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February 22, 2007
House of the Day: 1219 Bergen Street
Even if the listing for today's HOTD on Bergen Street didn't include a photo with an easel and frames in it, one might still be able to guess that an artist lived there. The house has a very pleasing (in our opinion) vibe that is at once minimalist and respectful of its architectural history. (Either that, or the owner is using a great stager!) The listing is a little skimpy on photos though so it's impossible to know if the rest of the house has the same feel. The fact that the 16-footer is located between New York and Brooklyn Avenues in the footprint of first phase of Crown Heights North landmark district makes the $850,000 asking price a little easier to digest, no?
1219 Bergen Street [Douglas Elliman] GMAP P*Shark
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Comments
saw this house. let's just say there's a reason that there's not many pics up. the house was extremely cluttered and messy which turned me off and shortened my stay so in all fairness maybe i didn't give it a fair shot.
comes with a driveway which is a plus
Posted by: NOT! at February 22, 2007 12:08 PM
This place has been on the market for months! It looks nice in the pics but when I realized how narrow it was, I didn't think it was really worth the ask. Anyone seen it?
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 12:09 PM
mr b:
this one has been for sale like 4 months. also this one (http://www.nwnyrealty.com/Listing/ViewListingDetails.aspx?ListingID=862237&Bb=TR&Cc=862237) is on the same block and is asking $150K more.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 12:09 PM
also....1221 bergen sold for $825K in september...so it's not that badly priced i guess.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 12:14 PM
In reference to "http://www.nwnyrealty.com/Listing/ViewListingDetails.aspx?ListingID=862237&Bb=TR&Cc=862237," I remember this property being renovated last summer. Needless to say, they didn't use the best material and it was definitely cheap labor.
On the plus side, it has a beautiful exterior. I've never been inside, but I think it still has some details left and as Brownstoner mentioned it is part of the 1st phase of the Crown Heights North landmark district.
Posted by: faithful at February 22, 2007 12:46 PM
does anybody know what the deal is with the 2nd floor windows? i've seen other houses like this, with the windows squashed up against each other, but usually this sort of asymmetry is something i associate with Fedderstones. how
Posted by: Jimmy Legs at February 22, 2007 12:52 PM
Looks like it needs alot of interior work, and where are the pics of the Bathrooms??
Posted by: Dave at February 22, 2007 1:06 PM
I would have to see the bathrooms and more of the kitchen(s) before I could comment on the price. Are there two kitchens? It's unclear as the ad reads, it's a legal 2-family but used as one. I will say the area is great because you are so close to the park and children's museum. I think that's a plus and may be a grea thing for a family.
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 1:18 PM
i believe there's only one ktichen...which needed a great deal of updating
Posted by: roll up your sleeves at February 22, 2007 1:31 PM
This area is not great, and not really near the museum or park. It's in the 71st precinct, where there were 23 murders last year, and another 50 murders took place in the surrounding 3 precincts.
Calling it the 'Crown Heights North Landmark District' doesn't make it any safer, although it does sound cozy.
Posted by: anonymous at February 22, 2007 2:12 PM
Sorry, that's the 77th and not the 71st.
Posted by: anonymous at February 22, 2007 2:16 PM
2:12
"This area is not great, and not really near the museum or park. "
are you referring to the bklyn children's museum? how is this not near that museum? it's a block away, isn't it?
Posted by: stumped at February 22, 2007 2:56 PM
Found this homicide map in the NYtimes, and realize it only contains 2003-2005, but it is interesting. Puts a map to the murder talk on this blog. http://www.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20060428_HOMICIDE_MAP.html
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 2:57 PM
anon 2:12
Those stats mean nothing w/o knowing the stats of other areas.
anon 2:57, thanks for providing some context.
Posted by: a little context please at February 22, 2007 3:02 PM
what does the "first phase" part mean of the proposed landmarked bla bla bla ?
Posted by: d8 at February 22, 2007 3:10 PM
Because the proposed Crown Heights North Historic District covers such a large area, it has been sectioned off into four phases, so that landmarking can begin in one area while research continues for the other areas. A map can be viewed on the LPC website.
Posted by: Hal at February 22, 2007 3:35 PM
no to start this up again w/ the LPG troll, but if you look at the ny times map linked to by anonymous, there were only 2 murders in the general vicinity of LPG, and really none in the historick district...just saying
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 3:47 PM
This is a great area. It's a block and a half from the park... It's 77th precinct and yes I know there were murders in the precinct. I go to the meetings. But from our experience over the last two years, we have never had any scary run-ins with anyone in our neighborhood. I know it's tooting my own real estate horn but we have seen the area change even in the last 8 months...
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 3:55 PM
Again posting for Crown Heights Proud:
d8, the Crown Heights North Landmark area is so large that when Landmarks designated the area, they divided it into 4 phases, each to be officially landmarked one at a time, over an unspecified amount of time. This house is in the first phase, and will be landmarked this spring. A couple of blocks over - Park Place, for example, will be landmarked in Phase 2, and other areas to follow.
This block is around the corner from the Children's Museum, and is a very nice, quiet block. While Crown Heights is by no means perfect, to intimate that this house is in the middle of a war zone is the usual crap that really is not accurate. Landmarks would not bother to designate an entire district if it was going the way of a Baghdad neighborhood, what a waste of time, money and effort that would be.
With AY breaking ground, PH, CH, and parts of BS too expensive, people are going to be in CHN in droves. Only jealousy, not some vague desire to "warn" the rest of mankind, would inspire this usual rant. We have beautiful blocks with beautiful homes. If you want to join us here, and help make it better for everyone, you are welcome.
CHP
Posted by: Bx2Bklyn at February 22, 2007 3:55 PM
also, i am definitely not one to start up the murder/crime talk on here, i will say that although every stat of crime is substantially down in the 77th pct from previous years, murders are suspiciously up nearly 100% since 1998...check it out here... http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/pdf/chfdept/cs077pct.pdf
unfortunately, in this case, facts are facts.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 3:57 PM
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 3:57 PM
True. But part of the reason those murders are up is because of two fires that had multiple fatalities. These were labeled as murders. That's not the same as drug dealers gunning you down on the street. These were poorly maintainted rental buildings that had fatal fires. There is more info on this on the CH message board.
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 4:01 PM
4:01..i knew about those, but even if you look at the stats from a few yrs ago, since 1998, murders have been generally increasing while all other violent crimes in the neighborhood have been decreasing. i dont think you can argue that...right?
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:03 PM
I understand that emphasizing the property will soon be landmarked does not necessarily mean that it's in a great neighborhood, but to me it means promise of a better place, at least for those of us who have been priced out of the Slope, Fort Greene, Clinton Hill, etc. Years ago many were describing the above neighborhoods this way too. Now those people who purchased there in the not-so-good days and stayed are sitting pretty.
This area is on the rise. Statistics aside, are there any areas that have not benefited from a landmarked status?
Posted by: faithful at February 22, 2007 4:05 PM
faithful...one that comes to mind for me is mott haven in the bronx.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:06 PM
I agree you can't argue the stats. But check out Manhattan's rise in murder rates over the last two years... But I would never buy there.. too dangerous... ;)
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 4:11 PM
what bubble?
I don't know much about the Bronx, but can you tell me why, in your opinion, landmark designation was not beneficial to Mott Haven? Thanks.
Posted by: faithful at February 22, 2007 4:14 PM
comparing the whole borough of manhattan to one single precinct in brooklyn is beyond disingenuous
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:15 PM
faithful...i dont think the right way to look at it is why wasn't designation helpful, i think the right way (although some might argue it's saying the same thing) is to say the designation had no effect on mott haven. no offense to anyone living there, but it wasn't a good neighborhood before and is not really a good one now (despite all the push to build in the south bronx)....it was only designated to protect some older brownstones there, but those brownstoner were already in pretty bad shape and it was only a 2 1/2 block area or so that was landmarked, so there was no way those 2 blocks were going to have some great benefit from being landmarked while the whole surrounding area was not and is not generally known to be a good or safe neighborhood.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:20 PM
faithful i might say that many people are trying to make that area of mott haven into the new williamsburg, but b/c it's such a small confined area surrounded by not so great housing and not so great area, it's really not happening at any great pace or w/ any interest
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:25 PM
"comparing the whole borough of manhattan to one single precinct in brooklyn is beyond disingenuous"
It's not anymore disengenous than including the fire murders in the fear monger promotion of crown heights... and then dismissing them.. I am out of this one
Posted by: CH wannabe at February 22, 2007 4:33 PM
Given your answer, I don't think that you can compare Mott Haven with CHN. This designation is not only two blocks, but four phases. http://www.nyc.gov/html/lpc/downloads/pdf/maps/ProposedCrown_Heights.pdf
Many of the properties have caring homeowners. The neighbors look out for each other. There is a great association. http://www.crownheightsnorth.com
No offense to Mott Haven, but we're in a different place and this designation will solidify our standing as a neighborhood for future buyers, as well as naysayers, to keep their eye on.
CrownHeightsProud,
I was unable to make yesterday's meeting. Did you attend? If so, can you enlighten me? Thanks.
Posted by: faithful at February 22, 2007 4:38 PM
i wasn't comparing mott haven to CH...you asked a general question about neighborhoods who haven't benefitted not to compare and asked for us to name one..i did...read your question again and my answer
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:44 PM
what only 2.5 blocks of brownstones in the Bronx?
Well they're obviously endangered and I guess LPC treats the city like Triage. It's a good thing that they were saved.
Posted by: jack slade at February 22, 2007 4:45 PM
do you even read what people wrote? who said only 2 1/2 blocks of brownstones in the entire bronx? not me. i don't understand how you can respond to a comment that wasn't made.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 4:50 PM
Bubble, dont panic I didnt even know the Bronx had brownstones Ooops!
Now lets get back to planet of Brooklyn.
Posted by: jack slade at February 22, 2007 5:04 PM
Sorry Jack Slade- I'm a Bronx girl so just to do one last revisit- The bronx is huge and up until very recently no one paid much attention except to movies like Fort Apache, the Bronx, and to the infamous fire history (The Bronx is Burning). But maybe Mott Haven was landmarked before its time- if you don't know, the Bronx is justly renowned for the grand Concourse and its wonderful Art Deco era buildings, not for its brownstones. My family still lives up there, and like every other part of NYC some areas are better than others. But it is coming back if for no other reason than Manhattan is bursting at the seams and it has some fabulous housing stock with its deco apartment buildings.
Posted by: Bx2Bklyn at February 22, 2007 5:15 PM
ok BX I'll visit. Then I'll lean back lean back :)
Posted by: Jack Slade at February 22, 2007 5:34 PM
You know, I read this website quite often for many reasons...without much to say. Sometimes, I find it extrememly humorous how so many posters go into their neighborhood statistic rants. I've lived in Brooklyn quite awhile. I'm not sure there are really any neighborhoods that are not within walking distance of the hood...whatever you may consider that to be.
Whether you live in Park Slobe, Cobble Hill, Fort Greene, Bed-Stuy or Williamsburg (which I find hilarious when people try to defend the sketchiness here and I'm not sure why)...all Brooklyn neighborhoods have areas and blocks that leave something to be desired! I find it funny that to define/defend these neighborhoods, posters go as far to use streets and parks and corners and precincts to decide which part of the neighborhood is most desirable.
This is just the psychology of leveling. My corner/park/precinct/store is better than the one down the street. It's stupid. You guys have to remember, you live in NYC.
Posted by: cillmylandlord at February 22, 2007 5:43 PM
And that coming from someone who calls him or herself "Kill My Landlord" except misspelled...
Posted by: Anonymous at February 22, 2007 5:48 PM
Dont worry I saw that and I dont plan on renewing his lease.
Posted by: got rent? at February 22, 2007 5:50 PM
What bubble?
"Given your answer, I don't think that [you] can compare Mott Haven with CHN."
When I wrote the word "you," I didn't mean you per se. I meant in general -- comprende.
Posted by: faithful at February 22, 2007 6:06 PM
"Cill my landlord" is a reference to a sketch Eddie Murphy used to do on Saturday Night Live back when it was funny. The misspelling of "kill" was part of the sketch. The poster's reference made me laugh, but I guess you had to be there.
Posted by: Kingston at February 22, 2007 6:09 PM
Thanks Kingston, it was funny to me too!
Posted by: cillmylandlord at February 22, 2007 6:22 PM
kill my landlord. c-i-l-l my landlord. hilarious. i had forgotten about that.
Posted by: mr robinson's neighborhood at February 22, 2007 7:03 PM
bk4life, w/ all due respect, what the f$%^ are you talking about? did you read anything i wrote? i never said the neighborhood was bad or dangerous or anything...in fact i said crime was down throughout the precinct and suspiciously only murders were up...that's called a fact...look it up..if you don't like the facts do something to change them. it is not true that murders are up in that precinct? it is... did i say dont buy? no. did i say it was too dangerous to live there? no
so again, what the f%^& are you talking about? don't think you can put me down w/o me defending myself
i am not a renter...i own. but i guess you know me better than i do. i am not fanning any flames...go back and read all my posts on this site...oh i forgot you dont like to read what people actually write.
as a matter of fact i myself am attorney and dont' need to back to school, but thanks for the offer.
i'm glad you live in FG, but this house is in CH...it's a different neighborhood w/ different stats, but i guess you dont know how to read a map either.
what a schmuck!
and BTW, you are the one inserting race into this...i said nothing of race, but for some reason you put the term "dark people" into this...well i am a dark person and am entitled to state a fact about murders in a neighborhood. many great people live in great and bad neighborhoods...so what? does it change the fact there are more murders in some neighborhoods than others? if i were you i'd go ask that ivy league school for a refund b/c you need to be re-educated.
Posted by: what bubble? at February 22, 2007 9:21 PM
The best thing about the C-I-L-L-my-landlord sketch was the reprise, when Murphy thoughtfully added of his poetic gem: "Still holds up."
Gosh, that crime map is depressing--to think of the dozens of murders in 2005 alone, within walking distance of our house, and I don't even know any of their names. Maybe I should've been a small-town girl, that just seems wrong somehow.
Posted by: Brenda from Flatbush at February 23, 2007 12:26 AM
Bk4life-
Now that what bubble? gave you what for, I'd also like to add what does your "typical renter" comment mean? I rent. Plenty of people rent- and guess what. Plenty of them pay rent which you homeowners need to keep your houses. With all that education you claim to have, you couldn't come up with a less ignorant comment than that?
Posted by: Bx2Bklyn at February 23, 2007 1:04 AM
Faithful, I'm sorry you were not able to make it, I was looking forward to meeting you at last.
The meeting was good. We had reports on the landmarking - everything on schedule. We heard that the LPC and the Hebron School and SDA officials are meeting next week to discuss the calendaring of the Hebron School. Our House and Garden Tour committee is rolling right along. We are looking for volunteers to work the actual tour, as room sitters and guides,(you don't have to live in CH, or be in CHNA to volunteer) and we are still looking for people to put their homes on the tour.
We had a local banking officer give us a lesson in all of the kinds of mortgages, refinaces and home loans currently on the market, and the advantages and disadvantages of each kind of loan. He also explained the new reverse mortgages that are available for people over 62, that enable you to take out equity on your house, and the loan is not paid in your lifetime. Your heirs would have to assume a mortgage for the amount borrowed, plus interest, or the house can be sold, with the bank getting first dibs on the amount borrowed. This kind of loan may be good for seniors who would like to enjoy some of the equity on their homes while they are still alive, and leave paying it back to those who follow. If no one follows, the bank sells the house, and gets the money back that way. All of the different loans are obviously not all for everybody, and the presenter did a very good job spelling out the pros and cons of each. I think everyone learned something they may not have known before.
I hope you can make the next meeting, which will be in April.
Posted by: Crown Heights Proud at February 23, 2007 1:25 AM
Here is my obligatory assertion that the above is me, even though typekey never registers my first post, no matter what I do.
Posted by: Crown Heights Proud at February 23, 2007 1:28 AM
CHP,
Thanks so much for the update. I planned on making this meeting, but as life would have it, my 3 year old was sick. It sounds like it was a very informative meeting. I wanted to find out if the finalization of landmarking status would, in anyway, affect my approve plans.
Posted by: faithful at February 23, 2007 9:24 AM
why cant you two just email each other and spare us the details?
Posted by: Anonymous at February 23, 2007 9:33 AM
owns the blog?
Posted by: Anonymous at February 23, 2007 12:05 PM
Any information on the expansion of the Stuyvesant Heights Historic District?
Posted by: Anonymous at February 23, 2007 12:20 PM
Anon 9:33
Because perhaps someone else missed the meeting too. Duh!
Posted by: faithful at February 23, 2007 1:42 PM
yawn........
Posted by: Anonymous at February 23, 2007 1:52 PM
I think Cill My Landlord was the funniest "classic" sketch ever on SNL. It's just so memorable, and it's always made me laugh when someone references it or if I would happen to catch it on a "best of" SNL show on TV. Glad to hear others remember and appreciate it too!
Posted by: Anonymous at February 23, 2007 3:57 PM
There are now interior pics for this link http://www.nwnyrealty.com/Listing/ViewListingDetails.aspx?ListingID=862237&Bb=TR&Cc=862237
Posted by: faithful at February 24, 2007 4:36 PM
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