« Toll Brothers in the Burg: 49 North 8th Coming Hope Street Bohemoth Sells for $26 Million »
September 6, 2006
Irresponsible Developers Try to Dump New-Build
This building on the corner of Grand and Greene, the poster child for the wave of cheap, ugly developments that are selling short the futures of many Brooklyn neighborhoods, is finally on the market. While it was being built slapped up, we documented the poor craftsmanship while one reader called it a shit sandwich. Earlier in its construction, the developer had received a Stop Work Order for shoddy excavation. Basically, he'd dug the foundation without an engineer using unlicensed labor, so big surprise that the structural integrity of the adjacent building was compromised. Now these jerks are trying to cash in and dump the place off on some unsuspecting soul. Hopefully, the gas lines and electrical meters that adorn the facade will be a red flag but maybe someone will fall for the sales pitch touting "original stone from Jerusalem." And that front door: They must have spent, what, $25 on it? What a load of crap.
4-Story 2-Family [Craigslist] GMAP
Comments
To think how many times I was barred from using this site by using language LESS vulgar!
Posted by: Ed at September 6, 2006 10:21 AM
Wow. I don't ever say this - and I think people who usually do are more or less people who will say they hate everything in the world except for the stuff they own - but, this really is ugly.
Posted by: dcardoni at September 6, 2006 10:24 AM
We've been watching this building go up over the last year. Such a travesy! They didnt even try to make it look decent. Further, its definitely to their OWN financial disadvantage making it look like a jail. Doesnt make any sense...
Posted by: I love Clinton Hill at September 6, 2006 10:27 AM
worst. building. ever.
Posted by: clinton hilbilly at September 6, 2006 10:29 AM
wonder what's behind the lovely wood piece?? The facade looks like Alice's adventures underground with that ridiculously tiny front door. Wish they could be sued for sheer gall.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 10:30 AM
there's a 'bay' window behind the plywood. the aesthetics of this place are astounding, even by new construciton standards. in the back they've literally dug a back yard 10 ft into the ground, so the cellar can be considered part of the 'double duplex.' the yard is basically a concrete tub.
that top floor is hilarious. i have to admit, the railing makes it look a little better than it did without it, but that's not saying much.
still, who wouldn't want a window in their bedroom overlooking the kitchen?
Posted by: Jimmy Legs at September 6, 2006 10:44 AM
Real question is why does the city allow this crap to be built? Why is there no mechanism to deny this aesthetic vandalism?
Posted by: SeamusMacD at September 6, 2006 11:01 AM
I don't know much about building codes...but can someone PLEASE tell me how the f**k they can LEGALLY install gas lines on the exterior facade!! How freakin dumb is that!
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 11:08 AM
lovely. my question is, how much does such a gem go for these days? i don't see a price anywhere...
Posted by: sylvia at September 6, 2006 11:38 AM
This is suppoed to be a free capitalist country. The government regulates so much already, who do you folks want more regulation? It's a property owners right to design as he wishes as long as builing code is followed. In order to get a C of O, this guy had to follow the code, so I see no problem.
If you don't like, don't buy it.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 11:45 AM
You can decide not to buy it, but those of us in the neighborhood have no choice but to look at it. You also could make the argument that the developer of this just "stole" from his neighbors by erecting this monstrosity and thereby decreasing, by some degree, the desirability of the nearby houses.
Posted by: brownstoner at September 6, 2006 11:50 AM
Brownstoner,
I am confused about the intentions of this blog. It's great that you chart these real estate developments in Brooklyn, but it is very unclear how you feel about the borough as a whole.
As a Manhattaner, I rarely visit your area, but the more I read this blog, the less I want to. You present Brooklyn as a disgusting wasteland of miss opportunities and ugly buildings - that there is no reason to cross the East River.
As you are very intelligent about the subjects you cover, you owe it to the place you call home to take action against this drivel, because no one else is. You document it, but do nothing, except complain. Why? What does this accomplish?
Every week we are bombarded with dire and the ugly images. You sell yourself and your neighbors short. So, in short, take initiative and create change.
Otherwise, you are just another internet wannabe
Kevin
Posted by: Kevin at September 6, 2006 11:52 AM
Hey 11:45,
If according to DOB standards, its perfectly cool to place freakin natural gas lines on the exterior facade..err..cinder block wall, then maybe I should be mad at the city agencies... and I agree with 11:50, I don't want our BK nabes to look like Philly where there are no "good neighborhoods" but only "good blocks"!!
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 11:57 AM
Hey Manhattaner (whatever the hell that is),
You should not be quick to criticize Brownstoner for not being some sort of political action committee or special interest group...I believe they created this blog to be a forum, a type of truly democratic news source, a people's soapbox in the square...
"I rarely visit your area, but the more I read this blog, the less I want to". In that case, please continue reading.
Sincerely,
A true New Yorkanite
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 12:12 PM
Anon 11:45- what makes you think he followed the code? Building regulations are there to make sure that they are built to a certain safety code- duh! Considering what's been going on in Brooklyn develoers ignore them anyway. So if the exterior gas lines are unprotected, don't you think the neighbors have something to worry about? I damn well do.
Kevin- stay in Manhattan. If you don't get that this blog is about fighting to keep what is best about Brooklyn (and there is a huge amount of it), then you're the one with the problem, not brownstoner.
Posted by: jennyanne at September 6, 2006 12:19 PM
seems to me there are plenty of mentions of nice houses on this site as well as the bad stuff. he shouldn't need to defend himself to anyone (esp somebody who admits to not having any interest in the area anyway), but he has been involved in advocacy (grand ave is still barricaded). but when it comes to ugly new construction buildings, if there's a way to stop them, sign me up!
Posted by: Jimmy Legs at September 6, 2006 12:36 PM
I get the feeling that the vast majority of Kevin's Brooklyn expreience amounts to passing through on his way to Jersey when Hudson river crossing traffic necesitates a Staten Island transverse.
Kevin - stick with curbed.
Posted by: csk at September 6, 2006 12:52 PM
Correction Kevin: Brownstoner has done a lot for the community. Look at the recent quality of life improvements in Clinton Hill as a result of the Grand Ave police intervention and the closing of the Lefferts Hotel. These positive community developments were initiated and cultivated right here on this blogsite. Brownstoner can't be all things to all people, but his love for his community is incontrovertible.
Posted by: BrownBomber at September 6, 2006 1:01 PM
Original stone from Jerusalem? What did he do, pillage it from the Western Wall?
Posted by: DC at September 6, 2006 1:08 PM
that comment from kevin is really steaming me. this site is great for brooklyn. i guess it goes to show that there will always be a critic.
Posted by: csk at September 6, 2006 1:18 PM
Wow. Do we have a new sighting of the Troll? If
"Kevin" is his real name, I'd be shocked.
Posted by: Anonymouse at September 6, 2006 1:40 PM
I'm sure Brooklyn has all kinds of fabulous things going on, but I'm a busy person who often does not get to go out nearly enough. I check blogs like these often for quick bursts of information as to where I should devote my time when I'm not running around with my head cut off at work.
From my perspective, this Blog's tone seems to be devoted to expressing their disdain and disgust for all things Brooklyn. I love New York, and have enjoyed my experiences exploring all its boroughs, but if you were someone who's only real experience of Brooklyn was Brownstoner, you would gain a very disgusting portrayal of it – one loaded with nothing but newly constructed Fedders.
If it is illegal to place gas pipes on the front façade, and Brownstoner notices this, they owe it to their community to report such a travesty, so it is comforting to know that they’ve placed their journalistic might and watchdog attitude into furthering certain causes in the past.
CSK, I don’t know what a “Troll” is, but I have every right to be critical of information placed in the public view. That is, as another commentator noted, what a forum is about. Regardless; your slanders are not of my concern, but the improvements of our community.
Now I will stop wasting my time with your petty insults and start putting my money where my mouth is.
Posted by: Kevin at September 6, 2006 2:23 PM
I'm sure Brooklyn has all kinds of fabulous things going on, but I'm a busy person who often does not get to go out nearly enough. I check blogs like these often for quick bursts of information as to where I should devote my time when I'm not running around with my head cut off at work.
From my perspective, this Blog's tone seems to be devoted to expressing their disdain and disgust for all things Brooklyn. I love New York, and have enjoyed my experiences exploring all its boroughs, but if you were someone who's only real experience of Brooklyn was Brownstoner, you would gain a very disgusting portrayal of it – one loaded with nothing but newly constructed Fedders.
If it is illegal to place gas pipes on the front façade, and Brownstoner notices this, they owe it to their community to report such a travesty, so it is comforting to know that they’ve placed their journalistic might and watchdog attitude into furthering certain causes in the past.
Anon # 1:40, I don’t know what a “Troll” is, but I have every right to be critical of information placed in the public view. That is, as another commentator noted, what a forum is about. Regardless; your slanders are not of my concern, but the improvements of our community.
Now I will stop wasting my time with your petty insults and start putting my money where my mouth is.
Posted by: Kevin at September 6, 2006 2:24 PM
How can a site be surrounded by thousands of exemplary buildings and still come out like this? Because architecture schools train their students not to imitate sucessful models, but rather, to be creative.
Posted by: Ian at September 6, 2006 2:25 PM
"How can a site be surrounded by thousands of exemplary buildings and still come out like this? Because architecture schools train their students not to imitate sucessful models, but rather, to be creative"
Did they even use an architect for this? :)
the problem is not that they are trained to be creative, but novelty-seeking for the sake of novelty.
with regards to the stick issues of an owner having a right to do with his property as he pleases -no there are zoning laws, there are historic districts, there desginated historic buildings. There are covenants in deeds too, but these are often disregarded.
But i think it's safe to say that for example, on a brownstone row street - a house like this brings down the value of the other homes...and neighborhoods, i think have a right to think about the long term value of their neighborhoods and the quality of life...that is until some greedy developer bribes the ESDC :)
Posted by: dreadnaught at September 6, 2006 2:49 PM
If you don't like it, buy it and tear it down. It's for sale, right? What's the big deal? Gather the neighbors together, pool some cash, and turn it into something beautiful!
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 3:20 PM
Okay I just erased a whole posting about Kevin. This building, it sucks. I think it is evidence that there could be a valuable service to be done to let developers know what design is and why it is valuable. Quite frankly, and I know this is going to sound snooty, it is simply a lack of education. Many of these developers are self-made men (sic) who simply have not been taught how to appreciate good design.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 6:44 PM
Bottom line is this...If I see something like this going up on my bstone block...I'm going balistic.
Lets work together people...right now.
Aside from 311, is there a DOB complaint hotline that anyone knows of?...I'm dead serious.
This ish has got to stop, booming market or not.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 7:04 PM
Unfortunately the 311 number is now a blanket between city folk and the people who are supposed to protect it. The numbers I used to be able to call no longer work and I'm told, call 311. Still, try the blue pages of the phone book- ya never know.
Kevin- pffftt! (A Bronx cheer to you)If you only pick up on the negative. maybe that's all you're capable of seeing. I see a blog of people passionately in love with Brooklyn and things brooklynese- the fact that you think it's disgusting or only concentrates on fedders, then you obviously can't read very well.
As for troll- sure you know. I thought it odd that in your first post, with a Typekey id you claim to be a Manhattanite and in the second you say, "Regardless; your slanders are not of my concern, but the improvements of our community."- which is it? or to quote the infamous one "busted."
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 8:20 PM
Ok, this one takes the ugly cake, along with ice cream and candles. Yeeesh! Your local Fedders looks like McKim, Mead, and White next to this. This has to be the fugliest townhouse I've seen on this blog, and we've had some winners.
Seriously, standards in building practices have hit rock bottom lately. Between this one and the sheet rock special the other day, there seems to be no quality left, whatsoever. What really upsets me, and this DOES affect other people's property values, is that Bed Stuy is becoming the Deadwood of new construction. You can obviously just roll into town and put up any old POS, and open for business. Any destructive jerk could easily do some serious damage to those gas pipes, and who in their right mind would want to live next door, or across the street. For that matter, who would want to live THERE? To the people who think Landmarks is some kind of Big Brother fascist organization: THIS is why it exists.
Posted by: Crown Heights Proud at September 6, 2006 8:39 PM
This is in Clinton Hill, across the street from the boundary of the landmarks district (southeastern cornr of greene and grand). Another example of why the landmarked district needs to be extended to prevent the few remaining open lots in the nabe from having this sort of crap built on them.
Posted by: lp at September 6, 2006 9:05 PM
Odd thing re outside electric meters I thought people would like to know.
I had ConEd tell me that they were changing all of their electric meters to wireless remote readers (i.e. no black things on the outside of your building with wires running to the meters in the basement). They insisted on upgrading mine (I resisted because mine worked properly after months of incorrect readings by ConEd). In the end I had the upgrade...
Point of my story is that I do not know why electric meters are on the outside of these developments. The remote reader is simply a replacement of the clear glass portion of the the meter. It can be read through walls wirelessly as mine is. Why, then, do developers put the meters on the outside if the new meters ConEd prefers can be read through walls, from a ConEd car on the street!!!!!!
Posted by: lp at September 6, 2006 9:10 PM
LP, are you sure it's ConEd that has the automated meter readings or is it Keyspan? I have the Keyspan auto-read gas meters in my buildings but not electric. Trust me; I hope that you're right because I would convert in a nanosecond!
As for the building, I agree, it's hideous and it certainly hurts the adjacent homes and the greater nabe. Nothing short of expanding the historic district can save Clinton Hill from further travesties. Same goes for Bedford-Stuyvesant. It's really a shame. Too many prime brownstone blocks are left ripe for the taking by unscrupulous developers with no concern for neighborhood aesthetics or historical significance.
With that being said, here’s my question: who’s the targeted buyer? I would assume that if someone had the means to afford and save the down payment, had the means and credit worthiness to secure a home mortgage and understood the desirability of living in hip Clinton Hill, that this person would certainly have some level of sophistication and class. Why would someone of this ilk, presumably educated and upwardly mobile, pluck down his or her hard earned money on this POS?!?!? The market will eventually correct itself in that the shoddy “luxury” development market will no longer be profitable for shady developers as substantial mark downs will be the only way to move these dumps.
Posted by: BrownBomber at September 6, 2006 10:20 PM
although this is surely an ugly building, I feel obligated to say it is not on a "brownstone block." There is an empty lot on one side, on the other a one-story commercial space followed by a short row of modest bow-fronts. Across the street is a nicely renovated apartment building (and boy, I remember when this was a boarded up wreck)and a short row of brownstones ending with a derelict building. The remainder of the block on both sides is empty lots, parking lots, commercial buildings, apartments buildings...a mixed bag of the good, the bad and the ugly. Just sayin.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 6, 2006 10:30 PM
Stick some dented sheet metal on the outside at weird angles and say it was inspired by Frank Gehry.
It will sell for double the asking price in no time at all.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 7, 2006 2:30 AM
BrownBomber - definitely ConEd - electric.
I already had the remote KeySpan gas reader. Only exterior reader now is for water.
As for not being a "brownstone block", Greene between grand and st. james is a brownstone block. This wreck is across the street on the opposite corner. This block, between grand and classon, is mixed, but does have several lovely, in need of restoration, row houses.
Posted by: lp at September 7, 2006 10:30 AM
I'm a local Brooklyn Architect and am looking for a few investors to buy this building with, tear it down and attempt to deign/ build something to replace it.
Anyone interested and have a few investment dollars to spare please leave contact information and I will gladly call you.
PS Kevin, I encourage you to be less productive at work and donate some of it to less fortunate circumstances (See building above)
Posted by: Anonymous at September 7, 2006 11:06 AM
this building hurts me, physically. the basement will be begin leaking next winter b/c the genius poured it in the dead of winter. sigh.
sorry to be so uncivicly minded, but any tips on how to prevent such ugliness in the future? any way to protest before building begins to ensure builders are more responsible at least if not also force taste on them?
Posted by: beth at September 7, 2006 12:45 PM
LPC should come to its senses and preserve all of Brownstone Brooklyn. It's the only way. Period.
Posted by: Anonymous at September 7, 2006 3:37 PM
If Kevin prfers to be a big cock-roach in Manhattan let him!
Posted by: anon at September 8, 2006 8:06 AM
Brownstoner,
In your previous article, March 21, 2006
Sketchiness Continues at Greene and Grand, there is evidence that this building has a serious violation no one mentioned.
The exposed joists have not been fire cut at the ends. This is serious and you should bring these images to the city's attention.
Maybe they'll ask them to take it down
Posted by: Anonymous at September 8, 2006 2:33 PM
yep - i have been nervously observing the "construction" here. dubious at best.
Posted by: janelle at September 8, 2006 5:54 PM
A couple points.
1)I'm a different Kevin.
2) They are gas meters, and if they were inside they would have to be in a fire rated room, which would cost uhh . hundreds.
3) Architects are not trained to do novel things for the sake of novelty. They are trained to think creatively and solve problems. The problem is defined by the owner. If the problem was to build a shelter for as little as possible, I guess he succeeded. Of course if he had any morals at all he should have said no thanks. But architects are people, some good and some bad.
4) Not agree with the other Kevin, but this site does seem to dwell on real estate issues an awful lot. Personally I would like more posts on finding a good doctor, dentist, etc. and local events. But It's still a great blog overall.
Posted by: Kevin Q at December 17, 2006 3:55 PM
I think the architect for this (and another shitty architect I know by the name of Tom Winter) should be run out of the city by angry mobs.
I thought this blog was started by someone who wanted to document their brownstone renovation, and the magic of the internet let it evolve into whatever it currently is. Which, I guess, is something where a lot of people of different opinions lay their viewpoint.
Posted by: Mike Manh at December 17, 2006 11:56 PM
Post a comment
Please be patient while your comment is published. It may take a moment.