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October 5, 2006

Victorian Flatbush in Vivid Color

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While nosing around flickr recently (as is our wont), we came across this great series of Victorian Flatbush that someone with the handle pictureinfocus took last Spring. If you've never made it out there in person, we strongly suggest you click through and watch the slideshow. Mmmm, mmmm, good.
Colonial Brooklyn 04-09-2006 [Flickr]




Posted by Brownstoner at 11:08 AM | Comments (24)
Categories: Neighborhoods

Comments

Why is the caption for this photo album "Colonial"

Perhaps a visit to a timeline like http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/knowhow/exteriors/article/0,16417,398039-1,00.html
is in order.

DUTCH COLONIAL Time: 1650-1710.

COLONIAL REVIVAL Time: 1880-1955

I don't really see Colonial Revival style houses in that album.

I do see:
CRAFTSMAN Time: 1905-1930
QUEEN ANNE Time: 1880-1910 (This ornate style is what people most often refer to as "Victorian." )
and maybe even
GREEK REVIVAL Time: 1825-1860

I am disappointed in the number of wood frame houses included in the album that have porches, etc. that have been brick clad, as that is not a detail that was original to the wood houses.
The album caption says: "Many of the old houses have had some remodeling but the architecture is the same."
Um, no a brick creep porch is not the same as a wooden porch.

If you want to celebrate the beauty of architecture of the area, why not be more discriminating about which houses you take photos of. There are many more wood frame houses in the area that have original and restored details that have not been engulfed in brick or stucco.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 12:34 PM

For more photos of the area check this post http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2006/06/victorian_flatb_2.html

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 12:53 PM

Tough crowd!

Posted by: brownstoner at October 5, 2006 1:15 PM

What train would I take from the Atlantic Avenue/Flatbush Extension area to reach this neighborhood?

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 1:15 PM

You could take the Q Train. Northern end of Victorian Flatbush get off at the Church Avenue stop, exit front of train, make a right out of the station and proceed to Buckingham Road, make a left into Prospect Park South.

Here's a good map of the areas of interest:

http://marykayg.com/html/large_map.html

Posted by: SeamusMacD at October 5, 2006 1:30 PM

Did anyone see the fascinating A Victorian Reborn? http://www.history.com/classroom/victorianreborn/index.html

Details were lovingly restored and/or replicated and the kitchen and bath brought up to modern standards but still blended in with the house.

And check out http://www.crazystable.squarespace.com/display/ShowJournal?moduleId=307444¤tPage=2
for Brenda from Brooklyn's blog entry about walking tour of Victorian Flatbush

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 1:38 PM

You can also get off the "Q" at Beverly or Cortelyou Road stops.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 1:40 PM

Great houses, I really love it over there. Since most people really don't know the architectural styles of most residential buildings, I'll cut the poster a break. To me, most (not all) are either shingle style Queen Anne's or variations on classic Four Squares, a Craftsman era style. They went nuts with the dormers on some of them. Since most of the area dates from the turn of the century and later, that works out.

The preservationist in me is very happy most look to be in excellent shape, with some exceptions of remuddling with faux brick, and the poor mustard house with the awful enclosed brick porch with the bay windows. What were they thinking besides more space, must make more space?

I love this part of Brooklyn, and wish I could get over there more often. Thanks for the mini tour.

Posted by: CrownHeightsProud at October 5, 2006 1:48 PM

I live (well, used to...my parents still do..) in one of these houses and while I can understand how many homeowners want to just add brick to lessen the amount of repairs to 100-year old wood, you need to remember that these homes are all proteced by the Landmarks Commission and it's a shame to alter their appearance so greatly. I'm all for renovation, but when you buy a landmark house you're stuck with certain rules against a number of changes to the original design.

Posted by: pasc at October 5, 2006 3:51 PM

I live (well, used to...my parents still do..) in one of these houses and while I can understand how many homeowners want to just add brick to lessen the amount of repairs to 100-year old wood, you need to remember that these homes are all proteced by the Landmarks Commission and it's a shame to alter their appearance so greatly. I'm all for renovation, but when you buy a landmark house you're stuck with certain rules against a number of changes to the original design.

Posted by: pasc at October 5, 2006 3:51 PM

The problem is, is that a lot of the houses ARE NOT in landmarked zones and the owners are doing whatever the fruggly they want to the houses.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 5:34 PM

Agreed -this entire area should be landmarked. It is a jewel. I was shocked when I first stumbled upon it - gorgeous real houses within 25 minutes to wall street on public transportation.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 6:14 PM

I blush so deeply at the raves for "Victorian" Flatbush that I should point out: Y'all should see our Keyspan bills...

Posted by: Brenda from Flatbush at October 5, 2006 6:38 PM

Many of the houses built in Ditmas Park proper, which is just a sub-section of Victorian Flatbush, were built in what is called the Free Colonial Revival style. There are many examples of Queen Anne (Victorian), Carpenter Gothic, Tudor, and throughout the greater area. True craftsman cottages (the only examples in Brooklyn) can be found on East 16th street in Ditmas Park.

In Prospect Park South there are also a handful distinctive "folly" homes, such as the Swiss Chalet, the Japanese House, the Renaissance palazzo, and a house, which according to the 1902 Brooklyn Eagle, which Indian bungalow.

With the exception of the homes in Prospect Park South (the grandest of the neighborhood) and Ditmas Park itself, the vast majority of Victorian Flatbush is not landmarked at present. Despite alterations to some of these homes, including ugly brick enclosures and siding, it is high time all of the continguous Victorian Flatbush neighborhoods were landmarked, before great tracks of it are permanently disfigured. Victorian Flatbush has the greatest number of freestanding Victorian homes in the country - a designation which is under growing threat each time one of these heinous renovations happens. Since the 1920s, over 1000 homes have been destroyed to make way for apartment buildings. Entire areas, such as the vast Vanderveer Park (east of Flatbush Avenue) have vanished almost completely.

It should be noted that there are many new homeowners in the Flatbush who are restoring previously disfigured houses, through the use of original sales photos and 1940s tax photos.

Victorian Flatbush is one of Brooklyn's and New York City's - underrated treasures. Don't let it disappear altogether.

For more info check out Brian Merlis and Lee A. Rosenzweig new photo history of Flatbush, out just this week, as well as my site:

http://home.att.net/~ebasics/Victorianflatbush.html

*Correction to the website: the original Matthews Park was not present day Caton Park, but a large section of current Beverley Square West

Posted by: Erin Joslyn at October 5, 2006 6:57 PM

That should read East Indian Bungalow.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 7:06 PM

BTW, Brenda, Love your glass restoration!

Posted by: Erin Joslyn at October 5, 2006 7:09 PM

This house is covered in asbestos shingles if I am not mistaken.

Posted by: da at October 5, 2006 10:48 PM

Yes, it would need to be tented to remove the shingle.

Posted by: Erin Joslyn at October 6, 2006 10:15 AM

Yes, it would need to be tented to remove the shingle. The original appearance is salvagable, if an expensive process. No part of the house has been structurally altered, as far as I can tell. The original shingle is usually protected by the asphalt/asbestos shingles, to some extent. Repairs can be made, or entire house can be reshingled. If in a landmarked neighborhood, there should be some financial help in the form of a loan for this sort of thing.

Posted by: Erin Joslyn at October 6, 2006 10:17 AM

A house on Beverley Road had this faux brick siding successfully removed a few years ago. I think it was refinished with hardiplank, which looks great.

Posted by: Erin Joslyn at October 6, 2006 10:18 AM

25 minutes to Wall Street?

It takes me 15 minutes from Cortelyou to Atlantic on the "Q" and then another 15 minutes on the "2" to get to Wall Street. So with walking plus waiting time it's more like a 40 to 45 minute trip. But still not a bad commute.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 6, 2006 10:32 AM

The Command Bus from Cortelyou road gets you to down town Manhattan pretty quickly...

Posted by: Anonymous at October 6, 2006 12:44 PM

The Command Busses are now part of NYC transit express bus systems and the price has gone up to $5 per ride. It's only marginally faster to take the bus then the subway and the stop in the morning let's me off on the wrong side of Manhattan, so have to walk cross town. And I don't work just in the Wall Street office every day. I'm at different company offices for morning meetings, and the bus doesn't stop near those other offices.

But some of my neighbor that are also coworkers ( and that only work the Wall Street office) do use the express bus and like it.

Posted by: Arsenic and Old Lace at October 6, 2006 1:40 PM

Yes - I am the 25 minute poster- I take the Command bus and it is 3 stops to my office, through the bus lane of the tunnel. I used to take the subway, which took about 45 minutes, but now I can pretty much guaranty I will be sitting behind my desk within 20 to 30 minutes of walking out my door. It is much faster for me.

Posted by: Anonymous at October 10, 2006 6:35 PM

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