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April 17, 2006
House of the Day: More Dean Street Action
In the wake of Thursday's news that 152 Dean had gone into contract $150,000 above asking price, it seems timely to look at another new listing on Dean Street with a similar profile. We don't know the exact address (but are counting on someone telling us) of this 4-story, 3-family brick, but it looks like it's on an attractive stretch of the street. The house has been recently renovated with some modern touches, but a decent amount of original detail appears to remain. We suspect it may be a little more built out than some buyers would like, but clearly the reno was a quality job. From nothing more than looking at a few photos, 152 Dean feels more up our alley, but we're sure this won't have a hard time attracting buyers. Do you think $2.2 million is on the mark?
Dean Street Townhouse [Brown Harris Stevens]
152 Dean Street In Contract [Brownstoner]
Comments
At what price does having an owner's duplex and two rentals above stop making economic sense for a buyer? I often muse that question in this appreciating market.
Posted by: alex at April 17, 2006 11:51 AM
I think 2.2 million is just too much (687 bucks a square foot)
Look at what 630 bucks a square foot can get you:
http://www.halstead.com/detail.aspx?id=1101056
amazing quality, much higher rental income. Beautiful garden, and layout, and wonderful location.
saying this one is "centrally located" on dean st sounds like it is too far east..
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 11:58 AM
For $2.2M you can get a lot more square footage at this house. 3900 sq ft. mid $500s per sq ft in Carroll Gardens.
www.306UnionStreet.com
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 12:07 PM
Assuming about $60,000 per year of income from the two rentals (say $2,000 per month for the 1 bedroom and $3,000 for the 2 bedroom). At 15 times rent roll, the rentals would be worth about $900K. That means the owner's duplex is costing about $2.0 million. Looks like a great place, but that's a very expensive duplex. Even for the prime PS location.
Regarding the Dean Street location, the house looks like it's in the historic district which means anywear from Smith to Nevins (3 blocks). I think all of those blocks are central.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 12:15 PM
It's debateable how much better a location 306 Union Street is (306 = somewhere bwteewn Court + Hoyt). Both are busy traffic streets. I Don't think that part of Union is landmarked.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 12:24 PM
"Assuming about $60,000 per year of income from the two rentals (say $2,000 per month for the 1 bedroom and $3,000 for the 2 bedroom). At 15 times rent roll, the rentals would be worth about $900K. That means the owner's duplex is costing about $2.0 million. Looks like a great place, but that's a very expensive duplex. Even for the prime PS location."
well the same can be said for dean st: definitely less rental income for two bog standard 1.5 bedders with no decks.
so the math still doesn't work:
$1.7m for a 1200 sq feet 2 bedder plus the hassle of handling the move-in move-out vacancy and please-fix-this arrangements of two families?
there is also no mention of a basement.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 12:29 PM
I agree which gets to the point of the first question which was "At what price does having an owner's duplex and two rentals above stop making economic sense for a buyer?"
Seems like someone willing to pay $1.6 mm to $2.0 mm for their own space wants an entire house or a triplex with a rental.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 12:43 PM
I guess the question would be how much is it worth (or should there be a discount) to convert a 3 or 4 family into a triplex rental or single family? Granted that all or at least 3 continuous floors can be delivered vacant.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 1:13 PM
I think this house is closer to Bond (which would still put it in the BH historic District). Dean Street between Smith and Bond has tended to be the trendsetter for BH prices, being among the first houses to break the million-dollar mark approximately 5 years ago. The price might be off by about $150K. If the owner is rationale, I predict a sale price close to 2.1M.
Rental income: I think the rental income to price ratio went out the window along time ago. Given the slow climb in rents, the last time we saw prices in BH that would allow a 3-family homeowner to make a colorable claim that the rent covered the mortgage was probably 1998.
Posted by: crouchback at April 17, 2006 1:48 PM
as to why someone would pay that much for a duplex, i can only confess to my own wishful thinking--that if rental income can help us get into a house, then sometime down the road we can expand our space by phasing out the rental income as our own financial position improves. this may not make total sense, but i think a lot of buyers are thinking this way. for those of us who love brownstones and don't have 2-3M ready, this seems like the only way to get in.
Posted by: looking at April 17, 2006 3:36 PM
As I start approaching, planning for retirement I'm very glad I have 2 rentals in my 4 story.
Originally had 3 tenants and then when had mortgage paid off made duplex for myself.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 5:15 PM
It's good to have options with the flexibility of 3 or 4 family.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 5:52 PM
Ok, I'm gonna skip the rental income question and cut straight to Re: Renovation. Mr. B, are you kidding me? WTF is up with that 3/4 height/half-witted wall dividing off the kitchen?! With the little cut-out? Are you kidding me? That's the stupidest thing I've ever seen - looks straight out of a 1980s rental building in Murray Hill.
Posted by: Mr. Minerva at April 17, 2006 6:00 PM
Let's see you idiots put up pix of where you live before you start dissing every house that comes on the market that you could NEVER AFFORD ANYWAY.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 7:37 PM
I strongly disagree, Anon 7:37pm.
Lots of people can afford that place. Who do you think is paying those prices? It's obvious that many weathly people use Brownstoner as a resource when researching a home purchase in Brooklyn.
Most of the "dissing" done on this sight is valid. I supervise lots of construction, and based on my own experience posters on this sight are by and large pretty astute -- even Brownstoner (ha ha).
Posted by: ebomb at April 17, 2006 10:26 PM
It's on Dean between Bond & Nevins. What do you think the tenant quarters look like? There ain't pix of the two upper floors (the rentals.) Fair price for a place like this $1.7/1.8 then you can sink another $500,000 and make it nice.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 17, 2006 11:04 PM
Here is another house. One block over for $500K less.
http://www.cobbleheights.com/
ref#: 5275863
There are different views about the same market. Can anyone decipher this riddle?
Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 5:56 PM
Here is another house. One block over for $500K less.
http://www.cobbleheights.com/
ref#: 5275863
There are different views about the same market. Can anyone decipher this riddle?
Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 5:59 PM
What block is that on? I see the bike lane so it's either Dean or Union. Unless the rentals are controlled this looks like good value.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 10:10 PM
What block is that on? I see the bike lane so it's either Dean or Union. Unless the rentals are controlled this looks like good value.
Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 10:10 PM
i think it is bergen b/t bond and nevins... there are quite a few 3 story buildings on that block...
Good value. I think YES. I don't think there is any rent control. does any ne know?
Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 2:05 AM
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...........Where do all these real estate experts come from? Can't they go back there?
Posted by: Ed at April 19, 2006 8:01 PM
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