guest at August 24, 2007 11:31 AM
I agree, after looking at several projects in the Slopes, I cannot believe the extraordinary value provided at Shangri-La. Similar projects with fewer conveniences would be double in price just a few blocks away in the North Slope. This is actually very good construction, with beautiful high-end finishes. I can’t ask for a better location for my money and I wouldn’t mind living here at all. See you all soon!
Posted by: guest at August 24, 2007 11:35 AM
Go Anonymous, this seems to have become a gossip column and people are using it to vent their frustrations, lets’ back up a second and use the site constructively to honestly talk about real estate and its value along with what it brings to the neighborhood…. This is truly a high end building with great finishes, lovely views, bright and spacious apartments, private and shared roof decks, elevator, etc. etc. I actually looked at the apartments and liked them very much, enough so that I have an offer in to buy one of the units. Change is good, enjoy it while you can!
Posted by: guest at August 24, 2007 12:01 PM
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