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April 18, 2006

House of the Day: Clinton Hill Mystery Location

house house
We were debating Mr. Minerva last week about the location of this Fillmore listing. He said Lefferts Place and we said St. James. Regardless, it's an interesting listing. At $1.5 million, we think they've overshot by a little but not a lot. The house has some wood detailing (what do you call that trellis-like stuff?) that we don't see a lot of in the nabe. We almost wonder whether it was added later on. The interior design, which has grandma written all over it, is a little hard to see through to get a sense of what kind of a tune-up the new owner would really need to give the place.
Clinton Hill Brownstone [Fillmore]




Posted by Brownstoner at 11:34 AM | Comments (43)
Categories: Properties

Comments

it's lefferts place (there is a lefferts place bonanza going on apparently) should be 23 lefferts place or something like that

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 11:55 AM

here's another http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/rfs/151887403.html

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 11:57 AM

It's on Lefferts Place between St. James and Grand (next to empty lot). 63 Lefferts Place just went into contract at $1.5m so the price doesn't appear to be that far off.

Posted by: BrownBomber at April 18, 2006 11:59 AM

I'm not sure about the exact spelling, but the design element above the stairs is called fretwork.

Posted by: combustiblegirl at April 18, 2006 12:02 PM

confirmed, 23 Lefferts Place.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 12:04 PM

Somebody owes me a ten spot...

Posted by: Mr. Minerva at April 18, 2006 12:27 PM

that's right. 23 lefferts place. Large houses on that block - wide, 22 or 23 feet I'd say.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 12:34 PM

I would have called the elements of the trellis-like thing spindlework; I think of fretwork as more geometric (like a greek-key pattern, with horizontals and verticals). Not sure what to call the thing itself...

Posted by: Halden at April 18, 2006 12:43 PM

The check is in the mail, Mr. Minerva!

Posted by: Brownstoner at April 18, 2006 12:45 PM

I also think it would be referred to as fretwork, though I've also heard it referred to as 'gingerbread'. (Though I think gingerbread is more specifically a Victorian reference?)

Any sort of decorative element that fits between the arches of a doorway, or in the corners, is called a spandrel.

I'm a sucker for etymology ; )

Posted by: sandra at April 18, 2006 1:13 PM

The inside is so over the top, they must have had to escape to the spartan back yard for a little relief.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 1:32 PM

I think that work above the stairs is also known as a spandrel

Posted by: anon at April 18, 2006 1:55 PM

For what it's worth, Sandra is correct on all points. You don't see a lot of that around, it's usually the first thing to get taken down when people start "modernizing" the house. All of it is in amazing shape.

I loved the Grandma description, it was a needed chuckle today.

Great house for someone with a very traditional Victorian sense of style, but adding some color on the walls, and some funky furniture and accessories would bring it right into the 21st century.

Posted by: CrownHeightsProud at April 18, 2006 2:19 PM

For what it's worth, Sandra is correct on all points. You don't see a lot of that around, it's usually the first thing to get taken down when people start "modernizing" the house. All of it is in amazing shape.

I loved the Grandma description, it was a needed chuckle today.

Great house for someone with a very traditional Victorian sense of style, but adding some color on the walls, and some funky furniture and accessories would bring it right into the 21st century.

Posted by: CrownHeightsProud at April 18, 2006 2:19 PM

Still a ghetto if you ask me.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 2:36 PM

Good thing nobody did.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 2:40 PM

Anon 2:36, a ghetto? Well you probably couldn't afford to live in the ghetto then! Ain't it funny how these things come around full circle. Cheers!

Posted by: The Empire Strikes Back at April 18, 2006 2:56 PM

I agree with Anon 2:36, although I wouldn't have used that term. Still a developing area I wouldn't choose to live in. And TESB, for your info, yes I can afford it many times over. Why do you people always assume that if someone says that they don't like an area it is because they can't afford it and really want to live there? That is so patheticly childish of you.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 3:27 PM

Whatever, there has not be a shortage of buyers, includling many young families, in Clinton Hill, or on this street for that matter (Brownbomber is right about the place on the next block of this street that went into contract within two weeks of listing). We'll see.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 3:33 PM

i think TESB meant that the prices here are pretty far out and not quite ghetto prices...
I live here and was not alogether sure i wanted to initially. it's really nowhere close to a ghetto now that I live here and have a better sense of it. that's just fear and misinformation.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 3:37 PM

Anon 2:36 and 3:27, perhaps if you close your eyes and say the word "ghetto" fifty times over, in a blink of an eye Clinton Hill brownstone would be on the market at 1988 prices again! Ahhhh...those $350k mansions on Clinton Ave...those were the days... ;-)

Posted by: The Empire Strikes Back at April 18, 2006 3:50 PM

Just curious, anon at 2.36 p.m. - where do you live?

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 4:50 PM

To answer you i live in Staten Island Todt Hill to be exact. I worked in the area for 10 yrs and i can say without a doubt the area is Ghetto. You fools tell everyone there are no gun shots and everything is great in Bed stuy and all the areas talked about well hello. You must all have your ears closed and eyes shut.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 6:14 PM

Actually, "we", unlike you, have our eyes open.

To each his own, though.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 6:33 PM

he "trellis-like stuff" is quite common in late 19th and early 20th Century Renaissance-revival houses like the ones in my neighborhood (PLG) or Crown Heights. I'm sure it's an addition to an earlier Italianate house like this.

Posted by: Bob Marvin at April 18, 2006 8:43 PM

since gambling's in the air--100 bills says that trellis-fret-spindle-rack is not original.

Posted by: mcteague at April 18, 2006 9:08 PM

I appreciate that Staten Islander gives us context for his comments. Those of us who actually live in the neighborhoods discussed can be both realistic about the raw edges and hopeful about change. That said do people think that this particular tide of home improvement and commercial development has peaked? While Myrtle Avenue has certainly improved, Fulton Street around the featured property is less than enticing.

Posted by: putnam-denizen at April 18, 2006 9:12 PM

The Christian book store on Fulton between Washington and St. James will be the office of a mortgage broker.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 9:24 PM

Was that a christian bookstore? It seemed to have a bunch of mass market books aimed at the African American community. I found some great kid books there. I can't say I think that replacing a bookstore with a mortgage broker is a good thing!

Posted by: putnam-denizen at April 18, 2006 9:56 PM

As you might know the fulton street association has just got a grant from the City and they will soon start a very similar project as the Myrtle avenue association, streer cleaning more security, buisness development and a web site, there is a very bright future for Fulton and I think all of us will enjoy it in a few years.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 18, 2006 10:53 PM

Staten Islander, you're either a nut or pathetic troll. The house in question is in Clinton Hill and anyone who refers to Clinton Hill as a "ghetto" clearly does not know anything about the neighborhood, its demographics or more importantly the meaning of the word. According to Webster's Dictionary, the word GHETTO is defined as "a quarter of a city in which members of a minority group live especially because of social, legal, or economic pressure." SI, now please explain to this blog community how Clinton Hill is a "ghetto". This should be interesting......

Posted by: BrownBomber at April 18, 2006 11:17 PM

Please, please don't have Staten Islander explain. It is true that parts of Clinton Hill feel more bourgey (never actually spelled that word!) and others feel still depressed. Lefferts Place can be quite cute, but it is surrounded by "spots" (drugs) and is between the aforementionedsoon to be rejuvenated but alas still not quite there Fulton Street and the auto repair strip and highway that is Atlantic Avenue.

Posted by: putnam-denizen at April 18, 2006 11:28 PM

Lefferts Place as is most of Clinton Hill is comprised of primarily million dollar townhouses and brownstones. It is a very diverse community, both racially, culturally and economically. How can anyone refer to Lefferts or any other section of Clinton Hill as the ghetto given the clear meaning of the word?

Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 6:20 AM

Why are you guys even bothering with SI. He doesn't know the nabe and is simply trying to ruffle some feathers. The guy lives in Todt Hill, Staten Island (never heard of it) and "worked" in Clinton Hill for 10 years - perhaps in the 70's or 80's (crack years?). Who knows. In event, if his stale perception is the barometer then we're all in trouble. BTW, if I could afford it I would love to live in this ghetto!!!

Posted by: Anon at April 19, 2006 7:47 AM

Hey I know SI and Todt hill too.. Mostly flattered that anyone from shalan wouldn't like our neighb.
So Todt hill is "fancy" for staten island. In fairness it's prety.. big hill.. views of the city.. very mafia SI masion kind of houses ... but with that "special" SI twist.. You know.. decorative gold lions gracing your entry type thing.

Posted by: shalan at April 19, 2006 9:01 AM

Actually I think that whole corner of Clinton Hill, despite whatever prices are being slapped on the houses, could be viewed as,er, challenged by socio-economic issues. Drug dealing, homeless people living in trailers on junkyards, at least two short-term hotels on Classon, broken sidewalks, relatively unsophisticated new construction, vacant lots, boarded up storefronts on Fulton. It is tougher than other parts of the neighborhood. When I bought four years ago I thought there would be more improvement, but those who own seem to be sitting on their property or trying to sell it at prices which are prohibitive for self-renovators who aren't corporate types.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 9:29 AM

Why is everybody so hung up on diversity?!? Fuhgetaboutit!! We don't need no freak'n diversity in Todt Hill!! We got more gold lions, monogrammed gates and pissing Greek statues than all of Brooklyn!!

Posted by: Tonay Soprano at April 19, 2006 9:34 AM

Anon 10:53, do you have more info about the grant that the Fulton Street Association has received?

Posted by: Brownstoner at April 19, 2006 9:36 AM

So according to SI man and some Anon poster, I guess Brownstoner and the rest of us who live in that "corner" of Clinton Hill are just really stupid and made a bad investment in buying in the ghetto, hmmm.

Silly coversation really.

As for the Fulton BID, I think if you look up "Fulton BID" on Google, there might be some more info. I recall there was a discussion about this recently.

Also, I looked at the Faculty House condos website yesterday (St. James and Atlantic) and it looks like there are only 2 or 3 that are not in contract already. That was pretty quick.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 10:17 AM

Southeastern Clinton Hill sits directly on the C train line and straddles Fulton Street. Two major pluses as the neighborhood continues to change and make serious improvements. Give it some time. The square block area of Washington to Classon and Gates to Atlantic will be considered prime real estate in 10 years. Great housing stock (no one refutes this), excellent transportation, minutes from Manhattan, etc. The pockets of poverty, however few, will surely disappear with time as gentrification takes further root. Those looking for Clinton Hill to turn into Park Slope overnight are not being realistic.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 10:31 AM

I agree that Clinton Hill is not going to turn into Park Slope overnight, and hope it never does. But as someone who has lived in CH for almost nine years, I'm pretty flabbergasted by the changes; the crack vials and prostitutes are long gone, the schools are finally getting better, house prices are beyond my wildest imagination (for better or worse), and there are very few derelict buildings/lots left that don't have some kind of construction happening. And the food choices are way better--not long ago, it was only bad Chinese or West Indian with no sit-down restaurants.

Like all neighborhoods, some sections are better than others. Below Fulton can feel a bit dicey, and Putnam has always been bad (but it's not as bad as it used to be). But I would argue that many Clinton Hill streets are already pretty prime.

Posted by: Anonymous at April 19, 2006 3:32 PM

I concur. But if you want to speed up the clean up process then bring in the cameras and smack a wrecking ball into about four buildings in the area that basically house all of the area's degenerates, i.e., those who have no community pride and basically crap where they eat! ;-)

On a more serious note, Fulton won't truly shine until the meth center on Fulton and Waverly is relocated to some "other" place. I know, very NIMBY.... I'm ashamed... :-(

Posted by: BrownBomber at April 19, 2006 4:29 PM

yeah i'm NIMBY too... why don't we move that meth clinic to Todt Hill? Maybe get invovled.. sign a neighborhood petition or somehing?

Posted by: nimby at April 21, 2006 8:22 AM

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