House of the Day: Hawthorne Street Woodie

I just got back from a walk to Hawthorne Street.The house is #99, on the Bedford--Flatbush block, a few houses from Bedford (a loooong block from Flatbush). It looks to me like an OK house, but somewhat remuddled--vinyl siding and what looks to me like a cement block porch.

I'd think you could get a two story house in Lefferts Manor for this price. It would be about the same size, the Hawthorne St. house is only 1,936 sq. ft., according to Propertyshark, but there couldn't be any rental income.

FWIW, I know a couple (cousins of a friend) who moved from Manhattan to a co-op on the next (Bedford--Rogers) block of Hawthorne recently.I'm told they're quite happy.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 28, 2006 2:56 PM

Tom,

I meant that there couldn't be any rental income in the hypothetical two-story Lefferts Manor house that i thought might go for the same price as the Hawthorne Street house. You are correct that THAT (Hawthorne St.) house is not in Lefferts Manor and could presumably have a rental unit, a possibility mentioned in the listing.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 28, 2006 3:41 PM

I agree with you Anon 4:16. IMO you actually get more privacy in a row house than you do with windows a few feet from your neighbors.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 28, 2006 4:31 PM

AFAIK Anon. 12:05 AM is correct about the kitchen extensions. Most of the limestone/red tile roofed houses on Maple II have them, certainly all I can see from the rear windows of my house, which backs on Maple. Some of them also have second floor extensions, so the size of these houses, which look similar from the front, varies greatly. I don't think any of the two story "Real Estate Associates" houses, near Rogers on all LM blocks, have rear extensions, but I might be wrong. I'd like to put in a good word for the brick colonial revival houses though--simpler yes, but really charming. I especially like the c.1915 ones on Midwood I that are identical to houses in the Albamarle-Kenmore H.D. in Victorian Flatbush.

Oh--BTW, pfa, dicier than BUSHWICK? I know that nabe has improved, with lots of new building to replace what was burned in the '77 blackout rioting, but REALLY? Not that Flatbush Ave. doesn't seem like all you say, but the QUIET as soon as you turn off Flatbush onto a Lefferts Manor block is striking.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 29, 2006 8:33 AM

Anon. 9:09,

After 32 years I'm certainly not "still in...[my] new neighborhood feelings" but I sure agree with Franz's 9:09 post [and find his 10;03 post really funny]. Still, yrmv--that's life.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 29, 2006 1:04 PM

That was a mistake Babs--I think it's Wendy's that has the license--they added brie to their dollar menu to go with the wine ;-)

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 29, 2006 3:37 PM

So, Anon. 7:12, I guess you will not be joining us for wine & cheese at Wendys either--aw shucks!

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 29, 2006 8:57 PM

Anon. 11:56,

Hypocracy aside, the kind of attitude you refer to simply flies in the face of reality. There are many many white families happily and successfully raising kids in PLG and similar neighborhoods. I did; many others are doing so now. I see many midle class white (and black) kids doing perfectly well here. Granted, some white people may not feel comfortable doing so--a regretable attitude IMO, but, if you feel that way, don't live here--just accept that your fears are not universal and maybe, just maybe, might be unwarranted.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 30, 2006 2:35 PM

Right John--it's an afront to your preconceptions about life in our neighborhood. Truth is we DO have quite a bit to be "smug" about.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at November 30, 2006 11:40 PM

Hmmm, evidence. It's REALLY hard to prove a negative(i.e. that PLG is NOT a high crime area), but FWIW, here's the text of the "Police Blotter" from the forthcoming issue of the Lefferts Manor Echo that I'm putting together for publication later this month. Of course, I COULD have fabricated it, but, if anyone questions my word that this is material is unedited they can check with P.O. Martinos, the 71st Pct Community Affairs Officer, to ensure that the information is exactly what he provided. P.O. Martinos' phone number is in the body of the article.If you do phone him, make sure to ask his opinion about crime here. Note that there are some robberies reported (at the end of the article--P.O.Martinos' placement--not mine), but the biggest concern seems to be a shortage of candy for trick-or-treaters on the annual Halloween walk:

"POLICE BLOTTER
By Bill Griffin with thanks to Community Affairs P.O. Vinnie Martinos

Thankfully, with crime in the 71st Precinct down 8% year-to-date, there are more holiday community service activities than crimes to report in and around Lefferts Manor.

Another Successful Halloween Walk

The 71st Precinct would like to thank those in Lefferts Manor who contributed to another successful Halloween Walk. The generosity of the neighborhood in handing out candy and displaying Halloween decorations helped create a tremendous spirit of community and a great experience for the more than 1,000 area kids who participated this year. The precinct has acknowledged, however, the neighborhood’s concerns that with the overwhelming growth in the number of kids, it has become unrealistic for many of us to provide sufficient candy, and that there is somewhat of a safety issue with the jostling crowds on our stoops. The precinct welcomes the neighborhood’s ideas for improving the process and will be working with the LMA to encourage more generous candy/snack donations from companies and local politicians who use the event as a public relations opportunity.

Turkey Drive

In partnership with HealthPlus, the 71st Precinct contributed to a happy Thanksgiving for many by giving away 50 turkeys to area families in need.

Winter Holidays Party – December 17th

On December 17th, officers from the Precinct will host a Winter Holidays Party for area kids at the public school across the street from the police station on Empire Boulevard. Festivities will include gifts, games, and a visit from Santa Claus to help celebrate the season. For more information please contact Community Affairs Officer Vinnie Martinos at 718-735-0527.

Careful of “Shoppers” Looking for a 5-finger Discount

With the holiday shopping season getting into full swing, the Precinct would like to remind everyone that this is traditionally a busy season for pickpockets in the stores and on trains, and for thieves looking to help themselves to packages left in cars. Please remember to keep your wallets and packages secure.

String of Robberies at Chinese-owned Establishments

There have been three recent robberies of Chinese-owned establishments along the Flatbush commercial district in our neighborhood. Although all three were at gunpoint, it is not clear whether they involve the same perpetrators as the methods of entry have all been different. The robberies are currently under investigation".

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 2, 2006 10:32 AM

Anon. 11:06,

You're absolutely right, BUT the article I posted is all the 71st Pct reported to cover a period of aprox 4 months since the last issue of the Echo:

http://www.leffertsmanor.org/newsletter.shtml

I hesitated before posting this "Crime Blotter" but I finally did so because

1--Anon. 8:16 asked for "evidence"
2--I figured that many readers might realize that, if the neighborhood was as "dangerous" as some have claimed, there might be a bit more for the PD to report.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 2, 2006 2:16 PM

"'all the crime reported' is not equivalent to 'all the crime committed'.... I'm afraid this is the case everywhere--not only in PLG but in every nabe".

Yes, of course, and furthermore, no attempt to disprove a negative can really be "compelling". Nevertheless I'm confident that the information I reported is a fair representation of what goes on which, as editor of the "Echo", I'll print in good faith. I can't do better then that.

I'm just asking that readers of this blog keep an open mind and that anyone curious about PLG (or any other neighborhood)see for themselves rather than relying on the sort of "facts" that get repeated so often on the net that they're taken as truth without necessarily corresponding to reality.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 2, 2006 3:25 PM

Thank you Helene--I was about to write a similar comment, but you beat me to it.

While I know Helene and her husband (mainly through PLG Arts) we have never discussed posts on Brownstoner about safety in PLG. (Actually I don't recall our having ever talked about issues of safety). However,I'm glad to see that we have similar views on this matter.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 2, 2006 5:46 PM

Carlo,

Thank you for the compliment, but Comrades? COMRADES?? I live in the same neighborhood as Ed and even agree with SOME of his posts, but I don't usually subscribe to conspiracy theories. Franz is another story--he has a sense of humor I can appreciate, even if his 10:29 AM post was less temperate than most of mine (although I understand his frustration).Actually I don't know Ed or Franz, although I've exchanged an Email or two with the former.

Thank you for NOT thinking that I was "behind" Helene's comment. Actually, I was ALMOST hoping that someone would accuse me of writing her post, that would be sort of flattering, but I guess no one would confuse my pedantic writing style for the graceful style with which she writes. :-)

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 2, 2006 10:30 PM

Ed,

You write "regarding "conspiracy" theories, I don't find anything particularly problematic about questioning the motives of some of the insane sensationalistic accounts of violence in PLG"

I can think of two problematic factors;

1--although the intent of SOME such posters is indeed questionable, it becomes easy to lump all who raise safety questions together and miss dealing with bona fide concerns

2. it only encourages those whose posts are "insane" since such people thrive on provoking outrage--they too want to "titillate and provoke".

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 3, 2006 4:44 PM

Ed,

I guess we'll never agree about everything, but I do love your "'Grandpa of Lefferts Manor' schtick" line, although I'm not quite THAT old. I even agree that there can be value to "a more agressive approach" in SOME venues, but it's SO easy to keep upping the anti without accomplishing anything on the net, were there are no real-world conequences.

And Babs--I agree that Paris is much too dangerous to visit :-)

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 3, 2006 6:22 PM

Babs--I was only joking--we'll always have Paris :-)

Posted by: Bob Marvin at December 4, 2006 6:43 PM